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Runway 4/22 At LGA  
User currently offlineLga1011 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 67 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3904 times:

Does anybody know what is going on on Runway 4/22 at LGA I saw trucks and a big X at the end of the runway. Whatever it is it should be over soon because the U.S. Open is about to start.

22 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21525 posts, RR: 55
Reply 1, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3889 times:

Probably maintenance work. The X means that the runway is closed. I think they like to do work on Saturdays because the airport is less busy.

They generally don't keep it closed for very long, so I'd expect it to be up and running again by Monday at the latest.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineKcrwflyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3795 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3875 times:



Quoting Lga1011 (Thread starter):
Does anybody know what is going on on Runway 4/22 at LGA I saw trucks and a big X at the end of the runway.

The runway must be closed for some reason.

Quoting Lga1011 (Thread starter):
Whatever it is it should be over soon because the U.S. Open is about to start.

Remind me how the US Open affects which runways airports are doing work on or have closed at any given time?


User currently offlineAA 777 From United States of America, joined May 2002, 807 posts, RR: 13
Reply 3, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3855 times:
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The Port closes one of the two runways just about every Saturday in the summer for construction. Right now they are in the middle of re paving 4-22 so that is why it was closed today.


CRJ-700 FO
User currently offlineAcey From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 1029 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 3742 times:



Quoting Lga1011 (Thread starter):
Whatever it is it should be over soon because the U.S. Open is about to start.

I highly doubt there is very much additional traffic into New York City for the Open, and of the three big airports LGA would probably see the least.



If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live. -- Martin Luther King, Jr.
User currently offlineMjzair From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 398 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 3736 times:



Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 2):
Remind me how the US Open affects which runways airports are doing work on or have closed at any given time?

Actually, it does.
Ever since the time of Mayor David Dinkins, who was an avid tennis fan, they limited the use of 13/31 to help not distract the players. So during this time, if at all possible, they try to avoid using the Expressway visual which would have landing aircraft starting their turn to short final right over the tennis complex.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21525 posts, RR: 55
Reply 6, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3708 times:



Quoting Mjzair (Reply 5):
So during this time, if at all possible, they try to avoid using the Expressway visual which would have landing aircraft starting their turn to short final right over the tennis complex.

Is 31 discouraged entirely, or can they still use the localizer approach?

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineKcrwFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3795 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3659 times:



Quoting Mjzair (Reply 5):
Ever since the time of Mayor David Dinkins, who was an avid tennis fan, they limited the use of 13/31 to help not distract the players. So during this time, if at all possible, they try to avoid using the Expressway visual which would have landing aircraft starting their turn to short final right over the tennis complex.

You've got to be midding me. Then again its not like that region has very crowded airspace, so it makes complete sense to mess with the usual flow of traffic for a TENNIS match....  Yeah sure


User currently offlineLGA777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1147 posts, RR: 19
Reply 8, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 3634 times:

During the US Open 13 departures usually fly the Flushing Climb, which is runway heading straight out departures instead of the usual Whitestone Climb which makes a right turn to a
heading of 180 right after departure and passes right by the US Open Arthur Ashe Tennis Center.

On a side note LGA had an unusual landing pattern for part of yesterday (Saturday 8-23) when
the winds caused a switch to Runway 13 around 1500L. Instead of the usual River Visual approach to 13 arrivals instead flew the ILS to Runway 22 then circle to land 13. It was fun to watch as many aircraft where turning a very short left base to 13 only 1/2 to a mile from the start of the runway, some were turning short left base over the 13 ILS. Surpringly I did not see one go-around, or missed approach, a very common site on the River visual as some unfamiliar crews are to high on final and go missed. As I type this LGA is up and down 31 and 4-22 is scheduled to re-open at 1200N.

Regards

LGA777


User currently offlineRwy04LGA From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 3176 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3540 times:



Quoting AA 777 (Reply 3):
The Port closes one of the two runways just about every Saturday in the summer for construction. Right now they are in the middle of re paving 4-22 so that is why it was closed today.

They alternate runways on Sundays for maintenance.



Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
User currently offlineAA 777 From United States of America, joined May 2002, 807 posts, RR: 13
Reply 10, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3513 times:
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Quoting Rwy04LGA (Reply 9):
They alternate runways on Sundays for maintenance.

Sure about that? I work there and cant say I've seen that a lot....



CRJ-700 FO
User currently offlineDashTrash From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 1519 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3461 times:



Quoting Mjzair (Reply 5):
Actually, it does.
Ever since the time of Mayor David Dinkins, who was an avid tennis fan, they limited the use of 13/31 to help not distract the players. So during this time, if at all possible, they try to avoid using the Expressway visual which would have landing aircraft starting their turn to short final right over the tennis complex.

No way dude. I was on a 4 day trip during last years Open, flying out of LGA exclusively. We used 13 for departure the entire time.

Quoting LGA777 (Reply 8):
During the US Open 13 departures usually fly the Flushing Climb, which is runway heading straight out departures instead of the usual Whitestone Climb which makes a right turn to a
heading of 180 right after departure and passes right by the US Open Arthur Ashe Tennis Center.

Almost. They use the Flushing Climb during the open, which is a left turn to 040. During the Open was the only time I flew, or heard anyone being assigned something other than the Whitestone climb, which is a right turn to 180, then at 2.9 DME a left to 040. The Whitestone takes you over Shea and the tennis complex while the Flushing flies you by it, but not over it.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21525 posts, RR: 55
Reply 12, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3420 times:



Quoting KcrwFlyer (Reply 7):
You've got to be midding me. Then again its not like that region has very crowded airspace, so it makes complete sense to mess with the usual flow of traffic for a TENNIS match....

If it doesn't affect the arrival rate, why not?

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineN757ST From United States of America, joined Feb 2002, 358 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3408 times:



Quoting AA 777 (Reply 10):
Sure about that? I work there and cant say I've seen that a lot....

Hes right to an extent. Usually during the weekends they will close a runway for the evening and morning. They are paving and doing maintenance on 4/22 lately, so that runway is out of commission.

Quoting DashTrash (Reply 11):

Almost. They use the Flushing Climb during the open, which is a left turn to 040. During the Open was the only time I flew, or heard anyone being assigned something other than the Whitestone climb, which is a right turn to 180, then at 2.9 DME a left to 040. The Whitestone takes you over Shea and the tennis complex while the Flushing flies you by it, but not over it.

The only time I have seen the flushing is during NY SWAP or the open. That said, while the whitestone is the most popular climbout, one must not forget that depending on JFK operations the coney climb is often used for southbounds and the Maspeth for west/northbounds.

N757st- LGA based capt.


User currently offlineN757ST From United States of America, joined Feb 2002, 358 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3406 times:



Quoting Mir (Reply 12):
If it doesn't affect the arrival rate, why not?

Because it does effect the arrival rate. During a weekday on single runway ops expect 2-4 hour delays. This will often happen in the winter on 31 anytime we see ~25+ know crosswinds on 4/22.


User currently offlineBigphilnyc From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 4076 posts, RR: 54
Reply 15, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3380 times:



Quoting Acey (Reply 4):
I highly doubt there is very much additional traffic into New York City for the Open, and of the three big airports LGA would probably see the least.

Actually, of the three major airports (EWR, JFK, LGA), LGA sees most of the GA action for such events. I don't think the US Open brings that many people, but if there's an increase, LGA will see it.

Quoting KcrwFlyer (Reply 7):
You've got to be midding me. Then again its not like that region has very crowded airspace, so it makes complete sense to mess with the usual flow of traffic for a TENNIS match....

As explained, the typical departure off of rwy 13 sends the aircraft directly over the stadium, and it can be very noisy for the snobby tennis lobbyists.  Wink

Because of that, rwy 13 can be used for departures, but the aircraft will either depart straight out, or make a fairly heavy left turn, instead of the more common right hand heading 180 and proceeding 2.5 DME.

Quoting N757ST (Reply 13):
Hes right to an extent. Usually during the weekends they will close a runway for the evening and morning. They are paving and doing maintenance on 4/22 lately, so that runway is out of commission.

Constructions is usually only limited to Saturdays, with occasional smaller overnight projects on other days. Sunday is NOT a slow day at LGA, and they usually cannot afford a runway closure for construction. "Weekends" would be incorrect because of this.



Phil Derner Jr.
User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21525 posts, RR: 55
Reply 16, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3375 times:



Quoting N757ST (Reply 14):
Because it does effect the arrival rate. During a weekday on single runway ops expect 2-4 hour delays.

I wasn't talking about using only one runway. But if they can land on 4 or 22 and depart on 31, or depart on 4 and land on 13 (River Visual), then the tennis center doesn't get any aircraft at all.

Obviously the winds have to be right for it to work, but neither of those configurations should affect the arrival rate.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineDashTrash From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 1519 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3325 times:



Quoting N757ST (Reply 13):

The only time I have seen the flushing is during NY SWAP or the open. That said, while the whitestone is the most popular climbout, one must not forget that depending on JFK operations the coney climb is often used for southbounds and the Maspeth for west/northbounds.

N757st- LGA based capt.

Condolences on being based at LGA.  Wink

The only thing I've ever done going south out of LGA is the flushing or whitestone, then over LANNA (or ELIOT / BIGGI if SWAP is in efect) and down J48. You mean there's other ways out of there!? Never used, or heard any other climb being done out of there. That in and of itself doesn't mean that much, granted.


User currently offlineRwy04LGA From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 3176 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 3306 times:



Quoting AA 777 (Reply 10):
Sure about that? I work there and cant say I've seen that a lot....

At 5:30am, when the Q33 makes that right turn at the bus depot, you can clearly see the illuminated X at the threshold of runway 04 (sometimes, not all the time). I work at the end of runway 31, so I can't see 04 from there.



Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
User currently offlineMjzair From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 398 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 3266 times:

Quoting DashTrash (Reply 11):
No way dude. I was on a 4 day trip during last years Open, flying out of LGA exclusively. We used 13 for departure the entire time.

I should have qualified that, I meant limiting the expressway visual.

[Edited 2008-08-24 13:39:35]

User currently offlineLGA777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1147 posts, RR: 19
Reply 20, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 3216 times:



Quoting Rwy04LGA (Reply 18):
At 5:30am, when the Q33 makes that right turn at the bus depot, you can clearly see the illuminated X at the threshold of runway 04 (sometimes, not all the time)..

That's because every year from April till Nov LGA is closed from 0000 lcl to 0600 lcl for construction and both runways are nornally closed overnight. That is why you see the X from the Q33 at 0530 A.M.

LGA777


User currently offlineBigPhilNYC From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 4076 posts, RR: 54
Reply 21, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 3190 times:



Quoting Rwy04LGA (Reply 18):
At 5:30am, when the Q33 makes that right turn at the bus depot, you can clearly see the illuminated X at the threshold of runway 04 (sometimes, not all the time). I work at the end of runway 31, so I can't see 04 from there.

He wasn't disputing the presence of the X, he was disputing runway closures on Sundays.



Phil Derner Jr.
User currently offlineRwy04LGA From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 3176 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3100 times:



Quoting LGA777 (Reply 20):
That's because every year from April till Nov LGA is closed from 0000 lcl to 0600 lcl for construction and both runways are nornally closed overnight. That is why you see the X from the Q33 at 0530 A.M.

Yes, I knew that. Thanks.

Quoting BigPhilNYC (Reply 21):
He wasn't disputing the presence of the X, he was disputing runway closures on Sundays.

Thank you!



Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
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