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Spanair MD-82 Emergency Landing  
User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6529 posts, RR: 51
Posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15702 times:

Oh boy...the media will be all over this.  Yeah sure

How long before the "MD-80's are unsafe" talk begins?

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/08/24/plane.spain/index.html

47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26854 posts, RR: 58
Reply 1, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15680 times:

Yes it will be like the Qantas incident. Even a faulty light will be reported.

User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17056 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15687 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 1):
Yes it will be like the Qantas incident.

That was also the first thing a thought about.



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineBochora From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2008, 491 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15658 times:



Quoting MSYtristar (Thread starter):
How long before the "MD-80's are unsafe" talk begins?

Well to be honest with you the evidence would show that something may be wrong with the MD-80 range.
I really have doubts about how old an aircraft should be before it retires: earlier rather than later.


User currently offlineSunshine79 From UK - England, joined Jan 2006, 1759 posts, RR: 30
Reply 4, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15625 times:

I've just been reading about this. It was described as an unscheduled landing, not an emergency landing. The flight was later cancelled. The a/c was going BCN-ACE. I wonder why they said it was a charter flight rather than a scheduled flight? Does anyone have an update on what was up with the a/c?


Formerly alcregular, Why drive when you can fly?
User currently offlineSwiftski From Australia, joined Dec 2006, 2701 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15623 times:



Quoting Bochora (Reply 3):
Well to be honest with you the evidence would show that something may be wrong with the MD-80 range.

Oh go on then. Provide the evidence for us all. We'll wait.


User currently offlineDanfearn77 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2008, 1811 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15588 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 1):
Yes it will be like the Qantas incident. Even a faulty light will be reported.

Yes totally agree. If the accident the other day hadnt occured this would never had made the news at all. Any one know what the problem was



Eagles may soar high, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines!
User currently offlineFlySSC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7403 posts, RR: 57
Reply 7, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15586 times:

You can be sure that in the coming week, every single little incident involving a MD80s or Spanair or a flight to/from the Canary Island will be the big "BREAKING NEWS" in the Medias ... They are pathetic !

User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26854 posts, RR: 58
Reply 8, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15470 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Reply 7):
involving a MD80s or Spanair or a flight to/from the Canary Island will be the big "BREAKING NEWS" in the Medias ... They are pathetic !

I have to say though if I was on a MD-80 JKK flight and mid air and the pilot came over the PA to announce an emergency landing I would be worried. I know the chances are slim of anything else happening but its only human . Whats wrong is the media hyping it up as they know everyone will be on edge again.


User currently offlineAirPortugal310 From Palau, joined Apr 2004, 3587 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 15419 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 8):
Whats wrong is the media hyping it up as they know everyone will be on edge again.

thats what they get paid to do. reporting that runways are made of cottonballs and rainbows doesnt make them anything



I sell airplanes and airplane accessories
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26854 posts, RR: 58
Reply 10, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 15201 times:



Quoting AirPortugal310 (Reply 9):
thats what they get paid to do. reporting that runways are made of cottonballs and rainbows doesnt make them anything

There is a balance and a happy medium.  Smile Especially when you see some reports with totally the wrong A/C and airline in them.


User currently offlineLitz From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1755 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 15086 times:
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Quoting Bochora (Reply 3):
Well to be honest with you the evidence would show that something may be wrong with the MD-80 range.
I really have doubts about how old an aircraft should be before it retires: earlier rather than later.

I rather think Delta, American, and Northwest would beg to differ.

All three are operating DC-9 series aircraft quite safely. If there were inherent problems with the aircraft, it would have come to light at at least one of those three airlines, due to the huge number of aircraft involved, collectively.

Especially Northwest as they are (and have been for some time) happily operating the oldest of the models. In fact, pretty much the only thing driving Northwest to retire their "Diesel-9s" is the fuel usage. They are paid-for and reliable.

Remember, despite the "the plane was OLD" claims about the Spanair accident, the actual airplane that crashed was only 15 years old. That's not even middle-aged in airplane terms.

- litz


User currently offlineAirPortugal310 From Palau, joined Apr 2004, 3587 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 14950 times:



Quoting Litz (Reply 11):
All three are operating DC-9 series aircraft quite safely

Yaaaa at least one of those airlines would only have had you thinking they were safe for awhile there....



I sell airplanes and airplane accessories
User currently offlineACDC8 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 7642 posts, RR: 36
Reply 13, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 14826 times:



Quoting OA260 (Reply 1):
Even a faulty light will be reported.

A few years back, when that Hapag Lloyd A310 ran out of fuel and tried to glide to VIE and just came up short of the runway set off a real feeding frenzy for the German media (not as big as the one after the Birginair crash) but with no word of a lie, RTL news actually reported that a Hapag Lloyd aircraft that took off from DUS returned to DUS because the coffee machine wasn't working ....  Silly

Quoting Bochora (Reply 3):
Well to be honest with you the evidence would show that something may be wrong with the MD-80 range.
I really have doubts about how old an aircraft should be before it retires: earlier rather than later.

Age has very little to do with safety of an aircraft, its maintenance that plays the biggest roll. I'm willing to bet that most of NW DC9 fleet is in better shape then a lot of the newer 737s or 320s in the sky.



A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 14, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 14759 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Reply 7):
You can be sure that in the coming week, every single little incident involving a MD80s or Spanair or a flight to/from the Canary Island will be the big "BREAKING NEWS" in the Medias ... They are pathetic !

I wouldn't limit that to flights to/from the Canary Islands - it'll be about everything that says Spanair on the outside, and about every MD80 series aircraft, and even worse if it's a combination of both.

Fortunately, there are not only irresponsible journalists out there. I've pretty much turned to ignoring most of the news I can get through the dozens of "Breaking News Alerts" on the internet and on TV and gone back to reading newspapers... you know... the paper-kind...

A lot of the articles that make it onto paper (in respectable newspapers) are actually researched. Not all, but certainly far more than all of those "media outlets" that appear on the internet.

Quoting Litz (Reply 11):
That's not even middle-aged in airplane terms.

Well... 15 years doesn't qualify for new any more, so I'd say "middle-aged" is pretty much what I'd call it. What term would you use?



Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineUA935 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 610 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 14716 times:



Quoting Bochora (Reply 3):
Well to be honest with you the evidence would show that something may be wrong with the MD-80 range.
I really have doubts about how old an aircraft should be before it retires: earlier rather than later.

Grow up little boy.



Live every second like you mean it
User currently offlineMika From Sweden, joined Jul 2000, 2861 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 14682 times:



Quoting Litz (Reply 11):
Especially Northwest as they are (and have been for some time) happily operating the oldest of the models. In fact, pretty much the only thing driving Northwest to retire their "Diesel-9s" is the fuel usage. They are paid-for and reliable

How old are the NW DC9's by the way? I must say that i am abit fascinated (in a good way) that a western airline still use the good ol DC9 in service..it adds abit of nostalgic value to aviation for a plane buff like myself.

I have no doubt that they are perfectly safe to operate, i doubt that they'd win a 'environmentally friendly' award any time soon though. But that's something else.


User currently offlineBrianDromey From Ireland, joined Dec 2006, 3919 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 14621 times:



Quoting Mika (Reply 16):
How old are the NW DC9's by the way? I must say that i am abit fascinated (in a good way) that a western airline still use the good ol DC9 in service..it adds abit of nostalgic value to aviation for a plane buff like myself.

I know there have been TR's where the FO was younger than the DC-9 he was flying! I think the oldest is about 35 years in service.

I think that the MD-80 is perceived to be a "troubled" aircraft by the media as there have been a few spectacular/fatal accidents with the type, which could be said of any type but have hung around in memory longer than other types. Perhaps this is a result of MDD not being around to defend itself and attempt to 'bury' the story the same way Boeing or Airbus would do with any of their own/true products?

Brian.



Next flights: MAN-ORK-LHR(EI)-MAN(BD); MAN-LHR(BD)-ORK (EI); DUB-ZRH-LAX (LX) LAX-YYZ (AC) YYZ-YHZ-LHR(AC)-DUB(BD)
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26854 posts, RR: 58
Reply 18, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 14468 times:



Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 13):
RTL news actually reported that a Hapag Lloyd aircraft that took off from DUS returned to DUS because the coffee machine wasn't working .... Silly

 rotfl   rotfl  Youd need more than coffee after that . Change of pants and a Whiskey.


User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3288 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 14082 times:



Quoting AirPortugal310 (Reply 12):
Yaaaa at least one of those airlines would only have had you thinking they were safe for awhile there....

The only reason one of those airlines had issues with MD-80 safety was because of their actions, not because there was something inherently wrong with the design of the plane. The MD-80 is a proven aircraft from that respect. The same "sky is falling" types screamed the same thing after the Alaska Air tragedy. Turned out to be a problem with AS, not the design of the aircraft.


User currently offlineAtlanta From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 473 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 13757 times:



Quoting Bochora (Reply 3):
Well to be honest with you the evidence would show that something may be wrong with the MD-80 range.
I really have doubts about how old an aircraft should be before it retires: earlier rather than later.

I hope your being sarcastic......

Atlanta



Welcome To The New Delta- The World's Largest Airline
User currently offlineAirPortugal310 From Palau, joined Apr 2004, 3587 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 13709 times:



Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 19):
The only reason one of those airlines had issues with MD-80 safety was because of their actions, not because there was something inherently wrong with the design of the plane.

That is correct. I should have clarified that. Alas, public perception was still skewed a bit. Obviously, we know better than that...



I sell airplanes and airplane accessories
User currently offlineSm1011 From Mexico, joined May 2008, 1 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12962 times:

there is an old saying; whileBoeing was making big airplanes ,Douglas was making great airplanes

User currently offlineRichM From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2004, 798 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12856 times:



Quoting Bochora (Reply 3):

Well to be honest with you the evidence would show that something may be wrong with the MD-80 range.
I really have doubts about how old an aircraft should be before it retires: earlier rather than later.

I don't agree with you there at all. You need to be careful what you say on these forums, or you risk getting flamed. Comments which are deemed to be ignorant do not tend to receive positive replies, and obviously that can cause arguments, which may result in people getting upset. So it's always best to do your research first imo.

Emergency landings are not that uncommon. Many, if not most aircraft in these situations, are able to land safely. The only reason why this may not be common knowledge, is simply because the media do not report on the majority of the emergency landings which take place. I'm guessing that this emergency landing only got reported due to the tragic disaster which happened a few days back. I'm willing to bet that it wouldn't have been reported if it hadn't been for the previous incident.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that the MD80 series has a very good safety record when taking into account the number of them which have entered service.

- RichM


User currently offlineDano1977 From British Indian Ocean Territory, joined Jun 2008, 484 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 12776 times:

After reading god knows how many posts on this subjects various threads......

Wait for the NTSB and the Spanish Equvilent to release there findings and data?

Because until then, everything is just pure speculation.

I know some A.netters are Pilots,Cabin crew,Engineers and Ramp Rats, and they are entitled to there opinion, but until anything official gets released it is only their opinion!!!!

I know some posters may have pointed out the age of the aircraft invovled.....I own a 25% share in a 1970's Piper Cherokee 140, i know a guy that owns a 2000 model Mooney...does it make it any less safe????, Nope because i know Both planes are maintained within the rules and requirements on the UK CAA

UNTIL OFFICIAL REPORTS HAVE BEEN MADE.....EVERYTHING ELSE IS JUST SPECULATION!!!!!!!



Children should only be allowed on aircraft if 1. Muzzled and heavily sedated 2. Go as freight
25 Nwarooster : That is what brought down an Eastern Airlines L-1011 about 30 plus years ago. The pilots got too interested in a light which should not have been on.
26 Vald : I looked at your profile, your a young man, the md range / before that dc-9 range of aircraft are doing what they do pretty well for a long time. but
27 SA006 : Oh please. Aircraft are designed to last. I live in a country where many older aircraft are used on a regular basis. Maintenance is the key. A well m
28 BMIFlyer : Spanair do fly Charter flights as well as scheduled ones
29 Nwarooster : [quote=Vald,reply=26] Quoting Nwarooster (Reply 25): Well to be honest with you the evidence would show that something may be wrong with the MD-80 ran
30 YWG747 : Maybe it isn't the aircraft.... maybe it's the owner of them.
31 ACDC8 : No, a faulty light did not bring down EA401, poor flight crew management did. The light merely started the chain reaction of events that downed the a
32 Allpress : phewww..atleast we (qantas) dont have any MD-80's... closest we have is 717's... haha cam
33 Glareskin : It will result in the end of SAS and AA.....
34 Beagleboys : after boeing acquired Douglas it evolved to: Boeing makes planes, Airbus makes videogames. But is OT...
35 Litz : Until the last couple of years, NW was still flying DC-9-10s from the mid 1960s ... Almost certainly the planes were older than their crews. They've
36 Post contains links AirCatalonia : Ok and another one now: Spanair JK6621 GRX-BCN returns to GRX due to a com problem: http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2008/0...adcbe4abe82fac66c6651&t=121
37 Arrow : Jeez, lighten up. He is commenting on a forum, not filing an official report or submitting an affidavit. The point is, the crew got so obsessed with
38 Post contains links Spacecadet : That's not entirely correct. Both Alaska's maintenance and the design of the MD-80 are cited as contributing factors to the accident. This is from th
39 Haggis79 : well... they have updated the cabin and PSUs, so you can't even tell from them any more... only chance to realize you are on a really old plane is to
40 ACDC8 : There are people here roasting others for using "too" instead of "to" and your telling me to lighten up because I was merely providing a little bit o
41 Arrow : That should be "you're telling me..." Under most circumstances I'd let that go, just as I do for all the other blatant spelling and grammatical miscu
42 ACDC8 : Good, you're paying attention ..... I wasn't trying to attack the poster I was replying to, just trying to add some more information to prevent any c
43 Airbazar : What's pathetic is 100+ people dead due to, by all indications, gross negligence on the part of the airline maintenace. I see nothing wrong with the
44 Falstaff : NW has some DC-9s that are 40.
45 Qantas787 : Personally I doubt it.
46 ACDC8 : I should have said just as good of shape, and I meant mechanically (safety) sound not cabin appointments just to clarify my earlier post
47 EZEIZA : We don't know yet if there was negligence by the airline maintenace, and the media blowing every little thing out of proportion regarding JK will onl
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