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Southwest Suspends HOU Ops for Hurricane Ike  
User currently offlineFrequentFlyKid From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1206 posts, RR: 1
Posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 7565 times:

Southwest Airlines has announced that beginning at 9:00AM CDT on Friday, September 12, 2008 that its operations at HOU will be suspended due to the impending conditions from Hurricane Ike.

I find it interesting that CRP and HRL are still operating as of now; however since CRP is only served to/from HOU it is effectively suspended also.

I don't have intimate knowledge of Southwest operations, but what do they do in a situation such as WN #801. It is scheduled BNA-MSY-HOU-OKC-MCI-MDW-IND-BWI. Since HOU operations are suspended do they operated the flight as usual, but just skip the stop in HOU and fly MSY-OKC and keep the schedule?

[Edited 2008-09-10 21:35:37]

[Edited 2008-09-10 21:41:36]

52 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTwal10114ever From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 7393 times:

Typically they will just overfly HOU and do the MSY-OKC flight nonstop. At least this was the standard procedure when I worked for WN in MCO. I remember a hurricane hitting MSY and we operated MCO-PHX and MSY-HOU nonstop instead of the flight operating MCO-MSY-PHX and MCO-MSY-HOU.

User currently offlineAtrude777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5686 posts, RR: 52
Reply 2, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 7354 times:

Curious how this will affect HOU based Pilots and F/A for SWA. Will they just not have to report for work or anything?

Alex



Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
User currently offlineAS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6004 posts, RR: 24
Reply 3, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 7360 times:

Here is the message sent to employee's. Just mailed to me by a friend.

09-10-08 | Weather Advisory: Hurricane Ike Advances Toward Texas Gulf Coast
The Weather Disruption Task Force (WDTF) is keeping close tabs on the progress of Hurricane Ike. The storm is slowly gaining strength, and the outerbands of Ike are expected to make landfall somewhere along the Texas Gulf Coast on Friday. Although the intensity and exact landfall location of the storm are still uncertain, the WDTF has decided to suspend all operations at CRP and HRL for Friday and Saturday. All scheduled service at HOU will discontinue at 9 a.m. on Friday. The resumption of our operations at these airports will be contingent upon airport facilities and services. In addition, the WDTF is making preparations for the potential disruption of service at AUS and SAT as the storm moves inland. As the conditions develop, there is the possibility of delays, diversions, and/or cancellations at any of these stations.

Full Story | Today@SWA

ASSFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8868 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 7206 times:



Quoting FrequentFlyKid (Thread starter):
BNA-MSY-HOU-OKC-MCI-MDW-IND-BWI

A seven-stopper...wow. That's impressive.

Seriously though, I've heard of several times where WN will just overfly an airport in an irrops situation. It's one of the nice perks of them not being a hub-based airline (and being a P2P one).


User currently offlineDsuairptman From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 877 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 7063 times:

Does anyone have a good idea when WN might restart HOU ops? I'm slated to fly through HOU this coming Sunday. The storm appears to be on a track to have it out of the HOU area by Saturday.


GEAUX SAINTS!
User currently offlineLoneStarMike From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 3783 posts, RR: 34
Reply 6, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 7006 times:



Quoting Twal10114ever (Reply 1):
Typically they will just overfly HOU and do the MSY-OKC flight nonstop.

The one exception would be if the flight departs DAL, stops in HOU and continues on to a city outside the Wright Amendment perimeter. Looks like none of those flights departing DAL after 7:30 am will be operating on Friday, since WN cannot legally fly nonstop from DAL to a city outside the Wright Amendment perimeter.

LoneStarMike


User currently offlineBrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4058 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 6934 times:



Quoting LoneStarMike (Reply 6):
since WN cannot legally fly nonstop from DAL to a city outside the Wright Amendment perimeter.

Even in such situations the Wright Amendment still takes precedent?



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineWNCrew From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1414 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 6902 times:



Quoting Brilondon (Reply 7):



Quoting Brilondon (Reply 7):
Quoting LoneStarMike (Reply 6):
since WN cannot legally fly nonstop from DAL to a city outside the Wright Amendment perimeter.

Even in such situations the Wright Amendment still takes precedent?


I don't think so, I've worked DAL-MDW before and it overflew MCI due to weather. We knew we'd overfly before we even departed and so pax got off and we flew out with around 40 or so.



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineBrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4058 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 6852 times:



Quoting WNCrew (Reply 8):
I don't think so, I've worked DAL-MDW before and it overflew MCI due to weather. We knew we'd overfly before we even departed and so pax got off and we flew out with around 40 or so.

Thanks.



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineEA CO AS From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 13255 posts, RR: 62
Reply 10, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 6831 times:
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Quoting WNCrew (Reply 8):
Quoting Brilondon (Reply 7):




Quoting Brilondon (Reply 7):
Quoting LoneStarMike (Reply 6):
since WN cannot legally fly nonstop from DAL to a city outside the Wright Amendment perimeter.

Even in such situations the Wright Amendment still takes precedent?



I don't think so, I've worked DAL-MDW before and it overflew MCI due to weather. We knew we'd overfly before we even departed and so pax got off and we flew out with around 40 or so.

I think the key here is they cannot PLAN flights to circumvent the Wright Amendment - so an intended DAL-MCI-MDW flight could overfly MCI if enroute weather made the MCI stop impossible, but the flight couldn't be planned solely as DAL-MDW, IIRC - there has to at least be the intent to stop at MCI, weather permitting.



"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 18704 posts, RR: 58
Reply 11, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 6791 times:



Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 4):
It's one of the nice perks of them not being a hub-based airline (and being a P2P one).

Yeah, although they have a lot of business at HOU. But I think they'd rather cut their losses and just cancel the flights now than take the risk of having to screw over all their customers with a last-minute cancellation. It also shows that they are behaving responsibly and doing the right thing, rather than trying to squeeze every penny out of the bottom line.

THAT is why WN is so profitable. They (usually) do the right thing and the money takes care of itself.


User currently offlineAznMadSci From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 3635 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 6758 times:



Quoting Dsuairptman (Reply 5):
Does anyone have a good idea when WN might restart HOU ops? I'm slated to fly through HOU this coming Sunday. The storm appears to be on a track to have it out of the HOU area by Saturday.

What they're telling us here in Houston is that we'll start to feel Ike Friday evening and make early landfall just southwest of the Houston area early Saturday morning. HOU may not get as much wind damage as IAH, so possibly HOU could be back up early Sunday afternoon or earlier.



The journey of life is not based on the accomplishments, but the experience.
User currently offlineLoneStarMike From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 3783 posts, RR: 34
Reply 13, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 6750 times:



Quoting WNCrew (Reply 8):
I don't think so, I've worked DAL-MDW before and it overflew MCI due to weather. We knew we'd overfly before we even departed and so pax got off and we flew out with around 40 or so.

That's interesting. I tried to make dummy reservations for Friday from DAL to places like TPA, MCO, FLL, BWI, etc, and all the flights that appear to be one-stop directs through HOU (except the very early ones where you'd get into and out of HOU before 9:00 am) are showing unavailable. And of course any itinerary that shows a connection at HOU is also unavailable.

LoneStarMike


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 6455 times:

Quoting FrequentFlyKid (Thread starter):
Southwest Airlines has announced that beginning at 9:00AM CDT on Friday, September 12, 2008 that its operations at HOU will be suspended due to the impending conditions from Hurricane Ike.

With all due respect, your thread title "Southwest Suspends HOU Operations" is misleading with respect to the above, as since today is Thursday, September 11th, one could read your title and erroneously assume that nothing is operating at HOU "today" (Thursday).

All HRL and CRP flights are operating today, Thursday, and the normal terminating aircraft there will ferry out, with no HRL or CRP flights on Friday or Saturday.

Quoting FrequentFlyKid (Thread starter):
I don't have intimate knowledge of Southwest operations, but what do they do in a situation such as WN #801. It is scheduled BNA-MSY-HOU-OKC-MCI-MDW-IND-BWI. Since HOU operations are suspended do they operated the flight as usual, but just skip the stop in HOU and fly MSY-OKC and keep the schedule?

Over the next couple of days, there will be lots of overflys and oddball city-pairs as HOU is bypassed. Lots of ferry flights too.

[Edited 2008-09-11 06:22:56]

[Edited 2008-09-11 06:23:59]

User currently offlinePlateMan From United States of America, joined May 2007, 919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 6325 times:

Do they take all their planes out of HOU in advance of the storm?


"Explore. Dream. Discover." -Mark Twain
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 6262 times:



Quoting PlateMan (Reply 15):
Do they take all their planes out of HOU in advance of the storm?

Yep. Everything will come out on Friday...


User currently offlineLuiePL From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 58 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 6247 times:

They also do the same thing in the winter with bad weather in places like MDW. Back when I worked at BDL I remember them bypassing MDW and doing some straight LAS/LAX flights. So they are more than used to operating this way.


-Luie PHL-
User currently offlineBlueFlyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3709 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5980 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting Brilondon (Reply 7):
Even in such situations the Wright Amendment still takes precedent?

It takes an act of Congress to waive an act of Congress. Or a judge. Not a hurricane.

Quoting WNCrew (Reply 8):
We knew we'd overfly before we even departed and so pax got off and we flew out with around 40 or so.

And having only 40 passengers on board made you compliant with the spirit, if not the letter, of the Wright Amendment.

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 10):
I think the key here is they cannot PLAN flights to circumvent the Wright Amendment

I think the key is Southwest gambling on the fact it is irregular ops and that it would save their skin if someone decided to be stupid and sue them... The amendment doesn't just ban the planning of flights beyond the authorized states, it bans anyone from providing transportation.



I've got $h*t to do
User currently offlineCoronado990 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1593 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5238 times:



Quoting BlueFlyer (Reply 18):
It takes an act of Congress to waive an act of Congress. Or a judge. Not a hurricane.

If we're playing rock, paper, scissors, isn't a hurricane a "act of god"? Seems to me god is much stronger than any judge or congress I know of.



Uncle SAN at your service!
User currently offlineViasaMSY From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 91 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 4985 times:



Quoting Coronado990 (Reply 19):
If we're playing rock, paper, scissors, isn't a hurricane a "act of god"? Seems to me god is much stronger than any judge or congress I know of.

A hurricane is an act of nature my friend. Just an act of nature
 Yeah sure



Rebuild New Orleans!!!
User currently offlineABQopsHP From United States of America, joined May 2006, 848 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 4924 times:

Here in CRP, when Dolly hit last month RP was the only one running flights. XE WN and AE all cxld flts, but since we handle RP we had to go in. Once again WN and AE are going to cxl flts and we have been told to expect to go in tomorrow and Saturday. I really doubt we will see much weather down here since CRP will be on the dry side of the storm, but it can easily change course too. Since I left work early, and nothing is in my email, I have no idea if plans have changed. Our manager was on confernce call with XE corporate at IAH finding out what was going to happen. We were told that there will not be any a/c staged here by CO mainline or XE, since CRP is still a bit too close. Last time IAH took a direct hit I recall CO and XE having a/c staged in ABQ and ELP.
JD CRP XE



A line is evidence that other people exist.
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6579 posts, RR: 32
Reply 22, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 4897 times:



Quoting BlueFlyer (Reply 18):
And having only 40 passengers on board made you compliant with the spirit, if not the letter, of the Wright Amendment.

No, that's not true. They are compliant with the letter of the law as well. The Wright Amendment doesn't restrict the operation of the non-stop flight, it restricts ticketing. It merely states that airlines operating from DAL may not sell or offer for sale itineraries containing a non-stop flight between DAL and a point outside the perimeter. When the DAL-MCI-MDW tickets were sold, they were not sold or offered for sale as non-stop tickets.

Back before the most recent changes to the Wright Amendment, you could book an itinerary between DAL and a point outside the perimeter -- but only by using a Rapid Rewards award voucher. Because they weren't actually selling you a ticket (they were transporting you for free), the Wright restrictions didn't apply.

Quoting BlueFlyer (Reply 18):
I think the key is Southwest gambling on the fact it is irregular ops and that it would save their skin if someone decided to be stupid and sue them... The amendment doesn't just ban the planning of flights beyond the authorized states, it bans anyone from providing transportation.

See above. Also, good luck finding the standing to sue unless you're the FAA/DOT. Southwest can fly from DAL to anywhere in the U.S. and vice versa -- they do it with ferry flights quite frequently. They just can't sell tickets if the other point is outside the perimeter. Actually, that's not entirely true; there's an exclusion for a limited number of scheduled flights as well -- something like six per month. Once upon a time, if memory serves, WN briefly offered weekly DAL-JAC service.

Quoting LoneStarMike (Reply 13):
I tried to make dummy reservations for Friday from DAL to places like TPA, MCO, FLL, BWI, etc, and all the flights that appear to be one-stop directs through HOU (except the very early ones where you'd get into and out of HOU before 9:00 am) are showing unavailable.

Those flights may well still operate as non-stops, overflying HOU. But once Southwest knows that they're going to operate non-stop from DAL to a point beyond the perimeter, they're not allowed to offer or sell the seats.


User currently offlineYWG747 From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 251 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 4879 times:

RIP Houston

Quoting ViasaMSY (Reply 20):
A hurricane is an act of nature my friend. Just an act of nature

Amen to that brother!


User currently offlineRFields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7345 posts, RR: 32
Reply 24, posted (5 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 4794 times:



Quoting BlueFlyer (Reply 18):
And having only 40 passengers on board made you compliant with the spirit, if not the letter, of the Wright Amendment.

The law defines allowed aircraft by SEATS on the aircraft, not the number of passengers. SWA will only be fined if there is a deliberate attempt to circumvent Wright. There will be no lawsuits - SWA will be fined for violations.

Emergencies don't count. Since Wright is SWA's protection for DAL, they are not going to do anything which might jepardize Wright and allow other LCC airlines into DAL.

Quoting AznMadSci (Reply 12):
Quoting Dsuairptman (Reply 5):
Does anyone have a good idea when WN might restart HOU ops? I'm slated to fly through HOU this coming Sunday. The storm appears to be on a track to have it out of the HOU area by Saturday.

What they're telling us here in Houston is that we'll start to feel Ike Friday evening and make early landfall just southwest of the Houston area early Saturday morning. HOU may not get as much wind damage as IAH, so possibly HOU could be back up early Sunday afternoon or earlier.

You will want to keep an eye on local conditions. I would suggest KHOU or KPRC TV station web sites.

The Mayor / Harris County Judge may suspend incoming passengers if there is damage to the infrastructure - especially electrical power - not just at the airport - if a substantial part of the community is without power, they will not want people coming in.

It is not unusual for airlines to only be able to fly into an airport after a storm aid / relief workers, electrical power specialists, etc - no regular passengers for a couple days.

But EVERYTHING is up in the air today - only after the storm moves ashore and officials evaluate the results can anyone say exactly what will happen.

Personally, I'd plan on postponing the trip. Best case is it will be a tremendously crowded plane with frantic passengers and busy harassed employees.

SWA is the best airline in the US when such things happen in my opinion - but it's going to be a nightmare no matter what.


25 Post contains links ABQopsHP : Here is one of the sites we use for tracking http://stormpulse.com JD CRPXE
26 Sflaflight : yeah, just ask AA the logistics of completely shutting down a hub due ot a hurricane. That is not fun. You just can't overfly that one. What is CO do
27 Imapilotaz : How does it protect SWA? They have a lease on the majority of the gates, that's what keeps someone from coming in and setting up shop. If any LCC wan
28 RFields5421 : There is a separate thread - but COA is closing up KIAH early Friday morning and plans to be down until sometime late Sunday.
29 BlueFlyer : It doesn't say anything about ticketing. It states a) "provide the transportation of individuals, by air, as a common carrier for compensation or hir
30 ScottB : Ah, but that is exactly why it applies to the ticketing. They are permitted to carry people for free, of course, because that is not "for compensatio
31 DTWAGENT : I have been reading on the FAA site that MSY may be closing to. They are under a Tropical Storm Warning. However, with IKE being so big and with high
32 RFields5421 : I saw where 12 medical evacuation aircraft had flown from the Houston area to New Orleans today - KNEW - Lakefront Airport. I presume they were taking
33 Okie : So the next question depending on the path and strength of IKE. Will the hurricane move far enough westward then north to effect DAL and DFW on Sat or
34 Swatpamike : Hello All Ike sucks. I just flew down from BHM to see the KU-USF game in Tampa on Friday and now will plan to return on Saturday instead of Sunday bec
35 ABQopsHP : The last COex flt will leave CRP at 1015a 12Sep. We have been advised to come back on sunday morning. My friends that work at IAH have been told they
36 RFields5421 : It is really up in the air. Tonight's Dallas TV station weather guessers on the air right now are saying the center track will pass over Mexia, Canto
37 RFields5421 : Looking at the models as reported on weather underground - three of the six predictions show the storm passing east of Houston - barely over the east
38 Type-Rated : IAH will close tomorrow at 2pm. It will also remain closed all day on Saturday. The area is calling for 80 mph winds.
39 RFields5421 : The 2AM models have shifted the track back west a bit. All four models now show the storm to cross the coast over Galveston Island or Galveston Bay. U
40 AznMadSci : For those who are familiar with the Houston freeway system, they're talking about Ike making landfall over Galveston Island around midnight CST and th
41 AznMadSci : Galveston is slowly getting flooded with the runway at GLS flooding over.
42 RFields5421 : From the FAA Airport Status web site: Due to IKE, the Southeast Texas Regional Airport (BPT) was closed as of Sep 12 at 09:00 AM CST. The date/time wh
43 RFields5421 : Flightaware's inadequacy is showing. They are still showing all the normal scheduled to traffic to BPT, HOU and IAH as arriving this afternoon and dep
44 Type-Rated : I noticed on the news they reduced the estimated winds up near IAH from 80mph to 40-60mph. That's good news.
45 RFields5421 : Flightaware is showing the latest arrival at HOU as 10:10 local time and the latest departure at 12:02 local time.
46 RFields5421 : A Careflight A109 from Medical City Hospital in Dallas landed at HOU at 1344 local A Beech KingAir 90 landed at 1340 - and was back in the air at 1350
47 OPNLguy : Still calling for gusts 70-75 kts from 1am on... KIAH 121736Z 121818 04020G35KT P6SM BKN035CB BKN100 BKN250 FM2200 03030G40KT P6SM VCSH BKN030CB BKN0
48 RFields5421 : The CareFlight helicopter left HOU at 1422 - headed for Palestine Texas - KPSN
49 RFields5421 : HOU METAR - KHOU 121853Z 04018G28KT 1353 local time - winds 18 kts from 040 with gusts of 28 kts recorded. I don't like flying helicopters at any time
50 Bcoz : Did all the carriers at HOU ferry all of their aircraft out? What about at IAH? bcoz
51 RFields5421 : Yes most aircraft not hangered are gone. The last COA flight I've seen left IAH at 1502 - a B738 for Fort Lauderdale The last commercial flight to lan
52 Cjpark : My goodness isn't this just too sad. Just think if Southwest had moved to DFW to begin with they would not have this problem would they? On a differe
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