RampRat74 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1384 posts, RR: 2 Posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2883 times:
United Express to Exit Palmdale Market
On December 6, United Express service at Palmdale airport in California will terminate. We are eliminating the least-profitable markets from our fall schedule so that we can compete effectively in a challenging environment in which fuel prices are still more than 50 percent higher than last year and continue to be volatile.
We will be contacting customers directly to accommodate their travel plans. Airport services are provided by Air Wisconsin, and we thank the Palmdale employees for their contribution in the market.
While we worked with airport officials to make our schedule more convenient by adding additional flights and experimenting with various fares, there simply was not enough customer interest to offer this service profitably.
USPIT10L From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 3154 posts, RR: 9 Reply 1, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2860 times:
Somehow I knew that wouldn't last long. UA seems to take the dumbest risks on routes that should be profitable. Why they left there in the first place seems beyond me.
Highflier92660 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 532 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2806 times:
It's remarkable how through the years Southern California regional planners have predicted an explosion of air traffic in the Antelope Valley. I have a book in my collection with a photograph of the late Ronald Reagan almost forty years ago cutting the ribbon at the brand new Lockheed L-1011 Tri-Star factory in Palmdale, a predictor of the industry (and population) that would surely flock to the area in the coming decades. Everybody is still waiting.
Since then air carriers variously flying everything from twin otters to regional jets have attempted to service the Palmdale airport with the same result. Perhaps these same planners-or their descendants- will now become finally convinced an international airport will not be made in Palmdale (a suggestion made long ago) and do something to radically improve LAX.
Gsosbee From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 825 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2758 times:
LA and the surrounding communities will not allow this.
I have lived in the LA area and still do not understand the love for LAX. They will sit in traffic and cuss LAX as they drive past BUR, ONT, LGB, SNA and PMD. If you live anywhere east of downtown LA; south of Carson; or in the Valley and are traveling domestically, it makes no sense to go to LAX.
Lightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 7954 posts, RR: 98 Reply 4, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2597 times:
Quoting RampRat74 (Thread starter): While we worked with airport officials to make our schedule more convenient by adding additional flights and experimenting with various fares, there simply was not enough customer interest to offer this service profitably.
The local market is too small. The defense contractors could have supported a Palmdale-DEN flight... but not at today's fuel prices.
I wish. LAX's lack of capacity is starting to drive business out of LA. BUR, LGB, and SNA lack expansion room. ONT, for most LA businesses, is too far of a drive during the business day. Its past due to expand LAX.
Unfortunately, far more consolidation is required. But recessions are the best time to build infrastructure. I could only dream that funds would be usefully spent on the major US airports.
Pgtravel From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 443 posts, RR: 4 Reply 5, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2497 times:
Quoting Lightsaber (Reply 4): LAX's lack of capacity is starting to drive business out of LA.
It's not so much a lack of capacity but rather who controls it. Flights have been cut dramatically over the last few months, but the airlines control their own terminals. United and Delta are probably the worst offenders - they have far more gates than they need right now but LAWA can't put others in there without actually growing a pair and doing something about it.
But let's be honest, who wants to grow in LA right now? Virgin America is growing and they got their gates in T3. There are still a couple open gates there as well. So, if someone wanted to come in, there's room. I think the only real problem is that Southwest is out of room in T1 and they probably don't want to straddle multiple terminals. If only UA would take in US, then WN could grow.
But back to the original topic . . . this one has been coming for a long time. Flights to SFO are not the way to go here, and I'd be surprised if it could really support anything just yet. Maybe one day, but if this couldn't even work with massive subsidies . . .
PanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 11 Reply 6, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2410 times:
LAX has an agreement with the surrounding communities that it will expand to a certain pre-set number of passengers. If it goes over that limit, then gates will be removed.
BUR, LGB, and SNA have residents ready with bulldozers for the opportunity to close and bulldoze the airports. Being a NIMBY isn't just trendy there, it's your patriotic duty, and anyone caught saying, "the airport ain't so bad" will be tarred, feathered, and run out of town. They will NEVER expand, period.
ONT and PMD are the only viable alternatives (other than perhaps PSP), but driving through the L.A. metroplex can be a nightmare, 24/7/365.
People love airports when they have plane tickets to go on vacation, but when it comes to their infrastructure, people HATE them with a passion. They will buy a ticket from a distant airport that costs $5 less than a nearby airport and then spend more than that in gas (and time and frustration as well!) getting to the airport.
You can't legislate intelligence.
Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
Rampart From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 2330 posts, RR: 8 Reply 7, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2194 times:
Palmdale should be the equivalent of New York's Newburgh (SWF). Both metro areas have their cluster of main and satellite airports, and both need capacity relief. While Newburgh hasn't been a huge success, it has maintained multiple airlines over many years now, and is expected to grow. Like Newburgh is now part of PANYNJ, isn't Palmdale part of LAWA? It should work somehow. What's the big difference between Palmdale and Newburgh?
Knope2001 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2311 posts, RR: 34 Reply 8, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2144 times:
Quoting Rampart (Reply 7): What's the big difference between Palmdale and Newburgh?
Income makes a big difference in the amount of leisure flying.
Average family income
Palmdale $49,293
Lancaster $48,276
Putnam County NY $82,197
Orange County NY$60,355
Dutchess County NY $63,254
Also, a key difference is having a solid leisure travel market destination. Namely, Florida.
Business-aimed flights out of SWF have not done very well, but there's definitely a market for snowbird traffic.
At PMD, there really isn't any similar single destination that lots of local residents would fly to. Maybe if Vegas were a 15 hour drive away there might be enough local PMD-LAS traffic for big aircraft. But it's only around 3 1/2 hours.
474218 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6340 posts, RR: 9 Reply 9, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2008 times:
Quoting Highflier92660 (Reply 2): It's remarkable how through the years Southern California regional planners have predicted an explosion of air traffic in the Antelope Valley. I have a book in my collection with a photograph of the late Ronald Reagan almost forty years ago cutting the ribbon at the brand new Lockheed L-1011 Tri-Star factory in Palmdale, a predictor of the industry (and population) that would surely flock to the area in the coming decades. Everybody is still waiting.
I moved to Palmdale in 1955, population was less than 5,000 people today is is close to 200,000 people, the growth is there. Why has air service to PMD failed, see the answer below.
Quoting Rampart (Reply 7): What's the big difference between Palmdale and Newburgh?
The main difference between Palmdale and Newburgh: The car, people in Southern California don't have a problem driving an hour or two to get to one of the major airport. I lived in Palmdale, worked in Burbank drove it every day for nine years, thats 120 miles a day. Its something that Southern Californians have done for years and I can't see them changing anytime soon.
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From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1384 posts, 
BUR, LGB, and SNA lack expansion room. ONT, for most LA businesses, is too far of a drive during the business day. Its past due to expand LAX.
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