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VS To Reduce LHR-LAX Schedules In Winter 2009.  
User currently offlineLACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Posted (5 years 10 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6880 times:
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Hi All,

Per airlineblogspot.com VS will be reducing their LHR-LAX-LHR flights during the slow Winter season in 2009. The affected flight will be VS 23 & 24. It will go from daily to operating X3 weekly up to X6 weekly from 19 January 2009 thru 28 March 2009 varying week by week..
How can I find out what their loads have been on their flights to & from LAX?

Link: http://airlineroute.blogspot.com/200...n-atlantic-reduce-los-angeles.html

At first I was a bit surprised but then when I thought about BA's Winter cutbacks @ LAX as well, it makes complete since with the out of control fuel prices and the economical problems here in the U.S. in addition to the worsening financial crisis within the state of California.


Does anyone else have any information about this or any other season cutbacks in international markets other than BA's reduction of one daily flight CX's reduction of one daily flight as well and the expected UA discontinuation of FRA.

Best
LACA773

[Edited 2008-09-25 01:25:39]

29 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1131 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 10 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 6769 times:

BA are doing similar with their Tokyo service by having one service BA5/6 operate one month then the next having BA7/8 operate and then changing it again. It is a way of keeping the slot without having to run the service full time. Expect a lot of this for the coming winter season.

User currently offlineCabinboy From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2000, 189 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 10 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 6650 times:

Actually there are allot of ad-hoc VS cancellations in the upcoming winter schedule mostly to LAX, NRT, PVG, HKG, ORD and NBO

User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4801 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (5 years 10 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 6646 times:



Quoting LACA773 (Thread starter):
Does anyone else have any information about this or any other season cutbacks in international markets

NZ has/is cutting back its LAX-LHR service also from 744 to 772ER...still remaining daily however.



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineUnitedTristar From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (5 years 10 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6552 times:

AA is dropping the second LAXLHR trip...looking forward to next summer its still gone

-m

 airplane 


User currently offlineF1eddie From Ireland, joined May 2007, 461 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (5 years 10 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6501 times:

Looks like EI did the right thing by completely dropping it for the winter period if these big players are cutting back on LAX. Although we do think it will resume for next summer. No confirmation on that though yet...


Flown on EI, FR, BMI, TG, PG, FD, JQ, DJ, LA, NZ, SQ, DL, LX, LH
User currently offlineLACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (5 years 10 months 1 day ago) and read 6398 times:
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Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 3):
NZ has/is cutting back its LAX-LHR service also from 744 to 772ER...still remaining daily however.

As I remember, they normally do this when Autum comes around signaling the begining of our slow season.

Quoting UnitedTristar (Reply 4):
AA is dropping the second LAXLHR trip...looking forward to next summer its still gone

They have always done this.

Quoting F1eddie (Reply 5):
Looks like EI did the right thing by completely dropping it for the winter period if these big players are cutting back on LAX. Although we do think it will resume for next summer. No confirmation on that though yet...

I'm sorry I forgot to mention EI. I'm glad they kept their SFO service intact for the time being.


User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6491 posts, RR: 55
Reply 7, posted (5 years 10 months 20 hours ago) and read 6086 times:

Don't forget BR and CI that have cut some flights already. On some days, BR only have one flight, on other days they have three including KIX. CI has dropped the afternoon flight a few times a week.

On the other hand, TG will switch to 772 with same frequency and we'll get some new carriers; EK and VA both with 777s as well.

The777Man



Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4801 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (5 years 10 months 11 hours ago) and read 5801 times:



Quoting LACA773 (Reply 6):
Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 3):
NZ has/is cutting back its LAX-LHR service also from 744 to 772ER...still remaining daily however.

As I remember, they normally do this when Autum comes around signaling the begining of our slow season.

Well it may be the slow season, but they are doing it to save a few million $ pa on this sector alone.



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11416 posts, RR: 59
Reply 9, posted (5 years 10 months 9 hours ago) and read 5729 times:
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Quoting Cabinboy (Reply 2):
Actually there are allot of ad-hoc VS cancellations in the upcoming winter schedule mostly to LAX, NRT, PVG, HKG, ORD and NBO

VS should look for more destinations in the South to use such capacity in the winter season, like Airlines from US are doing. The problem would be the lack of capacity on summer. May be when they begin services to GIG, BKK and MEL (as well as why not EZE) they can take such advantage.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineAaway From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1521 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 5485 times:



Quoting LACA773 (Thread starter):
Does anyone else have any information about this or any other season cutbacks in international markets other than BA's reduction of one daily flight CX's reduction of one daily flight as well and the expected UA discontinuation of FRA.



Quoting The777Man (Reply 7):
Don't forget BR and CI that have cut some flights already. On some days, BR only have one flight, on other days they have three including KIX. CI has dropped the afternoon flight a few times a week.

Yes, the LAX-China/Taiwan sector really underperformed this summer. CA never began their 2nd PEK-LAX-PEK r/t. CZ and MU have had several ad-hoc cancellations (about 30 by MU from Jun. through Sep.) BR had several as well, prior to implementing a reduction effective with its Sep. sked.

Have also seen ad hocs cancels by AI (which has withdrawn from LAX) and SQ (recent chatter has indicated very, very light loads on SQ's soon to be discontinued TPE-LAX-TPE flight.)

Skeds have been finalized for the upcoming winter season, but its rumored that MU will have additional ad hocs. Also, CZ's presence is very tenuous - but will likely begin with additional ad hocs prior to any move toward a withdrawal from LAX.

Beyond that, just the typical seasonal drawdowns...at this point in time.



With a choice between changing one's mind & proving there's no need to do so, most everyone gets busy on the proof.
User currently offlineLACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5360 times:
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Quoting Aaway (Reply 10):

Yes, the LAX-China/Taiwan sector really underperformed this summer. CA never began their 2nd PEK-LAX-PEK r/t. CZ and MU have had several ad-hoc cancellations (about 30 by MU from Jun. through Sep.) BR had several as well, prior to implementing a reduction effective with its Sep. sked.

Have also seen ad hocs cancels by AI (which has withdrawn from LAX) and SQ (recent chatter has indicated very, very light loads on SQ's soon to be discontinued TPE-LAX-TPE flight.)

Skeds have been finalized for the upcoming winter season, but its rumored that MU will have additional ad hocs. Also, CZ's presence is very tenuous - but will likely begin with additional ad hocs prior to any move toward a withdrawal from LAX.

Beyond that, just the typical seasonal drawdowns...at this point in time.

Thanks for the information Aaway. Didn't SQ discontinue their TPE flight earlier this month?

Do you think CZ's days @ LAX are numbered considering the fuel costs and economical problems? It would seem not to make sense for them to continually cancel flights and then on other days operate. Are they basically doing this on flight with very light loads and no freight?


User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7492 posts, RR: 24
Reply 12, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5312 times:



Quoting Aaway (Reply 10):
Skeds have been finalized for the upcoming winter season, but its rumored that MU will have additional ad hocs. Also, CZ's presence is very tenuous - but will likely begin with additional ad hocs prior to any move toward a withdrawal from LAX.

I would hate to see anything happen to CZ or MU. That would leave LAX without service to PVG or CAN.

In the end LAX might be fine without service to CAN, but lack of LAX-PVG service would be awful.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineSingapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13738 posts, RR: 19
Reply 13, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5305 times:



Quoting Aaway (Reply 10):
(recent chatter has indicated very, very light loads on SQ's soon to be discontinued TPE-LAX-TPE flight.)

Loads are alright but yields are just  yuck 



Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6491 posts, RR: 55
Reply 14, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5293 times:

SQ still flies LAX-TPE-SIN until around 25Oct08.

The777Man



Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7492 posts, RR: 24
Reply 15, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5288 times:



Quoting The777Man (Reply 14):
SQ still flies LAX-TPE-SIN until around 25Oct08.



Quoting Singapore_Air (Reply 13):
Loads are alright but yields are just

I wish SQ could find another routeing that works for them from LAX. I might be wrong, but I feel like there could be 2 flights in addition to the nonstop from LAX-SIN. If TPE doesnt work, then maybe SQ might be able to find another stopping point. I would love to see them fly LAX-HKG-SIN.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6491 posts, RR: 55
Reply 16, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5285 times:



Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 15):
I would love to see them fly LAX-HKG-SIN

I would love to see that too! With a 777-300/ER!!

The777Man



Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
User currently offlineAaway From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1521 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5031 times:



Quoting LACA773 (Reply 11):
Do you think CZ's days @ LAX are numbered considering the fuel costs and economical problems? It would seem not to make sense for them to continually cancel flights and then on other days operate. Are they basically doing this on flight with very light loads and no freight?

Being merely an observer (I don't have regular contact with CZ staff), I can only surmize based upon anecdotal information. Yet, the anecdotal evidence is fairly strong:

(1) The Chinese economy has curtailed (albeit temporarily) its ascent due to inflationary pressures / devaluation of the yuan.

(2) According to the Wall Street Journal, the CAN market has exhibited some market bubble symptoms - overbuilt industrially, speculative office real estate development.

(3) Don't underestimate the continuing reverberations of the earthquake. Though CAN itself wasn't directly affected, various economic links between CAN and that wide swath of southwest Chinese provinces have been. Of the Chinese 'Big 3', CZ has the largest presence in the region via CAN, CSX, KMG and KWE.

In summation, CZ has had difficulties on top of what had thus far been a tough market. Specific to LAX, the ad hoc cancellations have occurred on days when pax loads have been light. In recent the past (read, lower fuel costs) this could be mitigated somewhat by cargo loads. Now, the highly directional nature of that side is cause for greater scrutiny.

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 12):
I would hate to see anything happen to CZ or MU. That would leave LAX without service to PVG or CAN.

PVG will remain, though the player(s) may change.

Quoting Singapore_Air (Reply 13):
Quoting Aaway (Reply 10):
(recent chatter has indicated very, very light loads on SQ's soon to be discontinued TPE-LAX-TPE flight.)

Loads are alright but yields are just

Thanks for the imput. A recent chat (or hearsay  Smile) with SQ had indicated multiple days of sub 100 pax loads for this flight.

You're on the mark regarding the yield. BR's reduction of what, historically, has been its heavily patronized afternoon LAX-TPE departure is indicative of this.

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 15):
I wish SQ could find another routeing that works for them from LAX. I might be wrong, but I feel like there could be 2 flights in addition to the nonstop from LAX-SIN. If TPE doesnt work, then maybe SQ might be able to find another stopping point.

The very recently amended Japan-Singapore aviation agreement gives Singaporean air carriers beyond rights to the U.S. ex-KIX and NGO. Who knows?????



With a choice between changing one's mind & proving there's no need to do so, most everyone gets busy on the proof.
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32596 posts, RR: 72
Reply 18, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4948 times:



Quoting LACA773 (Reply 6):
Quoting UnitedTristar (Reply 4):
AA is dropping the second LAXLHR trip...looking forward to next summer its still gone

They have always done this.

They are not resuming the second flight next summer.



a.
User currently offlineUPPERDECKFAN From Spain, joined Jun 2007, 992 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (5 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4863 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 18):
They are not resuming the second flight next summer.

Where will the 772 be deployed next summer?



744,742,741,772,773,762,732,735,738,752,727,717,DC10,DC9,M82,M87,319,320,321,343,346,L1011,CRJ2,CRJ9,E190,ATR42,DSH8,
User currently offlineLACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (5 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4456 times:
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Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 18):
They are not resuming the second flight next summer.

Thankyou for the information Mark.
How did the second daily seasonal LHR flight do out of LAX for AA this past summer with all the economical problems here in the U.S.?


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32596 posts, RR: 72
Reply 21, posted (5 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4455 times:



Quoting UPPERDECKFAN (Reply 19):
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 18):
They are not resuming the second flight next summer.

Where will the 772 be deployed next summer?

MIA-MAD and DFW-GRU are now year-round 777s, and MIA-GRU is now year-round 3x daily 777s. That right there is 5 777s that were used elsewhere last summer.

Quoting LACA773 (Reply 20):
How did the second daily seasonal LHR flight do out of LAX for AA this past summer with all the economical problems here in the U.S.?

No idea, but LAX-LHR is traditionally a very strong route for AA.



a.
User currently offlineCoolfish1103 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 402 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (5 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4427 times:



Quoting Aaway (Reply 17):

The very recently amended Japan-Singapore aviation agreement gives Singaporean air carriers beyond rights to the U.S. ex-KIX and NGO. Who knows?????

For East Coast destinations only.

EVA has kept the reduced 17 weekly schedule (2 daily + 3 weekly via KIX), and CAL has put their frequencies back to 2 daily. SIA is about to end this route, which I am unsure if that's good for the passengers... or the airlines. MAS will also operate at a reduced 3-5 weekly schedule

Would be fun to see TPE-PVG-LAX being a route made, since both TPE-PVG and PVG-LAX would have some great markets.


User currently offlineLACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (5 years 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 4136 times:
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Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21):
No idea, but LAX-LHR is traditionally a very strong route for AA

I thought it was as well, Mark. It would make sense for them to cut this second flight due to the remarkable increase in costs associated with these flights do to the cost of fuel like it has affected so many other strong/healthy airlines.


User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7380 posts, RR: 17
Reply 24, posted (5 years 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4016 times:

Over the winter timetable BA are planning to operate 2 flights a day LHR-LAX for 12 weeks and three flights a day for 11 weeks.

BA283 and BA269 are scheduled to operate weeks commencing 27 Oct, 3 Nov, 10 Nov, 2 Feb, 9 Feb and 16 Feb.

BA283 and BA279 are scheduled to operate weeks commencing17 Nov, 24 Nov, 1 Dec, 12 Jan, 19 Jan and 26 Jan.

BA279, BA283 and BA269 are scheduled to operate weeks commencing 8 Dec, 15 Dec, 22 Dec, 29 Dec, 5 Jan, 23 Feb, 2 Mar, 9 Mar 16 Mar, 23 Mar and 30 Mar.

As Theginge has pointed (Reply 1) out the switching from BA279 to BA269 when only two flights are operating is to preserve grandfather rights to the LHR slots used by both flights.

Not dissimilar schedules apply to many other BA routes this winter.


25 LAXdude1023 : No word on where that particular 777 will be, but I can tell you that the LHR slot will be used for the 3rd daily DFW-LHR (or at least now its slated
26 Joeljack : Is UA still flying LHR-LAX?? Or did they drop that?
27 UpstateDave : Its been widely reported on v-flyer, that the cancellations are due to schedule heavy maintenance coming up this fall. Originally VS had planned on le
28 LAXintl : Daily 777. Was on it last week.
29 LACA773 : Wow! When I first started reading your post, VV701 I was wondering why BA would do that instead of running the two of three most popular flights they
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