LACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3749 posts, RR: 2 Posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 5157 times:
Hi All,
Per airlineblogspot.com VS will be reducing their LHR-LAX-LHR flights during the slow Winter season in 2009. The affected flight will be VS 23 & 24. It will go from daily to operating X3 weekly up to X6 weekly from 19 January 2009 thru 28 March 2009 varying week by week..
How can I find out what their loads have been on their flights to & from LAX?
At first I was a bit surprised but then when I thought about BA's Winter cutbacks @ LAX as well, it makes complete since with the out of control fuel prices and the economical problems here in the U.S. in addition to the worsening financial crisis within the state of California.
Does anyone else have any information about this or any other season cutbacks in international markets other than BA's reduction of one daily flight CX's reduction of one daily flight as well and the expected UA discontinuation of FRA.
Theginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1110 posts, RR: 0 Reply 1, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 5046 times:
BA are doing similar with their Tokyo service by having one service BA5/6 operate one month then the next having BA7/8 operate and then changing it again. It is a way of keeping the slot without having to run the service full time. Expect a lot of this for the coming winter season.
UnitedTristar From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1240 posts, RR: 4 Reply 4, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 4829 times:
AA is dropping the second LAXLHR trip...looking forward to next summer its still gone
-m
Welcome aboard United Airlines L1011 Friendship Service to Osaka!
F1eddie From Ireland, joined May 2007, 461 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 4778 times:
Looks like EI did the right thing by completely dropping it for the winter period if these big players are cutting back on LAX. Although we do think it will resume for next summer. No confirmation on that though yet...
Flown on EI, FR, BMI, TG, PG, FD, JQ, DJ, LA, NZ, SQ, DL, LX, LH
LACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3749 posts, RR: 2 Reply 6, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 4675 times:
Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 3): NZ has/is cutting back its LAX-LHR service also from 744 to 772ER...still remaining daily however.
As I remember, they normally do this when Autum comes around signaling the begining of our slow season.
Quoting UnitedTristar (Reply 4): AA is dropping the second LAXLHR trip...looking forward to next summer its still gone
They have always done this.
Quoting F1eddie (Reply 5): Looks like EI did the right thing by completely dropping it for the winter period if these big players are cutting back on LAX. Although we do think it will resume for next summer. No confirmation on that though yet...
I'm sorry I forgot to mention EI. I'm glad they kept their SFO service intact for the time being.
The777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6082 posts, RR: 56 Reply 7, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4363 times:
Don't forget BR and CI that have cut some flights already. On some days, BR only have one flight, on other days they have three including KIX. CI has dropped the afternoon flight a few times a week.
On the other hand, TG will switch to 772 with same frequency and we'll get some new carriers; EK and VA both with 777s as well.
The777Man
Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....GA, T5, CI and LX 777s
Zkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4739 posts, RR: 10 Reply 8, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4078 times:
Quoting LACA773 (Reply 6): Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 3):
NZ has/is cutting back its LAX-LHR service also from 744 to 772ER...still remaining daily however.
As I remember, they normally do this when Autum comes around signaling the begining of our slow season.
Well it may be the slow season, but they are doing it to save a few million $ pa on this sector alone.
LipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11201 posts, RR: 61 Reply 9, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 4006 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW FORUM MODERATOR
Quoting Cabinboy (Reply 2): Actually there are allot of ad-hoc VS cancellations in the upcoming winter schedule mostly to LAX, NRT, PVG, HKG, ORD and NBO
VS should look for more destinations in the South to use such capacity in the winter season, like Airlines from US are doing. The problem would be the lack of capacity on summer. May be when they begin services to GIG, BKK and MEL (as well as why not EZE) they can take such advantage.
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
Aaway From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1442 posts, RR: 14 Reply 10, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 3762 times:
Quoting LACA773 (Thread starter): Does anyone else have any information about this or any other season cutbacks in international markets other than BA's reduction of one daily flight CX's reduction of one daily flight as well and the expected UA discontinuation of FRA.
Quoting The777Man (Reply 7): Don't forget BR and CI that have cut some flights already. On some days, BR only have one flight, on other days they have three including KIX. CI has dropped the afternoon flight a few times a week.
Yes, the LAX-China/Taiwan sector really underperformed this summer. CA never began their 2nd PEK-LAX-PEK r/t. CZ and MU have had several ad-hoc cancellations (about 30 by MU from Jun. through Sep.) BR had several as well, prior to implementing a reduction effective with its Sep. sked.
Have also seen ad hocs cancels by AI (which has withdrawn from LAX) and SQ (recent chatter has indicated very, very light loads on SQ's soon to be discontinued TPE-LAX-TPE flight.)
Skeds have been finalized for the upcoming winter season, but its rumored that MU will have additional ad hocs. Also, CZ's presence is very tenuous - but will likely begin with additional ad hocs prior to any move toward a withdrawal from LAX.
Beyond that, just the typical seasonal drawdowns...at this point in time.
With a choice between changing one's mind & proving there's no need to do so, most everyone gets busy on the proof.
LACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3749 posts, RR: 2 Reply 11, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3637 times:
Quoting Aaway (Reply 10):
Yes, the LAX-China/Taiwan sector really underperformed this summer. CA never began their 2nd PEK-LAX-PEK r/t. CZ and MU have had several ad-hoc cancellations (about 30 by MU from Jun. through Sep.) BR had several as well, prior to implementing a reduction effective with its Sep. sked.
Have also seen ad hocs cancels by AI (which has withdrawn from LAX) and SQ (recent chatter has indicated very, very light loads on SQ's soon to be discontinued TPE-LAX-TPE flight.)
Skeds have been finalized for the upcoming winter season, but its rumored that MU will have additional ad hocs. Also, CZ's presence is very tenuous - but will likely begin with additional ad hocs prior to any move toward a withdrawal from LAX.
Beyond that, just the typical seasonal drawdowns...at this point in time.
Thanks for the information Aaway. Didn't SQ discontinue their TPE flight earlier this month?
Do you think CZ's days @ LAX are numbered considering the fuel costs and economical problems? It would seem not to make sense for them to continually cancel flights and then on other days operate. Are they basically doing this on flight with very light loads and no freight?
LAXdude1023 From Lebanon, joined Sep 2006, 6779 posts, RR: 25 Reply 12, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3589 times:
Quoting Aaway (Reply 10): Skeds have been finalized for the upcoming winter season, but its rumored that MU will have additional ad hocs. Also, CZ's presence is very tenuous - but will likely begin with additional ad hocs prior to any move toward a withdrawal from LAX.
I would hate to see anything happen to CZ or MU. That would leave LAX without service to PVG or CAN.
In the end LAX might be fine without service to CAN, but lack of LAX-PVG service would be awful.
DFW Fan Boy: Im crude, irreverent, and blunt, but Im not clueless. I offer no apologies.
The777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6082 posts, RR: 56 Reply 14, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3570 times:
SQ still flies LAX-TPE-SIN until around 25Oct08.
The777Man
Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....GA, T5, CI and LX 777s
I wish SQ could find another routeing that works for them from LAX. I might be wrong, but I feel like there could be 2 flights in addition to the nonstop from LAX-SIN. If TPE doesnt work, then maybe SQ might be able to find another stopping point. I would love to see them fly LAX-HKG-SIN.
DFW Fan Boy: Im crude, irreverent, and blunt, but Im not clueless. I offer no apologies.
The777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6082 posts, RR: 56 Reply 16, posted (4 years 7 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3562 times:
Aaway From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1442 posts, RR: 14 Reply 17, posted (4 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3308 times:
Quoting LACA773 (Reply 11): Do you think CZ's days @ LAX are numbered considering the fuel costs and economical problems? It would seem not to make sense for them to continually cancel flights and then on other days operate. Are they basically doing this on flight with very light loads and no freight?
Being merely an observer (I don't have regular contact with CZ staff), I can only surmize based upon anecdotal information. Yet, the anecdotal evidence is fairly strong:
(1) The Chinese economy has curtailed (albeit temporarily) its ascent due to inflationary pressures / devaluation of the yuan.
(2) According to the Wall Street Journal, the CAN market has exhibited some market bubble symptoms - overbuilt industrially, speculative office real estate development.
(3) Don't underestimate the continuing reverberations of the earthquake. Though CAN itself wasn't directly affected, various economic links between CAN and that wide swath of southwest Chinese provinces have been. Of the Chinese 'Big 3', CZ has the largest presence in the region via CAN, CSX, KMG and KWE.
In summation, CZ has had difficulties on top of what had thus far been a tough market. Specific to LAX, the ad hoc cancellations have occurred on days when pax loads have been light. In recent the past (read, lower fuel costs) this could be mitigated somewhat by cargo loads. Now, the highly directional nature of that side is cause for greater scrutiny.
Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 12): I would hate to see anything happen to CZ or MU. That would leave LAX without service to PVG or CAN.
PVG will remain, though the player(s) may change.
Quoting Singapore_Air (Reply 13): Quoting Aaway (Reply 10):
(recent chatter has indicated very, very light loads on SQ's soon to be discontinued TPE-LAX-TPE flight.)
Loads are alright but yields are just
Thanks for the imput. A recent chat (or hearsay ) with SQ had indicated multiple days of sub 100 pax loads for this flight.
You're on the mark regarding the yield. BR's reduction of what, historically, has been its heavily patronized afternoon LAX-TPE departure is indicative of this.
Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 15): I wish SQ could find another routeing that works for them from LAX. I might be wrong, but I feel like there could be 2 flights in addition to the nonstop from LAX-SIN. If TPE doesnt work, then maybe SQ might be able to find another stopping point.
The very recently amended Japan-Singapore aviation agreement gives Singaporean air carriers beyond rights to the U.S. ex-KIX and NGO. Who knows?????
With a choice between changing one's mind & proving there's no need to do so, most everyone gets busy on the proof.
LACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3749 posts, RR: 2 Reply 20, posted (4 years 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2733 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 18): They are not resuming the second flight next summer.
Thankyou for the information Mark.
How did the second daily seasonal LHR flight do out of LAX for AA this past summer with all the economical problems here in the U.S.?
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31117 posts, RR: 74 Reply 21, posted (4 years 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2732 times:
Quoting UPPERDECKFAN (Reply 19): Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 18):
They are not resuming the second flight next summer.
Where will the 772 be deployed next summer?
MIA-MAD and DFW-GRU are now year-round 777s, and MIA-GRU is now year-round 3x daily 777s. That right there is 5 777s that were used elsewhere last summer.
Quoting LACA773 (Reply 20): How did the second daily seasonal LHR flight do out of LAX for AA this past summer with all the economical problems here in the U.S.?
No idea, but LAX-LHR is traditionally a very strong route for AA.
Coolfish1103 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 384 posts, RR: 0 Reply 22, posted (4 years 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2704 times:
Quoting Aaway (Reply 17):
The very recently amended Japan-Singapore aviation agreement gives Singaporean air carriers beyond rights to the U.S. ex-KIX and NGO. Who knows?????
For East Coast destinations only.
EVA has kept the reduced 17 weekly schedule (2 daily + 3 weekly via KIX), and CAL has put their frequencies back to 2 daily. SIA is about to end this route, which I am unsure if that's good for the passengers... or the airlines. MAS will also operate at a reduced 3-5 weekly schedule
Would be fun to see TPE-PVG-LAX being a route made, since both TPE-PVG and PVG-LAX would have some great markets.
LACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3749 posts, RR: 2 Reply 23, posted (4 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 2413 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21): No idea, but LAX-LHR is traditionally a very strong route for AA
I thought it was as well, Mark. It would make sense for them to cut this second flight due to the remarkable increase in costs associated with these flights do to the cost of fuel like it has affected so many other strong/healthy airlines.
VV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 6621 posts, RR: 17 Reply 24, posted (4 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2293 times:
Over the winter timetable BA are planning to operate 2 flights a day LHR-LAX for 12 weeks and three flights a day for 11 weeks.
BA283 and BA269 are scheduled to operate weeks commencing 27 Oct, 3 Nov, 10 Nov, 2 Feb, 9 Feb and 16 Feb.
BA283 and BA279 are scheduled to operate weeks commencing17 Nov, 24 Nov, 1 Dec, 12 Jan, 19 Jan and 26 Jan.
BA279, BA283 and BA269 are scheduled to operate weeks commencing 8 Dec, 15 Dec, 22 Dec, 29 Dec, 5 Jan, 23 Feb, 2 Mar, 9 Mar 16 Mar, 23 Mar and 30 Mar.
As Theginge has pointed (Reply 1) out the switching from BA279 to BA269 when only two flights are operating is to preserve grandfather rights to the LHR slots used by both flights.
Not dissimilar schedules apply to many other BA routes this winter.
25 LAXdude1023: No word on where that particular 777 will be, but I can tell you that the LHR slot will be used for the 3rd daily DFW-LHR (or at least now its slated
26 Joeljack: Is UA still flying LHR-LAX?? Or did they drop that?
27 UpstateDave: Its been widely reported on v-flyer, that the cancellations are due to schedule heavy maintenance coming up this fall. Originally VS had planned on le
29 LACA773: Wow! When I first started reading your post, VV701 I was wondering why BA would do that instead of running the two of three most popular flights they
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) with SQ had indicated multiple days of sub 100 pax loads for this flight.
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