Malaysia From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 3185 posts, RR: 0 Reply 1, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3389 times:
I guess yes its for MX at HAECO.
I wonder if a 764 can possibly make it fully-loaded ANC-HKG (just a scenario)
curious if YVR-HKG would be pushing its limits? for example
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NorthstarBoy From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1713 posts, RR: 1 Reply 3, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 3094 times:
Just out of curiosity, why would DL outsource any mx when they have their own mx department, wouldn't they just send the plane to techops in Atl? why go to the extra expense to fly the plane all the way to Hkg, plus pay an outside contractor when they can just use their own employees and avoid unnecessary extra expenses?
I could have elite status if I wanted it, but flying the same airline all the time is boring.
ChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1605 posts, RR: 1 Reply 4, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 3050 times:
Quoting NorthstarBoy (Reply 3): Just out of curiosity, why would DL outsource any mx when they have their own mx department, wouldn't they just send the plane to techops in Atl? why go to the extra expense to fly the plane all the way to Hkg, plus pay an outside contractor when they can just use their own employees and avoid unnecessary extra expenses?
It's still less expensive to send it over to HKG. Amazing, isn't it?
DeltaMIA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1672 posts, RR: 19 Reply 6, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 2977 times:
Quoting NorthstarBoy (Reply 3): Just out of curiosity, why would DL outsource any mx when they have their own mx department, wouldn't they just send the plane to techops in Atl? why go to the extra expense to fly the plane all the way to Hkg, plus pay an outside contractor when they can just use their own employees and avoid unnecessary extra expenses?
If Delta does it inhouse then they make no money off of it. The time and manpower hours saved are used to work on Tech Ops income generating contracts that Delta has with other airlines.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
DeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 8598 posts, RR: 8 Reply 8, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 2856 times:
If Delta does it inhouse then they make no money off of it. The time and manpower hours saved are used to work on Tech Ops income generating contracts that Delta has with other airlines.
Not only that Delta is pretty much out of floor space do do much more MX. They have started sending MX up to CVG and even starting to do MX in LAX at the old WA hangar. Till they get more floor space they will have to get the fleet where it is.
I want to say 75% of DL's MX is done in house.
Anyone know if DL is pleased with HAECO?
"Oh look at the sUGAr falling out of the sky! Look at the sUGAr falling out of the sky!" LM 1922-2011 Go Dawgs! G.A.T.A.
WorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 9, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2780 times:
DL outsources overhaul maintenance but then insources (brings other airline work into DL) primarily involving engine work. DL has determined it is cheaper to outsource heavy airframe related work because its facilities and mechanics can turn around and do work for other carriers that is much higher margin.
Also, as you well know, DL is doing alot of mods on its fleet as it moves planes to int'l uses and upgrades the onboard product. DL's maintenance is running flat out full and they still are contracting work out.
Dalmd88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2367 posts, RR: 15 Reply 10, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 2749 times:
Quoting NorthstarBoy (Reply 3): Just out of curiosity, why would DL outsource any mx when they have their own mx department, wouldn't they just send the plane to techops in Atl?
All HMV work for the 767/757 and MD88/90 fleets have been outsourced since I believe 2004. That is about the same time the DFW and TPA hangars were closed. The work done in those hangars was either part of the outsourced work or moved to ATL. Also in that same time period we gave up the old EA hangar in ATL. That work was moved over to TOC I were narrowbody HMV's were done. The 777 and 738 work is still done inhouse. I truely think they would have outsourced the larger checks for these fleets but had a hard time finding a vendor that could meet their terms.
The HMV work allegedlly can be done cheaper at outside vendors. Once it went out the door it will never come back. To ramp up two Maddog lines and at least four 757/767 lines would take hangar space we no longer have and another 1000 mechanics that are no longer on the payroll. These fleets are also geting near the end of their life cycle. Why invest in opening new lines only to do one more cycle of HMV's.
One poster stated DL is outsourcing HMV's so the mechanics can do more lucrative insource work. Sounds good, but I don't think we really grew the airframe insourcing much since we let all the DL heavy work go. Yes, we have some airframe work with World and the US Navy. These are the shorter high dollar visits, but most of the insource dollars I think are coming on the engine and component sides.
As far as the quality if the work coming out of our current round of vendors, I really am out of the loop now. We had some problems with the first contracts we sent out. Some blame to the vendors for quality issues or not being able to meet the contract and some blame to DL for very poor contracts. I haven't heard any horror stories about planes need a ton of work on return so I guess the quality of the work is OK. It is hard to tell though. With some of the HMV work you don't know until the plane gets ripped apart again. Are we saving money? I think they can make the number look like we are. Like I said, now the costs of reopening lines make outsourcing look even better.
MD88Guy From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 2 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2320 times:
While at Delta TechOps in ATL I worked as a liaison engineer on the last MD-88 HMV. I also believe the last 757 HMV was happening at the same time, but I'm not completely sure about that. The TechOps crew that did the MD-88 HMV's was top notch - these guys had the HMV down to a science. For the three years I worked at Delta, I spent all my time supporting MD-88 HMV's, and it was the most enjoyable job I've had yet. I was devastated to hear that they were closing the HMV line and couldn't believe they would be able to do it better anywhere else. But then I realized that in our changing world the airlines don't care so much about quality anymore, it's about bottom line. So long as the planes stay in the air they don't care. From what I heard, the first few HMV's were somewhat shoddy, but I'm not sure what happened after that, as the guys I worked with slowly left Delta for more prosperous jobs.
LAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 22077 posts, RR: 51 Reply 12, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2189 times:
With heavy checks taking up 1,000's of man-hours in labor, it becomes quite compelling to look for way to reduce this cost which has grown to become the single largest portion of heavy checks.
The average hourly labor cost (incl benefits) amongst the US majors comes in the $40-50hr range. Being able to shave $10 off this(or even more overseas) can save airlines huge sums of money over time.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
DeltaGuy767 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 633 posts, RR: 2 Reply 13, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1653 times:
Talking about hangars, what does DL use their hangar in BOS for?
Malaysia From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 3185 posts, RR: 0 Reply 14, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1474 times:
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 12): With heavy checks taking up 1,000's of man-hours in labor, it becomes quite compelling to look for way to reduce this cost which has grown to become the single largest portion of heavy checks.
But it puts a lot of US mx workers out of work and plus makes it harder for them to find work, since things go overseas. (sure some dream to not mind moving overseas to do it, but they cannot be given work-permits, since A/C mx does not really fall into a category that is in demand to provide work permits for US licensed mx)
Now it has been Maintenance.... Reservations Centers... All Industry Call Centers... and even now Accouting as well.
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
Luckyone From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1588 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1446 times:
A friend of the family actually works for DL in Hong Kong. I'm not entirely sure of his job responsibilities, but he does work on the 767. He has, I believe, six weeks on, two weeks off. Living in Georgia he flies to NRT and then catches the DL flight home.
LAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 22077 posts, RR: 51 Reply 16, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1295 times:
Quoting Malaysia (Reply 14): But it puts a lot of US mx workers out of work and plus makes it harder for them to find work, since things go overseas.
Well, thats what happens when Americas labor prices themselves out of a global arena.
Either they must do it 1) cheaper or 2) more efficiently otherwise more and more such work will walk.
Its only natural.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
Malaysia From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 3185 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 1144 times:
Quoting Luckyone (Reply 15): A friend of the family actually works for DL in Hong Kong. I'm not entirely sure of his job responsibilities, but he does work on the 767. He has, I believe, six weeks on, two weeks off. Living in Georgia he flies to NRT and then catches the DL flight home.
Probably Quality Assurance to babysit the HAECO guys, I doubt any airline would just drop a plane off at some place devoid of some individual that works for the airline. They need some sort of observation on what work is being done. I wonder if any airlines do outsourcing and not bother sending atleast 1 person over to watch.
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
DALMD88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2367 posts, RR: 15 Reply 18, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 1037 times:
Quoting DeltaGuy767 (Reply 13): Talking about hangars, what does DL use their hangar in BOS for?
BOS is a Line hangar just like CVG and SLC. They are used mostly overnight visit items. A prime example is a lube visit. BOS and CVG both do flight control lube visits for the 757 fleet. We also do engine changes and fuel tank work. Both of those jobs are best done out of the weather. Many nights in BOS we don't have anything that requires a hangar. So we just use it as remote parking, since we have more overnights than we have gate space for.
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