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Hawaiian Air & The A330 Question...  
User currently offlineB6FA4ever From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 819 posts, RR: 11
Posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7160 times:

Aloha all!

i found this press release on Yahoo and had a question.

Yahoo! Press Release

Quote:
In a significant first step of its long-range fleet plan, Hawaiian Airlines today announced the acquisition of two new wide-body Airbus A330-200 aircraft that will accelerate the start of the company's transition to a new Airbus fleet to 2011.

maybe i havn't had enough coffee yet (since i'm just waking up) but are these 2 "additional" A330's plus the 6 previously ordered? or are are these 2 A330's the first confirmed planes HA will receive from the original 6? HAL or HALFA...you around and know anything!?

is it 2011 yet!? i can't wait to see these planes in action! HA has always been my favorite airline to get me back home to the islands!

~B6FA4ever

31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLatinAviation From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1279 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 7083 times:

These are two additional A330s, in addition to Hawaiian's order.

User currently offlineSimairlinenet From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 922 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 7085 times:

Keep reading further down....

Quote:
In a significant first step of its long-range fleet plan, Hawaiian Airlines today announced the acquisition of two new wide-body Airbus A330-200 aircraft that will accelerate the start of the company's transition to a new Airbus fleet to 2011[b].

[b]The first deliveries of A330s under Hawaiian's purchase agreement with Airbus will join the fleet in 2012,
with the A350s scheduled for delivery starting in 2017.



User currently offlineB6FA4ever From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 819 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 6988 times:



Quoting LatinAviation (Reply 1):
Keep reading further down....

much mahalo for clearing that up for me! lol. guess the caffeine hadn't kicked in yet when i first read the article!

too bad this "accelerated" order won't be til 2011.


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6527 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 6958 times:



Quoting LatinAviation (Reply 1):
These are two additional A330s, in addition to Hawaiian's order.

In the news release put out by HA said two A332's with seats for 298 passengers. Will the HA aircraft really have this many seats? Other carriers have 220-240 seats. The release definitely said A332 and not the A333 which does have that many seats.


User currently offlineRobsawatsky From Canada, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 597 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6747 times:



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 4):
In the news release put out by HA said two A332's with seats for 298 passengers. Will the HA aircraft really have this many seats? Other carriers have 220-240 seats.

Air Transat has A330-200 with 343 (21 in Club Class and 322 in Economy Class), twin aisle, 3-3-3 configuration in Economy Class.

EVA has 252 (24 + 228)

Qantas has 299 (265 + 34), which is probably most similar to the HA layout.


User currently offlineDL767captain From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2539 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6685 times:

So the first A330s will be arriving in 2011? Any idea what routes these initial A330s will be used on? It will be exciting to see an A330 in SAN when they transition over completely

User currently offlineSoxfan From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 870 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6632 times:

I know it's a few years away, but any idea if HA will introduce new seats/IFE on the Airbus aircraft?


Pilot: "Request push, which way should we face?" JFK Ground: "You better face the front, sir, or you'll scare the pax!"
User currently offlineDL767captain From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2539 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 6403 times:



Quoting Soxfan (Reply 7):
l introduce new seats/IFE on the Airbus aircraft?

Using slimline seats would be very interesting, i could see them using the new cozy suites that DL is offering, but since dl is the sole user in the US i guess it might not happen, but IFE like what is installed on virgin america would be very interesting


User currently offlineHa763 From United States of America, joined Jan 2003, 3669 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 6302 times:
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Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 4):
In the news release put out by HA said two A332's with seats for 298 passengers. Will the HA aircraft really have this many seats? Other carriers have 220-240 seats. The release definitely said A332 and not the A333 which does have that many seats.

In the 767, HA already has up to 262 seats in certain aircraft (18 F, 246 Y). 298 sounds about right for the A332 in HA's configuration. In the DC-10-10, HA had 304 seats, 34 F and 270 Y.


User currently offlineDTWAGENT From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 6261 times:

Can an A332 land in SAN ? If so is it going to be weight controled ? That runway does not seem that long for a fully loaded A332 to land. Also, are they still going to hang on to the B767 once they get their A332's ? Would be nice to see HA here in DTW.

Any how thank you to however answers my questions.
Chuck


User currently offlinePanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 6240 times:



Quote:
Can an A332 land in SAN ? If so is it going to be weight controled ? That runway does not seem that long for a fully loaded A332 to land.

Absolutely. If both 747's and 777's can land at SAN (the 777 non-stop from LHR!), then so can an A332.

I know the A332 isn't overpowered like a 757 (but what else is?), but I'm sure its power-to-weight ratio is well within the requirements for SAN.



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User currently offlinePohakuloa From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 429 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 6132 times:



Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 10):
Also, are they still going to hang on to the B767 once they get their A332's ? Would be nice to see HA here in DTW.

if i remember correctly, they will have a mixed fleet for a while yet. also IIRC, until the 350's would come online (or perhaps an all 332 fleet pending the finalization of the 350, but who knows right?), it will definitely be a mixed fleet.

admittedly it would be nice to see HA further east, but who kknows at this point in time.

Quoting Ha763 (Reply 9):
In the 767, HA already has up to 262 seats in certain aircraft (18 F, 246 Y). 298 sounds about right for the A332 in HA's configuration. In the DC-10-10, HA had 304 seats, 34 F and 270 Y.

Ha763, HALFA or HAL - does anyone know for sure the layout? Im pulling for the 2-4-2 like NW has them. convenient for "people like me"



Fast cars and 'Jet A' - such a sweet smell!
User currently offlineHawaiianA330 From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 23 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 6088 times:



Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 10):
Also, are they still going to hang on to the B767 once they get their A332's

Most definitely, HA just recently ordered winglets for the 763ER's in their fleet. It seems they'll be in service for quite a while.


User currently offlineHAL From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2572 posts, RR: 53
Reply 14, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 5963 times:



Quoting Pohakuloa (Reply 12):
Ha763, HALFA or HAL - does anyone know for sure the layout? Im pulling for the 2-4-2 like NW has them. convenient for "people like me"

I don't think anything is set in stone as far as the configurations or IFE for now, but the drawings I've seen so far show the A330's with a 2-4-2 configuration in Y - and a total of 36F and 269Y. That makes 305. I suppose the 298 number may be because we're leasing these first two aircraft from AWAS, and they've already set the configuration that way.

Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 10):
are they still going to hang on to the B767 once they get their A332's ?

Yes. As Hawaiian A330 said in post #13, we're getting winglets for most of our 767's. I"m guessing that we'll keep them for quite a while as the Airbus planes come online. If I hear more, I'll let you all know.

HAL



One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
User currently offlinePohakuloa From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 429 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 5925 times:



Quoting HAL (Reply 14):
I don't think anything is set in stone as far as the configurations or IFE for now, but the drawings I've seen so far show the A330's with a 2-4-2 configuration in Y - and a total of 36F and 269Y. That makes 305. I suppose the 298 number may be because we're leasing these first two aircraft from AWAS, and they've already set the configuration that way.

Thanks for the insight HAL!!



Fast cars and 'Jet A' - such a sweet smell!
User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5592 posts, RR: 12
Reply 16, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 5634 times:



Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 10):
Can an A332 land in SAN ? If so is it going to be weight controled ? That runway does not seem that long for a fully loaded A332 to land.

FYI Chuck, landing at Lindbergh has never been an issue for any a/c, even with the displaced threshold (due primarily to a parking gargage a few feet from the end of runway 27!) Remember that a "fully loaded" arrival is not full of fuel - a major factor of a/c weight.

The problem is with the GTOW of certain fully loaded a/c departing SAN due to terrain issues below the takeoff flightpath (over Point Loma) off of runway 27. (And a departure off runway 9 is even worse.) The problem is only an issue for heavies bound for intercontinental destinations -- e.g., Asia, Europe -- due to the fully loaded fuel tanks necessitating payload hits on cargo and/or passengers. This is the primary reason SAN has so much trouble acquiring (and keeping) any intercontinental service.

Flights from SAN to Hawaii should not pose any problem for any of today's a/c.

bb


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6527 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5268 times:



Quoting Pohakuloa (Reply 12):
Ha763, HALFA or HAL - does anyone know for sure the layout? Im pulling for the 2-4-2 like NW has them. convenient for "people like me"

If they select 2-4-2, HA will never get 298-305 passengers onboard. They must be going to
3-3-3.


User currently offlineLufthansa From Christmas Island, joined May 1999, 3224 posts, RR: 10
Reply 18, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5163 times:



Quoting Robsawatsky (Reply 5):
Qantas has 299 (265 + 34), which is probably most similar to the HA layout.

Not on longhaul they don't. That kind of arrangement is purely for domestic flights/jetstar flights and the 'first class' isn't even 40" pitch. If you look at 330s used on long haul flights that figure is reduced to about 230something seats.


User currently offlineManchesterMAN From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 1234 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4864 times:



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 17):
If they select 2-4-2, HA will never get 298-305 passengers onboard. They must be going to
3-3-3.

300 in a 2-4-2 is no problem at all, look at the QF layout:

http://www.seatguru.com/airlines/Qan...Qantas_Airways_Airbus_A330-200.php



Flown: A300,A319,A320,A321,A330,A340.A380,717,727,737,747,757,767,777,DC9,DC10,MD11,MD80,F100,F50,ERJ,E190,CRJ,BAe146,Da
User currently offlineDL767captain From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2539 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4756 times:



Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 10):
Also, are they still going to hang on to the B767 once they get their A332's ? Would be nice to see HA here in DTW.

Considering HA just ordered winglets for their 767s and the fact that it will be some years before they have enough A330s to replace all their 767s we will see both operating side by side for a while. Maybe when the A350s start arriving they can start retiring the 767s.


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6527 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4738 times:



Quoting ManchesterMAN (Reply 19):
300 in a 2-4-2 is no problem at all, look at the QF layout:

Looks like you are correct. Appears awfully cramped compared to the NW 332's, which are the ones I am familiar, with 243 seats in a two class configuration.


User currently offlineTrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4869 posts, RR: 14
Reply 22, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3711 times:
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Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 21):
Quoting ManchesterMAN (Reply 19):
300 in a 2-4-2 is no problem at all, look at the QF layout:

Looks like you are correct. Appears awfully cramped compared to the NW 332's, which are the ones I am familiar, with 243 seats in a two class configuration.

thats their "domestic" A332 though. international ones have 235 pax.


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6527 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (6 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 3620 times:



Quoting Trex8 (Reply 22):
thats their "domestic" A332 though. international ones have 235 pax

Aha, the truth shall prevail. I will bet it is too comfortable on a domestic 332. If HA is going to use them on Mainland- Hawaii routes and International routes , its going to be a pretty tight five plus hours.with 2-4-2 seating


User currently offlinePohakuloa From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 429 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (6 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 3489 times:



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 23):
Aha, the truth shall prevail. I will bet it is too comfortable on a domestic 332. If HA is going to use them on Mainland- Hawaii routes and International routes , its going to be a pretty tight five plus hours.with 2-4-2 seating

Well, considering that is the way their 763's are now, it would be the same as it is now. No big deal to me, but nice none the less.

I would think the only big difference would be MNL-HNL where with the 332 there is less chance of making the tech stop in GUM.

I wonder if the 763 once winglets installed may be forced to make that stop in GUM? Anybody?? or is there yet enough information to say one way or another?



Fast cars and 'Jet A' - such a sweet smell!
25 Viscount724 : I don't understand your comment. 2-4-2 is the standard Y class seating on Airbus widebodies (A300 through 340) and is comparable to 2-3-2 on a 767 or
26 Bobnwa : You are right, HA is apparently going with the 3-3-3 configuration like domestic QF. My mistake is saying 2-4-2.
27 RichardJF : Why is Hawaiian so conservative on the Australian market. Should be running HNL-BNE 4-5 times per week, daily on HNL-SYD and A330 daily when they come
28 Ha763 : They don't need to go 3-3-3 in Y to reach 298 or even 305. They already fit up to 264 in a 767-300 with 18 F in 3 rows of 2-2-2 at 42" pitch and 246
29 HAL : No. Our A330's are going to be 2-4-2 configuration. The A350's will be 3-3-3. Part of the problem is a lack of aircraft. We don't have enough to do m
30 RichardJF : HAL- Admittedly the Hawaiian-Australia market is very finite but the Australia-US market is HA's for the taking. I don't understand it.
31 ANstar : QF have 2 A330-200 configs Domestic 34J (2-3-2) with 38" Pitch 265Y (2-4-2) with about 31" International 36J (2-2-2) (Not sure piich, but lay flat be
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