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DL/NW Merged Fleet: Too Many Subfleets?  
User currently offlineTranspac787 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3208 posts, RR: 13
Posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 13466 times:

Hey all,

I know it's been discussed several times, regarding the merged fleet of DL/NW. However, I don't think I really quite realized just how many aircraft subfleets there will be. This might pose a bit of a problem for differences training, especially with pilots and FA's. Others might be able to expand on this list, but the merged NW/DL will have the following types:

DC9-31
DC9-32
DC9-41
DC9-51
MD88
MD90
A319-113
A319-114
A320-211
A320-212
737-732
737-832
757-251 (5500 series)
757-251 (5600 series)
757-251 (5600 series) Atlantic OW
757-251 (5600 series) Pacific OW
757-232
757-212
757-231
757-26D
757-2Q8
757-351
767-332
767-332/ER
767-3P6/ER
767-324/ER
767-432/ER
A330-223
A330-323X
777-232/ER
777-232/LR
747-251F
747-222F
747-249F
747-212F
747-251B
747-451

I would guess that no other airline in the world will have quite such an expansive and diverse fleet of aircraft. Will this create any major logistical or other problems for the merged airline??

All comments appreciated.

123 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTranspac787 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3208 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 13455 times:

Edit feature INOP still??

Anyhow, add following to list:

787-851
787-832

and possibly 787-932


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6474 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 13386 times:

I would hardly call the DC-9 31,32,41,51 sub fleets. Pilots are qualified on all of them. The same applies to the 757's and 330's at NWA. I'm confident the same applies to DL pilots on the 757, 767, and 777. The actual sub fleets at the DL will be significantly smaller than your list.

User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined exactly 9 years ago today! , 9426 posts, RR: 14
Reply 3, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 13367 times:

I agree

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
A319-113
A319-114
A320-211
A320-212

They should drop these

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
MD90



Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
737-732
737-832

and add more of these
 Silly  bigthumbsup   duck   rotfl   rotfl 



yep.
User currently offlineMoman From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 1054 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 13320 times:

Fleet commonality is much overrated. DL will be in a great position to send the optimum aircraft into the right station/route based on route demand and performance. With the volatile oil prices today, there will be good competitive advantage to doing so. This will also help keep DL from flooding the market with seats which suppress yield.

For evidence of the contrary, look at AA which is stuck flying MD-80s or RJ's on routes too small/big for those aircraft due to lack of alternates.



AA Platinum Member - American Airlines Forever
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23021 posts, RR: 20
Reply 5, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 13306 times:



Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
767-332
767-332/ER
767-3P6/ER
767-324/ER

The 6 -3P6s and the lone -324 are sort of orphans, but they're a bit more capable than the -332ERs; DL does use that ability on some routes, though once they have 332s and 333s in the stable, I'd say there's a chance that they dispose of the 7 6 door 763s.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently onlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6771 posts, RR: 17
Reply 6, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 13296 times:

My armchair with no substance Deltawest wishlist..

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
DC9-31
DC9-32
DC9-41
DC9-51

See Embraer 190/195

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
MD88
MD90
A319-113
A319-114
A320-211
A320-212

See Boeing 737-700/800

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
737-732
737-832

See Boeing 737-700/800

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
767-332
767-332/ER
767-3P6/ER
767-324/ER
767-432/ER

See Boeing 787-3/8

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
A330-223
A330-323X

See Boeing 777-200/300

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
777-232/ER
777-232/LR

See Boeing 777-200/300

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
747-251F
747-222F
747-249F
747-212F
747-251B

See Boeing 777-200F/300F

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
747-451

See Boeing 777-200/300

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
757-251 (5500 series)
757-251 (5600 series)
757-251 (5600 series) Atlantic OW
757-251 (5600 series) Pacific OW
757-232
757-212
757-231
757-26D
757-2Q8
757-351

See Boeing 787-8

So, overall, the new fleet looks like this...

Embraer 190/195
Boeing 737-700/800
Boeing 777-200/300
Boeing 777-200F/300F
Boeing 787-3/8

Click, print, done!



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23021 posts, RR: 20
Reply 7, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 13288 times:



Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 6):
Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
A330-223
A330-323X

See Boeing 777-200/300

What has changed since NW selected the 330?



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7591 posts, RR: 27
Reply 8, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 13251 times:



Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 6):
So, overall, the new fleet looks like this...

Embraer 190/195
Boeing 737-700/800
Boeing 777-200/300
Boeing 777-200F/300F
Boeing 787-3/8

Click, print, done!

Show me the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$!


User currently offlineTranspac787 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3208 posts, RR: 13
Reply 9, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks ago) and read 13199 times:



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 2):
I would hardly call the DC-9 31,32,41,51 sub fleets.

Actually there are even more subfleets than my list. Given the fact that NW acquired them from different previous-operators such as:

Alitalia
Swissair
SAS
Hughes Air West
Southern
North Central
Republic
Eastern
Muse Air
Austrian
Korean Air
Hawaiian
JAT

They all have small differences. While most are insignificant, there are still many differences between even individual planes.

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 2):
Pilots are qualified on all of them.

No kidding??  Wink

Still doesn't negate the fact there are sub-fleets.


User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (5 years 10 months 4 weeks ago) and read 13190 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 3):
and add more of these

Ah yes and have less comfortable aircraft! I'm a huge Boeing fan, but when it comes to comfort the A319/320 is worlds better than a 737 in terms of space.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6474 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 12937 times:



Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 6):
So, overall, the new fleet looks like this...

Embraer 190/195
Boeing 737-700/800
Boeing 777-200/300
Boeing 777-200F/300F
Boeing 787-3/8

Click, print, done!

And how many billions of $ do you think it would cost to accomplish this and where would those billions come from?


User currently offlineDL767captain From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2539 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 12775 times:

Yes they will have a very filled out fleet but i think that could actually work to their advantage. Just think, they will always have the right aircraft for a certain route, no need to put a A330 on a route that only requires a 767, that then frees up the A330 for a route that doesn't need the size of the 777 which then.... well you see where i'm going. This large fleet allows Delta to operate with much better economics.

To me it seems that the DC-9s will be replaced sometime soon (1-2 years). The MD-80s will be phased out and can be replaced by the A319/320s. Some 757s may be retired but otherwise they will mix well, i'm sure delta will keep some 753s on Hawaii routes. 767s and A330s and 777s will all play well together allowing the right aircraft to be on the right route. The 747 i think will stay for a while, they already needed that capacity just for NW so now with DL passengers wanting the same flight they may need to go as big as the 748. DL would be a perfect US carrier to order the 748, maybe they could get a lower price as compensation for late 787s.

Below is pure speculation and wishful thinking:
After maybe a decade i can see DL starting to get rid of the A320s as they come up for expensive maintenance, but i think they will hold on to the A330s for quite a long time. Then they can order the 737RS, C-Series, 787-3/9.


User currently offlineBrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4226 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 12719 times:

I would believe that at first we will not see much of a change because NW and DL have very few routes that would over lap with each other. Once we have gone through a schedule cycle with the combined fleets then maybe we will see some minor changes.

On a second note I don't predict many 777 visits to DTW as NW will still have many A333's being used.



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineWA707atMSP From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2226 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 12704 times:



Quoting DL767captain (Reply 12):
Yes they will have a very filled out fleet but i think that could actually work to their advantage.

I think the costs associated with multiple fleets far exceed the advantages.

At DL / NW, the sheer number of aircraft types in the fleet means that they will have a higher percentage of pilots in training than if they had just four or five types, because pilots will move from one type of aircraft to another more often.

Likewise, the more aircraft types an airline has, means the more money they will have tied up in spare parts.

All of us agree that AA needs an aircraft in their fleet between the CRJ 700 and the MD 80 / 737-823, but overall, I think AA's goal is the right one.

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 11):
Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 6):
So, overall, the new fleet looks like this...

Embraer 190/195
Boeing 737-700/800
Boeing 777-200/300
Boeing 777-200F/300F
Boeing 787-3/8

Click, print, done!

And how many billions of $ do you think it would cost to accomplish this and where would those billions come from?

Several members of this forum say the merged airline will be so profitable it will burn the barn down. If the merger is as successful as WT et all are predicting, then DL will have no trouble getting the money for their new fleet.



Seaholm Maples are #1!
User currently offlineLuckyone From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 2172 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 12655 times:



Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
DC9-31
DC9-32
DC9-41
DC9-51

1 pilot group.

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
A319-113
A319-114
A320-211
A320-212

2 pilot groups

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
737-732
737-832

Three pilot groups

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
757-251 (5500 series)
757-251 (5600 series)
757-251 (5600 series) Atlantic OW
757-251 (5600 series) Pacific OW
757-232
757-212
757-231
757-26D
757-2Q8
757-351
767-332
767-332/ER
767-3P6/ER
767-324/ER
767-432/ER


4 pilot groups

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
A330-223
A330-323X

4 pilot groups

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
777-232/ER
777-232/LR

5

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
747-222F
747-249F
747-212F
747-251B

6 pilot groups, though isn't this fleet type slowly but surely making its departure from the fleet.

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
747-451

7

Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
MD88

8
MD90

9

Indeed that looks messy from a pilot perspective. How many aircraft are FA's permitted to be qualified on simultaneously? Personal opinion? MD90's out the door ASAP replaced by the baby Airbii. 747 Classics gone ASAP since I don't believe they operate scheduled passenger services any more. 88's slowly phased out and replaced by a mixture of 737's and Airbii that come available as a result of the CVG and Memphis hub closings and further downsizing and network integration. DC-9's... gone, plain and simple. So we go from 9 to 5, which is about what most majors have, no?


User currently offlineRidgid727 From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1130 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 12611 times:



Quoting Transpac787 (Thread starter):
I know it's been discussed several times, regarding the merged fleet of DL/NW. However, I don't think I really quite realized just how many aircraft subfleets there will be. This might pose a bit of a problem for differences training, especially with pilots and FA's

Do you think for one minute that those putting this merger together didn't consider this?


User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4674 posts, RR: 11
Reply 17, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 12568 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 10):
Ah yes and have less comfortable aircraft! I'm a huge Boeing fan, but when it comes to comfort the A319/320 is worlds better than a 737 in terms of space.



On NW???? I'm 6'0 and I was so cramped on an A319 it was aweful. The only aircraft worse than that was a DL 727.

Quoting Moman (Reply 4):
Fleet commonality is much overrated. DL will be in a great position to send the optimum aircraft into the right station/route based on route demand and performance.

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark   checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 

This is the counter argument to fleet commonality and a very valid one at that. the right plane for the right route.



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineGsosbee From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 825 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 12482 times:



Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 14):
the more aircraft types an airline has, means the more money they will have tied up in spare parts

I believe at best a relative minor point. The number of airplanes and hours flown are more important. AA keeps more spare parts than HA because they have more airplanes flying more often to more destinations. You will be buying parts for whatever airplane. The difference will be cost between the manufacturers.

Of course the Airbus FBW parts will be different and probably more costly.


User currently offlineCatiii From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 3031 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 12436 times:



Quoting Moman (Reply 4):
Fleet commonality is much overrated.

Not when you factor in trainign costs and maintenance costs. There's a reason that a majority of the airlines went either all Boeing or all Airbus.

Quoting Ridgid727 (Reply 16):
Do you think for one minute that those putting this merger together didn't consider this?

And maybe they did, but it doesn't necessarily mean they made the right decision.


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6474 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 12387 times:



Quoting Catiii (Reply 19):
There's a reason that a majority of the airlines went either all Boeing or all Airbus.

I don't think a majority of airlines are all Airbus or all Boeing. Of the top of my head it doesn't apply to AA, UA, US, NW, HA, AF,KL, BA, LH, JL, CX, QF, etc. In fact of the worlds largest 20 airlines, according to ATW,it doesn't apply to 14 of them.


User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 12304 times:



Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 7):

What has changed since NW selected the 330?

Easy:
what's changed is that the acquiring airline wouldn't have any consideration whatsoever for PW4000-powered 777s and their inherent/artificial restrictions, which completely changes the parameters of the (now rather [in]famous) NW decision process.


User currently offlineWA707atMSP From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2226 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 12238 times:



Quoting Gsosbee (Reply 18):
Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 14):
the more aircraft types an airline has, means the more money they will have tied up in spare parts

I believe at best a relative minor point.

Every city an airline serves needs to keep a minimum number of spare parts on hand for each aircraft type that passes through that city. Let's say it's $100,000 per aircraft type per station.

If a medium sized station is served by four types of aircraft, they will need to keep $400,000 in spare parts on hand.

If the airline reduces the number of types passing through that city from four to two, they will only need to keep spare parts for those two types of aircraft on hand. Although they will need to keep more parts on hand for both remaining types, they will not need to keep twice as many spare parts on hand for each type. They might need to keep an extra $25,000 to $50,000 in spare parts on hand for the two remaining types, but not $100,000.

An airline with a diverse fleet can reduce their spare parts needs by reducing the number of stations that are served by each type, as AA has done by not flying 737s out of ORD, and MD-80s out of MIA. However, MSP, for example, is served by 737s from MIA, and MD-80s from ORD. MSP needs to keep spare parts on hand for both 737s and MD-80s, but would only need to keep 737 spare parts on hand if AA phased out their MD-80s.



Seaholm Maples are #1!
User currently offlineNA From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10736 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 12197 times:

The small 757-300 and 767-400 fleets are surely a bit odd. A332s in its place would be much better for the passengers. The more so in a gigantic airline as NWelta will be. The DC9s are on the way out anyway, as are the 742s which are retained for special charters as long as it makes sense. Otherwise the fleets are quite sizable or modern enough to remain as they are.
Now what about A380s, or 748Is? The combined fleet is so big that some routes should justify VLAs like the main East Coast to LHR/FRA/CDG, maybe AMS routes. Isn´t this a great opportunity to reduce unnecessary frequency?

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 17):
On NW???? I'm 6'0 and I was so cramped on an A319 it was aweful. The only aircraft worse than that was a DL 727.

??? The A320 series is wider than the 737. I´ve been flying both series over a hundred times, not on NWA I admit, and anything but saying the Airbus offers more space is rubbish.


User currently offlineGsosbee From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 825 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 12186 times:



Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 22):

Thanks for the excellent analysis. This shows the reason to limit the number of types and manufacturer at non-hub stock points. I agree at the hubs there would be a doubling of effort.


25 1337Delta764 : Neither the 753s nor the 764ERs will be eliminated. The 753s serve a similar purpose to NW that the domestic 763s serve to DL, and some leisure route
26 SPREE34 : In reality, you'd need a tape measure to see it. What, 1 inch at shoulder height across the cabin?
27 NA : A small difference like 777 vs. A340. But the difference is width of 737 vs.A320 is more apparent.
28 Par13del : Better not tell this to Airbus, its one of their main selling points as it relates to pilot training. Thought it was the other way around, at least f
29 RL757PVD : A wider cabin doesnt offer more legroom, If I was a C-O-S, then I might notice
30 ConcordeBoy : ...and we've all seen how grounded in reality ~those~ can sometimes be. *cough, Leahy* E.g., how many airlines can you list where A32x pilots are cro
31 AirframeAS : Why 2 pilot groups? They are the same aircraft, just different series. They can be cross-trained. So only one pilot group would do. Same as above...
32 Keesje : But those 777-200ER cost & burn significantly more on the Atlantic & don't carry more seats / cargo. You are basicly flying around 45.000 lbs of dead
33 ConcordeBoy : That latter part of that isn't true at all... should a carrier desire, the 772ER certainly does have the ability to carry more seats (particularly in
34 WA707atMSP : Luckyone was keeping a running tally of the # of pilot groups. The first group on Luckyone's list was the DC-9 pilots. The second group was the A319
35 Norlander : I agree that there needs to be a reduction in the fleet variety at DeltaNW, but those who wish for an all Boeing fleet are going to be disappointed. T
36 Burnsie28 : What? Here are the breakdowns of seperate pilot fliying that will happen at the combined airline, 737 pilots are not just on the 800 or 700, they are
37 NADC10Fan : I'm 6'7" & 300# +, and I have to agree with Burnsie. I'll take the A320 series aircraft over 737s any day and twice on Sundays, so far as personal co
38 Bomber996 : He's making a total of groups needed starting from the top. 1 for DC-9's, 1 for A32x's, 1 for 737's, 1 for 757/767(same type rating), 1 for A330's, 1
39 WA707atMSP : I still feel that if "the right plane for the right route" was the best approach, then WN would have purchased 757s for their denser routes, and CRJs
40 CatIII : At DL pilots fly the domestic 757 and 767 as one category. I know there's a seperate category for international 767ER flying, and for the 767-400. I
41 Jfk777 : Is that why Air Canada went to 777's from an all Airbus fleet for its long haul need ?
42 Brilondon : Are these not basically the same aircraft? Do they require completely different maintenance procedures? Are there different engine types? These were
43 Goomba : So when do the NW aircraft start carrying the DL paint schemes? I cannot wait to see the A330, A320, A319 aircraft in the new DL paint scheme. If anyo
44 Jfk777 : TOO many sub-fleets , YES; efficient YES. They are because NW/DL have large numbers of whatever airplane each fleet has. DC-9's will go as will MD-88'
45 RL757PVD : I was towards the back of the 319 and couldnt even get my backpack out from under the seat in front of me. Perhaps the seat pitch gets worse as you g
46 Par13del : Difference in size of the A320 / B-737 is at the shoulder level cross cabin, the seat pitch, width etc is soley the responsibility of the user and do
47 Brilondon : Why would you wnt to reduce frequency? This is an oppertunity charge more for the same frequency as you reduce the competiiton on a particular route.
48 RL757PVD : Thats what i said Ever think that cabin length could be just a few inches off from providing the optimum comfort? ( I dont expect a response or an an
49 Keesje : No, I guess AC was broke, Boeing offered to buy all the busses if needed & the US government financed the deal. Apart from that the 777ER is better s
50 Bobnwa : Please explain how the US government financed the deal?
51 Post contains links Keesje : Please explain how the US government financed the deal? As usual, via the US governments "Boeing Bank" the Ex-Im bank. "The Export-Import Bank support
52 Viscount724 : What evidence do you have that the US government financed AC's 777s? And one reason for AC's switch from A340 to 777 was the 777's better cargo capab
53 Goomba : Again I ask the question...does anyone know when the NW aircraft are going to take on the DL paint scheme? Please advise.
54 MoMan : The exception, not the rule. This is different than what we are talking about. See point above. Pilots don't generally move around from A320 to A330
55 Post contains links Keesje : Now you won't find this in the Seatlepi or Chicago Tribune but: Boeing 777 Financing On April 19, 2007, Air Canada received a commitment for loan gua
56 Luckyone : The difference between this and a loan from any other bank being?? The terms seem pretty concrete to me, a standard loan. A loan is a loan. I seem to
57 Bravo1six : And EDC does the same for BBD products. And the European export credit agencies do the same for Airbus products. And the Brazilian ECA does the same f
58 N707PA : After the airlines merge.
59 Bobnwa : Can't be advised because it has not been announced yet.
60 DALMD88 : Rumor has it the merger will be final sometime near the end of next week. The last I looked no NW planes were on the paint line schedual for ATL for
61 NorthstarBoy : the ones i'm going to feel sorry for are the gate agents when it comes to equipment subs. two scenarios come to mind, one, agents are expecting a 757-
62 Columba : There is no 777-300F, also NW will get rid of the 747F and will no longer operate Cargo aircraft. The A32x and A330 will not leave the fleet anytime
63 PSU.DTW.SCE : I don't believe you are going to see a NW aircraft repainted until after the 1st of the year. They still plan on essentially being NW & DL through th
64 Bobnwa : The equipment substitution are not going to happen that fast that the gate agents will be surprised by what type aircraft shows up at the gate. Well,
65 Post contains images Keesje : The NWA A330-300 is the best medium / long haul aircraft you can have at this moment. Ideally 767s (better suited for medium / non cargo flights) coul
66 Columba : Just read it in a German aviation magazin. DL urges NW to sell the 747F and that after the merger DL will no longer operate freighter aircraft.
67 WA707atMSP : The combined DC 9 / MD 80 fleet of the merged airline will be so large that, even if DL had enough money to take delivery of one replacement aircraft
68 Post contains links and images Keesje : I think a good bunch of GTF powered A320 Enhanced offering superior cargo, fuel efficiency, maintenance intervals, comfort & resale value is more like
69 Bobnwa : I think your German magazine has it wrong. No such thing has happened.
70 WA707atMSP : Unlikely. DL's Next Generation 737s are much younger than NW's A320s. Many of NW's A320s are actually older than DL's MD-80s. It would make more sens
71 NADC10Fan : "The exception"? Perhaps, I don't know. I only know it's wierd the different experiences I've had on my many flights over time. As someone of some co
72 Post contains links and images Keesje : I'm not sure, Airbus is working to extend life span of the A320 family to 120.000 or 180.000 hrs. Far longer then any DC9 ever flew. The order backlo
73 Mayor : Interesting tidbit (rumor) from a friend at cargo in SLC. In response to a question I had about the 747F operation he said that it looks like it will
74 DALMD88 : True at most stations. Bos is set to be one of the first stations to be combined. We were told to expect to see NW aircraft at terminal A in Dec. The
75 FruteBrute : Yes. The "new" Delta-NWA combo will file for bankruptcy again within 36 months after merging. I'm sure they will cite some "unforeseen circumstance"
76 Mayor : Would you like to put some money down on that bet?
77 FruteBrute : It'd be the safest bet around. Sure.
78 ScottB : Delta has 21 767-400's, while NWA has 11 A332's. Arguably the A332 fleet is the one that is "small," and the 767 is an extremely passenger-friendly a
79 Post contains links Keesje : Good old Randy magic The A320 is wider everywhere.. http://boeingblogs.com/randy/archives/2006/03/width_is_which.html Randy once promised to get back
80 CatIII : Not in the US: Delta (Boeing) AirTran (Boeing) Southwest (Boeing) American (Boeing) Alaska (Boeing) Continental (Boeing) Midwest ( Airbus-albeit smal
81 Bobnwa : I would wager that most thinking people with a full brain would disagree with you.
82 Viscount724 : Or they may just drop many of the routes operated by those aircraft. If memory correct, NW eliminated much of Republic's route network, especially ro
83 Post contains images Keesje : Fedex, UPS,
84 Brilondon : Doesn't Several countries have interests financially speaking in Airbus such as Germany, France and Spain. I would call this a subsidy. Why would DL
85 Keesje : I think that the NW DC-9's will be in the fleet for the near future. Also I believe that they are far older then the A320 program its self. Also reme
86 Mayor : You'd have better odds with the lottery.
87 IliriBDL : That is the plan that Airbus has in for US. lol I'm happy though myself, I love the Airbus planes, and don't be surprised since they have a very exce
88 Luckyone : Well I wasn't trying to open that can of worms Just trying to point out a double standard. Yeah I'm a relative newcomer around here but good grief wh
89 FruteBrute : Well except all those that don't work for NWA-Delta just might. Especially the taxpayers of MN whom are owed $250 million by a company that has defau
90 WA707atMSP : The only ex-Republic aircraft type NW grounded post merger was the Convair 580. Even Republic's DC-9-10s stayed with NW for more than 15 years after
91 Bmacleod : The next anticipated big move will likely be a large 787 order, expect most 763s to be mothballed...
92 Bobnwa : The taxpayers of MN have not lost one penny because of NWA.
93 Luckyone : "Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me." -- Ben Franklin.
94 NADC10Fan : Midwest is currently Maddogs and 717s; no Airbii there at all, nor have ever been. Though if another topic here on A.net has it right, the MDD/Boeing
95 Viscount724 : Before NW bought Republic, I recall RC advertising that they served more points in the U.S. than any other airline. They had a real mish-mash of a ro
96 Bobnwa : I don't believe he said Airbus in reply 80, did he?
97 DeltaL1011man : DL is more of a GE fan. They mostly pick PW over RR. M88s Only had the PWs 752 PW vs.RR.....picked PW 763s mix GE and PW. 77L and 737s all GE 764 GE
98 NADC10Fan : I quoted the pertinent part, but here's the full one. I don't THINK I'm seeing things when I look at that post ...
99 Dispatchguy : Plan is after the holidays, that some NWA aircraft will start sporting some type of DL logo on their aircraft. What logo and where - who knows...
100 Dispatchguy : There was an interview with the DL Chief of Planning a while back (I wanna say late summer), and he said that the DC9s will still be around for a whi
101 OyKIE : Great thread. I tried to start a similar thread about the number of planes in the combined NW/DL airline. This was deleted because it was to similar t
102 Mayor : Don't forget the MD-90......I don't have the numbers, tho.
103 Post contains images Keesje : The biggest 757 fleet, about 200. Question is how to replace these. 787 are much to big, expensive and heavy, B737-900ER & A321 are more efficient bu
104 Mayor : Looks more like 336, to me.
105 Davescj : Are you sure 763 is getting new seats (by which I mean flat seats). I ask as the DL website says 764 will be getting new flat seats starting 2009. Sp
106 OyKIE : That is a very good question. I read an article when AA bought the 787 and AA said they might replace their 757 with 737-900ER og 737-800. Perhaps DL
107 Cubsrule : A lot of times when people talk about "replacing 757s," they make an implicit assumption that DL will replace the 757s that fly ATL-JAX with the same
108 Papatango : Somebody call Delta and tell them to pick up those 5 Cathy Pacific 777-000,s.
109 DocLightning : The majority of people who say this are quite happy on a 757 for a very long trip. And yet the 757 and 737 have the exact same cross-section.
110 OyKIE : I believe that the oldest least capable 757 might be replaced by current generation A321 or 739ER to fly domestic U.S routes. And then DL might hold
111 WA707atMSP : After Steve Wolf became president of Republic in 1984, RC did a major realignment of their route network - dropping most of the old Hughes Airwest ro
112 CatIII : I didn't think I did either, but apparently I did? Brain cramp... Good point, but I usually exclude them because the economics of the package moving
113 Cubsrule : I don't believe that will be possible until the certificates are merged. At that point, it'll be required on any aircraft painted in NW colors.
114 CatIII : Even if it is a wholly owned subsidiary? Keep in mind, the Song tag on the door said "Operated by Delta Air Lines, Inc." which I agree they couldn't
115 Timf : You will see the opposite though. Any NW aircraft that get painted into DL colors before the certificates merge will have "Operated by NWA, Inc." like
116 Cubsrule : I don't think so. Do any wholly-owned regionals do it? I can't see a reason why they wouldn't if they could...
117 Post contains links and images CatIII : I don't think there is anything preventing them from putting something like that on the side of the airplane by the boarding door, or even by the nos
118 OyKIE : I do not know what the combined age is but for NW the average age was 18,5 years in 2007. For DL it was an average of 14 years in April 2008. Source:
119 CatIII : The transcon 757's have that interior...
120 NewToTheWidget : I love how everyone speculates on here about what will be done with this aircraft and that aircraft. It makes me laugh. The DC9 will soldier on despit
121 Mayor : "Speculation" is our middle name.
122 Okie73 : I bet there are more subfleets before there are less.
123 1337Delta764 : Well, almost, although the overhead bins are slightly different. The ex-TWA ETOPS 757s also have the interior you describe as well. However, the NW 7
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