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First B777F To AF In Jan. 2009  
User currently offlineFlySSC From France, joined Aug 2003, 7379 posts, RR: 57
Posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6471 times:

The very first Boeing 777F will finally be delivered to its launch customer Air France in January 2009.

Initialy planned for October 2008, the delivery was delayed because of cetification problems.

Air France has planned to receive 5 B77F in 2009.

The first aircraft will be F-GUOC. Followed by F-GUOA & OB in March and April.

FGUOD & OE will be delivered in October and November 2009.

In the meantime, Air France will retire from servIce 3 of its B744 Freighters :
F-GIUB in March, then F-GISF and F-GISA.

From 10 B744F in its fleet currently, the fleet of Air France Cargo will grow to 12 aircraft in November 2009 : 7 B744F + 5 B777F.



21 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineOldAeroGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3423 posts, RR: 67
Reply 1, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 6289 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Thread starter):
Initialy planned for October 2008, the delivery was delayed because of cetification problems.

I believe the Boeing-IAM strike played an important role in the delay as flight test hours were not accumulated at the planned rate. Lack of fight test hours delayed certification.



Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
User currently onlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 16998 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 6255 times:

Wow, the 777F looks really nice.

Do you know to where the retired 744Fs will go??



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6402 posts, RR: 55
Reply 3, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 6148 times:

Any idea what routes the 777Fs will fly ?

The777Man



Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly...T5, CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
User currently offlineER757 From Cayman Islands, joined May 2005, 2431 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 6116 times:

Where is this plane now? Haven't seen it at BFI the last few times I drove past. Just see the one in Boeing house colors. I'd assume PAE, but I don't get up that way much.

User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5830 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 5991 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

With the new 4-year agreement underway, Boeing can move on. Although one more hurdle and that's the SPEEA negotiations.

User currently offlineEBJ1248650 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1932 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 5927 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 2):
Do you know to where the retired 744Fs will go??

Would UPS take them?



Dare to dream; dream big!
User currently onlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 16998 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5886 times:



Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 6):
Would UPS take them?

I dont know. How old are these 744Fs that AF is going to retire??



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineGECMD11 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 111 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5853 times:

when does aerologic get there first 777F ?

User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9564 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 5669 times:



Quoting The777Man (Reply 3):
Any idea what routes the 777Fs will fly ?

The777Man

I have the same question. Where will AF Cargo send their 77F's? Will they start South American cargo flights? If so, to which destinations? I would like to know more about why AF and KL Cargo don't have South America in their scheduled cargo timetable? Is demand that small or unattractive to have fall-cargo flights to and from South America, next to their passenger flights to/from South America?

A388


User currently offlineQF744ER From Australia, joined Jun 2004, 299 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 5637 times:

Why would AF retire F-GIUB and not say another older BCF such as GISB, GISE for example?

GIUB is quite a new build B744F, maybe it's already been sold.


User currently offlineMEA-707 From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4264 posts, RR: 34
Reply 11, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 5635 times:



Quoting A388 (Reply 13):
AF and KL Cargo don't have South America

Martinair Cargo which you can see as part of the AF/KL group is pretty strong in South America, their 4 744BCFs and 7 MD-11Fs are probably flying on South America for at least 50%



nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9564 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 5618 times:



Quoting MEA-707 (Reply 15):
Quoting A388 (Reply 13):
AF and KL Cargo don't have South America

Martinair Cargo which you can see as part of the AF/KL group is pretty strong in South America, their 4 744BCFs and 7 MD-11Fs are probably flying on South America for at least 50%

Yes, but they are not KL Cargo. They are part of AF-KL but not AF-KL. MP indeed is very strong in South America but I was wondering why AF-KL don't fly to this region of the world. Is the competition too intense making it not worthwhile to compete to/from South America?

A388


User currently offlineGlom From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 2809 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 5425 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Thread starter):
Initialy planned for October 2008, the delivery was delayed because of cetification problems.

Certification problems? Why has Boeing suddenly decided to spontaneously combust?


User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2179 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5392 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Thread starter):
Initialy planned for October 2008, the delivery was delayed because of cetification problems.

Three months hardly qualifies as a delay!!! In the 21st Century, where we have the A380, the B787, the Superjet, and Windows Vista, three months should be as on-time as you can expect any program to be!  Wink



Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlineFlySSC From France, joined Aug 2003, 7379 posts, RR: 57
Reply 15, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5364 times:

Quoting QF744ER (Reply 10):
Why would AF retire F-GIUB



Quoting QF744ER (Reply 10):
GIUB is quite a new build B744F

I guess it's not a question of "new" or "old". Probably GIUB is close to a "C" or "D" Check, and AF doesn't want to pay for this VERY expensive maintenance check for an aicraft that is scheduled anyway to leave the fleet within the next 3 years.

Quoting B747forever (Reply 7):
How old are these 744Fs that AF is going to retire??

B747-428 ERF F-GIUA Oct. 2002 (from ILFC)
B747-428 ERF F-GIUB Oct.2002
B747-428 ERF F-GIUC Nov 2002 (from ILFC)
B747-428 ERF F-GIUD Mar 2004 (from ILFC)
B747-428 ERF F-GIUE Jun 2005
B747-428 BCF F-GISA Sep 1991 - Converted into a Freighter in Jun 2006
B747-428 BCF F-GISB Nov 1991 - Converted into a Freighter in Aug 2006
B747-428 BCF F-GISE Feb 1993 - Converted into a Freighter in Nov 2007
B747-481 BCF F-GISF Sep 2007 - Leased from ANA


B747-406 ERF F-GIUF was transfered to KLM Cargo last month.

[Edited 2008-11-03 00:28:01]

User currently offlineFrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1462 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5222 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Reply 16):
B747-406 ERF F-GIUF was transfered to KLM Cargo last month.

I wonder how long it will stay there. With the replacement of KL's 747s it's most likely the freighters will go as well. But to be replaced with what? KL won't order any new 777's any more, so what's left?



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT3,ATP,E90,F50/70,M11,
User currently offlineFlySSC From France, joined Aug 2003, 7379 posts, RR: 57
Reply 17, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5144 times:



Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 17):
But to be replaced with what? KL won't order any new 777's any more,

Why not ? AFKL will probably order additional B777F for AF in a close future, they could also add a few more units for KLM to replace the B747F. That would be logical.
The A330F is also an option for both AF & KL.

Air France Cargo is already "chartering" some A300F for services to North & West Africa and the Middle east.


User currently offlineAFC_Ajax00 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 775 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5124 times:

I should think it's highly likely that KLM will order 777Fs to replace 747Fs when they need replacing.


Once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward; for there you long to return
User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9564 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4851 times:

Why are people now already talking about the KL Cargo 744ERF replacement? Those aircraft are still practically new. How many years do we expect KL Cargo to keep using their 744ERF fleet? 3 years? The 744ERF is still a very efficient and modern aircraft that will probably be used for at least 5 years or more. Anything can happen by that time. I think it's too early to already start discussing replacement of these new cargo haulers. AF-KL might even go for the A350F by that time.

Just my opinion.

A388


User currently offlineFrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1462 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 4755 times:



Quoting FlySSC (Reply 18):
Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 17):
But to be replaced with what? KL won't order any new 777's any more,

Why not ? AFKL will probably order additional B777F for AF in a close future, they could also add a few more units for KLM to replace the B747F. That would be logical.

That would be logical to me too, but HB-IWC was pretty certain about it when he mentioned the 77W would be last 777 to be ordered be KL. And he seems to be in the know...

Quoting A388 (Reply 20):

Don't forget that AF's 744ERF's are also very young, just 3-5 years old. And those will be gone by 2013 too. Since AF/KL have their cargo division completely integrated, it wouldn't be logical too keep the KL 744ERF's that much longer (unfortunately, I should add).



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT3,ATP,E90,F50/70,M11,
User currently offlineFlySSC From France, joined Aug 2003, 7379 posts, RR: 57
Reply 21, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4409 times:



Quoting The777Man (Reply 3):
Any idea what routes the 777Fs will fly ?

No indication yet on the destinations. It just says that "the B777F will be deployed on the North American and Asian routes.


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