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Status Of AA 757 Refurbishment  
User currently offlinePRAirbus From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2005, 1129 posts, RR: 1
Posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 9807 times:

Wondering if anyone knows what is going on with this matter...I've heard the first AA 757 (prototype) would be rolled out last October/2008. Any feedback would be interesting to read.

70 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineKeny156 From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 58 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 9731 times:

1st 757 doesnt start IFS config until 17 Nov.

User currently offlineAF022 From France, joined Dec 2003, 2148 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 9527 times:

What are they doing to the aircraft? Winglets?
How long does it take to put on winglets?


User currently offlineQqflyboy From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2266 posts, RR: 13
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 9524 times:

According to the most recent schedule for the domestic a/c refurbs, the prototype was due out October 17. However, it is not yet done, and that specific a/c still shows active, so it's not undergoing the refurb currently. In addition, the flight attendants have yet to receive information for our manual about this particular configuration, something that would be required before we could actually operate the a/c. I am not sure what the delay is, or when the a/c will get the conversion, as the schedule has not been updated.

The rest of the domestic fleet is scheduled to get the mods beginning in March. We'll have to wait and see if that remains true.



The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
User currently offlineQQflyboy From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2266 posts, RR: 13
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 9495 times:



Quoting AF022 (Reply 2):
What are they doing to the aircraft? Winglets?

The winglets have either been completed, or their down to the last few on the 757 fleet. That project should be wrapped up by year's end.

All 124 757s will undergo refurbishment in the coming months. Most notably, 18 a/c will be reconfigured for TATL flying with 16 lie flat J-class seats with AVOD. The entire a/c will get new sidewalls and lavs, as well as new seats in coach. A digital, over aisle IFE system with 17" flat panel monitors will replace the current system in coach, no AVOD or PTVs there.

The remaining 106 domestic 757s will get new seats in first and coach and new lavs and sidewalls throughout. First will also gain two seats bringing the a/c up to 24 first, 166 coach. These a/c will also get the new digital over aisle IFE system, no AVOD or PTVs in either cabin.



The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
User currently offlineKeny156 From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 58 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 9476 times:



Quoting AF022 (Reply 2):
What are they doing to the aircraft? Winglets?

no winglets are mostly done, I believe there are 10 left. They are modifying the interior on the 757. Its called the CIP (Cabin Improvement Project). It is there to change the old out dated 757 interior in both coach and first class. Also there will be a subfleet of 18 ETOPS 757 that will be change to the IFS configuration of 16 Businesss Class seats (Recaro Mustang) and 166 coach seats and larger lav tanks. Also they will remove the midgalley closet and reduce the size of the galley. Another part of this mod is the MAUI mod that will update the cockpit. Search other threads as that has been talked about.


User currently offlinePSA727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 974 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 9475 times:



Quoting QQflyboy (Reply 4):
All 124 757s will undergo refurbishment in the coming months. Most notably, 18 a/c will be reconfigured for TATL flying with 16 lie flat J-class seats with AVOD. The entire a/c will get new sidewalls and lavs, as well as new seats in coach. A digital, over aisle IFE system with 17" flat panel monitors will replace the current system in coach, no AVOD or PTVs there.

Are they prioritizing one configuration over the other? Trying to get as many TATL birds ready
for the peak season as soon as possible.



fly high, pay low...Germanwings!
User currently offlineQQflyboy From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2266 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 9377 times:



Quoting PSA727 (Reply 6):
Are they prioritizing one configuration over the other? Trying to get as many TATL birds ready
for the peak season as soon as possible.

The 18 TATL birds are scheduled to be complete October 19, 2009. While the prototype for the TATL config is due mid-January, 2009, the rest of the a/c will undergo mods between April and October. The domestic fleet won't be done until 2014, as those a/c are only getting the mods during heavy maintenance.



The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
User currently offlineMariodgf From Venezuela, joined Oct 2008, 11 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 9122 times:

Excellent to hear these news coming from AA. The 757 is an essential aircraft for them and I believe they were in the need for a good refurbishment! No doubt that many of us living in Latin America will appreciate this changes since the 757 are always present in the schedules to our countries!


Mario Antonio Di Giovanni Furiati
User currently offlineMoMan From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 1054 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 9054 times:



Quoting Mariodgf (Reply 8):
Excellent to hear these news coming from AA. The 757 is an essential aircraft for them and I believe they were in the need for a good refurbishment! No doubt that many of us living in Latin America will appreciate this changes since the 757 are always present in the schedules to our countries!

And the bad news it you probably won't see a 'new' 757 for a long time. The rate of conversion is exceptionally slow, so much that some aircraft will probably never get completed before being retired. AA needs to get these done in the next two years, as the interiors of this aircraft are horrible and not befitting of a carrier such as AA. Especially the big brown FC seats which are straight from 1989.

For your specific situation, AA will increase the use of 738s to CCS so that's doubly problematic for your chances to fly on a refurb.



AA Platinum Member - American Airlines Forever
User currently offlinePRAirbus From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2005, 1129 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 9021 times:

Typical of AA's management latest trends...announcing something and then backing down.

User currently offlinePanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4875 posts, RR: 25
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 8997 times:
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Quoting PRAirbus (Reply 10):
Typical of AA's management latest trends...announcing something and then backing down.

They aren't 'backing down'...if they were, they would be cancelling the project. Problem is that given the current economic meltdown, capital and cash are very precious commodities...an airline has to watch its capital expenditures...drawing out some of these refurbishments over a longer period is a way to preserve cash/capital.


User currently offlineSandyb123 From UK - Scotland, joined Oct 2007, 1073 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 8967 times:
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Does the cabin refresh include new overhead bins? IMO old style bins date an aircraft much more than seats or sidewalls.

No individual ptv puts AA behind CO and DL on TATL ops. Is this purely a budget thing?

Sandyb123



DC3, 727, 737, 744, 753, 777, A32X, A345, A388, ERJ145, E190, BaE146, D328, ATR72, Q400
User currently offlineMoMan From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 1054 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 8922 times:



Quoting Sandyb123 (Reply 12):
Does the cabin refresh include new overhead bins? IMO old style bins date an aircraft much more than seats or sidewalls.

No individual ptv puts AA behind CO and DL on TATL ops. Is this purely a budget thing?

No new overhead bins.

This aircraft is being redone in a budgetary way. AA knows they have to do something about their interiors as the ff base is starting to complain about the 'slAAve ships'.

I'm top tier on AA and finding their nickel-and-diming of customers to be tedious. Having to fly on crappy planes is just another reason to make the jump to DL, CO, or heck, WN.



AA Platinum Member - American Airlines Forever
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11432 posts, RR: 61
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 8920 times:



Quoting Sandyb123 (Reply 12):
No individual ptv puts AA behind CO and DL on TATL ops. Is this purely a budget thing?

Indeed it is a budget thing - not only do those 190 PTVs in every seat cost a substantial figure to install, but they also cost a whole lot more in the maintenance of the units themselves, the wiring, the housing assembly in the seatback, etc., and - not to mention this not-too-small point - they add hundreds of pounds of weight to each plane, which translates to millions each year in fuel across the fleet.

And all of the above for what is really a relatively minor bump in consumer satisfaction, if you ask me. AA has done this research - over and over again - and determined that customers simply are not willing to buy an airline ticket based on a PTV. In other words, if AA offers a nonstop JFK-MAN flight for $577 round-trip, and Delta offers the same flight for $613 round-trip, but gives you a PTV, AA's research has found that there are not enough people willing to pay the extra $36 per round-trip (or $18 each segment) to make the PTVs worth all the extra maintenance, fuel, etc.

Not to mention that many if not most people these days come prepared and bring on board some form of entertainment to occupy themselves while inflight anyway - be it a laptop, portable DVD player, a book, or just the view out the window (my personal favorite).

And, beyond all of the above, AA is going to be offering inflight entertainment on these flights - so it's not as if the book- and laptop-less masses will have nothing to stare at for 6 hours on the way to Europe but the seat in front of them. They'll still be able to watch a movie plus CBS Eye on American, just not at their seat.

And I personally think that is probably the right compromise of price and functionality - they can still be occupied with some visual stimulation if they want it, but they just won't be able to press stop, pause, rewind, etc. or listen to one of 6.3 million songs or whatever Continental or Delta is going to be offering.


User currently offlineSoxfan From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 864 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 8906 times:

Are they going to do anything with the powerports, i.e. expand the number of ports available in coach, change the power from DC to AC, etc.? I would imagine for the TATL planes that business class would get AC power with their seats, but I'm not sure about domestic for either cabin. If this were to happen hypothetically, how much additional weight would be added to the cabin?


Pilot: "Request push, which way should we face?" JFK Ground: "You better face the front, sir, or you'll scare the pax!"
User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 60
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 8831 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 14):
. AA has done this research - over and over again - and determined that customers simply are not willing to buy an airline ticket based on a PTV. In other words, if AA offers a nonstop JFK-MAN flight for $577 round-trip, and Delta offers the same flight for $613 round-trip, but gives you a PTV, AA's research has found that there are not enough people willing to pay the extra $36 per round-trip (or $18 each segment) to make the PTVs worth all the extra maintenance, fuel, etc.

Even the renting of the digiplayers a few times didn't go too well...everyone brings their portable music/video player and/or laptop.....at least that's what I see flying on AA....



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6441 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 8813 times:



Quoting MoMan (Reply 13):
No new overhead bins.

Actually, the current bins on the AA 757s aren't exactly the original overhead bins. In the early 2000s, with the exception of the ex-TWA 757s, AA actually installed overhead bin extensions on their 757s and MD-80s, which are more rounded than the originial bins.

Delta has also installed similar overhead bin extensions on their 757 and MD-88 fleet, only with holding rails. Delta has even installed them now on the ex-TWA 757s that they acquired from AA. I wonder if Delta will install them on the NW 752 fleet.

Continental has also installed similar bin extensions (without holding rails) on their 752 and 737 Classic fleet.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlineWN700Driver From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 8733 times:

It's been said that there will be new sidewall panels. Anyone know is this applies to just the components near the window, or is it from the ceiling all the way down to the DADO panels too?

I ask because I've noticed that on the Super 80s these all look very well put together, but also that were all updated as part of one package too.
also, anyone know the timeframe per airframe on this?


User currently offlineQQflyboy From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2266 posts, RR: 13
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 8729 times:



Quoting MoMan (Reply 13):
No new overhead bins.

As 1337Delta764 pointed out, the overhead bins were expanded in the past five to eight years and given new streamlined doors. Each bin now can hold four roll-a-board suitcases wheels first, nearly doubling the carry-on space on the a/c.

Quoting Sandyb123 (Reply 12):
Does the cabin refresh include new overhead bins?

Keeping the above in mind, keeping the original PSUs, or passenger service units, which contain the reading lights, air vents and call buttons can indeed date the interior. Since AA's 757s span a 15 year time frame in age, they are different from a/c to a/c, but there was no specific info regarding the PSUs in the project outline, so I'm guessing these will remain the same.

Quoting Soxfan (Reply 15):
Are they going to do anything with the powerports, i.e. expand the number of ports available in coach, change the power from DC to AC, etc.?

I asked this question several months ago, and I was told they were evaluating the options. I am hopeful they will be new, standard plug type power ports, but we haven't been told. As far as additional power ports, well, no specifics have been given on that either.



The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
User currently offlineMoMan From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 1054 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 8268 times:



Quoting WN700Driver (Reply 18):
It's been said that there will be new sidewall panels. Anyone know is this applies to just the components near the window, or is it from the ceiling all the way down to the DADO panels too?

All the way from top to the bottom. I have noticed some of the AA 757s do have new sidewalls that match the 777. I've even seen 1 or 2 757s with the new panel walls on the 2L bathroom/galley, matching the 777/737 style.



AA Platinum Member - American Airlines Forever
User currently offlineFUN2FLY From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 1025 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 8220 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 14):
And all of the above for what is really a relatively minor bump in consumer satisfaction, if you ask me. AA has done this research - over and over again - and determined that customers simply are not willing to buy an airline ticket based on a PTV. In other words, if AA offers a nonstop JFK-MAN flight for $577 round-trip, and Delta offers the same flight for $613 round-trip, but gives you a PTV, AA's research has found that there are not enough people willing to pay the extra $36 per round-trip (or $18 each segment) to make the PTVs worth all the extra maintenance, fuel, etc.

I'm not to sure about this. Certainly other airlines disagree. CO will have PTV's in nearly every domestic n/b and all international flights when LiveTV is done. LH is retrofitting many L/H w/PTV's, and many other examples. With that logic, will AA's 788's not have PTV's for the same reasons you mention? It seems to be WN's philosophy that AA is taking on, not the premier image that they aspire to.


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11432 posts, RR: 61
Reply 22, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 8040 times:



Quoting FUN2FLY (Reply 21):
With that logic, will AA's 788's not have PTV's for the same reasons you mention?

No, the 787s will almost certainly have PTVs for two reasons:

1. They are going to be used on far, far longer flights than the 757s ever could or would be

2. The weight savings built into the 787 make it a lot more bearable for AA to add a few hundred pounds of weight with PTVs

Quoting FUN2FLY (Reply 21):
It seems to be WN's philosophy that AA is taking on, not the premier image that they aspire to.

It's been a long time since I'd say AA truly aspired to any sort of "premier image."


User currently offlinePRAirbus From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2005, 1129 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7845 times:

AA Management draconian cost cutting initiatives might be working for the stockholders and balance sheet health but service wise AA is in the dark ages. Besides having a bitter workforce compared to other major carriers such as Delta, AA's service is coach is close to non-existent. I do recognize Delta was bankrupt and was able to get away with many things but from a passenger perspective Delta offers more. PTVs, AVOD, nicer interiors, amenity kits in Coach, free liquor with dinner on international, mid-movie ice cream service, signature cocktails and Delta is in aggressive expansion mode. In contrast, AA planes are getting old and in need of repair; the interiors are full of masking tape, broken and deferred items, etc, etc...FAs and AA employees in general also portray a very poor image, their uniforms are outdated or falling apart if you can call that uniforms since they are a hodge podge of old and less old pieces or bring your own clothes to work...most males do not even wear a tie...it is pathetic...

User currently offline1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6441 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 7717 times:

Quoting QQflyboy (Reply 19):
Keeping the above in mind, keeping the original PSUs, or passenger service units, which contain the reading lights, air vents and call buttons can indeed date the interior. Since AA's 757s span a 15 year time frame in age, they are different from a/c to a/c, but there was no specific info regarding the PSUs in the project outline, so I'm guessing these will remain the same.

Well, some of AA's 757s (mostly from the mid-1990s and later) have newer style PSUs than the original 1980s style of AA's older 757s.

For those wondering about the difference, here they are:

MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Dean Straw
MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Nick Spotter



The left image is of the older 1980s-style PSUs, while the right photo is the newer type used from the mid-1990s onward.

On some of Delta's older 757s, Delta has installed aftermarket PSUs, which have the same dimensions and button layout as the 1980s-style PSUs, but have more modern and brighter reading lights. Perhaps AA should do this with their older 757s.

[Edited 2008-11-11 07:22:24]


The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
25 Mariodgf : Yes no doubt.. Sad to see such a slow pace for this refurbishment since as many have said, the AA 757s interiors don't reflect the level of American A
26 AA1818 : AA have power port in Business class on th 757s already....I use them all the time! As for coach, AA may decide to disperse some power ports like the
27 Keny156 : LOL what we have been saying for a while. I dont know if we are trying to be a LCC or a "premier carrier". It seems we are sort of inbetween. At leas
28 MAH4546 : In 2015 when AA is the only major domestic carrier without PTVs (unless US is still around), then everybody else will have the last laugh. While AA's
29 QQflyboy : Business class is to have built-in AVOD, no hand held players. AA has power ports on all their a/c, front, back and middle, if applicable, ie, First,
30 AA767400 : Yet you yourself are a Flight Attendant based in MIA for either AA or MQ. If you don't like the company you work for, find another job. Because bad m
31 Commavia : I fully appreciate his right to express his opinion - and wholeheartedly agree with many of his concerns. He is certainly right that there are many s
32 SXDFC : Anyone know what tail number this prototype is? As I recall from another thread I started about AA 757 Ops that it will probably be a N1**AN a/c since
33 WN700Driver : Yet you yourself are a Flight Attendant based in MIA for either AA or MQ. If you don't like the company you work for, find another job. Because bad mo
34 MoMan : ExP here. I can say first hand that I spend $500+ a week with AA. As of now I'm kind of in a holding mode, dealing with the shoddy hit or miss servic
35 Soxfan : A good point, but the follow-up question is: where do they go?
36 Commavia : Wherever they would like, which is obviously - judging by the treatment I've gotten lately on some flights - not to work for American anymore.
37 Soxfan : Really good conversation, but perhaps for another thread since I want to stay on the OP's topic... Does anyone think/know if the refurbishing will com
38 Ckfred : Considering the number of MD-80s that fly long-haul routes, such as ORD-West Coast, I'm just glad when I'm on an AA 757, since I can put my book or m
39 Tommy767 : YIKES! an inch thinner? Those seats are thin enough as it is!
40 MAH4546 : Fort Lauderdale sure has it's fair share of Scandinavian service this winter - Copenhagen, Helsinki and Oslo all served.
41 1337Delta764 : The new coach seats will be made by Weber. Since they will be thinner than the current seats, I assume the seats will be the Weber 5751. I think they
42 Keny156 : 5ET/N185AN will be the 1st prototype. All of the IFS aircraft are the 18 newest ones ranging from a delivery date of 7/2001-4/2002.
43 PRAirbus : Quoting AA767400: Yet you yourself are a Flight Attendant based in MIA for either AA or MQ. If you don't like the company you work for, find another j
44 QQflyboy : The refurb will include the installation of the same IFE system on the 763s, Panasonic's eFX system, which includes automated announcements. Currentl
45 Tommy767 : Really? I believe you, it just seems that everytime I ride on an AA 757 the seats are horribly thin that I can feel the springs digging into my back.
46 1337Delta764 : Delta has the Weber 5751 seats on their 737-700s, 737-800s, ex-TWA ETOPS 757s, domestic 767-300s, and 777-200LRs. However only those on the 772LR hav
47 QQflyboy : Which surprises me, because DL has been pretty innovative and forward thinking in their cabin designs in the past few years. Why overlook this much l
48 N62NA : Will the refurbished 757s have the ability to display the moving map that we sometimes see on the 763s and that we all have access to on the AA 777s?
49 AA767400 : That is not limited to AA. There are a lot of airline Employees who feel underpaid at many levels, positions, and airlines. What you both forget is t
50 1337Delta764 : I am pretty sure it will. The Panasonic eFX IFE system includes a moving map program known as iXPLOR. I am pretty sure that J passengers will have ac
51 QQflyboy : Yes. They'll have iExplore like the 763s. The 777 has Airshow.
52 PHX Flyer : The summer 2009 slot allocation conference is set to begin tomorrow in Athens, Greece. US and DL have long announced their long-haul plans for next su
53 PSU.DTW.SCE : Agreed. As it is now, my preference for AA's narrowbody fleet is 1) MD-80 2) 738 3) 757 The MD-80 workhorse is still very much a desirable aircraft f
54 PRAirbus : Not sure AA will be growing or expanding like Delta. Most likely the AA TATL 757s will substitute 763's; basically downgrading. It is a shame because
55 QQflyboy : Yes and no. There will be substitutions. It is widely expected (and reported by some management) the late JFK-CDG and JFK-BRU will go to a 757. There
56 Jacobin777 : NRT is another one....as well as OneWorld feed at LAX, JFK, ORD, MIA, etc. DL is waaaaay behind.... Already is... Fortunately the pilots union likes
57 MAH4546 : From what I have heard, ORD-MAN/DUB and JFK-BCN will become 752s; however JFK-BCN is a maybe because it is a long flight and I think there might crew
58 LAXdude1023 : Last I checked, AA doesnt fly NRT-MIA. AA has a different strategy than DL. Granted AA is a little too conservative, but AA has always chosen to focu
59 MoMan : AA is primarily focused on the oneWorld and allowing partners to operate flights. Given the state of their on-board product, it's not a bad plan.
60 PHX Flyer : These routes were also brought up by someone on 'Flyertalk'. I am almost certain that AA did not request slots at DUS for 2009. Maybe they'd consider
61 Jacobin777 : Ya' smart-alec ..you know you know what I meant...
62 QQflyboy : I had forgotten about DUS until Mark mentioned it. I wasn't aware there were slot restrictions at DUS. However, could BA give AA one of theirs allowi
63 MAH4546 : Typically new routes are. However, information at the IATA conference is not made public. Airlines can request routes, and the public does not nessec
64 PHX Flyer : I read that memo. It was released during the first week of September. It said that new routes wer "in the process of being finalized". That was six w
65 MAH4546 : No, there is no point in keeping it secret from the public, unless AA themselves aren't exactly sure what date they will launch the routes since the
66 ConcordeBoy : All 757 1stop charters though, right? Good luck getting the routing authority....
67 MAH4546 : Finnair - FLL-YHZ-HEL, 752, scheduled Thomas Cook Airlines Scandinavia - FLL-CPH, 330, charter TUIfly Nordic - FLL-OSL-ARN, 763, charter
68 Andaman : Scheduled but charter-like service, similar to their HEL-BOS and HEL-YYZ service both 752 in summer. Otherwise AY use 752 (227 seats) for holiday cha
69 N62NA : Funny how people claim on here that the only people who care (or notice) whether a plane is a widebody or narrowbody on a particular route for "esthe
70 Jacobin777 : quid-pro-quo... ....but the other two are certainly viable....as of today.
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