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CO IAH-GIG - DL Looking For More Flights To Brazil  
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 8009 times:
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DL also presented today to DOT a reply to Continental request to fly IAH-GIG daily saying they want more flights to Brazil:

OST-2008-0315
Answer of Delta Air Lines
"
Hereby answers the application of Continental Airlines, Inc. (“Continental”) which seeks allocation of seven of the 14 new U.S.-Brazil frequencies that become available in 2009. Delta also has a strong interest in offering new service to Brazil, and Delta intends to submit an application in response to Department’s invitation for route case proposals.

The Department has already stated that it will establish a route case for the purpose of allocating these opportunities. See DOT Notice dated July 7, 2008 (“We will entertain applications for the rights that become available in 2009 and 2010 in a future proceeding, to be announced by the Department.”) Delta wants to commence additional Brazil service at the earliest available opportunity in 2009. Thus, Delta’s and Continental’s requests are mutually exclusive.

Delta urges that the Department’s new Notice inviting applications consider, at a minimum, both the June 1, and October 1, 2009 frequencies. This will avoid wasting DOT and carrier resources in two immediately sequential proceedings, to examine identical U.S.-Brazil service and competition issues. In addition, the Department will be able to make a reasoned choice to maximize the public interest benefits between and among the competing applicants.
"

Also, Spirit required DOT to allocate asap the frequencies, but as per DL comment, this will not be possible.

AA probably will be the next.


New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
81 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17428 posts, RR: 46
Reply 1, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 7745 times:

Sounds like they're just stalling? Or is this going to be like their last circus of a Brazil application?


E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 2, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 7697 times:
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Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 1):
Sounds like they're just stalling? Or is this going to be like their last circus of a Brazil application?

Well seems that they will fight with CO for a route that they are trying to get time to announce.
I believe it could be ATL-BSB, ATL-CNF or JFK-GIG.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7556 posts, RR: 25
Reply 3, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 7650 times:

I think CO would win this fight. IAH-GIG is a market that needs service that has none. I dont know of an ATL-Brasil flight that doesnt have service that would have half the O&D that IAH-GIG does.


Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 4, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 7589 times:
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Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 3):
I think CO would win this fight. IAH-GIG is a market that needs service that has none. I dont know of an ATL-Brasil flight that doesnt have service that would have half the O&D that IAH-GIG does

Agree 100% with you. But DL will try (and i believe AA also) but they should focus to fight for the Oct 2009 frequencies. CO service will get a very strong support from Oil Industry and i use to say, only a possible UA IAD-BSB would got so big public interest as IAH-GIG but as all of us know, UA is not able even to use their current 21 frequencies year-round.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineAlianza From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 230 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 7584 times:

Didn't DL recently cut a frequency to Brasil ??

User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17428 posts, RR: 46
Reply 6, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 7579 times:



Quoting Alianza (Reply 5):
Didn't DL recently cut a frequency to Brasil ??

ATLMAO is down one weekly flight. BOGJFK is also cut to 5 weekly as well.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 7, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 7560 times:
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Quoting Alianza (Reply 5):
Didn't DL recently cut a frequency to Brasil ??

They drop one of their future flights to MAO (to 6 weekly from daily) in favor of having the rights to fly with 2 unrestricted frequencies their expected Los Angeles-São Paulo service.

They are also some weeks ( but not every week ), not flying one JFK-GRU flight so i believe the third frequency (for LAX-GRU) will come from JFK-GRU.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17428 posts, RR: 46
Reply 8, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 7523 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 7):
They drop one of their future flights to MAO (to 6 weekly from daily) in favor of having the rights to fly with 2 unrestricted frequencies their expected Los Angeles-São Paulo service.

I wonder if that's not a convenient excuse to save face and wiggle out of as much ATLMAO as possible



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7556 posts, RR: 25
Reply 9, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 7523 times:

DL might as well come out and say: "We dont know where we want to fly, we just dont want CO to have the frequencies for IAH-GIG".


Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 10, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 7469 times:
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Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 9):
I wonder if that's not a convenient excuse to save face and wiggle out of as much ATLMAO as possible

Agree... advance bookings are not good up to now.

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 10):
DL might as well come out and say: "We dont know where we want to fly, we just dont want CO to have the frequencies for IAH-GIG".

That's the "subject" of their message. They asked DOT to "invite" airlines for the 2009 draft instead of immediately present a request for a specific flight.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 7419 times:

let's not write the obituary for ATL-MAO just yet. A.net has been famous for propogating false or premature information only to be proven wrong later. AtLMAO is still more than a month from departure of the first flight. None of us know what the expected bookings or the global sales efforts are that involve this flight. Remember also that DL clearly expects for ATLMAO to be part of its global network and dependent on int'l flow traffic - unlike other US-Brazil routes which are largely dependent on US or Brazilian traffic.

DL dropped the 7th ATLMAO conditional on the DOT granting it LAX-GRU. The 7th frequency of JFK-GRU is being transferred to start LAX-GRU 3 days/week along with the two ex-UA frequencies.

But regardless of what CO applies for, AA and DL will vigorously fight for more service to other points in Brazil or even add'l GIG service from other parts of the US before conceding IAH-GIG to CO.


User currently offlineYellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6091 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 7401 times:



Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
let's not write the obituary for ATL-MAO just yet. A.net has been famous for propogating false or premature information only to be proven wrong later.

Amongst all this good news today (africans expansion), thou shalt seize upon one little bit of negative and defend it like it was the holy grail.

Looking at some snapshot seat availability for the coming few months..every flght seems very very wide open.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7556 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 7379 times:



Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
But regardless of what CO applies for, AA and DL will vigorously fight for more service to other points in Brazil or even add'l GIG service from other parts of the US before conceding IAH-GIG to CO.

Yes because its DL's choice who the frequencies are awared to.  Yeah sure

I fully expect IAH-GIG to be granted reguardless of who applies.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17428 posts, RR: 46
Reply 14, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 7374 times:



Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
Remember also that DL clearly expects for ATLMAO to be part of its global network and dependent on int'l flow traffic - unlike other US-Brazil routes which are largely dependent on US or Brazilian traffic.

All of DL's Brazil routes with the exception of GRUJFK are very dependent on flow--which should be no surprise seeing as DL is a flow carrier. In fact the biggest OD on ATLGRU and ATLGIG is not ATL, but MCO.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineFrostbite From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 396 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 7280 times:



Quoting Yellowtail (Reply 13):
Looking at some snapshot seat availability for the coming few months..every flght seems very very wide open.



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 11):
Agree... advance bookings are not good up to now.

This may well be true, but it wasn't that long ago that new routes were *expected* to require time to develop. DL began their modern-day expansion to LatAm in spring 1998 with ATL-CCS, with ATL-GUA/SAL/SJO/PTY following days thereafter, all daily on 757s. I worked for DL at the time and noted that loads were pitiful (25 pax or so) for some months after the inaugurals. Needless to say, performance ramped up and DL's LatAm presence has grown by leaps and bounds since then.

DL's decision to fly to Manaus is consistent with their wider strategy of aggressive expansion to emerging & underserved international markets, and more often than not this has been a formula for success (particularly out of ATL). This is not without risk...some nuts are going to be harder for DL to crack than others and perhaps MAO is not as "underserved" as was initially thought. We will see what happens with MAO but I wouldn't write it off just yet - fares are very high and I would guess the break-even load factor isn't much north of 50%. If they do pull out of MAO the widget will just show up somewhere else in Brazil, there are other promising markets as others have pointed out.

I can't help but add...if I was still a DL employee I would take advantage of the soft loads and non-rev to MAO in a heartbeat - what a unique part of the world.


User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3694 posts, RR: 19
Reply 16, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 7242 times:



Quoting Frostbite (Reply 16):
MAO is not as "underserved" as was initially thought.

JJ's 767 to MIA is more than enough.


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11429 posts, RR: 58
Reply 17, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 7216 times:
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Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
let's not write the obituary for ATL-MAO just yet. A.net has been famous for propogating false or premature information only to be proven wrong later. AtLMAO is still more than a month from departure of the first flight

That's why i mention as "advance bookings". No one is saying the flight will be a mistake at this time.
As we discussed on another thread, IMO it could be better used as ATL-BSB.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
But regardless of what CO applies for, AA and DL will vigorously fight for more service to other points in Brazil or even add'l GIG service from other parts of the US before conceding IAH-GIG to CO.

They will fight, and i don't know DOT criteria, but seems to me that the O&D on IAH-GIG is bigger than anything DL or AA may ask for.

Quoting Yellowtail (Reply 13):
Looking at some snapshot seat availability for the coming few months..every flght seems very very wide open.

Correct, just the first flight is almost full.

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 14):
I fully expect IAH-GIG to be granted reguardless of who applies.

One more time, agreed!

Quoting Frostbite (Reply 16):
This may well be true, but it wasn't that long ago that new routes were *expected* to require time to develop



Quoting Frostbite (Reply 16):
This is not without risk...some nuts are going to be harder for DL to crack than others and perhaps MAO is not as "underserved" as was initially thought. We will see what happens with MAO but I wouldn't write it off just yet - fares are very high and I would guess the break-even load factor isn't much north of 50%

MAO is now served non-stop to MIA by JJ on a 767 with 205 daily seats (30C175Y) as well as Copa runs a 4x weekly MAO-PTY allowing several connections to places like MCO and LAX with E190.
There's room for DL ? I don't think so and they will fight for O&D MAO as their schedule isn't so good for people from BEL or BSB for example. MAO is a city with strong electronic industry and this, because Brazlian Real become weaker against US$, is facing a downturn (imagine that LCD TV that use to cost R$ 3990 and now is available at R$ 5490) with less activity.

Quoting C010T3 (Reply 17):
JJ's 767 to MIA is more than enough

A 3-4 weekly MAO-ATL would be interesting considering DL can focus on North American and Japan markets.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4009 posts, RR: 13
Reply 18, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 7216 times:



Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
But regardless of what CO applies for, AA and DL will vigorously fight for more service to other points in Brazil or even add'l GIG service from other parts of the US before conceding IAH-GIG to CO.

I am thinking AA will not apply for anything. CO gets its Rio route and Spirit and Delta bleed the equivalent of an oil tanker on their MAO battle.

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 7):
They are also some weeks ( but not every week ), not flying one JFK-GRU flight so i believe the third frequency (for LAX-GRU) will come from JFK-GRU.

If Delta is willing to give up one frequency at JFK-GRU then their flying JFK-GIG seems a remote possibility indeed. And JFK-GRU has not done nearly as well as some insiders have tried to make us believe.


User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 7192 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 18):
They will fight, and i don't know DOT criteria, but seems to me that the O&D on IAH-GIG is bigger than anything DL or AA may ask for.

IAHGIG is clearly a large market. The question is simply whether the DOT is interested in developing a new market such as BSB or add more capacity to GIG.

I think CO has as good of a chance for more service to GIG as anyone does but it isn't a given that

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 19):
And JFK-GRU has not done nearly as well as some insiders have tried to make us believe.

and you have the facts to prove that from ....?

And I also don't think DL will stick around MAO if NK or B6 comes in or at least with all 6 current frequencies... there are far more opportunities for serving Brasil than just MAO; the frequencies can be moved and DL has the airplanes to fly to other regions, something B6 or NK can't do.


User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17428 posts, RR: 46
Reply 20, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 7175 times:

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 20):
and you have the facts to prove that from ....?

DL is the least full of all the NYC/GRU carriers by a good amount, including JL, and it's not likely they have a fare premium. In fact they're noticeably below the market average it appears. Makes you wonder about JFKEZE which is a smaller market with lower fares.

[Edited 2008-11-13 14:32:24]


E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently onlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32702 posts, RR: 72
Reply 21, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 7149 times:



Quoting Incitatus (Reply 19):
I am thinking AA will not apply for anything. CO gets its Rio route and Spirit and Delta bleed the equivalent of an oil tanker on their MAO battle.

AA will be applying, likely MIA-FOR.



a.
User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4009 posts, RR: 13
Reply 22, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 7145 times:



Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 20):
and you have the facts to prove that from ....?

The fact that DL is willing to move one frequency from JFK-GRU to LAX-GRU is sufficient.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 20):
And I also don't think DL will stick around MAO if NK or B6 comes in or at least with all 6 current frequencies...

This contradicts an earlier statement you made 3 hours ago which I reproduce below.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
Remember also that DL clearly expects for ATLMAO to be part of its global network and dependent on int'l flow traffic



User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3694 posts, RR: 19
Reply 23, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 7095 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 18):
A 3-4 weekly MAO-ATL would be interesting considering DL can focus on North American and Japan markets.

I's rather have two carriers in a solid position at MAO than three suffering. I think that the consolidation of JJ's and CM's flights is the safest alternative for the Manauara market. DL's network is very volatile at the moment and will stay so for at least two years because of NW's integration.

Quoting Incitatus (Reply 19):

If Delta is willing to give up one frequency at JFK-GRU then their flying JFK-GIG seems a remote possibility indeed.

Well, either DL, AA or CO will apply for NYC-GIG. There's no way the US carriers will allow JJ to explore the market by itself for at least two years until the next round in 2010.


User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4009 posts, RR: 13
Reply 24, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7005 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 22):
AA will be applying, likely MIA-FOR.

You may be right, but AA also has an incentive to stay put and let Spirit get the MAO frequencies and let them and DL struggle.


25 WorldTraveler : but that data really says nothing about profitability. DL's costs are considerably lower than AA's. I'm not doubting that AA does very well on JFK-GR
26 MAH4546 : There is no new viable new market to open except BSB. AA also won't necessarily let losing a frequency battle end their plans to serve Fortaleza.
27 LipeGIG : Lets wait, as per Mark comments i doubt AA will not apply for the 14 frequencies. It's my coment only, not DL decision yet. And they need to use one
28 Incitatus : DL dropped one frequency for high season. How many will they drop for low season, and considering that travel is slowing?
29 LipeGIG : Considering they don't know yet the possible year-round route performance, it's early to say, but again, focus was to have LAX. But as i mentioned, M
30 Jetlanta : Incitatus, keep in mind that a 6x weekly 737-700 service in the ATL-MAO market is virtually invisible in a company the size of the new Delta. They ca
31 WorldTraveler : It should also be noted that as DL builds JFK to more secondary destinations in Europe and the Middle East, they do create some connecting opportuniti
32 OA412 : Additionally, JFK-NRT should help a great deal.
33 Cmtehori : DL cancelled only 3 flights JFK-GRU in november due to poor loads. As a reminder, november is historically the month with lowest loads between US-Bra
34 Incitatus : I understand what you are saying and that sometimes airlines (and other companies) act like that. But ATL-MAO is not "virtually invisible" inside DL.
35 MaverickM11 : I've never said it's unprofitable, but on the revenue side it's probably the weakest player in the NYCSAO market. And when you factor in this.... ...
36 LipeGIG : Thanks Carlos, just to clarify, i didn't said that DL will do, i said that considering they can manage to maintain all frequencies on ATL routes year
37 Incitatus : I don't know if it is shrinking but it seems to be one the core strategies of every airline that serves both Japan and Brazil. With at least a dozen
38 MaverickM11 : There's definitely some good traffic to be had there, but it does seem like the options between SAO and TYO are endless and probably drive the fare w
39 MasseyBrown : DL seems to have kicked the AA anthill and now the ants are swarming. But I'm not sure why you think DL, the big dog now, is more likely to get route
40 Incitatus : Delta's consolidator fares between Sao Paulo and Tokyo start at US$850.
41 MaverickM11 : Yeesh...well they carry the most traffic between the two points after JL
42 C010T3 : That could be true, but this is a unique situation. I really can't think of another case in which the competition is between short-haul and long-haul
43 LipeGIG : Which show how this seems to be a low yield market. Sao Paulo-New York fares start at around US$ 750
44 WorldTraveler : The DOT really doesn't want to be involved in these continuous right cases between AA and DL in Brazil. the reason DL amended its application for the
45 Incitatus : Consolidator fares can now be had in the $500s for NY-SP. The issue with fares between Brazil and Japan at the bottom of the market is vanilla econom
46 MAH4546 : Spirit applied with DOT for beyond rights from Brazil to Argentina; the eventual plan is to extend FLL-MAO to EZE; if not launch it like that. Then a
47 Cmtehori : Could not agree more ! (however, I don´t see it happening. Hopefully I´m wrong!) However, aren´t yields to LAX too low? Some say they´re as low a
48 AF086 : Spirit presented a reply to the DoT supporting Continental's application: OST-2008-0315-0003 Answer of Spirit Airlines Inc.: "Spirit Airlines, Inc. (
49 Cws818 : That may be how it looks to you, but it is not how it looks to everyone. From another perspective, it might look as though AA and DL have irreconcila
50 Jetlanta : But revenue isn't the ONLY side, is it? What do you think Delta's aircraft ownership and operating costs are compared to AA? CO? or even JJ with thei
51 LipeGIG : Some says yields are low, but California as far as i know is the biggest US state and they are increasing business with Brazil during the past 3 year
52 Incitatus : I find these statements risible. It reminds me of a certain recent candidate to office in the US who pulled generic statements out of a hat to answer
53 WorldTraveler : antitrust doesn't play a part in the process if the US DOT is the one that is telling the airlines to figure out a way to meet their needs. The airli
54 Commavia : No they don't.
55 MaverickM11 : On a related note DL is now firmly #3 to Latin America through the second quarter of 2009 in terms of ASMs after last weeks round of cuts.
56 LipeGIG : You made a very good point. O&D from MAO is also diluted by the cost to get the US Visa. Costs are almost the same of the ticket MAO-US-MAO.
57 MAH4546 : Delta has no such argument. Delta, more than any other, has shown how easy it is to get access to Heathrow. Delta has acquired the slots they need; a
58 WorldTraveler : yes, they do. Because want to believe that ATLLHR is open doesn't mean it is. Access is still much more limited than at any other major hub in Europe
59 LAXdude1023 : Youre full of it. If you do hopefully the DOT will be able to see through the excrement youre posting. All you want is for DL to have a competitive a
60 WorldTraveler : and the cost of those slots is much higher than at any other airport in Europe. The market is not open if the cost of access is prohibitive. Spending
61 Cws818 : It IS open because any U.S. carrier has the opportunity to serve LHR today, unlike before. For proof you need only look as far as the widgets parked
62 LAXdude1023 : No, I know you dont work for the DOT. Im not worried about that. You do have influence on a.net because like Rush Limbaugh or Al Franken, occasionall
63 Post contains images MAH4546 : No, that logic is not "priceless." Both AA and DL have 100% valid arguments as to why they should each receive the unrestricted frequencies. It is cl
64 MasseyBrown : CO capitalized the costs of the slots, as do all airlines; as intangible assets, the slots are not amortized unless for some reason the airlines shou
65 LipeGIG : No WT, you didn't get the point. MAO does not have a US consulate and the closer is in fact the Embassy in BSB. US requires interview so it demands t
66 WorldTraveler : I don't have to work for the DOT to have an influence. The US is a democracy... I get to speak my voice and Washington is supposed to listen. Sometim
67 Incitatus : The reality is that Delta/AF are at a disadvantage at Heathrow. Star holds a sizeable chunk of slots there. That's why WT is whining. Competition can
68 MaverickM11 : DL's tendency to delay and drop DOT awards and circus-style filings will weigh against them much more than your [nonexistant] influence. They actuall
69 C010T3 : If the USA proposed visa waiving to the Brazilian government, be sure that the passports would be changed once more in no time. Just set a deadline.
70 WorldTraveler : No, DL/AF is not in denial. They know they are at a disadvantage and are not going to allow someone else to say the market is open when DL/AF/NW/KL c
71 C010T3 : No, Brazil entered the list of countries with low visa refusal. There is no automaticity in the admittance to the VWP. Well, it's standard in Brazil.
72 MAH4546 : Technically, the admittance is "automatic" once Brazil adopts electronic passports. Just like the Czech Republic, South Korea, and four other countri
73 Cws818 : If they are not in denial, then they and you seem to be stuck in a state of semantic and/or conceptual confusion. The market is open!!!! If it were n
74 Commavia : Well, I suppose, in some people's logic, if Delta is not dominating a market, it must be because there is some unfair or protectionist policy in plac
75 LAXdude1023 : It is an open market because anyone who wants to can fly there any time they want. All they have to do is acquire a slot. Not like NRT where slots ca
76 C010T3 : If it were automatic, more countries would have been accepted, not to mention that Brazil would have been accepted to the programme, but its citizens
77 MAH4546 : Brazil will be accepted into the the visa waiver program when they get the right passports and assuming that the refusal rate doesn't rise again.
78 WorldTraveler : OPEN means that there is the opportunity to grow at reasonable rates. DL and Skyteam are still far behind BA and AA in terms of market access at LHR.
79 C010T3 : OK, so you should really contact the Itamaraty and tell them that.
80 Incitatus : Skyteam has too many slots at LHR. They have so many that they wasted one flying to LAX this past Summer.
81 Cws818 : Perhaps that is because SkyTeam does not have a British member carrier. It is entirely reasonable that BA has more Heathrow slots than AF, and vice-v
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