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NW TPA-AMS?  
User currently offlineBTVB6Flyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 218 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 6907 times:

According to Wikipedia (yes I know Wikipedia) it shows that KLM is flying, TPA-AMS operated by NW, it also shows it as seasonal but with no start date? If I’m not mistaken this flight has not been around correct? So is this a new flight or just a mistake?

On a side note it also shows US TPA-LAS is ending 3/4/2008

Here is the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tampa_International_Airport

38 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAAH732UAL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 6881 times:

I think that is an error. Flightaware does not show any flights plus what airplane? Its out of the 757-200s range and there is no A330s that go into there from NW.

User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 6882 times:

I believe it was a rumored/planned route, now that Delta took over, it won't likely happen, as DL says, NW flies too much to AMS.


"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineMisbeehavin From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 914 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 6780 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 2):
I believe it was a rumored/planned route, now that Delta took over, it won't likely happen, as DL says, NW flies too much to AMS.

It was more likely someone's fantasy being played out on Wikipedia. Isn't the first time either. And dude, seriously, stop feeling sorry for yourself that DAL bought NWA.


User currently offlineMHTripple7 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 1105 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 6622 times:

For a second I thought that a TPA-AMS route was actually starting! Oh well maybe someday.

Quoting BTVB6Flyer (Thread starter):
On a side note it also shows US TPA-LAS is ending 3/4/2008

Thankfully WN also flies this route so we won't be loosing the service completely.

Also it says that Air Dominicana flies to Punta Cana and Santo Domingo. I've never heard of this airline and it doesn't have an IATA code so I'm guessing this service doesn't exist.


User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4695 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 6518 times:

TPA from AMS? KL/NW couldn't even make MIA work (it's MP now), what does TPA have that MIA doesn't?


For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineBTVB6Flyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 218 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 6364 times:



Quoting MHTripple7 (Reply 4):
Also it says that Air Dominicana flies to Punta Cana and Santo Domingo. I've never heard of this airline and it doesn't have an IATA code so I'm guessing this service doesn't exist.

Actually Air Domincana service does exist, my dad who works at TPA with immigration inspects the flights. I’m not sure why it doesn't have an IATA code though?


User currently offlineMKE22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1141 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 6309 times:



Quoting MHTripple7 (Reply 4):
Also it says that Air Dominicana flies to Punta Cana and Santo Domingo. I've never heard of this airline and it doesn't have an IATA code so I'm guessing this service doesn't exist.

It's a newer airline, a start-up out of the Dominican Republic.



If Your not pissed, your not trying
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32782 posts, RR: 72
Reply 8, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 6305 times:



Quoting JRadier (Reply 5):
KL/NW couldn't even make MIA work (it's MP now),

No, it's not "MP now."

It has always been MP. KL/NW tried to compete with MP, but couldn't successfully.

MP has flown to Miami since the 1980s. However, if KL takes over MP as expected, it's pretty likely KLM will return to Miami.



a.
User currently offlineBillReid From Netherlands, joined Jun 2006, 1012 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 6259 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 2):
I believe it was a rumored/planned route, now that Delta took over, it won't likely happen, as DL says, NW flies too much to AMS.

The chance of this is about the same as MLB having LH, BA, AF all announce A380 service with three daily flights each.

KL does NOT fly to FLA at all. DL has no N/S out of FLA, nor does NWA. Skyteam is only represented in FLA with AF service. MP has only 5 pax birds in inventory. And AMS had lobbied NWA for PIT-AMS service and it was implemented as PIT-CDG service.

There are NIL scheduled carriers considering TPA. BA can't even maintain daily to TPA. Condor failed at TPA, MP failed at TPA. So why would any EU airline consider TPA?

Beyond this TPA is a non-starter, MIA is the city destination, MCO is the amusement park destination, and TPA possesses no beach destinations within its counties. PIE, SRQ, RSW are all superior for tourists. Business yield is crappy, just ask BA

PIPE DREAM!



Some people don't get it. Business is about making MONEY!
User currently offlineSampa737 From Brazil, joined May 2005, 637 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 6157 times:

Wikipedia showed MEM-LHR some time back. That never happened either. My son swears by Wikipedia and urge him or anyone not to use it as a viable source.

User currently offlineMHTripple7 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 1105 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6097 times:



Quoting BTVB6Flyer (Reply 6):
Actually Air Domincana service does exist, my dad who works at TPA with immigration inspects the flights. I’m not sure why it doesn't have an IATA code though?

That's interesting. Do you know their schedules into TPA by chance? I wasn't able to find their flights in any GDS.


User currently offlineBTVB6Flyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 218 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6061 times:



Quoting MHTripple7 (Reply 11):
Do you know their schedules into TPA by chance?

I do not...I checked their website but is currently under construction. Considering that they are a charter airline it is probably very sporadic.

Wikipedia now shows the NW TPA-AMS flight gone.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32782 posts, RR: 72
Reply 13, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6035 times:



Quoting BTVB6Flyer (Reply 12):

I do not...I checked their website but is currently under construction. Considering that they are a charter airline it is probably very sporadic.

They are operating a 733 from Futura and are currently not flying to Tampa.



a.
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 5657 times:



Quoting BillReid (Reply 9):
Skyteam is only represented in FLA with AF service.

AeroMexico, COPA, and Air Europa also offer nonstop int'l service from Florida, and soon, so will CSA.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32782 posts, RR: 72
Reply 15, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 5645 times:



Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 14):

Quoting BillReid (Reply 9):
Skyteam is only represented in FLA with AF service.

AeroMexico, COPA, and Air Europa also offer nonstop int'l service from Florida, and soon, so will CSA.

As does Alitalia.



a.
User currently offlineTN757Flyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 5568 times:



Quoting Misbeehavin (Reply 3):
It was more likely someone's fantasy being played out on Wikipedia. Isn't the first time either. And dude, seriously, stop feeling sorry for yourself that DAL bought NWA.

Aside from Burnsie's obsession with the evil Delta empire, most a.net readers I believe have come to discover that Wikipedia is less than accurate in much of what it states about the airline industry. I would not place much stock in anything Wiki says. This seems an unlikely route for Delta to take on, at least in the foreseeable future. Lets let them get the marriage consummated and the route system adjustments made, then see what things look like.


User currently offlineSyncmaster From United States of America, joined Jul 2002, 2032 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 5515 times:
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Quoting Sampa737 (Reply 10):
That never happened either. My son swears by Wikipedia and urge him or anyone not to use it as a viable source.

If you check the sources of information on Wikipedia it can be used as a viable source. I agree that you need to be careful though.

Back on track, what demand would there even be for a TPA-AMS route? At the moment I don't see it working out that well, especially because its more leisure traffic. I suspect that Delta will begin relying more on ATL, JFK and DTW for TATL service and just connect passengers beyond those gateways.


User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 18, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 5490 times:

DL could/should bring back MIA to AMS, either getting KL to operate it with the A332 or operating it with one of DL's 763s. Martinair has been successful on the route, I don't see why a network carrier couldn't do just as well. All the big flag carriers of Europe (just about) serve MIA, why not feed into the hub at AMS too.

As for wikipedia - a fine place to start, get some background info - a sort of outline... not a place to do real research. If only wikipedia says something, it's no doubt wrong.



"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32782 posts, RR: 72
Reply 19, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5450 times:



Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 18):
DL could/should bring back MIA to AMS, either getting KL to operate it with the A332 or operating it with one of DL's 763s. Martinair has been successful on the route, I don't see why a network carrier couldn't do just as well. All the big flag carriers of Europe (just about) serve MIA, why not feed into the hub at AMS too.

KLM owns Martinair.

Martinair is a cheap airline, and the fares on MIA-AMS are incredibly cheap. They probably make most of their money on cargo on the flight, as they have a cargo hub at MIA and also run MD11Fs on MIA-AMS.

It would be hard for KL to compete on price with MP. Though if MP decides to exit the passenger business, it is inevitable that KLM will fill the gap on MIA-AMS.



a.
User currently offlineXtoler From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 953 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4804 times:



Quoting BillReid (Reply 9):
And AMS had lobbied NWA for PIT-AMS service and it was implemented as PIT-CDG service.

When was this? Wouldn't that have been US making those flights? US used to have TATL flights in and out of PIT. Then again if NW can fly Hartford to AMS, I guess why not use PIT.

Sounds like someone doesn't like TPA. The reason for NW going to AMS from TPA is for people to get out of TPA, didn't say anything about going into TPA. Not much of a fan for TPA either.  Embarrassment



EMB145 F/A, F/E, J41 F/A, F/E, because my wife clipped my wings, armchair captain
User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4695 posts, RR: 50
Reply 21, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4592 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 8):
No, it's not "MP now."

Should have said 'just MP now'.....

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 8):
However, if KL takes over MP as expected, it's pretty likely KLM will return to Miami.

I don't really see why. Yields are low and most of the traffic are tourists. For those MIA is served pretty well through DL/NW hubs in the US.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 19):

KLM owns Martinair.

As you said above, they don't. They own 50% and are after the other, but are blocked by the EU (for the moment).



For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32782 posts, RR: 72
Reply 22, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4434 times:



Quoting JRadier (Reply 21):
I don't really see why. Yields are low and most of the traffic are tourists. For those MIA is served pretty well through DL/NW hubs in the US.

They'll fill the gap because Miami-Amsterdam is an important market that will not be left unversed. It's only pathetic on KLM's part that they can't make MIA work, because every major European carrier flies to MIA except KLM.

Quoting JRadier (Reply 21):

As you said above, they don't. They own 50% and are after the other, but are blocked by the EU (for the moment).

Correct, 50%, my error.



a.
User currently offlineJRadier From Netherlands, joined Sep 2004, 4695 posts, RR: 50
Reply 23, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 4267 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 22):
They'll fill the gap because Miami-Amsterdam is an important market that will not be left unversed.

Important how exactly?

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 22):
It's only pathetic on KLM's part that they can't make MIA work, because every major European carrier flies to MIA except KLM.

Neither was NW (although that's one and the same pricing wise). AMS-MIA is not a very large O/D market other than tourists (which are fine at MP) and MIA is served very well through ATL and CDG.



For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
User currently offlineFlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15
Reply 24, posted (5 years 10 months 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 3609 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 19):

KLM owns Martinair.

Martinair is a cheap airline, and the fares on MIA-AMS are incredibly cheap. They probably make most of their money on cargo on the flight, as they have a cargo hub at MIA and also run MD11Fs on MIA-AMS.

Are they fully integrated with KL, even if they are only half owned? For instance, could you check in with MP in MIA, fly them to AMS, and then get on a KL flight onward to WAW, or any other European city without re-checking in and what not?

Now that KL is introducing tourism configured 77Ws, might they integrate MP, if they buy more of it, and run tourist configured flights under the KL banner?



"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
25 JRadier : Nope, it's just a separate airline. the 77W, although in 10-abreast layout, is not a 'tourism' plane. HV and to a lesser extend MP operate those serv
26 ElmoTheHobo : Compete? Hasn't KLM owned half of Martinair for decades now?
27 BillReid : You can add Comair, ASA, and about twenty non-consequentual airlines to the list. Get serious start considering bonifide longhaul from Europe. Where
28 Humberside : Starts next year I think once a week
29 TN757Flyer : I thought AM's MIA-Europe service ended quite some time ago. I know they used to fly MIA nonstop to MAD and/or Paris at one point. Now that they serv
30 MAH4546 : Yes, but they still compete. It did, early 1990s. Czech is tenatively set to begin weekly MIA-PRG service in March 2009. Important as in Miami is the
31 Bobnwa : NW/KL have never considered TPA-AMS.
32 Burnsie28 : Pilots were talking about it being rumored in the early/mid 2000's. So someone at HQ typically mentions it for something like that to go around.
33 TN757Flyer : Rumors from pilots do not equate to someone at HQ "talking about it". How many alleged rumors from non-management employees have been the topics of t
34 ConcordeBoy : Though as a side, didn't NW once have a focus/minihub at TPA in the not too distant past though?
35 Burnsie28 : Yes a lot of the caribbean routes were served out of TPA for a long time before moving them to Memphis to allow for better connections.
36 ConcordeBoy : Interesting. About how long ago was that? Also, what LatAm/Carib nonstops does MEM still have?
37 BillReid : Thanks, this is very interesting. However TPA-AMS still remains a very weak pipe dream.
38 MSYtristar : I know TPA had a daily NW nonstop to MBJ as late as the early 00's IIRC. TPA-MBJ was flown on the 320.
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