Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
AA Keeping 717s! Not A318s!  
User currently offlineHighliner2 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 696 posts, RR: 2
Posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2000 times:

Air Transport World is reporting that AA has cancelled TWA's A318 order but is keeping the 717's TWA has now as well as 15 still on order. This is why I love AA. All Boeing baby!


Go Cubs!
47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineGOT From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 1912 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 1757 times:

That's bad. I think the A318 would look absolutely great in AA c/s. And after all, AA could be using some more Airbuses, not only the old A300.

GOT



Just like birdwatching - without having to be so damned quiet!
User currently offlineTan flyr From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1903 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 1739 times:

Just was on a new TW B-717 earlier this week..Nice plane. I believe AA will use them to retire the DC-9-30s ASAP at TW. Later we might see them in on regular AA routes. Look for most TW aircraft to stay with in the TWA, LLc for now as AA figures out the best way to smoothly intregrate TW into AA.
oh, and BTW, GOT, AA has a gentlemens agreement to buy Boeing for many years to come. Hundreds of manufacturing slots on the 737,757 & 777 line are already reserved for AA. There will be no more Airbusses other than the 35 on hand now.


User currently offlineEyeSky From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 312 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 1715 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

This isn't so surprising. It makes a lot of sense from a commonality standpoint. The 717 is much more in line with AA's current fleet. I don't think it is an indictment of the A318.

BTW - Isn't AA supposed to be replacing their A300's soon?

EyeSky  Insane


User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5722 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 1705 times:

To the best of my knowledge- which mostly originates from this forum- AA has no plans to replace the A300 series in the near future. They work very well for what AA needs them for, transatlantic. It took AA a long time to find the niche that the Airbus fit into, but once they did they became quite happy. That's my understanding.

Randy


User currently offlineSamurai 777 From Canada, joined Jan 2000, 2458 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1647 times:

This'll be a blow to Airbus, but wait'll Air Canada or some other airline makes a substantial order for the A318.

The 717 would be a perfect replacement for the Fokker 100s in AA's fleet. Only problem though, is that the F100 fleet in AA is not that old.


User currently offlineTEDSKI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1632 times:

Being that AA currently operates the MD-80, these 717s (MD-95s), will blend in with them because technically they are from the same family. Also AA engine mechanics will have no problem servicing the 717's RR engines.

User currently offlineRIX From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1787 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1616 times:

This'll be a blow to Airbus - was the order that big? How many A318s are ordered by other airlines? It doesn't seem to me A318 is at any danger...

User currently offlineAA767400 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 2332 posts, RR: 26
Reply 8, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1615 times:

Cannot wait to see the 717 in AA colors! the F100's are
not that old at all, so i don't think AA has plans for them to go anytime soon. A300's will remain in the fleet
for a long time to come, they work very well on there
caribbean routes. and the 3class A300's are going to
get a makeover. GO AA717!



"The low fares airline."
User currently offlineQantasA3XX From Singapore, joined Dec 2000, 218 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1612 times:

Sad that AA is not keeping the A318s ..

The Airbus A320s to prove to be better planes then B737s .. Sorrie ...

More AIrbus for US Airlines please !!

This will make Boeing work harder !!!

The better the competition the better planes we see

Sorrie pal but Airbus planes for me
Except i love Boeing 777s and vintage ones ..


User currently offlineWestern737 From United States of America, joined May 2000, 489 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1597 times:

RIX, wait a min? The order of A318 might be rather small to you. They have alot of F100 and older TWA's older DC-9 that they might consider to order more 717 to replace them in future. We never will know...

QantasA3XX,

How do you know that A320 proves better than 737? I never seen any perfect plane, yet.

Lastly, GO BOEING! AA made right decision.






User currently offlineSamurai 777 From Canada, joined Jan 2000, 2458 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1592 times:

was the order that big? How many A318s are ordered by other airlines? It doesn't seem to me A318 is at any danger

Please keep in mind that TWA had orders for about 50 A318s - and that's out of about 160 total orders for the A318 by all airlines to date. That means roughly about $2 billion in lost sales to Airbus, which also has to worry about the A380 being a hugely expensive project to develop.


User currently offlineLogos From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 793 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1574 times:

Quantas A3XX - The Airbus A320s to prove to be better planes then B737s .. Sorrie ... .

You know, this is what I hate about these Airbus vs. Boeing debates (aside from the horrid grammar and spelling) on these boards is that people just come out and say something like this without justification.

Both aircraft have pluses and minuses but, from an operator's standpoint, when everything is taken into consideration, I think the 737 is a marginally better choice. According to the figures I've seen, their CASM is better (particularly for the 737-800 vs. A-320). Continental and Southwest, the only US carriers to make a profit in the most recent reporting period, are both big 737 operators, which has got to tell you something.

That doesn't make the A-32x series bad aircraft (especially with the sweetheart deals Airbus is wont to give), but a statement like they prove to be better or "they're more economical" are wholly unsubstantiated. Keep the discussion factual.

By the way, the loss of this A-318 order does hurt Airbus. As was mentioned above, TWA comprised a significant portion of all A-318 orders and was the North American launch customer. Now only Frontier has them on order in North America, as far as I know. Whether anyone is hot to take TWA's delivery positions, especially with the economy doing what it's doing, I don't know. I don't see anybody clamoring for them like Midwest Express and AirTran were for the 717s if they became available.

Cheers,
Dave in Berlin

By the way



Too many types flown to list
User currently offlineNavion From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1010 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1568 times:

I know some of you guys are disappointed that AA will not be getting the TWA ordered A318's. However it is important to remember, for the job AA would need the 717's, the A318's are simply too heavy. An A318 becomes more attractive the longer the sector. The 717 is not only much lighter, but it has in fact beat it's performance guarantee targets so significantly that Boeing actually increased the payload allowed. I do like the look of the A318 (especially with that taller fin), but AA has certainly not made a mistake. One final thing, if AA needs lower density longer stage length aircraft, it has the 738 which is extremely efficient with great long range performance.

User currently offlineJuul From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 1555 times:

Logos,

You know what I hate about these A vs. B wars (aside from what you already mentioned)? People twisting numbers in such a way that the product they prefer comes out best, no matter how old or rediculous those statements, numbers or facts are. Examples:

"Continental and Southwest, the only US carriers to make a profit in the most recent reporting period, are both big 737 operators, which has got to tell you something."
So they're profitable because they operate the 737? You can't possibly take this seriously, can you?

"...aircraft (especially with the sweetheart deals Airbus is wont to give)".
Oh man, this one's really old. Can you actually PROVE that Airbus gives more discount than Boeing?

Remember, let's keep this discussion factual, like you said...

Making up some facts to prove your point is just as bad as not providing any facts, which is what A3XX did (oh, and I don't agree with what he (Airbus A3XX) said or the way he said it...)

Greetings



User currently offlineJkelley480 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 127 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 1530 times:

Just a question: Why did TWA order both the 717 and the 318? Aren't they competing aircraft with similar capabilities? Just wondering.

User currently offlineRIX From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1787 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 1526 times:

Samurai 777, thank you for information - now I see Airbus has what to worry about.

Western737, the TWA A318 order is not "rather small" for me - after I knew the numbers. Which was the only purpose of my question...  Smile.


User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4531 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 1485 times:

It can't really be proved by any of us on this forum, but Airbus has been known to give large price cuts when selling aircraft.

User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 1483 times:

Finally, i can't stand Airbus.

User currently offlineGerardo From Spain, joined May 2000, 3481 posts, RR: 31
Reply 19, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 1481 times:

CBA, the same did Boeing. Do you honestly believe, that any airline buys Boeing just because they are fan of Boeing? Remember the sweetheart deal of SQ, where Boeing offered to buy all A343?

As for the lost A318 deal: the A318 is not an aircraft with high margins, so the funding for the A380, or of any other Airbus project, is in no way in danger so far.

Gerardo



dominguez(dash)online(dot)ch ... Pushing the limits of my equipment
User currently offlineJuul From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 1476 times:

Cba,

Do you really think Boeing doesn't do that? That's just the way business is done, my friend...
Or do you really think AA, DL and CO would sign exclusivity contract without HUGE discounts being included.

Another thing: you say 'Airbus has been known to give large discounts...'. Where is it these rumors are beig spread? Right, here on these forums, because each time Airbus wins an order, you can bet that after a while some juvenile comes along with the good old 'Airbus probably gave them away' line. Is it really that hard to accept that airlines might actually choose to buy Airbuses because they believe they're the best for their needs, not just because they 'hand 'em out' like some people believe. Airbus is not a charity, you know...


User currently offlineBoeing747-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 1437 times:

I wish Air Canada would pick up on those lost A318 orders and use them for the Fleet Renewal.

User currently offlineAA767400 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 2332 posts, RR: 26
Reply 22, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 1438 times:

"some juvenile" juul i do not think that age has anything
to do with posting something that someone does not agree with.



"The low fares airline."
User currently offlineCritter592 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 1434 times:

JUST STOP IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! God!!!!!!... Airbus, and Boeing are Both Great Aircraft Manufacturers. They Both Fly, They Both make money, They Are Both Good Aircraft. WHY DO YOU PEOPLE MAKE A BIG ARGUMENT OVER THIS EVERY TIME AIRBUS OR BOEING IS MENTIONED IN THE SAME TOPIC... It is like you guys wait for it to show up and then say "YAY, AN AIRBUS VS. BOEING POST!!!" Just leave it alone. So AA wants to keep the 717s and not the A318s. Let that be for American to Debate about... I Think an Airbus A318 would look good in American Colors, But we cannot change their decision... JUST STOP FIGHTING. AIRBUS IS A GOOD COMPANY, Sure, They have their flaws, but so does Boeing. Do you expect Airbus to be Perfect? So just Stop this argument RIGHT NOW!!!!!!!!!!  Pissed

User currently offlineN766AS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (13 years 4 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 1413 times:

GO AA!

They sure know a superior product when they see one.


25 Early Air : AA is not all Boeing, they have those Fokker's + the MD-80's. This is what I expected from them though. I could not imagine AA with another airbus, I
26 Cba : Yes, I know that Boeing gives discounts too, but when I hear that Airbus was selling the A380 at 40% of list price to, that got me a little suspicious
27 N-156F : Ok, people, repeat after me. I, Airliners.net user, swear to never again post information which is clearly biased towards Boeing or Airbus, or to post
28 Post contains images Baec777 : In my airline company, I will have Airbus, Boeing, Etc.... all fleets... Please stop the Airbus/Boeing suggestions..... !!!!!!! Baec777 P.S. Boeing &
29 Cba : No, if that happened, they would have a monopoly.
30 Logos : Juul, Sorry, because I don't live on these boards I missed the debate my post stirred. In re-reading my post, you make some good points. Although I ca
31 Srbmod : When it comes to sweetheart deals, AirTran got the mother of all sweetheart deals. It has not been offically reported, but word is they are getting th
32 AA777 : Good For AA. I would Like to see Airbus in their fleet, if nor for anything else, but for variety....Whatever. it doesnt matter, the 717 is good for f
33 AerLingus : I hope they use the 717 on SFO-FAT routes. It would boost their image in Fresno by operating jet commuter flights.
34 Post contains images Baec777 : American should accept the the Airbus A318 orders with the B717 orders.... Take Both !! Baec777
35 Skippy208 : I think the 318 would look really cool in all metal finish so American should definitely get some. Skippy
36 N-156F : >I think the 318 would look really cool in all metal finish so American should definitely get some. Gee, there's an intelligent statement. If how an a
37 Post contains images AeroGlobeAir7 : I read somewhere that in a poll taken internationally Boeing aircraft were preferred to Airbus aircraft. Although I do find the Airbus planes exotic (
38 RayChuang : Very likely, AA will use the 717-200's on shorter mainline flights out of DFW, ORD and soon STL. I really doubt that AA will fly the 712 out of SJC, g
39 A330_DTW : "All Boeing, baby!"? I guess the MD-11's AA has are technically Boeings since the McD/Boeing merger...but those A300s and A310s certainly aren't manuf
40 Samurai 777 : I'm interested in seeing which routes may use the 717. But then again, I'll bet they'll used to augment routes already used by the Fokker F100. Still,
41 N-156F : AA has no, and has never had any, A310s. They have ~30 A300s, which are used on Caribbean and transatlantic routes. IIRC, AA really likes them, and ha
42 QantasA3XX : Western737 I flew on both A320s and B737s !! i know the difference !! All the way Europeans !!! But i respect Boeing !!
43 QantasA3XX : I do agree that the Boeing 717-200 is a good plane !! I have no disrespect for Boeing planes ,its just that i prefer Airbus .But Boeing 717 has no sis
44 Post contains images QantasA3XX : I have nothing against Boeing I like Boeing planes too like B707 , B717 , B727 , B744 only , and B 777 its just that i dont like the B737 tats about i
45 MD-90 : Don't all Airbus aircraft have to be painted to preserve the bonds between the materials used to build them (or something like that?). There wouldn't
46 AerLingus : I'd rather dive into an empty pool than call American the largest Boeing operator. They are the largest McDonnell Douglas operator! The DC-9, MD-11, a
47 NUair : TWA order: 25-A318 20-A319 www.airbus.com then look under the orders database that comes up in Acrobat. They are very good positions in the production
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
AA 738 Routes Not Involving MIA posted Fri Oct 13 2006 15:56:45 by Cubsrule
AA MIA-MAN Not Returning This Winter posted Wed May 31 2006 17:33:53 by AJMIA
What Happened To The AA/TWA B-717s? posted Sun May 8 2005 08:11:11 by KC135TopBoom
AA/TWAs 717s posted Mon Dec 31 2001 20:33:40 by 777fan
AA/TWA 717s? posted Mon Oct 1 2001 00:41:35 by Highliner2
AA Is Still Not Biggest! posted Sun Jul 29 2001 19:01:16 by SESGDL
AA's New Business Class - Not Impressed! posted Tue Jul 3 2007 03:16:11 by Gh123
Why Didn't AA Keep The TWA 717s? posted Mon Jan 1 2007 00:14:17 by 1337Delta764
AA Pilots Not Backing Beijing Flight posted Mon Nov 13 2006 19:08:02 by AA787823
Why NOT -- AA To GEO And PMB? posted Sat Oct 28 2006 01:34:08 by AJMIA