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NW Flight Attendants Union Sues Delta-Part 2  
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10645 posts, RR: 14
Posted (6 years 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 4388 times:

Just to continue this thread, saw this opinion piece in the local paper..........

http://www.swtimes.com/articles/2008...olumns/david_sanders/sanders01.txt



Of particular interest is this paragraph...........


"In fact, he attempted to alleviate concerns that the bill would be on the fast track that union leaders had hoped for in the new Congress. He predicted that a President Obama wouldn’t push the measure in the first six months of his administration, and that he might wait until 2010 to bring it up."


Still think the unions can stall for this much time?


Don't forget, Senator Pryor was a sponsor of this legislation in the Senate and a staunch supporter. Maybe my e-mail to him did some good.


"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
55 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCokePopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 1, posted (6 years 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 4345 times:

http://www.sltrib.com/business/ci_11082423

Flight attendant joins union suit against Delta
Senority » She hopes to stall integration with Northwest
By Paul Beebe

The Salt Lake Tribune

Updated: 11/27/2008 09:38:44 AM MST


A Salt Lake City-based flight attendant at Delta Air Lines is trying to help block the carrier from starting the process of combining the seniority lists of Delta and Northwest Airlines flight attendants until both groups can vote on union representation.


User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3403 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (6 years 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 4295 times:



Quoting Mayor (Thread starter):


I have read recently that EFCA doesn't apply to airlines, as we're covered under the Railway Labor Act (RLA).

Where it does apply is to the unionized employees in this country that are covered under the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA).

Maybe someone can shed some (unbiased) light on this?

Quoting CokePopper (Reply 1):
http://www.sltrib.com/business/ci_11082423

Flight attendant joins union suit against Delta

A few random thoughts:

1. Good for Marianne Bicksler for standing up for what she believes in.

2. I wonder how many of her co-workers are/were content to side idly by while others did the hard work?

2A. I wonder if that will now change?

3. How will Mother Delta react to someone defying their will? This will be an interesting test of the vaunted "open and direct" relationship.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineNWADTWFA From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 162 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (6 years 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 4277 times:

I would imagine by adding a DAL flight attendant to the law suit, it helps argue that both sides agree with the lawsuit.

I know that when some grievance are filed the are filed with one persons name and et. al; meaning anyone impacted by the violation. Is this the same kind of thing? Are there some DAL flight attendants that prefer the seniority integration be completed after we vote for a union. Personally, I would prefer that DOH be agreed to before a union vote. If there was any resistance for DOH it would only bolster support for AFA.

AFA's concern has to be that DAL will grant DOH before a union vote and take the wind out of their sales (sails).

Joanne Smith sent a letter to all flight attendant today. While I did feel there was some anti-union slant to a few things she said. Some of what was stated was dead on.

NWADTWFA

Glad to see the respectful adult discussion has been continued.


User currently offlineCokePopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (6 years 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4253 times:



Quoting NWAESC (Reply 2):

3. How will Mother Delta react to someone defying their will? This will be an interesting test of the vaunted "open and direct" relationship.

Please understand that Ms. Bicksler isn't the first, and wont be the last to
disagree with "mother Delta" Management won't touch her. However she may
have a few spirited discussions with here fellow "Pre merger" Delta F/A's about
her stalling this important issue.

Quoting NWADTWFA (Reply 3):
Personally, I would prefer that DOH be agreed to before a union vote

I agree 100% Lets sit down and talk. DOH couldn't be the end result but
we won't know until all sides sit down.


User currently offlineCokePopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (6 years 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4232 times:

Edit not working. Should read:
I agree 100% Lets sit down and talk. DOH could be the end result but
we won't know until all sides sit down.


User currently offlineAloha73G From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2372 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4185 times:



Quoting CokePopper (Reply 5):
I agree 100% Lets sit down and talk. DOH could be the end result but we won't know until all sides sit down.

Exactly. The discussion could be as simple as this.....

DL F/As: "We think date of hire would be the fairest solution for everyone."

NW F/As: "We agree completely, and that is what our contract says."

DL F/As: "Great, I guess we have a deal....lets get it done."

BUT....we'll never know if they don't sit down.

-Aloha!



Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10645 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (6 years 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4180 times:



Quoting NWAESC (Reply 2):
3. How will Mother Delta react to someone defying their will? This will be an interesting test of the vaunted "open and direct" relationship.

You just don't get it, do you? The "open and direct" relationship exists as much as you would like to think it doesn't. I know that you haven't had that, for the most part with NW, but DL has had it and still does.

The only reason that "Mother Delta" exists as it is, is because DL has taken care of us.



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineNWADTWFA From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 162 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (6 years 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4180 times:

My prediction is the end result will be date of hire for bidding reasons. Those other dates related to other aspects of seniority will take some sorting out. The employees at both DAL and NWA that have changed crafts and class will be of focus on many of these issues. Once they find a base line for integration it should go quickly. Got to meet to do that though.

I believe that AFA antics (whether they are justified or not) are going to end upsetting and pushing people away. I know several flight attendants that this has already upset. As Joanne Smith said in her letter to all DAL flight attendants (pre and post), AFA has labeled this, in the media, as a stall tactic.

Let's follow the laws and get to work running "one great airline"

NWADTWFA


User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7564 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (6 years 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4164 times:

Stay tuned, NW pilots just filed lawsuit against DL/NW.

But DL could terminate this DL flight attendent today if they wanted too, for "defacing the company" or some other reason, or "your position isn't needed anymore. Thats what can happen without a union.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10645 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (6 years 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4154 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
Stay tuned, NW pilots just filed lawsuit against DL/NW.

Sources?? Since both pilot groups have already agreed to a contract, I can't see what they would be suing DL about.

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
But DL could terminate this DL flight attendent today if they wanted too, for "defacing the company" or some other reason, or "your position isn't needed anymore. Thats what can happen without a union.

They could, but they won't. It's not their style. It may be NW's style, but not DL's. Something you'll have to get used to, I guess.



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineFFlyerWorld From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 335 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4137 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
Stay tuned, NW pilots just filed lawsuit against DL/NW.

But DL could terminate this DL flight attendent today if they wanted too, for "defacing the company" or some other reason, or "your position isn't needed anymore. Thats what can happen without a union.

Delta flight attendants have fared better than any union represented carrier for most of nearly 79 years now. Delta f/a's have been given the opportunity for unionization a couple of times at least over the years and have always rejected the idea. What do you suppose they know that AFA doesn't? Overall a much more positive work force from my many many experiences.


User currently offlineSurprise From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 133 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (6 years 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4111 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
But DL could terminate this DL flight attendent today if they wanted too, for "defacing the company" or some other reason, or "your position isn't needed anymore. Thats what can happen without a union.

While this is technically true I can tell you it would be easier to teach a dog to fly an airplane than to get someone fired at Delta. Really it's very difficult to have someone terminated at Delta. Unless it's something egregious like theft or violence or security you would need a whole lot of documentation on a person before HR would even look at it.


User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3403 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (6 years 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 4075 times:



Quoting CokePopper (Reply 4):
Please understand that Ms. Bicksler isn't the first, and wont be the last to
disagree with "mother Delta" Management won't touch her.

That's good. Hopefully, that holds true.

Quote:
However she may
have a few spirited discussions with here fellow "Pre merger" Delta F/A's about
her stalling this important issue.

That's good too, IMO; nothing better than some educated discussions amongst co-workers....

Quoting Mayor (Reply 7):
You just don't get it, do you? The "open and direct" relationship exists as much as you would like to think it doesn't. I know that you haven't had that, for the most part with NW, but DL has had it and still does.

Oh, I "get it," I just have yet to see it. You were around a great many years, but fortunately, most of those were in a different era. Those days are gone. This regime is one I do have experience with, and "nice" isn't exactly the first word that comes to mind...

Here's a few things I've come across in the last few days; maybe you can help me understand how these are part of the benevolence you continuously tell me about:

1. A supervisor in BOS destroying all of the leaflets given to employees, and yelling at the ramp crew "You f**king better not vote in that f**king union!"

2. Other (East coast) managers blocking access to the IAM website from work (this is on the NW side, by the way).

3. Above wing employees in MEM having their hours cut by 1 hour/daily.

4. A DL manager threatening termination to anyone posting/possessing union literature.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineMCOAviationFan From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 247 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (6 years 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 4032 times:



Quoting CokePopper (Reply 1):
A Salt Lake City-based flight attendant at Delta Air Lines is trying to help block the carrier from starting the process of combining the seniority lists of Delta and Northwest Airlines flight attendants until both groups can vote on union representation.

According to several DL F/As, this particular F/A has been the lead union organizer in the SLC base for quite some time now. She is so active that some wonder whether she is being paid by the union for her work. In fact, she was featured on a video on the AFA website during a union meeting.

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
But DL could terminate this DL flight attendent today if they wanted too, for "defacing the company" or some other reason, or "your position isn't needed anymore. Thats what can happen without a union.

This F/A has been a union organizer for numerous years, yet she is still a DL and not terminated, along with many other union organizers.

Quoting CokePopper (Reply 5):
I agree 100% Lets sit down and talk. DOH could be the end result but
we won't know until all sides sit down.

Exactly. Each group can discuss which options are available and which is best. DOH may just be the best option. You don't know for sure until both sides see how it affects each other.


User currently offlineBreaker1011 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 938 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (6 years 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3990 times:



Quoting CokePopper (Reply 14):
1. A supervisor in BOS destroying all of the leaflets given to employees, and yelling at the ramp crew "You f**king better not vote in that f**king union!"

2. Other (East coast) managers blocking access to the IAM website from work (this is on the NW side, by the way).

3. Above wing employees in MEM having their hours cut by 1 hour/daily.

4. A DL manager threatening termination to anyone posting/possessing union literature.

Having been extremely close to this kind of process in the past (with one of the more notorious unions), this type of "naughty list" is something you'll commonly see, and see much more of over the next year. The sad part is - who says it's true or based on fact, or not twisted? No one will know - because from a legal standpoint, as long as organizing activity is present, the union can publish/say almost whatever they wish to, whether or not it's based on fact. Perhaps even the union has no idea whether it's a truth or not and they just hear the report from an employee, because pro-union supporters can be very passionate about their belief and if passionate enough, make up whatever they want.

There are practically no repercussions for a union in this circumstance under RLA should they choose to publish inflammatory or false information, knowingly so or not, and the airline itself can only sit by and watch. If the company on the other hand published even a sentence accusing the union of derogatory activity in this way prior to an election, the union has the legal right to call interference and engage in a lawsuit. The company doesn't have those rights. It's very one sided.

I hope everyone that sees "naughty lists" like these takes their true past experiences into consideration and decides for themselves whether or not to believe. No doubt some are based on fact, while others - not so much.



Life's tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid. J. Wayne
User currently offlineCdgdtw From United States of America, joined May 2003, 200 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (6 years 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3951 times:



Quoting FFlyerWorld (Reply 11):
Delta flight attendants have fared better than any union represented carrier for most of nearly 79 years now. Delta f/a's have been given the opportunity for unionization a couple of times at least over the years and have always rejected the idea. What do you suppose they know that AFA doesn't? Overall a much more positive work force from my many many experiences.

I suppose the various work groups at Delta have fared better because of unions. That's right, unions. I know, I know . . . DL isn't unionized except for ALPA. When negotiations at other airlines keep a certain standard, Delta is forced to act in kind or risk complete unionization of their employee groups. When NW and DL employees are completely integrated, they will form the largest airline in the world, thereby redefining the aforementioned standard. Delta will have no outside incentive to maintain industry standard because they will be industry standard.

Do you think the pilots of the world's largest airline would go without a union, despite how many tales of woe pilots will share about ALPA? Almost half of the equity in the new Delta was pre-negotiated for the pilots, one of the smallest groups compared to flight attendants and customer service professionals. The rest of the employees shared what was left over because they didn't have a spot at the table.

Why are you seeing such passionate letters against unionism from Joanne Smith and Delta? Follow the money. If it weren't worth anything, why would they be spending anything?


User currently offlineAloha73G From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2372 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (6 years 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3933 times:



Quoting Cdgdtw (Reply 20):
Follow the money.

The same goes for AFA. Union dues for a combined DL and NW are nearly $11,000,000.

$10,836,000 for 21,000 F/As @ $43/month.

That is ALOT of money!!

-Aloha!



Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
User currently offlineBinMonster From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3912 times:



Quoting NWAESC (Reply 13):
1. A supervisor in BOS destroying all of the leaflets given to employees, and yelling at the ramp crew "You f**king better not vote in that f**king union!"

2. Other (East coast) managers blocking access to the IAM website from work (this is on the NW side, by the way).

3. Above wing employees in MEM having their hours cut by 1 hour/daily.

4. A DL manager threatening termination to anyone posting/possessing union literature.

Delta has experienced several unions attempts at organizing Ramp and In-flight.
Employees are allowed to engage discussions about union, hand out materials during their break times and in non-work areas. In fact many rampers are wearing small IAM pins. Here is the rule, since employees are allowed to wear their service pins, employees that support the AFA or IAM may wear a union pin the same size as the service pin.

So there are some very clear guide lines for employees to express or discuss the issues, of course supervisors or managers will get after employees that are passing out materials when they should be working. Not a big deal if the employees takes the hint to stop.We have a few guys that are very active with the TWU and IAM’s drives, nothing never happened to these guys. Never been an issue since they played by the rules. Of course there is still some ideal talk planeside between off-load and the on-load.

One time we had an open discussion after briefing. Supervisor said something to the effect “that this is the end of our operational briefing your free to go, however if you have questions about the union activity I am available for questions”. To my surprise most people stayed, the pro-union guys had equal time. Some former union guys that worked at other airlines like US were very critical of their union.
My observation was the extreme view points of some of the over zealous union guys are distorting what a union can do or guarantee, distorting what the company is going to, etc.
These tactics turn off a lot of people and the former union guys from other carries stood up and challenged the over zealous supporters.
However one of the main Delta ramp organizers showed up for the discussion, he was well spoken, knew his stuff and was always careful “not to distort” what a union can do.

So be careful with the stories about union supporters being fired, suspended, etc. so much hear say and distortions.

Oh my the way you can access the IAM and AFA websites from the Deltanet, unless your on an IDLE MODE set. The IDLE MODE is locked out from the internet it will only allow you use the links to the deltanet and work related web sites via a link.
Managers can not lock out websites only Delta technology can.

I am not saying that there are not over zealous supervisor or mangers. I am sure there are isolated case of a supervisor or managers not follow the rules that allow union activity or discussions.
However the supervisor or managers that cross the line would be at risk for disciplinary action or termination. More so that a front line employee such as the SLC based FA.

Ok before the pro-union set jumps all over this point, consider this.
The company is at risk for legal action; see the thread about AFA filing interference charges against Delta. So Delta as a profound responsibility to protect the company from litigation. So it career suicide for a manger /supervisor to not follow the guidelines.


User currently offlineCdgdtw From United States of America, joined May 2003, 200 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (6 years 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3889 times:



Quoting Aloha73G (Reply 21):
The same goes for AFA. Union dues for a combined DL and NW are nearly $11,000,000.

$10,836,000 for 21,000 F/As @ $43/month.

That is ALOT of money!!

It is a lot of money. Representation takes money for negotiations, legal, staff, etc..

Delta costs per flight attendant are some of the lowest in the industry. In comparison with the dollar figure quoted above, a legally binding contract is worth hundreds of millions.


User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3403 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (6 years 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3888 times:



Quoting Breaker1011 (Reply 17):
The sad part is - who says it's true or based on fact, or not twisted? No one will know - because from a legal standpoint, as long as organizing activity is present, the union can publish/say almost whatever they wish to, whether or not it's based on fact. Perhaps even the union has no idea whether it's a truth or not and they just hear the report from an employee, because pro-union supporters can be very passionate about their belief and if passionate enough, make up whatever they want.

This wasn't from the union, but rather from a friend of mine. I also have to say that the IAM has done very little as far as "publishing" anecdotal incidents. The only one I can remember is when DL employees notified DL143 that certain Delta managers were promising them 3 to 1 seniority.

I've noticed no one's denied the MEM story; that was the one I was hoping to proved wrong on the most...

Quoting BinMonster (Reply 22):
Oh my the way you can access the IAM and AFA websites from the Deltanet, unless your on an IDLE MODE set. The IDLE MODE is locked out from the internet it will only allow you use the links to the deltanet and work related web sites via a link.
Managers can not lock out websites only Delta technology can.

As noted, this was on the NW side, not the DL side. I have no idea what you guys can/can't access. NW IT is the only one who can grant restrict access here as well, however all it takes is one phone call, as our access is by employee, and not by a particular terminal.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineNWADTWFA From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 162 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (6 years 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3877 times:



Quoting Cdgdtw (Reply 20):
Why are you seeing such passionate letters against unionism from Joanne Smith and Delta? Follow the money. If it weren't worth anything, why would they be spending anything?

 checkmark 

Quoting Aloha73G (Reply 21):
$10,836,000 for 21,000 F/As @ $43/month.

That is ALOT of money!!

 checkmark   dollarsign   dollarsign 

That is exactly why this discussion is taking place...big savings for DAL with no union, huge lost of dues for AFA with no union.

So it comes down to other issues for me, other than who saves, loses the most money is who can promise to take care of the flight attendants?

Let the promises fly....


User currently offlineCokePopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (6 years 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3875 times:



Quoting NWADTWFA (Reply 25):
That is exactly why this discussion is taking place...big savings for DAL with no union, huge lost of dues for AFA with no union.
So it comes down to other issues for me, other than who saves, loses the most money is who can promise to take care of the flight attendants?

Many of us on the "Pre Merger" side feel that Big savings for Delta means more
money in our pocket. Remember, the more Delta makes the more profit sharing.


User currently offlineBreaker1011 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 938 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (6 years 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3847 times:



Quoting NWAESC (Reply 24):
This wasn't from the union, but rather from a friend of mine.

By the way NWAESC, I think your posts are intelligent and unbiased - this thread has been much better than the other thanks to rational folks like yourself. Nice to be talking to you.

Anyway, my point exactly. Where did your friend get the information? This kind of anecdotal information get things moving - it makes it into print (even if only on a-net) - your friend tells you, you post it, people read it, and suddenly you have an "oh my gosh they did WHAT?" anti-company balloon in your hands. It's rumor mill at it's worst in an already tense situation. This is where the union will take advantage of a situation that the company cannot in a similar situation. I could be wrong, but I will suggest that you'll find one of these 4 "holy cow" issues on a leaflet or website in the near future, factual or not.

Quoting NWADTWFA (Reply 25):
I've noticed no one's denied the MEM story; that was the one I was hoping to proved wrong on the most...

It's only been 3 hours since you posted it, perhaps no one in MEM has been looking. Don't loose that hope just yet, they are probably still outside watching all the FX M-11's landing!

Quoting NWADTWFA (Reply 25):
Managers can not lock out websites only Delta technology can.

If a bunch of employees are too often accessing a single website instead of working, I'd not blame a company for blocking it. Not saying they did, but if so, they have every right just as they have every right to block EBay, Yahoo, Facebook, MySpace, sleazes-n-a-bag.com, etc. It can logjam corporate intranets and servers. And by the way, people are being paid to work not surf. If I owned the company, I would. It's so out of hand in my office right now I'm considering blocking it all myself just be reading this (the MySpace crap is driving me nuts)

Quoting NWADTWFA (Reply 25):
That is exactly why this discussion is taking place...big savings for DAL with no union, huge lost of dues for AFA with no union.

I wonder though - is it really a big savings for DL NOT to have a union? DL's overall comp package for non-union FA's is about dead-even with NW's AFA package from what I've seen, maybe even a bit better. Without having legit and apples-to-apples $$ facts that I consider reliable (the $$ posted in the previous thread have many variable factors therein are are not valid for comparative purposes), my bet is that DL's desire to remain unorganized is more about maintaining a culture and spirit of team and cooperation than it is about $$. I might be a bit altruistic (though I have no reason to be) but that's how I see it. Let's face it - $$ or not - life is signifiantly easier for any company when it comes to managing a non-union workforce over an organized workforce. Doesn't mean it's a worse or better life, it's just easier to not have a middle man. One never knows, a contract negotiation, when finally completed in 2 years, might just give the group less than they have today.



Life's tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid. J. Wayne
User currently offlineNWADTWFA From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 162 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (6 years 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3824 times:

Breaker1011,

For some reason all of your quotes are attributed to me when I only wrote one. I wonder if there is a quoting malfunction.

Quoting Breaker1011 (Reply 27):
I wonder though - is it really a big savings for DL NOT to have a union?


This is an intelligent question. There certainly are costs associated with not having to deal with litigious unions. But as I understand it DAL has EIG to study and analyze different aspects of the business. So lets discuss where the cost savings come from not having a union...

Quoting Breaker1011 (Reply 27):
a contract negotiation, when finally completed in 2 years, might just give the group less than they have today

Again, my understanding as pre-merger NWA flight attendant, my current contract is ground zero.

NWADTWFA


25 Cdgdtw : Yes. Let the pre-union election promises fly. Without a contract, promises DL makes to incentivize flight attendants not to vote are subject to the w
26 Cdgdtw : I'm sorry, I forgot. How long did this years' NW/DL ALPA negotiations last? Was it 3 months?
27 Breaker1011 : To my knowledge, there's really no 'real' ground zero when negotiations launch, that's just the union's position going into it, and a bit of propagan
28 Breaker1011 : Profits aren't intended to simply be "shared" down the line. They are required for investment maintenance and market capitalization. Let's not forget
29 Breaker1011 : Remember that it works both ways, with this important caviot: The union is legally unobstructed from saying whatever it wants, and making whatever pr
30 LH469 : Just curious how large of paycuts did Bankrupt NWA impose on FA's vs Bankrupt DL?
31 Mayor : I haven't been gone all that long, actually.....just three years and have managed to keep my finger on the pulse of the airline, since then. I may be
32 NWADTWFA : 40% for NWA flight attendants. I have gone from flying 85 hours a month and being gone 15 days, to trying to fly 120-140 hours a month and being home
33 Mayor : Sources, sources, sources. Are #3 and #4 on the NW side? If not, maybe there's no one on here for DL from MEM to verify or refute it. The rest could
34 Ocracoke : And that right there, in that one sentence, explains the great divide between DL and NW. Did you know that until the mid 1990's, DL didn't even have
35 CokePopper : Great observations Ocracoke! I believe you summed it up nicely. To help build that trust I believe the sooner we start working side by side, the bett
36 Cdgdtw : Wrong. After financial transaction in October, pilots began new pay rates per the newly negotiated contract. They are currently in arbitration to dec
37 NWAESC : Thank you very much. That's mutual. Rational discourse is much more fun than bombast any day. The internet blocking is first hand knowledge. The rest
38 Surprise : I really have to agree, that was well said. Going back to the original thread of this post, and the one before it, I read on Deltanet this morning th
39 NWAESC : That starts at the top. The leadership of the newly combined company has not done much, IMO, to build that trust. It's not the trust in each other as
40 NWAESC : I saw that too... I wonder if these are "official" talks, or informal ones? There's nothing stopping "informal" ones from occuring. I know that EIT t
41 Mayor : No, but we had to deal with Leo & Co., which as it turns out, was much worse than it seemed at the time. This will be a walk in the park, compared to
42 NWAESC : I think you're wrong, but hope you're right...
43 Mayor : Amazing that I can't find anything about this, anywhere. Perhaps it's just wishful thinking on your Dad's part, eh?
44 Cdgdtw : Something must be wrong with quotes here. I didn't say that.
45 Nwaesc : I know, I did. Also, some earlier posts that quoted me were attributed to another poster?
46 CokePopper : Your absolutely correct. I guess what I meant to say is that some fears and misunderstanding would be put at ease once we are working side by side. B
47 Squid : The way I see it is like this, unions today are generally un-needed and are very costly to the company and the employee's they supposedly represent. I
48 NWAESC : Sweet, mother of God... You're joking, right? You do realize that with the integration you've proposed that the new DL will self destruct, right? Rem
49 NWADTWFA : Thank you for the most humorous post I have read in a long time. I laughed so hard my eyes were watering. This is the best idea I have ever heard...t
50 Cdgdtw : What a charitable solution you offer. With this logic, should we maintain sweatshop conditions and suffer gladly for the honor of having a job? It's
51 BinMonster : No limit on hours picked up at Delta My wife made 45 K last year and avg hours per month 79 over the last 12 months. Most of the time 3day trips over
52 CokePopper : Interesting bit of math. I read the following from an ATL based F/A If a Delta F/A with 32years had been paying union dues...or put the same amount of
53 Cdgdtw : OR, you could invest the money from the extra insurance premiums and deductible at DL in comparison with what was contractually negotiated at NW. You
54 CokePopper : Based on history, I will continue to invest my money, but thanks
55 Breaker1011 : You are quite wise!
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