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Delta Returns To FAR; Starts BIS  
User currently offlinePhelpsie87 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 498 posts, RR: 1
Posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 5534 times:

Didn't see this posted yet so...

Well, it will only be a one year absence from FAR for DL. Today the carrier announced they are returning to FAR in June 2009, as well as opening BIS, both cities operating to SLC. This comes after Ed Bastian met with ND State Officials after they expressed concern that the state could possibly see a reduction in service. OO will operate the flights on behalf on DL, but schedules and start dates have not yet been announced.

Not much info, but here is an article: http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=224034

Hopefully SLC service will stick around this time. Any thoughts, comments?

42 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCIDflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2301 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 5512 times:

The Dakotas are huge for Northwest (I think UA is pretty much the only other option to that region, but NW sends mainline to a lot of cIties vs. UA crj's). Since NW is becoming DL, I could see the service having a better chance of making it. Now insetad of making west coast connections through MSP they will have another option through SLC.

User currently offlineFLYjoe From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 5433 times:

I guess DL sees some potential with secondary markets such as FAT, PSP, TUS, ABQ that have limited or no service on DL/NW from MSP. It definitely has the potential to take market share away from UA. I'm assuming there's a strong World Perks base in ND that will really help the SLC link succeed.

User currently offlineNwaesc From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3389 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 5434 times:



Quoting CIDflyer (Reply 1):
Now insetad of making west coast connections through MSP they will have another option through SLC.

This is what I was thinking, too... Eastbound connect through MSP. Westbound goes through SLC...



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlinePhelpsie87 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 5402 times:



Quoting CIDflyer (Reply 1):
The Dakotas are huge for Northwest (I think UA is pretty much the only other option to that region, but NW sends mainline to a lot of cIties vs. UA crj's). Since NW is becoming DL, I could see the service having a better chance of making it. Now insetad of making west coast connections through MSP they will have another option through SLC.

Well, out of Western ND, NW is virtually the only option. Fargo and Bismarck are the only cities that are served by more than one legacy. FAR also has F9, but the competition should definitely be interesting with flights to DEN and SLC.And I agree, now that NW is DL, and DL is NW, flights will show a FAR/BIS-SLC-LAX routing, compared to a FAR-MSP-LAX.

Surprisingly, I have actually heard people complain about the 45 min flight East if they are ending up West. I think it will be great for FAR and BIS. Maybe even an upgrade from CR2's to CR7's...or CR9's...haha not likely, but a man could dream.

This will hopefully also push UA into upgrading service to FAR. They have tested CR7's on the DEN-FAR-DEN and DEN-FAR-ORD routes, and while FAR-ORD never consistently preformed well, DEN-FAR-DEN did. I know some employees and myself would love to see that happen.


User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 5345 times:



Quoting Nwaesc (Reply 3):
This is what I was thinking, too... Eastbound connect through MSP. Westbound goes through SLC...

That may be, but its really not that far east from GFK or FAR to MSP.

Quoting Phelpsie87 (Reply 5):
And I agree, now that NW is DL, and DL is NW, flights will show a FAR/BIS-SLC-LAX routing, compared to a FAR-MSP-LAX

Not necissarily, for instance, when looking at several airfares from MSP-New England for example at NW's own website, the top basically 10 options have you on Delta flights going MSP-ATL-BOS etc. It would have made some since to maybe throw a CRJ MOT's way.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 5304 times:

Another thing that I forgot to mention is that the article gave me quite a chuckle about how the Grand Forks council man was excited about the merger that is bringing nothing new to Grand Forks. Also, I found it funny that Fargo's mayor was excited that Delta has never had a strike, its hard to strike without unions.


"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineAcey559 From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 1532 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 5234 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 6):
Also, I found it funny that Fargo's mayor was excited that Delta has never had a strike, its hard to strike without unions.

What does that have to do with anything? Is it a bad thing to not have much union representation and not have strikes, or would you rather have lots of unions and lots of strikes. (I know, that's not always the case, I'm just trying to make a point)

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 6):
Another thing that I forgot to mention is that the article gave me quite a chuckle about how the Grand Forks council man was excited about the merger that is bringing nothing new to Grand Forks.

Give it a chance. This thing was just announced. Do you expect GFK to be the first thing on the new DL's agenda? Give me a break! If anything, you should be happy that, unlike a LOT of airports around the country, they aren't losing much if any service. There have been worse things to happen.  Yeah sure


User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 5219 times:



Quoting Acey559 (Reply 7):
Give it a chance. This thing was just announced. Do you expect GFK to be the first thing on the new DL's agenda? Give me a break! If anything, you should be happy that, unlike a LOT of airports around the country, they aren't losing much if any service. There have been worse things to happen.

I was just saying that because before like other cities they wree not that excited, I don't expect GFK to get anything what we have, what we have is great actually NW has 5x daily with 3x DC-9's, 1x SF3, and 1x CRJ, its nice to have 3x mainline, and mondays and fridays bring G4 to LAS, though that is usually filled with 70-90% canadians. I just found it odd he was excited when the airport authority supposidly has heard not even a peep or a rumor of starting any other flights from DL other than MSP. So what would there be to be excited about?

Quoting Acey559 (Reply 7):
(I know, that's not always the case, I'm just trying to make a point)

I was just trying to make the point that because they haven't in history doesn't mean that they won't now...



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineTys777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 404 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 5131 times:



Quoting Phelpsie87 (Reply 4):
Surprisingly, I have actually heard people complain about the 45 min flight East if they are ending up West. I think it will be great for FAR and BIS. Maybe even an upgrade from CR2's to CR7's...or CR9's...haha not likely, but a man could dream.

your telling me...I've spent significant time in BIS, and will be moving there in 4 weeks....There are tons of NW loyalists there who will use this to get out west easire vs MSP, or UA via DEN..

Interesting note though, UA recently threw a CR7 into BIS giving it some 1st class seats..



Is it bad that I get excited to see even a CRJ overfly? Man, what this place does to you
User currently offlinePhelpsie87 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 4842 times:



Quoting Tys777 (Reply 9):

Interesting note though, UA recently threw a CR7 into BIS giving it some 1st class seats..

BIS has actually had off and on CR7's for at least year and half now. Sometimes they don't need all those seats, but my standby party of 5 didn't complain sitting F.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21625 posts, RR: 55
Reply 11, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4736 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 5):
its really not that far east from GFK or FAR to MSP.

It isn't. And I'd much rather connect in MSP than in SLC if given the choice - it's just a better airport. So I hope the option remains.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineDL Widget Head From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2093 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4719 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 6):
I found it funny that Fargo's mayor was excited that Delta has never had a strike, its hard to strike without unions.

That fact speaks volumes about how DL conducts labor relations. Most employees for 80 years now have not felt the need to succumb to union propaganda and extortion. And, for the record, DL has two unions--still no strike.


User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3292 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4689 times:

Is this just a return to BIS? I think there was mainline service for a while following the Western merger...

User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3389 posts, RR: 9
Reply 14, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 4562 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 5):
That may be, but its really not that far east from GFK or FAR to MSP.

I know.

I'm just saying that it may be the way they set things up....



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlinePhelpsie87 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4347 times:



Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 13):
Is this just a return to BIS? I think there was mainline service for a while following the Western merger...

not sure what you mean exactly...but in my memory, DL has never been to BIS. They did however serve FAR starting in Summer 06 through May 08.


User currently offlineStapleton From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 280 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 4282 times:



Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 13):
Is this just a return to BIS? I think there was mainline service for a while following the Western merger...

I know that Western once flew BIS - CPR - SLC with a 737 but I'm not sure if that was still on there when Delta and Western merged.


User currently offlineWESTERN737800 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 693 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 4171 times:

Good news for BIS and FAR.

Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 13):
I think there was mainline service for a while following the Western merger...

DL did fly mainline to BIS in around '90 or '91. They flew 737s SLC-BIS-FSD (Sioux Falls, SD) I think they overnighted in FSD then stopped in BIS on the way back to SLC.

Quoting Stapleton (Reply 16):
I know that Western once flew BIS - CPR - SLC with a 737 but I'm not sure if that was still on there when Delta and Western merged.

DL did fly mainline into BIS for a while (3 or 4 years) after the merger. I'm not sure if they kept the CPR-BIS part of the route or not.



Bring back Western Airlines!
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4049 times:



Quoting DL Widget Head (Reply 12):
That fact speaks volumes about how DL conducts labor relations. Most employees for 80 years now have not felt the need to succumb to union propaganda and extortion. And, for the record, DL has two unions--still no strike.

I know that the company has two unions, the pilots need one thats obvious, I am Pro-Union as long as they do what they are meant to, not some of the BS that some of them have pulled, granted the point of a union is to retain jobs. But with NW coming on, and a lot of NW management taking positions at the "new" delta it may change the minds of employees, who knows. The Delta now is not the Delta that it used to be.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineDesertAir From Mexico, joined Jan 2006, 1462 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3983 times:



Quoting FLYjoe (Reply 2):
I guess DL sees some potential with secondary markets such as FAT, PSP, TUS, ABQ that have limited or no service on DL/NW from MSP

NW currently has one daily nonstop to MSP with a second flight during part of the winter season. There are a lot of snowbirds that winter in Southern Arizona.


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6471 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3965 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 6):
Another thing that I forgot to mention is that the article gave me quite a chuckle about how the Grand Forks council man was excited about the merger that is bringing nothing new to Grand Forks. Also, I found it funny that Fargo's mayor was excited that Delta has never had a strike, its hard to strike without unions.

Burnsie, have you made it your mission to be negative about every aspect of the DL/NW merger? You make statements then never follow up when questioned. A case in point was your statement about a month ago that the pilot seniority had already been settled favoring the DL pilots two to one. Another case would be your statement today that the NW pilots were suing DL. We all understand that you and dad do not like this merger for whatever reason , but try and be factual.


User currently offlineTys777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 404 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 3871 times:

Flight # DEP ARI EQP
4591 SLC-BIS 7:30p 10:35 CRJ
4591 BIS-SLC 6:55a 8:00a CRJ




4594 SLC-FAR 7:30p 10:55p CRJ
4593 FAR-SLC 6:35a 8:00a CRJ



Is it bad that I get excited to see even a CRJ overfly? Man, what this place does to you
User currently offlineStburke From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 3804 times:

I'm just worried that this will take too much from F9. I've taken the Frontier FAR-DEN trip several times and it's never been full, only about 60% usually. The people I've talked to only take the DEN flight to avoid going to MSP.
GFK will never see west bound flights again, save Allegiant.



aaaand it's gone.
User currently offlineAzstar From United States of America, joined May 2005, 620 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 3683 times:

I don't really understand the logic, at all. If FAR-SLC service was a failure last year, during a much stronger economy, why resurrect it now? In addition, F9 has added 148 more seats per day to DEN, so the competition has increased too. I don't see it lasting. Traffic from the Dakotas in the middle of winter is dismal.

User currently offlinePhelpsie87 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (5 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3520 times:

Thanks Tys777!!

Quoting Azstar (Reply 23):
I don't really understand the logic, at all. If FAR-SLC service was a failure last year, during a much stronger economy, why resurrect it now? In addition, F9 has added 148 more seats per day to DEN, so the competition has increased too. I don't see it lasting. Traffic from the Dakotas in the middle of winter is dismal.

No, you have that wrong. Traffic IN the Dakotas in the middle of winter is dismal haha. Beside the point, service starts in June 09...not very winter then buddy.

I don't know what it is Azstar, but I feel as if we have had this discussion before. Do you have something against the state of ND and DL having service there?

Another thing you have to remember: A loyal NW traveler is planning a trip from SEA-FAR. Said traveler deals with the merger and will book through the New Delta. Instead of traveling SEA-MSP-FAR, he will travel SEA-SLC-FAR.

The above is only an example, but DL now has the power to decide what airport you connect through, and therefore, controls bookings on each leg. Granted there may be some flights through MSP over SLC for a higher price, but they now have that ability. Previously, NW flyers in ND flew NW...regardless of codeshare. They weren’t about to break their habit…now they may not have a choice. The DL service in 2006 was introduced as a whole new thing to the FAR community.

FAR has a significant amount of westbound traffic, and you can be sure that DL will make sure you fly through SLC if you’re heading anywhere west on DEN.

Another way to look at it...instead of saying DL announces FAR, we could say NW now serves MSP and SLC from FAR, because that is how many will view it.


25 Tys777 : no problem... another thing to remember is that this is only one flight consisting of 50 seats to each BIS and FAR.Not a huge amount of lift by any m
26 NWA ARJ : Its nice to see DL coming back to FAR. At least it will help our numbers at the tower Hopefully it wont push F9 out of FAR though...
27 Azstar : Even though traffic is strong during the summer months, let's say May-Sep, it is almost non-existent the other months. So, unless they plan on only fl
28 Phelpsie87 : No they are not... Originally, the flight only operated for the summer, but DL extended it due to load factors, which, btw, only started to significa
29 Burnsie28 : No I didn't, you keep saying that but I didn't, I said thats what DL pilots wanted. That was a factual statement, I'm still waiting for something to
30 Azstar : What????
31 Burnsie28 : Your assuming (speculating) that our economy will still be in poor shape 6 months from now. While it seems likely, speculation is what is a big cause
32 EXAAUADL : give them time...All of DL will be unionized by 2012 These times violate 8 hour overnight for FAR
33 Bobnwa : Not if the crews swap.
34 EXAAUADL : Yeah, I guess they can swap with UAX right?
35 IndyWA : Or it's a standup highspeed...
36 Burnsie28 : I believe its the same schedule that they had when they used to run SLC. Yes since it will be Skywest, now whether DL planned it around UA's schedule
37 SlcDeltaRUmd11 : For example for the Dakotas I could see FAR not needing 7 flights a day to MSP. Why not send 2 a day to SLC, 2 a day to ATL, and keep 3-4 a day to MSP
38 TWA902fly : About the crew timings... I assume these will be SkyWest CRJs.... can the crew fly in on SLC-FAR and leave (after 8+ hours) on a FAR-DEN flight on UA?
39 Phelpsie87 : Yes. DLC and UAX are interchangeable for flight crews, no difference for them besides a change in the "Welcome aboard (Delta Connection/United Expres
40 IndyWA : Interesting...I mean, we are totally interchangeable here at S5, but if you are on a DL pairing, you stay DL and vice versa for UA. We don't mix them
41 Burnsie28 : Very good question, but it could be possibly answered as to why NW never has added at DTW non-stop yet, there are several people going that way throu
42 Phelpsie87 : For the majority, crews mostly stay on one airline, however, I have seen some that will fly DEN-SLC on UAX, fly SLC-FAR for DLC, and return to DEN on
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