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Whats Up With The AA767 W/ Winglets?  
User currently offlineKochamLOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 295 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5073 times:

There is 2 or 3 pics on a.net of this aircraft. Where is it and why arent there more photos? Is it flying any routes yet or still in testing? Where and when will we see more of these modified 763s?
When will the airlines start to put these on all their 76-ERs?

I cant wait to see what the wing looks like from the cabin. Can anyone post a few pics of this modified 76 wing from inside the cabin? I wanna see that winglet!!!

23 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSNfreak From Belgium, joined Feb 2005, 91 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 4860 times:

I think I read somewhere in the forum that the aircraft completed it's flighttesting.
The Winglets were removed and the aircraft is now flying as before.
When certification is complete then we'll see 767 with winglets appear.
So I think it's just paperwork that has to be done.
Worst case scenario : we'll never see them flying just like the A320 with the big winglets.



Life is simple : Eat, Sleep and Fly
User currently offlineKochamLOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 295 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4568 times:

Can anyone confirm this?

What is the problem with the winglets and why were the winglets taken off?


User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17004 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4548 times:



Quoting SNfreak (Reply 1):
I think I read somewhere in the forum that the aircraft completed it's flighttesting.
The Winglets were removed and the aircraft is now flying as before.

That seems a bit weird to me, why would you remove the winglets??



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineTranspac787 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3163 posts, RR: 13
Reply 4, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4507 times:

The winglets have been removed. The specific plane is/was N389AA.

N389AA in July 2008:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Todd Wade





N389AA in November 2008:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Luis Fernando Nunes Pereira





As one poster said, I think there is quite a bit to the certification process yet before the planes can operate in commercial service with them. AA still has orders for winglets on all 58 of their 767-300ER's, so the order has not been canceled or anything.



A340-500: 4 engines 4 long haul. 777-200LR: 2 engines 4 longer haul
User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 5, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4507 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 3):
That seems a bit weird to me, why would you remove the winglets??



Quoting KochamLOT (Reply 2):
What is the problem with the winglets and why were the winglets taken off

Because they are not approved for use yet. They will now take the data gathered, look at it and see it its worth the cost of installing them on the fleet. There are a lot of steps here....



"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17004 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4501 times:



Quoting Transpac787 (Reply 4):
AA still has orders for winglets on all 58 of their 767-300ER's, so the order has not been canceled or anything.

Is AA currently the only carrier that has an order for winglets on the 767??



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineKeny156 From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 58 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4491 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 3):
That seems a bit weird to me, why would you remove the winglets??

Well you could leave the winglets on and sit the plane while the STC gets FAA approval. APB is in the process of the STC (Supplemental Type Certificate). There was another thread where it was said the a Delta 767 was going to be the first aircraft to fly revenue service. APB just used an AA 767 for testing purposes. Probably to get the winglets a either a cheaper price or they were paid to lease the 767 for that purpose.


User currently offlineLegacyins From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2022 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4481 times:



Quoting KochamLOT (Thread starter):
There is 2 or 3 pics on a.net of this aircraft. Where is it and why arent there more photos? Is it flying any routes yet or still in testing? Where and when will we see more of these modified 763s?
When will the airlines start to put these on all their 76-ERs?

already being discussed in this thread.

http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...eneral_aviation/read.main/4240358/



John@SFO
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17004 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4457 times:



Quoting KochamLOT (Thread starter):
cant wait to see what the wing looks like from the cabin. Can anyone post a few pics of this modified 76 wing from inside the cabin? I wanna see that winglet!!!

Maybe something like this: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...ines/Boeing%20767-323/ER/1370220/M



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 24080 posts, RR: 22
Reply 10, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4443 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 6):
Is AA currently the only carrier that has an order for winglets on the 767??

There are at least half a dozen. Without checking, others I can think of are DL, LA, OS, NZ and I don't think that's all.


User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4435 times:



Quoting Keny156 (Reply 7):
Well you could leave the winglets on and sit the plane while the STC gets FAA approval

Aah, planes don't make money sitting on the ground.........



"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17004 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4428 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 10):
There are at least half a dozen. Without checking, others I can think of are DL, LA, OS, NZ and I don't think that's all.

Okay, good. So once the wing let is ready to be installed, it will be a success.



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineHA_DC9 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 652 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4384 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 6):
Is AA currently the only carrier that has an order for winglets on the 767??

Here's a good thread with the orders:
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...general_aviation/read.main/4219876


User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17004 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4381 times:



Quoting HA_DC9 (Reply 13):
Here's a good thread with the orders:
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...19876

Great, thank you.

So there are many 767s that will get wing lets, great!



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineGatorman96 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 852 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4367 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 10):

There are at least half a dozen. Without checking, others I can think of are DL, LA, OS, NZ and I don't think that's all.



HA also. Here is the company's website that are producing the winglets

http://www.aviationpartnersboeing.com/



Cha brro
User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 18704 posts, RR: 58
Reply 16, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4304 times:



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 11):

Aah, planes don't make money sitting on the ground.........

And not only that, but they can be installed and removed in a few hours. It's easier than replacing an engine, if I understand correctly.


User currently offlineHypersonic From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2005, 149 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 4128 times:

Another question might be..

Why go for winglets at all? The 767-400ER has 'raked' tips like the 777-300ER.
.
This is a quote from THIS very website, from the 767-400ER description page, when discussing the Raked extensions.
.
"Winglets were originally considered but the wingtip extensions proved more efficient."

Granted the 767-300 is a bit smaller as a plane. (Fuselage-wise)
But the 300/ER has the SAME? wings as the 400ER, thus creates a similar amount of aerodynamic effects that warranted the use of Rakes on the 400ER.
(The raked extensions are over 7ft long, again, according to 'this' site, thus accounting for the span increase from 156ft to 170ft)

Therefore surely a raked tip for the 300ER or indeed 'any' other 767 model, is better than winglets? - According to the above?

Thoughts?


User currently offlineUA76Heavy From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 181 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3843 times:



Quoting Hypersonic (Reply 17):
"Winglets were originally considered but the wingtip extensions proved more efficient."

Even Boeing is toying with the idea of retrofitting 772ERs with raked wing tips to possibly boost their performance attractiveness in light of the A350. Would raked wing tips a better alternative to blended winglets for 763s?


User currently offlineHypersonic From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2005, 149 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3530 times:



Quoting UA76Heavy (Reply 18):
Even Boeing is toying with the idea of retrofitting 772ERs with raked wing tips to possibly boost their performance attractiveness in light of the A350. Would raked wing tips a better alternative to blended winglets for 763s?

I think they would... so why Winglets on the 763 if rakes are on the 764?


User currently offlineKochamLOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 295 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 3076 times:

Hey....I like those winglets!
And if the general raked wing concept was better, why wasnt it employed in a similar manner for the 73 and 75s?

Anyone have pics of the winglets from inside the cabin?
Where is the AA 767 w winglets now and when will everything be approved?


User currently offlineNWA757300 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 299 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 2857 times:

One of the posts on the other thread said DL's first aircraft will be going in for modifications on Dec 1. I assume this didn't happen if the winglets aren't certified for use, yet. What is the status of the certification process?

User currently offlineBoeing767mech From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1021 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 2764 times:



Quoting KochamLOT (Reply 20):
Where is the AA 767 w winglets now and when will everything be approved?

The winglets are laying on the hanger floor in MCI, since the STC has not be approved, The airplane is probably at 37K flying somewhere from someplace WITHOUT winglets. The STC should be approved in the first quarter of next year.

David



Never under-estimate the predictably of stupidty
User currently offlineJetJeanes From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1429 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 2673 times:

they say it can save an airlne a million bucks a year on fuel. I recall in 06 i got a 737
that had only one wingtip and as i stood at the window before boarding i could not figure out what it was that was differnt then it caught my eye, So im going to assume the other was damaged and we were a thousand miles from its base, I assume there is no safety problems
with just one winglet.



i can see for 80 miles
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