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NW/DL Dec. Voluntary Package Details?  
User currently offlineNWBOS From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 161 posts, RR: 2
Posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 5042 times:

Many of my co-workers are wondering when the details are going to come out regarding the latest round of buy-outs/early retirement packages at DL/NW. Does anyone have any details? I'm a little surprised that nothing is out yet since it was a week ago that Richard Anderson said he wants employees to have the details to employees soon, so they could talk about it with their families over the holidays.

The only thing that I have heard (unconfirmed, of course) is that this will be the best package they've offered to date, and that once you get notification that you have qualified, you only have 48 hours to decide and the answer is non-reversible.

I know a lot of employees have been waiting for something like this, so, it might be what the companies need to shed the extra frontline employees they vowed to keep within the terms of the merger transaction...

47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline611ATL From United States of America, joined exactly 9 years ago today! , 83 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4987 times:

They keep telling us at DL that it will be similar to the package that we had earlier this year. Not sure why they haven't released the details yet either...but I seriously doubt DL is going to have a 48-hour decision window. It'll be a pretty quick timeline, but in the past it's always been at least a few weeks (during which time they send out personalized financial statements and try to pack in retirement seminars).

User currently offlineNwaesc From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4976 times:

A few in my city are curious as well...

I'm also wondering how senior the annual early outs on the ESSC side will go this year, and how that package will compare to the DL one.

Should be interesting...



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineCokePopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1187 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4938 times:

The only insight was the statement that the "employees can
review the details over the holidays with their families and make a decision after the 1st of the year".
They will release the details on Delta Net.


User currently offlineSurprise From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 133 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4844 times:

The details are out. Get with your supervisor they have them.

User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7557 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4839 times:

Sounds like from Nwaesc and NWBOS is that a lot of NW employee's are wanting to jump ship.


"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineNwaesc From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4784 times:



Quoting Surprise (Reply 4):
The details are out. Get with your supervisor they have them.

I am a supervisor, and I don't have them. Neither does local management.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 7, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4747 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 5):
Sounds like from Nwaesc and NWBOS is that a lot of NW employee's are wanting to jump ship.

I don't think that many here are ready to jump per se, but if the right offer came along they might bite....

Not for nothing, but for me to even think about it would take at least the following:

*Payout of all accrued sick/vac/oji time (~1900 hours)

* Medical for at least 1 year -NOT at the COBRA rate

* The double severance that is accorded to us in our CBA currently-20 weeks in my case

* Some sort of flight benefits (this would be more for my wife than me LOL)

Yes, I know this is highly unrealistic, so no need for anyone to point that out....



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineNWA757300 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 299 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4690 times:

What was the package like that they offered in '08?

User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4661 times:



Quoting NWA757300 (Reply 8):
What was the package like that they offered in '08?

Which one are you asking about (I'm guessing the DL one)?



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineNWA757300 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 299 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4639 times:

Yeah the DL package. I remember they got a really good response from it, so I'm thinking it was a pretty good deal.

User currently offlineSdexplorer00 From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 156 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4633 times:

Details should be out this afternoon with the timeline for signing up between January 15 and 31st.

User currently offlineJetboyTWA From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 389 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4622 times:

Is airliners.net really the best place to discuss something like this?

User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6500 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4622 times:



Quoting NWAESC (Reply 7):
Not for nothing, but for me to even think about it would take at least the following:

*Payout of all accrued sick/vac/oji time (~1900 hours)

* Medical for at least 1 year -NOT at the COBRA rate

* The double severance that is accorded to us in our CBA currently-20 weeks in my case

* Some sort of flight benefits (this would be more for my wife than me LOL)

Yes, I know this is highly unrealistic, so no need for anyone to point that out....

I think those are reasonable requests. How many ex NWA people that you know do you think would take it.


User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4696 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4597 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 5):
Sounds like from Nwaesc and NWBOS is that a lot of NW employee's are wanting to jump ship.

Because it makes perfect sense to jump ship for the airline best prepared to weather an industry downturn, at a time when jobs are so abundant....

Any NW employee (or DL for that matter) leaving out of spite is probably someone not worth having on your team anyways thus good riddance.



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineJetboyTWA From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 389 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4556 times:

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 14):
Any NW employee (or DL for that matter) leaving out of spite is probably someone not worth having on your team anyways thus good riddance.

Very well said!

I'm crossing my fingers that those employees that plan to take their animosity to the combined carrier decide to jump ship as soon as possible.

[Edited 2008-12-12 11:59:22]

User currently offlinePar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7397 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4519 times:



Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 14):
Any NW employee (or DL for that matter) leaving out of spite is probably someone not worth having on your team anyways thus good riddance

There is another side to that story, those who are good workers with time in on the job who really do not have the energy to start all over again. This will not be an easy integration, those experienced employees will be counted on a lot to guide the younger more inexperienced workers, and after 10 or more years on the job in an industry where they are looking to shed employees left and right, why exactly would you stay, better to take the best package you can get and start over in another industry which is more stable.

DL and NW have trimmed employees in the past, and a lot of the "less desireables" may have already left, what you are now looking at is quality in addition to money, you may save money now but loose much more when the quality decides to take the offer. Look for a smaller window with lower options to encourage the experienced to stay for the long haul.


User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4339 times:



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 13):
I think those are reasonable requests. How many ex NWA people that you know do you think would take it.

I can think of at least 10-15 off of the top of my head. I know that's tea in the ocean, but my guess is that there would be a stampede to sign up if these (or better) were the terms.

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 14):
Any NW employee (or DL for that matter) leaving out of spite is probably someone not worth having on your team anyways thus good riddance.

C'mon. No one ever leaves out of spite. They hang around and half-ass things until something better comes along....

The people that most likely are on the fence fall into one of these categories:

1. Close to retirement, and need an "incentive" to make the leap. I don't know about DL, but there are a lot of people at NW that are marking time until they're eligible to go.

1A. Same as category 1, but may decide to go if it means someone junior gets to avoid furlough. A rare breed, but one that exists nonetheless....

2. People that have other jobs, or may be thinking about making a career change. This would also include folks that want to include continuing education as part of that. The severance might be enough to tide them over while they get things in order.

2A. Someone that wants to take some significant time off to stay at home with a young child or elderly parent, but doesn't have the $$$ to do so.

3. People that are just burnt out. Most of these also fall under answer #2, but maybe they haven't figured out what they want to do next.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10532 posts, RR: 14
Reply 18, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 4334 times:

Per DeltaNet, you NW folks should have something on RADAR and should also receive an e-mail about it by December 17th.


"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineHiflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2176 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4305 times:

While job losses in the country are rising hourly...with some estimates of a million a month next spring...any package is going to have to be extremely attractive. For the more senior folks the question is difficult....go now with a known quantity or wait and possibly be riding a sinking ship if the economy continues to fail and oil rises again....both not unlikely given the financial turmoil in the world's markets. Definitely an insurance package should be included and, of course, a pass program....understanding that interline benefits may not be as complete as ones based on retirement. Bridging of retirements levels to a slightly lower age would benefit as well. Payoff of accumulated sick leave would attract participants and stop sick leave abuse issues at end of career that have occurred in other programs around the industry. Restoration of value to company sponsored 401k plans, in lieu of pensions, that have been pummeled these past months would also be beneficial.

User currently offlineNwaesc From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4243 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 18):
Per DeltaNet, you NW folks should have something on RADAR and should also receive an e-mail about it by December 17th.

Details about both options were posted late this afternoon. Emails also went out to all employees...

Quoting Hiflyer (Reply 19):
Payoff of accumulated sick leave would attract participants

You bet it will. We haven't had that at NW before (or at least in a long time). For me alone that would be ~40k, and I know many people who have much much greater accrual totals.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineNWAdeicer From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 176 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4087 times:

Read the memo, did I miss the fine details as nwaesc listed reference sick, oji,etc payout and pass privileges ?


I miss the Red Tail
User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4075 times:



Quoting NWAdeicer (Reply 21):
Read the memo, did I miss the fine details as nwaesc listed reference sick, oji,etc payout and pass privileges ?

If you're referring to what I wrote in post #7, that's what it would take for me personally to go...

Having said that, on both official packages, pay out of sick and PPT time is listed. I would assume that for us at NW that includes all sick, vacation & OJI accruals.



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineNWBOS From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 161 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 4018 times:

Well just saw the details today and they don't look any better than what they had the last time around. Also, didn't DL offer lifetime passes with 10 years of seniority or more? They're not offering that that this time.

User currently offlineDLRESAGNT From Canada, joined Aug 2008, 27 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 3707 times:

I would like to see the program expanded to international employees. Looking at the preliminary details, I would have enough "points" for early retirement!  scratchchin  Pretty tempting and I am still young enough to start a new career.

25 M404 : RL757PVD Rick, this surprises me. Please note that no-one mentioned "spite" until u did. Are you saying that the 4000 DL folks that took the offer ear
26 Mayor : I took an early retirement from DL in 2005 and I hope no one thought I was spiteful for doing it. Like was mentioned, I had personal reasons for doing
27 Surprise : I could take the package and retire. I've been offered a job that would pay me a little bit more than what I make now. It would be in the travel indus
28 NW : From what I hear yes. The limited passes this time around is keeping many from taking the early out.
29 Mayor : Looks like the 55 point program offers unlimited travel for retirees, the Early Out program does not.
30 DALMD88 : That is the same as the last package I think. About the only difference I notice from the last package is the Early Retirement package is now offered
31 USAFDO : Where is the early out package information? Somebody please post it...
32 Mayor : If you're a NW employee, it should be on RADAR, if a DL employee it's on DeltaNet. Also, all employees should be receiving a company e-mail about it.
33 NWAESC : For the NW side, offering to pay out all accrued sick & OJI time is new... I think that may convince a lot of people to go. Correct. If you're on RAD
34 EXAAUADL : I really cant imagine too many people taking it That's over the top..can you source that claim? yup...the question is do you expect to be laid off la
35 Nwaesc : Also something I would imagine a lot of people in smaller stations are taking into account....
36 Surprise : If I was in a small station and we had already been cut to the minimum, which they all have, I would'nt be too worried. I don't see anymore outsourci
37 Jetlanta : I took a package in late 2004 that gave me one year of flight benefits for every year of service. For me, that was 13 years of flight benefits. I was
38 NWAESC : (bump) I received a clarification on what "PTO" will mean for those of us on the NW side... According to NW H.R., the "PTO" pay out is for vacation on
39 WorldTraveler : with all due respect, you are not the average airline employee. You have a wealth of knowledge and an ability to use your skills elsewhere that most
40 Nwaesc : It has nothing to do with one group being treated better than the other. They also could have avoided a lot of confusion by stating clearly what "PTO
41 WorldTraveler : I'm quite sure that DL didn't pay sick time as part of its exit packages and doesn't normally... it's use it or lose it which is the way it is at mos
42 Nwaesc : They did not. For the record, we don't normally get it, either, which is why it'd have been nice had they specified that. On DLNet, it does say vacat
43 WorldTraveler : I do not... please post or PM them.
44 NWAESC : WT-- Here you go... EARLY OUT PROGRAM: *Not retiree eligible* 1. Severance: Same- 2 weeks per YOS, max 20 weeks 2. Travel Privileges: NW: Space A at r
45 Mayor : Also, if I'm not mistaken, the flying benefit (at least for DL) is unlimited, just as it is for normal retirees and, yes, S3B is the retiree priority
46 WorldTraveler : thanks much. It goes to the argument that several people have made that NW benefits are richer but DL's pay is higher and that retirees don't fare as
47 NWAESC : You're correct on that. Unlimited for both carriers for retiree eligible employees. I didn't post that, because it is the same for both... just to cl
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