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CO, NW/DL, AA, UA When Will They Order Airbus?  
User currently offlinePlairbus From Germany, joined Feb 2008, 311 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 8449 times:

I am here at home and just writing done wich could be the next orders for Airbus from big airlines, and know arriving in the United States my predicton is very sad for Airbus...
NW after the fusion with DL is not going to order more Airbus widebody. CO after they order the 787 and a few more 777 is done too. AA i do not think and possibility for Airbus there in the next 25 years. UA, I do not know I mean they could use the 330 and 350 very well but the 777 is working also well for them and why should they change the fleet for a european product when they can have a similar product from the USA. So only USAirways will be a loyal Airbus coustomer and it looks like they will be in lets say 5 to 8 years a 90% Airbus fleet.
The only airlines that perhaps and I am saying only perhaps will buy Airbus a mix of 330 and 350 or only 350 is UA, but only if they can have them for a very good price but I think Boeing will not let them go. So what do you think?

64 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8402 times:

I can't speak for other airlines, but we at CO can answer that: NEVER. We have an outstanding relationship with Boeing, and I think they're excellent planes. And they've served us well. Why fix what ain't broken?

User currently offlinePlairbus From Germany, joined Feb 2008, 311 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8386 times:

I also think that CO is not buying Airbus soon, I will not say never but for sure not in the next years.
Perhaps one day Airbus making a good offer but no, it is far away.
My only bet would be perhaps UA.


User currently offlineEWRCabincrew From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5523 posts, RR: 56
Reply 3, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8389 times:



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 1):
we at CO can answer that: NEVER

Although we did order the A340/A330 a while back. I have service guides for these aircraft. We are a Boeing family, now.



You can't cure stupid
User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8343 times:



Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 3):
Although we did order the A340/A330 a while back. I have service guides for these aircraft. We are a Boeing family, now.

And we did have those junk-for-planes A300's. Our own and EA's. Those were a nightmare for us.


User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 5957 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8290 times:

AA =I don't think you will see AA order Airbus any time soon as I recall they are still in a bit of a spat with them over the A300 crash in NY.

DL/NW = I think DL is going to be evaluating the 737 and 320 fleet that they operate and at some point make a decision based off that on acquiring the 737NG or 320NG but that is years off at the earliest. The only hope I think Airbus has near term is DL falling in love with NWs 332s and DL placing a small follow on order.

CO = With all the Boeing's that CO has on order right now probably not, Airbuses best chance of selling something to CO would be the 320NG when that comes on line years from now.

UA = Maybe an order for the 380 and/or 350/332 at some point but I have to say that I think this is Boeing's order (748, 777, 787) order to loose. Airbus does have a decent chance with the 320NG to replace the 757 and early 320/319 fleet.

US = Probably the only reasonably locked in Airbus customer as far as the legacies go.



Semper Fi - PowerPoint makes us stupid.
User currently offlineWESTERN737800 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 693 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8223 times:

I think US will be the only US legacy to place any significant Airbus orders for a while.


Bring back Western Airlines!
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9169 posts, RR: 15
Reply 7, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 8200 times:

A 380 for UA eventually???? But I think they will go for the B 747-8 instead

User currently offlineAf773atmsp From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 2688 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 8193 times:

NW/DL: If DL likes the performance of the A330s and A320s then I'm sure DL would order more Airbus in the future

US: US will stay an Airbus customer

UA: Maybe if Airbus makes a good deal with UA to order the A320NG

CO: Never say never but won't be an Airbus customer in the near and probably long term future

AA: AA will stay a Boeing customer



It ain't no normal MD80 its a Super 80!
User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 9, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 7968 times:

US; When Airbus offers the right product at the right price within the right timeframe.
UA; When Airbus offers the right product at the right price within the right timeframe.
DL; When Airbus offers the right product at the right price within the right timeframe.
AA; When Airbus offers the right product at the right price within the right timeframe.

CO; See US, UA, DL and AA.  yes 

Before someome asks, I 've never purchased an aircraft nor am I a member of any airlines 'aircraft purchasing board'. However, common sense tells me that there's no money for sentiment when purchasing aircraft. Hawaiian did take may of us by surprise, didn't they? scratchchin   point  Who are we to be surprised by what aircraft an airline purchases when not made privy to the tender.  old 



SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
User currently offlineCPH-R From Denmark, joined May 2001, 6000 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 7946 times:

As far as I know, AA, CO & DL (so that presumably also means NW) are all honoring the agreement they made with Boeing back in the day, so I guess it will be a cold day in hell before any of those order Airbiis.

User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7063 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 7908 times:

I think it is hard to say right now, I would never say never as times change.
But if you look at the airlines right now and see their fleets and what aircraft they already have on order things for Airbus widebodies do look grim:

AA: has 787 on order, doubtful that they will order A350s or A330s. A320NGs might have a chance given the huge number of MD80s that need to be replaced and it would be hard for Boeing to deliver 300+ 737NGs to replace them.

CO: 787 on order as well as brand new 737NGs arriving replacing older 737 classics no chance for Airbus to score here.

DL: A350, A330 could have a chance as well as A320 and A320NG

UA: Would not rule out the A350 completely



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineCALMSP From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3969 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7761 times:
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CO/DL both have a gentlemen agreements with Boeing for Boeing aircraft only.


okay, I'm waiting for the rich to spread the wealth around to me. Please mail your checks to my house.
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7063 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7742 times:



Quoting CALMSP (Reply 12):
CO/DL both have a gentlemen agreements with Boeing for Boeing aircraft only.

A verbal contract is only worth the paper it is written on............stop with that gentlemen´s agreement, this is the business world and there are no gentlemen in it.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineTerryb99 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7742 times:

Not to mention Boeing owns a piece of the post bankruptcy Delta.

User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7591 posts, RR: 27
Reply 15, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7697 times:



Quoting CALMSP (Reply 12):
CO/DL both have a gentlemen agreements with Boeing for Boeing aircraft only.



Quoting Columba (Reply 13):
A verbal contract is only worth the paper it is written on............stop with that gentlemen´s agreement, this is the business world and there are no gentlemen in it.

The gentlemen agreement is a moot point these days.

Nevermind there have been significant leadership changes at DL since that time. Anderson and others have publicly stated they are interested in future Airbus orders. Obviously they are going to play each and all manufacturers to get the best deal possible for the right aircraft to suit their needs.

NW/DL, and Anderson specfically are in love with the A330's.

Also, as part of the merger, DL gained NW's ~6 on-order, indefinetely deffered A319/A320's. DL has no immediate need for anymore of these aircraft, but the deposit could be applied to something else in the future.


User currently offlineOlympic472 From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 456 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7685 times:

Not to mention Airbus owns a piece of the post bankruptcy US.  stirthepot 


Civil Aviation has a "Need for Speed"!
User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5438 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 7639 times:



Quoting Manni (Reply 9):
When Airbus offers the right product at the right price within the right timeframe.

That says it all.



I love long German words like 'Freundschaftsbezeigungen'.
User currently offlineCarls From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 522 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 7579 times:



Quoting Plairbus (Thread starter):
NW after the fusion with DL is not going to order more Airbus widebody.

NW had an strong relationship with Airbus, and that relationship won't change because the merge with DL.

Quoting Plairbus (Thread starter):
AA i do not think and possibility for Airbus there in the next 25 years

I said few weeks ago that AA was under negotiations with Airbus for A330. Airbus is still working hard to put something together for AA, they are interested but apparently the big issue they have is the wingspan of the A330 which is 16.5 meters more or less bigger than the A300. They went to Toulouse and were very satisfied with the capabailities of the A330. I know that there are many peoples that believe that they will use the 767 in routes where the A300 was flown, however they always forget the big difference in cargo capacity and that is a huge factor for AA when we talk about Latin America, apart of the better performance the A330 has over the 767.

My personal filing is that they could order the A330 if Boeing keeps pushing back the 787 EIS, which is today more than 2 years behind of schedule. The A350 is not an option since AA will keep the 777 for many more years. However if they decide to go ahead with the A330 then the A350 will have an opportunity, once they discover the better performance that the A330 has over the 777-200 they could start looking at the A350 with different eyes.


User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 7539 times:



Quoting Plairbus (Thread starter):
NW after the fusion with DL is not going to order more Airbus widebody.

I think we better tell NWA / Delta CEO Anderson..

Quoting Plairbus (Thread starter):
AA i do not think and possibility for Airbus there in the next 25 years

Well at some point they have to replace their fleet. If Airbus has a better offer (e.g. 200 GTF A319NG's to replace MD80s) do you think AA will draw a line. Not what they told me.

Quoting Plairbus (Thread starter):
perhaps will buy Airbus a mix of 330 and 350 or only 350 is UA, but only if they can have them for a very good price but I think Boeing will not let them go.

Will UA down scale / reduce market share on Pacific flights when the 747 fleet gets even older? Or slam the door when Airbus offers them excellent financing on 25 A350-1000's ?

Quoting CPH-R (Reply 10):
As far as I know, AA, CO & DL (so that presumably also means NW) are all honoring the agreement they made with Boeing back in the day, so I guess it will be a cold day in hell before any of those order Airbiis.

I sense a lot of hope here, maybe quality & price aint everything. However Bethune (ex Boeing, 757-300, 767-400ER, 737-900 (non ER), 767-200ER (new cabin/cockpit) ) is gone and I see different quotes.

For the younger members. Airbus has grabbed more the 50% of the market during the last 15-20 yrs. very often "unexpected" shifts from loyal Boeing customers.


User currently offlineDavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2307 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 7513 times:



Quoting Plairbus (Thread starter):
NW after the fusion with DL is not going to order more Airbus widebody.

Anything is possible.

Quoting United1 (Reply 5):
DL/NW = I think DL is going to be evaluating the 737 and 320 fleet that they operate and at some point make a decision based off that on acquiring the 737NG or 320NG but that is years off at the earliest. The only hope I think Airbus has near term is DL falling in love with NWs 332s and DL placing a small follow on order.

I think this is possible

Quoting United Airline (Reply 7):
A 380 for UA eventually???? But I think they will go for the B 747-8 instead

UA doesn't have money to buy wide bodies instantly. Personally, I hope for the 748. I think it would be a good boost to the program. The key would be deployment -- like with anything. I think it would depend which UA bases have the facility to accept an A380 and could they fill the plane profitably.

Quoting Carls (Reply 18):
NW had an strong relationship with Airbus, and that relationship won't change because the merge with DL.

I think DL is now in charge of ordering.

That said, I did recently ride an AF A330, and prefered it to the 767. I think DL may well consider the A330 as a 767 replacment. But I think the 787 will will out over the A350.

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlinePlairbus From Germany, joined Feb 2008, 311 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7429 times:

Two important things:

1.- CEO are going to change in the next years and this ia very important also when new decicion are going to make.

2.- Is that true? AA was in France visiting Airbus to check out the 330?


User currently offlineCarls From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 522 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7393 times:



Quoting Davescj (Reply 20):
I think DL is now in charge of ordering.
That said, I did recently ride an AF A330, and prefered it to the 767.

Well, that is not what I have heard. Orders will be decided by coordinated team integrated by NW/DL Technicians and Financial Directors.


That is why the A330 kill the 767 and force Boeing to close the FAL, until the 787 fiasco pushed them to reopen it to cope with the compensation they are giving to customers that ordered the 787 and are needing something meantime.


User currently offlineSeaBosDca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5467 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7385 times:



Quoting Carls (Reply 18):
once they discover the better performance that the A330 has over the 777-200 they could start looking at the A350 with different eyes.

AA flies 777-200ERs, not 777-200s. The A330-300 and 777-200ER are not comparable products, as the Boeing is a much heavier plane with much greater payload-range capability, all of which AA uses on its longer routes.

In the unlikely event that AA orders A330s, they'll be A330-200s. And if there are no further 787 delays, there is no reason for AA to substitute A330-200s for similarly sized, more flexible 787-8s.


User currently offlineSeaBosDca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5467 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7381 times:



Quoting Carls (Reply 22):
That is why the A330 kill the 767 and force Boeing to close the FAL, until the 787 fiasco pushed them to reopen it to cope with the compensation they are giving to customers that ordered the 787 and are needing something meantime.

Boeing never closed the 767 line. It has been continuously open since 1982, and the 767 has continually attracted small follow-up orders from existing operators in recent years, as well as a large freighter order from UPS.

Your broader point that the A330 outcompeted the 767 is correct, but your facts are not.


25 Sebring : A better question is whether US carriers will be tempted by the Bombardier CSeries which promises to have a much earlier EIS than any significantly im
26 Scorpio : Never say never. Just because the current management is completely pro-Boeing doesn't mean that will still be the case 10 years from now. I don't see
27 DL767captain : I think UA is your only real chance of seeing an Airbus order. DL/NW will remain with Boeing, probably going with the 77W to replace the 744s (plus th
28 Burnsie28 : DL is going to consider both aircraft... NW has had great results with their Airbus's though I will say that Airbus should have been named something
29 1337Delta764 : Just because DL bought out NW doesn't mean that DL is now forced to buy from Airbus. As stated in a previous post, Boeing is a part shareholder in Del
30 Plairbus : Can somebody confirm that AA is talking to Airbus for buying 330?
31 Carls : Mate you are free to belive it or not. That doesn't change anything. Now the question is, was Airbust the one puting the responsability over AA or NT
32 Carls : You are right and I missexpress my self. What I try to say was the sales of the 767 not the FAL. Now the 767 is not attaracting new customer nor new
33 DUALRATED : Why he knows. AA and Airbuses future is grim, AMR's pilots prefer that when they apply rudder pressure they would like the tail to stay attached to t
34 Carls : They were at Toulouse one month ago and they were there looking not only the A330 but the A350 also. They are looking to replace A300 for Latin Ameri
35 NYC2theworld : Its not just about the initial numbers, but also about post-purchase support. If AA thinks that god forbid another accident happens with an AA pilot
36 Hamlet69 : Agreed! In most cases, I completely agree with you. However, due to the very order you bring up, this is not always the case. Although HA had a stron
37 Post contains images DUALRATED : No myth its very real! This is the future of Airbus at AMR.
38 Carls : I thought I clarified this sufficient. quote=Hamlet69,reply=36] Wrong. AA flies the 777-200ER, a much more capable aircraft than the A330. After the
39 Carls : Based in what everybody has been saying here about the problems between AA and Airbus, should I assume that all the accidents that AA has had were Boe
40 Keesje : A little quiz for you. The number of Airbus aircraft delivered in North America is close to: a. 20 b. 200 c. 2000
41 DUALRATED : Airbus blaming the pilot for stepping too hard on the rudder pedal is about the most absurd thing I have ever read, it was an insult to any pilot. An
42 SpeedyGonzales : Tell that to NTSB, which is blaming the pilot!
43 Post contains links and images Keesje : The official NTSB report of October 26, 2004 stated that the cause of the crash was the overuse of the rudder to counter wake turbulence. Examination
44 AFGMEL : Putting aside the predicted jingoism and product loyalties, as this is a speculative topic, I am going to speculate that airlines in the US are about
45 Scorpio : Aah yes, that explains the literally hundreds and hundreds of Airbuses flying around in the US! Oh wait, I forgot: that was because Airbus gave those
46 RJ111 : This thread is probably heading for a locking. If you chose to ignore 50% of the offerings available then you're not going to help yourself. Completel
47 Jacobin777 : ..there are customers who are purchasing the B767, independent of the B787.....not to many, but after a 1,000 frames sold, it doesn't take a large pr
48 Carls : and A350- Then blame the NTSB too. Mate, you should lower your sensitive. I just said that AA was at Toulouse and they were there even if you don"t wa
49 Plairbus : I would fly the rest of my life only AA if they buy or lease the 330 and later buy the 350, wow that would be fantastic and the planes would be llokin
50 DUALRATED : ? but in any event AA is done with Airbus. There are a slew of American parts in every Airbus, com'on! ya'll did'nt think you could build aircraft al
51 NorthstarBoy : I think if Airbus were to steal a page from the Boeing playbook of old, and customize the A330 to AA's needs, for instance, creating an A332 sized air
52 DUALRATED : They did it's called the 7378/9
53 NorthstarBoy : Yes, they did, but they were almost ten years behind the curve. had they not waited ten years to counter the A320, it might have been a whole differen
54 Hamlet69 : I never said it wasn't true. Nor am I trying to burn you. I completely believe that AA went to TLS, as I also believe that they took a very good look
55 Jacobin777 : Almost certainly. Not to mention, its not as if Airbus probably has a number of slots for A350's laying around for AA, I'm sure Airbus will reserve t
56 Columba : Say 767-400 and 757-300, great aircraft but too late It depends on the timeframe, the 787 will replace A300s, 757s, 767s and early 777s. They need a
57 Hamlet69 : Agreed. At the same time, it's not as if AA is going to retire the A300 fleet en masse. It will be a gradual retirement, just as the 787 introduction
58 Columba : I would not say that they will order the A332 but the A333. They need a medium haul aircraft and the A332 is better on longhaul routes. They don´t n
59 NorthstarBoy : the 764, I agree, i think it was developed for DL as an L1011 replacement, and ordered by CO as a replacement for their DC-10-30 fleet, along with th
60 Columba : It was developed for Condor if I recall correctly.
61 Keesje : I think the 767-400 was devlopped to counter the A330. Launch customers were expected to be UA, AA, DL and CO however 9-11 changed everything. The pro
62 Columba : I remember that Boeing had high hopes to sell the 764 to LH as an A300 replacement that is why the aircraft was in FRA. LH also evaluated the 753 for
63 DUALRATED : I agree with this statement, it's just too bad AA will not be buying Airbus anytime soon.
64 Post contains links Keesje : I hope they can find the finances to order 787 next year. Anyway A380's also unlikely for AA.. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0CWU/is_/ai_n17
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