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MH Upgrades JNB-CPT-EZE To 3 Weekly  
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 7803 times:

Starting April 2009 Malaysian Airlines (MH) will upgrade KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE currently operating 2 x week B747 in 3 classes to 3 x week B747 in 3 classes. Services will operate Fridays, Sundays, Wednesdays.

The service upgrade to EZE will be timed with the launch of SA JNB-EZE 2 x week nonstop A340-200. Service will operate Wednesdays and Sundays starting 5 April 2009.

MH and SA service will clash on Wednesdays and Sundays. EZE will now get 5 weekly flights to South Africa.

Rgs,

58 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11433 posts, RR: 58
Reply 1, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 7795 times:
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Thanks for the interesting news.
Hardi, as i mentioned on other thread, they have product and a market. Good to CPT and they probably are looking to the world cup !



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 2, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 7780 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 1):
Thanks for the interesting news.
Hardi, as i mentioned on other thread, they have product and a market. Good to CPT and they probably are looking to the world cup !

Indeed, Lipe. But the fact that the timetable of SA and MH clashes also shows that they will fight for the market.

EZE will be SA newest destinations after the restructuring plan adopted by the airline. Lets see if SA introduces JNB-GIG also to take into account World Cup in Brazil.

Rgs,


User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5925 posts, RR: 40
Reply 3, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 7770 times:

interesting news!

I would love to use once MH on this route. But as per my understanding the fares to KUL from EZE are not to atractive.

regards
Avianca



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineNickofatlanta From Australia, joined May 2000, 1487 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 7722 times:

But, in the past, they have had some great fares ex-EZE to South Africa.

User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8337 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 7691 times:
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Does MAS make any money flying all the way from Kuala Lumpor to Buenos Aires ?

User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1392 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7664 times:



Quoting Avianca (Reply 3):
But as per my understanding the fares to KUL from EZE are not to atractive.

I did that route about 5 years ago and was below US$350



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5925 posts, RR: 40
Reply 7, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7648 times:



Quoting Nickofatlanta (Reply 4):
But, in the past, they have had some great fares ex-EZE to South Africa.

thats true, but I think also more in the past - as the last times I searched I never found good fares with them.



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11433 posts, RR: 58
Reply 8, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7611 times:
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Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 2):
Indeed, Lipe. But the fact that the timetable of SA and MH clashes also shows that they will fight for the market.

Sure about that, but i believe MH got a extra share because of the fact that they fly to CPT as well as they manage more markets in Asia to all South America. JNB-EZE for instance, is limited by the daily flight to São Paulo.

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 2):
EZE will be SA newest destinations after the restructuring plan adopted by the airline. Lets see if SA introduces JNB-GIG also to take into account World Cup in Brazil

This is something i do not expect. Nowadays there's no sense to open new routes to Brazil as ANAC is giving a lot of extra flights to São Paulo.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineThestooges From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7600 times:

I've never really been able to understand this MH route, KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE. To get to Buenos Aires from Kuala Lumpur it's three flights. I can't imagine there would be a whole lot of traffic from KL to BA, but I'm sure MH funnels passengers from other places in Asia. But then for example, it would be 4 flights from from BKK to EZE !!! Flying via Europe would be almost 2,000 miles longer, but you could do it in one stop instead of 3.

User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7571 posts, RR: 43
Reply 10, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7579 times:



Quoting Thestooges (Reply 9):
I've never really been able to understand this MH route, KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE. To get to Buenos Aires from Kuala Lumpur it's three flights. I can't imagine there would be a whole lot of traffic from KL to BA, but I'm sure MH funnels passengers from other places in Asia. But then for example, it would be 4 flights from from BKK to EZE !!! Flying via Europe would be almost 2,000 miles longer, but you could do it in one stop instead of 3

And now with QF launching SYD-EZE, one could get from KUL to EZE or vice versa with one stop in SYD only. I suppose most people flying between EZE and CPT/JNB do not come from or go to KUL.

On the subject of multistops, some time ago MH also had MEX-LAX-TPE-KUL service.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5925 posts, RR: 40
Reply 11, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7536 times:



Quoting Pzurita1 (Reply 6):
I did that route about 5 years ago and was below US$350

as non-rev? jeje

was the fare one-way and till KUL? I would really love to make the flight!



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5190 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7395 times:

Given MH/SAA codeshare I think SA starting flights is a bit stupid for this market.

User currently offlineMD11junkie From Argentina, joined May 2005, 3148 posts, RR: 57
Reply 13, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7375 times:



Quoting Hardiwv (Thread starter):
The service upgrade to EZE will be timed with the launch of SA JNB-EZE 2 x week nonstop A340-200. Service will operate Wednesdays and Sundays starting 5 April 2009.

Actually going up to 3x weekly in August.

Nice and pretty fast response MH!

Quoting Thestooges (Reply 9):
I've never really been able to understand this MH route, KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE.

It's commercial - so that MH can state that they fly to all continents.

Saludos,



There is no such thing as Boeing vs Airbus as the queen of the skies has three engines, winglets and the sweetest nose!
User currently offlineSA7700 From South Africa, joined Dec 2003, 3431 posts, RR: 26
Reply 14, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 7299 times:
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Quoting ANstar (Reply 12):
Given MH/SAA codeshare I think SA starting flights is a bit stupid for this market.

They don't codeshare in the EZE - market. SA and MH only have codeshares in place between JNB-KUL-JNB.


Rgds

SA7700



When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
User currently offlineShanxz From Singapore, joined Apr 2006, 243 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7271 times:



Quoting Hardiwv (Thread starter):
MH and SA service will clash on Wednesdays and Sundays. EZE will now get 5 weekly flights to South Africa.

Why would MH and SA plan it this way? Wasn't it possible to do in such that there is no clash? No point for both airlines to deliberately compete and bleed right?

Though, I do think that it's a good strategy to increase the frequencies now, that the World Cup is close. I wonder whether the Argentines will prefer to travel MH 744 or SA 342.

Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 5):
Does MAS make any money flying all the way from Kuala Lumpor to Buenos Aires ?

Supposedly, this was a loss-making route under the previous MH CEO. But when the new CEO came in, he told the staff that unless the route was made profitable, it would be axed, along with their jobs. This forced them to cut costs and increase the yields, as well as fares, to make it sustainable. So supposedly, they make money from it now.


Quoting Thestooges (Reply 9):
I'm sure MH funnels passengers from other places in Asia.

Tons of traffic from China, Vietnam and the Philippines, it seems.

Quoting Pzurita1 (Reply 6):
I did that route about 5 years ago and was below US$350

Wow! That's unheard of. Three year ago, when I had to fly from SIN-EZE, MH was the 1st option I was considering. But the price for the return ticket was over US$1700. In the end, I flew SIN - FRA - MAD - EZE on QF and IB metal.



Airlines are in the service business, not transport. Brand matters...
User currently offlineHaan From South Africa, joined Aug 2004, 289 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7260 times:



Quoting ANstar (Reply 12):
Given MH/SAA codeshare I think SA starting flights is a bit stupid for this market.

I agree but I think that MH must terminate in JNB and let SAA operate on a codeshare
JNB-EZE.


User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 17, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 7155 times:



Quoting Thestooges (Reply 9):
I've never really been able to understand this MH route, KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE. To get to Buenos Aires from Kuala Lumpur it's three flights. I can't imagine there would be a whole lot of traffic from KL to BA, but I'm sure MH funnels passengers from other places in Asia. But then for example, it would be 4 flights from from BKK to EZE !!! Flying via Europe would be almost 2,000 miles longer, but you could do it in one stop instead of 3.

As mentioned above, there are not many other options.

MH has a strong codeshare with KLM in AMS but KLM does not operate AMS-EZE. KUL-AMS-CDG-EZE (KL/AF) or KUL-AMS-GRU-EZE (KL/JJ) remains as one of the best options with daily operations. This because there are twice daily KUL-AMS flight both with the B747.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 10):
And now with QF launching SYD-EZE, one could get from KUL to EZE or vice versa with one stop in SYD only. I suppose most people flying between EZE and CPT/JNB do not come from or go to KUL.

This is a good point. It has become easier to travel from Asia to EZE via SYD with QF.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 10):
On the subject of multistops, some time ago MH also had MEX-LAX-TPE-KUL service.

Hi, Eddie. MH continues to operate LAX-TPE-KUL B747 3 x week (service was recently downgraded to 2 x week).

Quoting ANstar (Reply 12):
Given MH/SAA codeshare I think SA starting flights is a bit stupid for this market.

MH/SA only codeshare JNB-KUL and apparently MH only makes about 5 seats available for SA codeshare.

Quoting MD11junkie (Reply 13):
Actually going up to 3x weekly in August.

Nice and pretty fast response MH!

Gaston, have a look more carefully, MH will actually upgrade the flight from April 2009.

Quoting MD11junkie (Reply 13):
It's commercial - so that MH can state that they fly to all continents.

EZE was not profitable for MH until some time ago, under the previous MH CEO. However, things have changed and currently the route is certainly making money and selling very well. MH has a fantastic product. Fares have increased, and the majority of pax actually fly between Argentina and South Africa, added with a good amount of connecting pax from Asia, mainly China and the Philippines (as mentioned above).

Rgs,


User currently offlineMillwallSean From Singapore, joined Apr 2008, 1241 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 7116 times:

Hmm, I find it interesting to hear that the route is making money now. I can say on good authority that 2 months ago it was not profitable. Now this might have changed but I very, very much doubt it.

When the route was launched it was said that the PM of Malaysia enjoyed flying MH to his ranch in Argentina. These days that would not be a reason for flying.

Transfer traffic from the Philippines, Vietnam and China.
Now think about this and then think very careful about how profitable transfer traffic from those particular markets tend to be.



No One Likes Us - We Dont Care.
User currently offlineUPPERDECKFAN From Spain, joined Jun 2007, 992 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 7078 times:



Quoting Thestooges (Reply 9):
Flying via Europe would be almost 2,000 miles longer, but you could do it in one stop instead of 3.

Although KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE is a 3 stop journey, it's a direct flight so totaltime is shorter than flying through Europe, it has also the benefit that you don't have to time connections, there is no chance for your luggage to be left behind or to loose a connection due to delays.

BTW, there are not that many non stop Europe-EZE, correct me if I'm wrong but IIRC it's only MAD and CDG, since MAD have pretty limited links with Asia it leaves CDG as the only one stop option from S.E Asia to EZE through Europe.

OTOH, the one stop option through SYD on QF seems very attractive and therefore competitive.



744,742,741,772,773,762,732,735,738,752,727,717,DC10,DC9,M82,M87,319,320,321,343,346,L1011,CRJ2,CRJ9,E190,ATR42,DSH8,
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 20, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 7059 times:



Quoting UPPERDECKFAN (Reply 19):
BTW, there are not that many non stop Europe-EZE, correct me if I'm wrong but IIRC it's only MAD and CDG, since MAD have pretty limited links with Asia it leaves CDG as the only one stop option from S.E Asia to EZE through Europe.

AZ operates FCO-EZE B772 daily nonstop and LH operates FRA-EZE 6 weekly B747 nonstop. BA operates LHR-EZE via GRU daily B747.

Rgs,


User currently offlinePutnik From Sweden, joined Aug 2007, 229 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 6858 times:

I was always amused by this specific routing. What is the true benefit of having two stops in South Africa? Does anyone have any info regarding loads? I guess the current routing has some merit. Otherwise this route would be axed ages ago.
What are the future prospects of flights between KL and South America? Does anyone have a clue about how things would work with KUL-JNB-EZE flights twice a week and KUL-CPT-EZE once or twice a week? Would that make more sense? What about adding GRU to the package and making flights more frequent?



LH504 - we always remember our first :)
User currently offlineMD11junkie From Argentina, joined May 2005, 3148 posts, RR: 57
Reply 22, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 6727 times:



Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 17):
Gaston, have a look more carefully, MH will actually upgrade the flight from April 2009.

And you do too, I was referring to the SA flight - it will be taken up to 3x weekly in August  Smile



There is no such thing as Boeing vs Airbus as the queen of the skies has three engines, winglets and the sweetest nose!
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11433 posts, RR: 58
Reply 23, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 6633 times:
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Quoting Putnik (Reply 21):
Would that make more sense? What about adding GRU to the package and making flights more frequent?

No, because the bilateral only allows 2 weekly flights between Brazil and Malaysia



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineUPPERDECKFAN From Spain, joined Jun 2007, 992 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (5 years 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 6546 times:



Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 20):
AZ operates FCO-EZE B772 daily nonstop and LH operates FRA-EZE 6 weekly B747 nonstop. BA operates LHR-EZE via GRU daily B747.

Thanks for the heads up, as I wasn't sure about LH serving EZ non stop or via GRU and forgot about AZ, this leaves 3 options to get from SE Asia to EZE on one stop in Europe, LH through FRA, AF through CDG and TG/AZ through FCO.



744,742,741,772,773,762,732,735,738,752,727,717,DC10,DC9,M82,M87,319,320,321,343,346,L1011,CRJ2,CRJ9,E190,ATR42,DSH8,
25 Hardiwv : GRU is always a good option for airlines, but I dont think MH would manage a good market in GRU because 1) from KUL to GRU connections are easy via A
26 EddieDude : Correct. It is pity they are down to 2 weekly flights only. I wonder if they will be able to continue with this route or will eventually cancel it. I
27 TommyBP251b : Could the reason be the high altitude of JNB? The distance of the JNB-EZE leg is 4389 nm. That is similar to a LHR-DEN flight. So what is the reason
28 Hardiwv : You capture two markets CPT and JNB, this is the only reason I could think of. Now with SA introducing JNB-EZE nonstop I think MH will benefit by ser
29 Thestooges : I wasn't reffering to someone flying KUL to EZE on MH in my post, but from BKK. Like a lot of other people have commented, most of the Asian passenge
30 ANstar : I didnt realise that! Looks like SAA want to get MH off the JNB/CPT-EZE route then!
31 Hardiwv : But the issue is that this market is mainly divided in KUL-JNB-EZE and JNB-CPT-EZE. Most pax fly between South Africa and Argentina and between Malay
32 MAS777 : which did very well and was a popular service for LAX-MEX traffic.. until the US airlines/govt realised this and withdrew MAS' onward traffic rights
33 CityofAthens : I don't know whether this route is profitable or not, but if there is any truth in the following then one could reasonably argue that SAA's new servi
34 Thestooges : Did you mean to say KUL-JNB-CPT and JNB-CPT-EZE ??? I definitely agree with you in that if MH didn't have 5th freedom rights between South Africa and
35 Hardiwv : Correct. No doubt about this fact. As I said, what keeps the load of this flights is traffic KUL-JNB-CPT on the one hand and EZE-CPT-JNB on the other
36 TurkishWings : I have always wondered the crew scheduling of this flight. Does anyone have any idea?
37 Flyguy1 : How does MH do at EWR? Is there any chance this flight may get a frequency increase at some point?
38 TristarSteve : Very strong rumour of a timing change from NS09. Dept from KUL at 2359 and arr EWR at 1000. Return flights same as today, with a 12 hr layover at EWR
39 Thestooges : Does anyone have any exact proof or sources that this route is profitable or not? It would be interesting to know for sure !!! Yeah, I could imagine i
40 Putnik : I automatically placed KL abbreviation for Kuala Lumpur, forgetting that KLM will be the first and obvious choice Sorry Hardiwv, my mistake. I was wo
41 MillwallSean : If someone gives you exact numbers or proof they are in breach of more than a few internal privacy clauses. Judge the information that has been given
42 Brenintw : It is a two-week rotation. A friend of mine did it recently and mentioned that he'd been away from home for 14 days.
43 Vincewy : Also add BKK-MAD-EZE on TG/IB, unless TG axed MAD recently.
44 Pzurita1 : Sorry, I should have been more specific. It was EZE-CPT-EZE
45 HB-IWC : It is indeed a 14-day trip with the current twice weekly service. I would imagine that the addition of a third service will somewhat shorten this tri
46 TristarSteve : I believe the plan for the summer is that the crew that operates ARN-EWR will min rest in NYC and fly back the same evening to ARN.
47 DCAjet : Hardiwv, what you say used to be true. Right now, I'd say it is more than half/half. MH has become the fastest way between China and Argentina withou
48 Pzurita1 : I did met them. They are 3 Mexican girls, but told me they live in Malaysia.
49 AF022 : The sceptic in me believes that MH is increasing frequencies on this route because it is losing less money on this route than the others it serves. So
50 MaverickM11 : I still find it hard to believe this is anything more than a pride route. It does carry a ton of traffic to XMN of all places from EZE, even more than
51 Post contains links DCAjet : For those interested, take a look at actual boardings provided by Argentina's Subsecretaria de Transporte Aereo Comercial, discriminated by country of
52 Thestooges : What ?!?!? I'm not asking someone to divulge confidential company information, I was merely wondering if someone has a better source than just "I hav
53 MAS777 : " target=_blank>http://www.transporte.gov.ar/aero/es...x.pdf But should we not take into account South-Africa entry figures too? If you add both RSA a
54 Hardiwv : Actually you should take into account all South African entry figures since SA will only start operations in April 2009. Rgs,
55 Sukhoi : It´s loaded in Amadeus now! Dep KUL 23:59 Arr ARN 05.55 Dep ARN 07.45 Arr EWR 10.05 on Mondays, Thursdays and Saturdays with B744. Dep EWR at 22.00
56 Flyguy1 : Would be nice if they flew to JFK instead, esp. with the close ties with Skyteam.
57 MillwallSean : Much better timing that will improve MHs offering on the Scandinavian market. Very similar timing to Thais successful Scandinavian service or for that
58 Sukhoi : Sorry the days are Sundays, Wednesday & Friday!
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