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Condor Cancel Flight In Cancun For 3 Days Now!  
User currently offlinePlairbus From Germany, joined Feb 2008, 311 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 8995 times:

Condor has more than 200 passengers here at cancun most of them in my Hotel for the third day, without sending an other plane or sending them with other airlines, passengers a furios!!!
The plane had hydraulics problem here in Cancun and cancel 24 hours the departure because Airberlin the next day came with the part Condor asked for but they can not fix it and peolple are here now the third day and they do not know what happen. How is that possible is an airlines after 3 days not responsable to bring back the peolple even if they have to put them in other planes ???

31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFatmirJusufi From Albania, joined Jan 2009, 2441 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 8960 times:



Quoting Plairbus (Thread starter):
passengers a furios!!!

...sure they are!  Angry

Hope that will be a solution as soon as possible.


Fatmir



DO FLIGHTS. NOT FIGHTS.
User currently offlineCwldude From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 691 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 8794 times:

I'd rather an extra 3 days all expenses paid in Cancún than getting on a plane with a hydraulics problem! You may want to remind them of that?

I'm sure Condor are doing all they can to get both the passengers and their aircraft back home, it's costing them thousands of Euro's to keep those passengers in CUN so there's obviously some serious problem with the aircraft!



Thomson Airways - The UKs premier charter airline // now flown : BY -AA -AJ -AE -AT; OO -AX -AU -RA -BG; BRIG; OBYD
User currently offlineHestaman From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 89 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 8787 times:



Quoting Cwldude (Reply 2):
I'd rather an extra 3 days all expenses paid in Cancún

With all due respect... many of those people must return to their 'real' lives which include among other things work and family obligations that often do not afford the luxury of waiting 3 days. I think after 2 days in a row, if the airline could not bring those passengers home, it is time to find another airline who will do the job for them.


User currently offlineRobffm2 From Germany, joined Dec 2006, 1115 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 8583 times:

It has been said many times here on a.net that Condor is short of aircrafts.
Unfortunately the cold and snowy weather in central Europe does not help them.
Spiegel online reports that a flight to Cuba has been delayed by 8 hours. http://www.spiegel.de/reise/aktuell/0,1518,599631,00.html


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7057 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 8550 times:

As it is already beed said Condor is hort of aircraft as a result of that Condor has bought the former Belair 767.


It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineJohnnybgoode From Germany, joined Jan 2001, 2187 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 8428 times:



Quoting Columba (Reply 5):
As it is already beed said Condor is hort of aircraft as a result of that Condor has bought the former Belair 767.

the number of incidents, in which DE delayed flights by many hours or cancelled flights on short notice, seem to have occured very often in the last months. I also remember a number of such threads on various internet boards.

from what I've learned, it seems as though DE is not only short on aircraft, they do not have a spare aircraft! I know that the 763 fleet is quite small and a spare aircraft is not inexpensive. but it's standard at airlines such as LH, BA, etc. So what about charter airlines? don't they have any reserves to cover such incidents?

I heard that DE is interested in getting the sole Belair 763? could that be an indication that they are indeed short on aircraft and/or want to get a reserve aircraft?

the DE fleet is not getting younger and the 763 of them, so I am told, have very, very high numbers of flights and cycles, so as a lay person I would assume those aircraft will become even more prone to maintenance incidents.



If only pure sweetness was offered, why's this bitter taste left in my mouth.
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7057 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 8408 times:



Quoting Johnnybgoode (Reply 6):
from what I've learned, it seems as though DE is not only short on aircraft, they do not have a spare aircraft! I know that the 763 fleet is quite small and a spare aircraft is not inexpensive. but it's standard at airlines such as LH, BA, etc. So what about charter airlines? don't they have any reserves to cover such incidents?

I remember that I had a flight with DE a few years ago and instead of the scheduled 757 a LH A320 arrived.
Can not LH help out with an A340 or A330 when a DE 767 is stranded.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineHT From Germany, joined May 2005, 6525 posts, RR: 24
Reply 8, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 8390 times:



Quoting Plairbus (Thread starter):
Condor has more than 200 passengers here at cancun most of them in my Hotel for the third day

Where is the pax's luggage ? Do they still have it with them or is it in the custody of DE at the airport ?

Quoting Johnnybgoode (Reply 6):
from what I've learned, it seems as though DE is not only short on aircraft, they do not have a spare aircraft! I know that the 763 fleet is quite small and a spare aircraft is not inexpensive. but it's standard at airlines such as LH, BA, etc. So what about charter airlines? don't they have any reserves to cover such incidents?

2 summers ago, HF had a A306 leased from LH as standby a/c based at HAJ, painted in their own c/s. This a/c was scheduled to fly only a handful of rotations per week, but later was leased out to LX for their flights to Western Africa (Malabo, IIRC).

Having a spare B763 sitting idle right now (= busy X-mas / New Years season) when there are only 9 a/c of this type in your fleet, would be a bad thing from a financial point of view.

Quoting Johnnybgoode (Reply 6):
the DE fleet is not getting younger and the 763 of them, so I am told, have very, very high numbers of flights and cycles, so as a lay person I would assume those aircraft will become even more prone to maintenance incidents.

But this does not drive DE away from its plans to install winglets on their B763's from April 2009 onwards.
-HT



Carpe diem ! Life is too short to waste your time ! Keep in mind, that today is the first day of the rest of your life !
User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9159 posts, RR: 29
Reply 9, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 8345 times:

They have 2 inbound flights delayed at FRA right now and 2 outbound flights to Punta Cana. I can imagine that they have some irate passengers on boith ends of the lines.

Indeed their 767 fleet is a bit "stretched" and Lufthansa is no longer big mom who can help out with a spare aircraft but has only a stake in the company and DE not on the long term program anyhow. Otherwise it is safe to say that DE would have been re-equipped with 332s or be in the process right now. In the old days, DE used LH equipment over the weekends when charter was in heavy demand.

The market has been changed with the LCCs. With today's costs on the one side and frevenue potential on the other,, having a spare aircraft is next to prohibitive. Consume rprotection legislation is not really consumer friendly either. People who have booked Condor insist on getting a Condor aircraft at the gate and demand compensation when that is not the case.

They have to understand that they can't get everythng, cheap fares as well as the airline they have booked as well as on time performance. As long as safety coms first, regardless what happens, delays are sometimes unavoidable.



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlinePlairbus From Germany, joined Feb 2008, 311 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 8103 times:

In the lasy few month Condor had a lot of problems, it is not the first time people have to stay an extra 24 to 48 hours here at cancun and Riviera maya to go home, and 3 month ago also a Condor 763 from Fra to Cun after departure had to fly back to Fra because an emergency with fire and loosing fuel. Condor is playing to high I think Every week they have delays from 4 up to 48 hours because the 763 broken up with something.
By the way the 763 from Condor are old and overused.


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7057 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 7943 times:



Quoting Plairbus (Reply 10):
By the way the 763 from Condor are old and overused.

They will get a new cabin and winglets so Condor is planning to keep them a little longer.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlinePlairbus From Germany, joined Feb 2008, 311 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 6953 times:

New info is that now they are coming with an empty plane to Cancun and bring some people home. But they still have not enough place for all passengers. MX people from Mexicana broke something on the plane when they put the part that Air Berlin brought from Germany to fix the first problem with the hydraulic. More than one passenger is buying tickets with other airlines to fly back, because they do not want to fly back with Condor. Anyway I think Condor is doing very bad.

User currently offlineHT From Germany, joined May 2005, 6525 posts, RR: 24
Reply 13, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 6546 times:



Quoting Plairbus (Reply 12):
Anyway I think Condor is doing very bad.

Do you mean "Doing business badly" or "andling this very situation badly" ?

Quoting Plairbus (Reply 12):
MX people from Mexicana broke something on the plane when they put the part that Air Berlin brought from Germany to fix the first problem with the hydraulic.

While it is not supposed to be that way, error can happen ...
-HT



Carpe diem ! Life is too short to waste your time ! Keep in mind, that today is the first day of the rest of your life !
User currently offlineAFGMEL From Australia, joined Jul 2007, 744 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks ago) and read 5906 times:

They should have leased another aircraft by now. I can smell a group civil action.


B 727-44/200 732/3/4/8/9 767-3 742/3/4, 772/3, A319/20/21 332/333 342/3 , DC3/4/10, F28/50/100, ATR72
User currently offlineThenoflyzone From Canada, joined Jan 2001, 2377 posts, RR: 12
Reply 15, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 5782 times:



Quoting Plairbus (Reply 10):
By the way the 763 from Condor are old and overused.

Condor has 9 B763s, with an average age of 15.6 years.
On 105 airlines operating the 763 aircraft type, Condor is #58 when it comes to fleet age.

Yes the planes are old, but they will hang around for quite a few more years to come.

Thenoflyzone



us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9159 posts, RR: 29
Reply 16, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 5746 times:



Quoting AFGMEL (Reply 14):

They should have leased another aircraft by now. I can smell a group civil action.

I don't. Each individual can claim against the airline or the tour operator, whereever he bought his ticket.

On a positive side, Condor is making money and they do that because they make good use of their fleet, especially the long distance 763s. These aircraft are flying to remote destinations and then things like that can happen, What choices do you have when you are stuck with 200++ passengers sitting in MEX and an inop a/c? At the end of the holiday seaspn when everyone wants to get home and eastbound flights are full?

DE has four weekly flights to CUN and if some of the passengers get an extra 2 or 4 days - all paid . where's the problem? Most don't have to start working before coming Monday anyhow.



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlineCwldude From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 691 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 5442 times:



Quoting Hestaman (Reply 3):
With all due respect... many of those people must return to their 'real' lives which include among other things work and family obligations that often do not afford the luxury of waiting 3 days

You might want to read on what I said instead of selectively quoting half of my sentences  Smile

Quoting Cwldude (Reply 2):
I'd rather an extra 3 days all expenses paid in Cancún than getting on a plane with a hydraulics problem!




Thomson Airways - The UKs premier charter airline // now flown : BY -AA -AJ -AE -AT; OO -AX -AU -RA -BG; BRIG; OBYD
User currently offlineHestaman From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 89 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5230 times:



Quoting Cwldude (Reply 17):
You might want to read on what I said instead of selectively quoting half of my sentences

I understand the point you were making and acknowledge that quoting a portion of a statement just to make a point is probably not the best way to make a point or win friends.  Smile I do agree that it is far better sitting in a resort in Cancun rather than on an airplane with hydraulic problems. However, I think you are missing the point I was trying to make - it is completely unacceptable to expect human beings in the 21st century to be dalayed 3 days anywhere. I would think it is the airlines responsibility to rebook those passengers on another carrier if unable to get them home after a reasonable time period has occurreed (24-48 hours)


User currently offlineHT From Germany, joined May 2005, 6525 posts, RR: 24
Reply 19, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5226 times:



Quoting Hestaman (Reply 18):
I would think it is the airlines responsibility to rebook those passengers on another carrier if unable to get them home after a reasonable time period has occurreed (24-48 hours)

Actually, many of the pax stranded at CUN could / should have turned to their tour operator, as this is the one they are having a contract with (and who got the money from the customers).
-HT



Carpe diem ! Life is too short to waste your time ! Keep in mind, that today is the first day of the rest of your life !
User currently offlinePanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5187 times:

Let me ask this: Which would cost Condor less - putting all those passengers into hotel rooms, or finding them (any) possible seats on other airlines? Or perhaps chartering a plane from another airline to get these people home.

While safety is the number one priority, the solution that is the cheapest is a close second. If it is costing less for the hotel rooms (and I can't imagine that'd be cheap at this time of year!) than chartering a plane, well, I'm afraid these people are stuck.

At least nobody is forced to sleep at the airport!!



Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9159 posts, RR: 29
Reply 21, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5173 times:

Simple asnwer, it costs the less to accomodate the passengers at CUN.

The other point is, where to charter an aicraft., It is not so that on Jan 4 or 5 in the peak christmas travel season 763s are readily available, when your onw sitting at CUN might get fixed within hours. The other point is, under German law, you might have to compensate the charter pax as well because he booked Condor and on his return flight "Condor" was not written on the aircraft People cometims get hysterical about stuff like that.

People don't understand that these things can happen and the ressources at holiday destinations are limited.

. .



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlineCwldude From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 691 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5138 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 21):

Exactly! Finances are short at the moment, and all Condor care about is the most cost-effective way for them to go about dealing with this situation.

We're now into day 5 anyway aren't we? Are the passengers still with you?

[Edited 2009-01-07 14:51:28]


Thomson Airways - The UKs premier charter airline // now flown : BY -AA -AJ -AE -AT; OO -AX -AU -RA -BG; BRIG; OBYD
User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9159 posts, RR: 29
Reply 23, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5002 times:



Quoting Cwldude (Reply 22):
We're now into day 5 anyway aren't we? Are the passengers still with you?

they've never been with me. They are back in Germany now. We had footage on TV last night with a guy yelling at a poor Mexsican check-in agent in German.

To say it with Monthy Python : Always look at the bright side of life, Brian and enjoy a day or two extra vacation.



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlineB707forever From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 459 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 4882 times:

A delay of that magnitude reminds me of the 70's and the typical 24-48 hour delays that happened during peak travel periods. Dan Air London got me JFK-LGW-JFK one summer when I was very young (13 travelling alone) for 5 hours on the way over and 36 hours on the way back.

I am a bit surprised they didn't protect people on scheduled flights since there are so many options from CUN (eg Miami, ORD, JFK, DFW, IAH) to connect to Germany.

So what type of compensation per European law will the passengers be entitled to?


25 PanHAM : Depends if they bought the ticket direct from DE online or if they bought a package tour, I think if oits a package tour it will be 5% per day of the
26 HT : & As it is not standard procedure to handle pax connecting international to international sterile at US-airports, everyone would have to go through f
27 PanHAM : All German passports are good for entry into the USA, in fact "for all countries", our government imposes no restrictions on us whatsoever. The US mi
28 HT : The one time I had the SSSS on my BP at SNA, I actually was faster through security than normal pax. Is there no longer the option to get a temporary
29 Gkirk : Not the worst of places to be stuck in
30 PanHAM : happened to me once in KUL that I lost (better mis-placed) my passport and the Embassy issued to temporary. I am not sufre if you can get into MEX wi
31 Robffm2 : And there might be some pax not holding a German passport; holding passports from countries for which the visa waiver does not apply.
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