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OAG: NW/DL MSP-PSC Added, IND Cuts  
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7194 posts, RR: 13
Posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 7773 times:

I only check one week in each month, so the dates are approximate.
OAG changes are usually not reflected in GDS until Monday.

ATL-BGR delayed seasonal start from April to June
IND-BDL ends after March
IND-FLL ends after April
IND-MCO ends after April

IND will have 45 NW/DL departures as of April, down from 61 last Summer.

FNT-MSP dropped for April and May then resumes
IAD-MEM starts 1x with a CRJ in April
MEM-ORF/RIC were due to resume in July, now eliminated from the schedule
MSP-IDA delayed seasonal start from April to June
MSP-MHT delayed seasonal start from April to June
MSP-PSC starts 1X in April

NW/CP PSC MSP E75 1210 1701 1234567
NW/CP MSP PSC E75 0930 1039 1234567

67 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRJNUT From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 1222 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 7715 times:

i just love these OAG previews! Keep up the good work!

User currently offlineWingnutMN From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 643 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 7688 times:

Does PSC recieve service from SLC? Because I am trying to figure out how XJ is going to bridge the new CR9 flying into SLC from MSP starting next month. So far all I could see is taking over MSP-SLC from Skywest. Anyways congrats to CP.

Wingnut



Any landing you can walk away from is a good landing! It's a bonus if you can fly the plane again!!
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7194 posts, RR: 13
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 7648 times:



Quoting RJNUT (Reply 1):
i just love these OAG previews! Keep up the good work!

I appreciate that.  Smile

I was taking a beating on another thread by people saying if it isn't on the airline's website yet I shouldn't be posting it because it's not "official" yet. I'm glad to see at least one person disagrees. It is the airlines that update OAG after all!!

Quoting WingnutMN (Reply 2):
Does PSC recieve service from SLC?

4 to 5 times per day with CRJ and CR9.


User currently offlineCOERJ145 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 7633 times:



Quoting Enilria (Thread starter):
IND-BDL ends after March
IND-FLL ends after April
IND-MCO ends after April

Sad. I thought these flights were doing well.

Quoting Enilria (Thread starter):
MSP-IDA delayed seasonal start from April to June
MSP-MHT delayed seasonal start from April to June

Arn't both of these year round?


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7603 times:



Quoting WingnutMN (Reply 2):
Does PSC recieve service from SLC?

Yes - 3x CRJ and 1x CRJ-900 daily. Used to be a mainline station until not too long ago.

Quoting Enilria (Reply 3):

I was taking a beating on another thread by people saying if it isn't on the airline's website yet I shouldn't be posting it because it's not "official" yet. I'm glad to see at least one person disagrees. It is the airlines that update OAG after all!!

Tough for those guys. The OAG is the public domain - it's not like you're going into an internal website. Anyone can access OAG, and if that's the case, it's public domain. End of story. I too appreciate these updates.


User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7194 posts, RR: 13
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7596 times:



Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 4):
Quoting Enilria (Thread starter):
MSP-IDA delayed seasonal start from April to June
MSP-MHT delayed seasonal start from April to June

Arn't both of these year round?

IDA: It didn't fly in Sep2008 and was schedule to operate throughout 2009 but now it is missing April and May and also shows as ending after October. So, it is more seasonal.

MSP-MHT has already stopped flying. It stopped after the Holidays. Last year it flew April to December. This year it is now selling Jun-Aug only.


User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7194 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7585 times:



Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 5):
Tough for those guys. The OAG is the public domain - it's not like you're going into an internal website. Anyone can access OAG, and if that's the case, it's public domain. End of story. I too appreciate these updates.

 checkmark  Thanks


User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4676 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7501 times:

Is BDL-MEM coming back?


Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7546 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7463 times:



Quoting Enilria (Thread starter):
IND-BDL ends after March
IND-FLL ends after April
IND-MCO ends after April



Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 4):
Sad. I thought these flights were doing well.

They were which is surprising they are dropping especially with DL's love affair with Florida.

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 4):
Arn't both of these year round?

Yes and no, they always take a break usually for a bit after the holidays.


Lets keep in mind that this could all change. DL/NW are still working out a combined complimenting schedule and as of this week they have not decided to put in a flight for some of these routes due to aircraft and such they are still waiting, they are just making small updates as they come along.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently onlineEMB170 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 649 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7443 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
Quoting Enilria (Thread starter):
IND-BDL ends after March
IND-FLL ends after April
IND-MCO ends after April



Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 4):
Sad. I thought these flights were doing well.

They were which is surprising they are dropping especially with DL's love affair with Florida.

The only thing I would guess would be that they're being cut as these were for the most part run on 50 seaters. If DL's goal is to reduce 50 seat flying, then it makes sense that places that get 50 seaters will see fewer flights. MCO was mainline for a time but it could also have been due to the fact that they were competing with FL and WN and yields were going down the tubes.



Can passenger jets fly as fast as my feet do? Let's find out...
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7194 posts, RR: 13
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7379 times:



Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 8):
Is BDL-MEM coming back?

I show it only operated in July 2008 and is dead.

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
They were which is surprising they are dropping especially with DL's love affair with Florida.

Don't forget DL's hatred of AirTran which will probably snap up the IND flying.

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
Lets keep in mind that this could all change. DL/NW are still working out a combined complimenting schedule and as of this week they have not decided to put in a flight for some of these routes due to aircraft and such they are still waiting, they are just making small updates as they come along.

True, they keep making changes; although the changes are primarily additional cuts. They have announced a capacity reduction for 2009 so these cuts would need to be replaced by different cuts if they were reversed.

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 4):
Sad. I thought these flights were doing well.

BDL-IND was iffy...
Jan08 Load Factor 50.60
Feb08 Load Factor 56.92
Mar08 Load Factor 61.10
Apr08 Load Factor 72.52
May08 Load Factor 72.93
Jun08 Load Factor 78.16
Jul08 Load Factor 76.30
Aug08 Load Factor 70.91
Sep08 Load Factor 61.31

MCO and FLL were both packed, but who knows whether the yield was what they wanted. On second thought, I guess we know it wasn't!


User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6608 posts, RR: 24
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7337 times:



Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 9):
They were which is surprising they are dropping especially with DL's love affair with Florida.

DL's love affair with Florida is long over. DL has little interest in protecting Florida markets except for those routes that feed into the hubs.

Quoting Enilria (Reply 11):
Don't forget DL's hatred of AirTran which will probably snap up the IND flying.

FL already flies IND-MCO/FLL.


User currently offlineJohnJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1659 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7329 times:

Another new flight is MEM-SRQ on a CRJ; however, it's a quickie as it starts March 2 and runs only until April 20.

And yes, thanks for posting these threads - good reading.


User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4676 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7314 times:



Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 12):
DL's love affair with Florida is long over. DL has little interest in protecting Florida markets except for those routes that feed into the hubs.

Or in the case of BDL, where they are sitting on the routes to keep FL/B6 out. FL can't do anything at BDL without going up against DL... unless they wanted to do BWI aginst WN (probably an easier flight!)



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7194 posts, RR: 13
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7308 times:



Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 12):
FL already flies IND-MCO/FLL.

I mean they will probably fill in the lost capacity.


User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2015 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7274 times:

Quoting WingnutMN (Reply 2):
Does PSC recieve service from SLC? Because I am trying to figure out how XJ is going to bridge the new CR9 flying into SLC from MSP starting next month. So far all I could see is taking over MSP-SLC from Skywest.

According to the last CR9 pilots I flew with, it will be COS. they said that's the tentative plan, MSP-COS-SLC and then continue the trip. Of course, with 5 aircraft worth of flying, there may have to be a second bridge point or some deadheading.

[Edited 2009-01-09 09:11:28]


Good goes around!
User currently offlineSimairlinenet From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 917 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7264 times:



Quoting Enilria (Thread starter):
MSP-PSC starts 1X in April

NW/CP PSC MSP E75 1210 1701 1234567
NW/CP MSP PSC E75 0930 1039 1234567

We had originally planned to start this in May 2008, but it was never announced and eventually scrapped. I'm surprised that there's a market for it.


User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12110 posts, RR: 48
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7240 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quick question where/what is PSC?


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2015 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7240 times:



Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 18):
Quick question where/what is PSC?

Pasco, WA



Good goes around!
User currently offlineTinpusher007 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7198 times:



Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 16):
Quoting WingnutMN (Reply 2):
Does PSC recieve service from SLC? Because I am trying to figure out how XJ is going to bridge the new CR9 flying into SLC from MSP starting next month. So far all I could see is taking over MSP-SLC from Skywest.

According to the last CR9 pilots I flew with, it will be COS. they said that's the tentative plan, MSP-COS-SLC and then continue the trip. Of course, with 5 aircraft worth of flying, there may have to be a second bridge point or some deadheading.

Basically it involves a bit of deadheading around the system. The planes will be based at SLC and the flight crews will be moved around to "pick up" the aircraft. One pairing from next month's DTW CR9 bid package involves a deadhead to DFW with an overnight there the first night, then next morning flying DFW-SLC as DL Connex then deadhead SLC-DEN for the overnight. Next day fly DEN-SLC-DFW with an overnight. The last day is DFW-SLC with a deadhead back to DTW after that.



"Flying isn't inherently dangerous...but very unforgiving of carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2461 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7125 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting Enilria (Reply 6):
IDA: It didn't fly in Sep2008

That was due to the main runway at IDA closed for reconstruction. Only other runway is 5000', so only QX served IDA in September.
I have also heard that 'they' want to replace NW A320s with E175 at BOI. Guess we'll see on that.

And as for market between MSP-PSC, I seriously doubt there is one, even with connections onward. Connecting thru SLC is more than adequate for DL/NW I believe. Add in UA/OO to DEN and I think the demand is more than met. But, maybe the loads from Pasco/Richland/Kennewick are astounding during these grand economic times!  Wink



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineStapleton From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 280 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7088 times:



Quoting MtnWest1979 (Reply 21):
That was due to the main runway at IDA closed for reconstruction. Only other runway is 5000', so only QX served IDA in September.
I have also heard that 'they' want to replace NW A320s with E175 at BOI. Guess we'll see on that.

And as for market between MSP-PSC, I seriously doubt there is one, even with connections onward. Connecting thru SLC is more than adequate for DL/NW I believe. Add in UA/OO to DEN and I think the demand is more than met. But, maybe the loads from Pasco/Richland/Kennewick are astounding during these grand economic times!

BOI goes to E175 and/or CRJ-900 beginning February 11 - April 5. The schedule beyond April 5 is currenly only a filler so we should know after the next schedule change what happens after April 5. (BIL also goes to E175 during this time frame)

You are probably right on the amount of "local" traffic between MSP and PSC but MSP has significantly more secondary cities served non-stop in the midwest and east than Denver or Salt Lake City so the number of one stop connections for PSC will nearly double with MSP.


User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6608 posts, RR: 24
Reply 23, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7075 times:



Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 14):
Or in the case of BDL, where they are sitting on the routes to keep FL/B6 out.

I don't think DL flies BDL-Florida to keep carriers out. It's one of the few relatively strong performers to Florida left in the DL network. However, I tend to believe that if FL or B6 were to launch BDL-Florida, DL would likely leave.

I think FL can make BDL work, if they want to. BDL-ATL is a large enough route to support two carriers, especially with the connections available at ATL. And the BDL-Florida market is large enough to support two carriers on routes like BDL-MCO...presuming that DL would drop these. I don't expect FL would even think of trying BDL-BWI, that would be suicide.


User currently offlineOcracoke From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 681 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7076 times:

Seems that DL (OH) is also starting LGA-TVC during the summertime. Two trips a day. So out of TVC, DL/NW will have MSP/DTW/LGA this summer.

Too bad about the MEM-ORF flight going away. With the number of ORF-CVG seats drastically slashed in the past few years (a couple of years ago...there wee 757s on the route..now just 50 seaters), ORF-MEM was a nice option to bypass the ATL hub when heading south/southwest.


25 Enilria : What is really surprising is that on the one hand they seem to be removing overflying of hubs as part of this consolidation. Yet, they add something
26 RwSEA : Actually, the PSC area has been booming over the last several years as the Hanford cleanup work continues. The areas is one of the fastest growing in
27 WorldTraveler : The OAG is not a public filing in the sense that anyone in the public can access it... but once an airline files to the OAG, they know full well they
28 FlyPNS1 : You might want to look at schedules again, but PIT and CMH do nothing more than feed into hubs....and IND is likely headed that way.
29 DeltAirlines : I disagree on this point - it is public because I can pay the $21.99 a month if I should please and have access to the OAG flight schedules. I am not
30 USFlyer MSP : PSC has wanted a flight to MSP for a while because it makes it much easier to get to DCA which is the #1 east coast destination from PSC. A very high
31 SNCntry32 : And that is what MSP is very good at, connecting west to east using RJ's or larger aircraft.
32 DeltaL1011man : I think he is also talking about the PIT-CDG flight but that is kind-of a hub.
33 KingAir200 : MQ used to fly LGA-TVC. I wonder if they still do, and if so, how this will work with two airlines in a market that can't be that big. Kinda, but I w
34 WA707atMSP : Dow Chemical is headquartered in Midland, Michigan. I'm sure much of the LGA-MBS traffic is either Dow employees, or people in New York with meetings
35 KingAir200 : Part of why the area is one big Superfund site, but that's neither here nor there. Anyway, MBS-LGA, just like the other Midwest-LGA routes, are marke
36 Cessna172RG : I read most of the thread here...will that Pasco service take away from all of the connecting passengers that fly on QX to Seattle to connect to North
37 WA707atMSP : There are a lot of golf courses in the TVC area - I believe the reason MQ added LGA-TVC was to make it easier for people in New York who owned second
38 RwSEA : Perhaps, but DL and UA serve the PSC market in addition to QX. I don't see why a double-connect on QX and NW would have been that much better of an o
39 KingAir200 : That was the reason. TVC is big money territory.
40 Lexy : Well, you still have BNA if you desire the bypass of ATL. Of course, it's on WN and it primarily takes you to the larger southwestern cities.
41 Web : MQ has not flown this route for quite some time and they only flew it with ER3s. DL with 2x daily CRJs is going to be overkill.
42 Rjnut : EVERY summer for almost 10years, including last summer!!
43 KingAir200 : Ok. I was wondering how long it had been. 100 seats per day does seem a bit on the high side, but that's just my opinion.
44 Ridgid727 : The main reason NW started the IDA-MSP service was government contracts through INEL (Idaho Nuclear Engineering Laboratory) for improved services to
45 SNCntry32 : And it is also subsidized by the federal bank IIRC
46 PSU.DTW.SCE : AUS could also become a potential bridge for the XJ CR9s in/out of SLC to the NW/DL East network. XJ also has maintenance there. As expected, IND is b
47 SkyguyB727 : The "O" in OAG stands for Official! OAG=Official Airline Guide
48 HeeseokKoo : Sorry if already posted or discussed: are seasonal IND-SEA/SFO gone for this summer? I'm trying to book reward travel to Korea, and SEA/SFO as well as
49 RampGuy : Why does DL still fly to Florida at all if they keep insisting they are losing money?
50 Cubsrule : They're loaded right now... NW301 IND 0900 SEA 1036 319 daily NW300 SEA 1220 IND 1920 319 daily NW504 IND 0800 SFO 0938 319 daily NW505 SFO 1055 IND
51 OOer : Pasco was served by a combination of DL 737-300 and CRJ200 and CRJ700 until 2005 I believe. It was like a boom in seats all of a sudden. Really weird,
52 FL787 : It looks like IND-SFO/SEA has been discontinued in the last few days. DL seems to not have any big plans for IND. Are they really going to keep all 10
53 Enilria : I just meant that MBS and TVC are fairly close together aren't they? After all they are both small cities with LGA flights on NW. I would think flyin
54 Sflaflight : It doesn't matter if it is a hub or not; NW has a shootload of loyal FF in IND that it is going to loose -same as MKE. That is why NW kept IND as a f
55 SNCntry32 : I dont get why IND MCO is being cut. I have worked these flights the past few days and every single time every seat has been taken. I dont know what t
56 DeltaL1011man : Yields are more than likely low. Most people going to MCO are not going pay alot of money which will cause yields to go down quickly. And I don't bel
57 Cubsrule : It's about 30 miles longer than CVG-AMS... probably too long.
58 SNCntry32 : Well still ashame none the less if NW/DL wants to protect the heartland to see MCO going away.
59 DeltaL1011man : it is sad but its not the first time. DL alone has said good bye to DFW,LAX,CMH,TPA,MCO,FLL so they do it pretty good.
60 MOBflyer : Further cuts: effective in April, TPA is getting the axe.
61 RampGuy : I didn't get a response before, so here goes again.
62 MUWarriors : No, they aren't very close at all. It's about 200 with no decent direct route. There is zero overlap between the two catchment areas. TVC's closest a
63 WorldTraveler : it is possible to make money to/from Florida but not on most point to point (PTP) non-hub routes. PTP routes require that the market be pretty large
64 DTWAGENT : I like having this information early. I go to "airline route update" web site for this information also. This information helps me with my travel agen
65 Sf3sce : Could we see ATL-SCE coming back?
66 Cmhsrq : PIT and BWI were just added from TPA.
67 MOBflyer : I meant from IND.
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