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The New Alitalia: Official Thread  
User currently offlineNycfly75 From Italy, joined Aug 2005, 759 posts, RR: 9
Posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 6554 times:

The ownership of Alitalia has officially transferred from the Italian Government to CAI. AZ is now a completely private company. Together with the 25% interest of Air France-KLM group and the takeover of Airone, Alitalia now has a new direction which will hopefully take it to the glory days it once held. Here's to a promising future of the new ALITALIA!

http://www.alitalia.com/

http://www.alitalia.com/US_EN/your_t...9.htm?WT.ac=HP_newAZ130109_419x285

Use this thread to share thoughts and opinions about the newly privatized Alitalia.

[Edited 2009-01-12 15:29:08]

43 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineXkorpyoh From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 819 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 6523 times:

I have been searching for the new route map.
Please post it if anybody has it.


User currently offlineNewAlitalia From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6491 times:

Thank you Ncyfly75 for this thread.

I want to thank CAI for the courage they showed and their industrial plan they presented today. I thank them for the huge investment of 1 bln euro that permits to Alitalia/Air One to merge.

Good luck NEW ALITALIA.

Siamo davvero il più grande e bel Paese del mondo.

[Edited 2009-01-12 15:55:06]

User currently offlinePRAirbus From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2005, 1139 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6433 times:

Let's hope they refresh the airline, the interiors of AZ fleet need and overhaul, the livery should be modified its latest revision was too bland, had no major modifications...too dated. The A330 would look very nice in AZ colors. Yesterday, I noticed (3) AZ M11Fs sitting idle at MIA near the hangars by NW36ST. I guess those M11Fs were probably returned to lessors; (2) had the modified livery they looked sharp on AZ colors. Is the "new AZ" getting rid of the cargo planes (M11s)?

User currently offlineWAC From United States of America, joined Nov 2008, 275 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6431 times:

here is the network map for the new AZ http://corporate.alitalia.it/en/group/thenetwork/index.htm

User currently offlineGaystudpilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 453 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6359 times:

What's really changed that will make the "New Alitalia" successful?

Did the complete former AZ leadership team leave? Did all of the bitter and misguided AZ employees leave?

What does AF believe that makes them think they will earn a respectable ROI on their investment?


User currently offlineNycfly75 From Italy, joined Aug 2005, 759 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 6264 times:



Quoting Gaystudpilot (Reply 5):
What's really changed that will make the "New Alitalia" successful?

Did the complete former AZ leadership team leave? Did all of the bitter and misguided AZ employees leave?

What does AF believe that makes them think they will earn a respectable ROI on their investment?

Alitalia is no longer owned by the Italian Government. It has a completely new management and ownership team in place. The new Alitalia ownership group has also purchased Airone and has merged it into the new Alitalia. Air France/KLM Group has also taken a 25% interest in the new company.


User currently offlinePRAirbus From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2005, 1139 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6230 times:

Is it serving less destinations now? The maps look "bare", not much going on...or is it my impression? Would AZ still be part of Skyteam?

User currently offlineNycfly75 From Italy, joined Aug 2005, 759 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6182 times:



Quoting PRAirbus (Reply 7):
it serving less destinations now? The maps look "bare", not much going on...or is it my impression? Would AZ still be part of Skyteam?

Yes it will stay with Skyteam, especially since, um, Air France owns 25% of Alitalia now.....


User currently offlineNycfly75 From Italy, joined Aug 2005, 759 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6183 times:

Alitalia's newly combined fleet...All will be repainted in AZ's livery in the coming months..

http://corporate.alitalia.com/en/group/fleet/index.htm


User currently offlinePlanenutz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 6054 times:

I understand the unions were protesting right up until the last minute before the official handover of ownership.

In the end, how many lay-offs/redundancies are there going to be? Are there any industrial actions planeed for the near future?


User currently offlineRicardoFG From Spain, joined Feb 2005, 677 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 6027 times:



Quoting Nycfly75 (Reply 9):
Alitalia's newly combined fleet...All will be repainted in AZ's livery in the coming months..

Do you have a source for this info?? Because I am hearing that the two airlines will remain separate. Nobody seems to know for sure though...


User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10898 posts, RR: 37
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 5997 times:

I hope the new Alitalia will be successful.

 airplane 

Molti auguri!

 airplane 



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineOldeuropean From Germany, joined May 2005, 2091 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 5987 times:

When will we see the next strike?  

I don't understand why AF is investing in that company. LH was wise to kept their hand off that nightmare.

Axel

[Edited 2009-01-13 00:10:30]

[Edited 2009-01-13 00:11:18]


Wer nichts weiss muss alles glauben
User currently offlineTW741 From Liechtenstein, joined Sep 2004, 478 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 5946 times:

buona fortuna e buon volo, Alitalia Nuova! champagne   champagne   champagne 

Sad to see AZ not returning to Switzerland and Austria according present planning.



TWA - we showed you how good we have been!
User currently offlineBWE320 From Germany, joined Aug 2007, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 5913 times:



Quoting TW741 (Reply 14):
Sad to see AZ not returning to Switzerland

According to their route map they serve Geneva from Rome.


User currently offlineNewAlitalia From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 5888 times:



Quoting Oldeuropean (Reply 13):
When will we see the next strike?

Ehm no. The contract each worker of the new AZ signed and before the Unions, it says that strikes are not tolerated for a period of at least 5 years. CAI otherwise wasn't going to invest to buy Alitalia and Air One.


User currently offlineOlympicATH From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2001, 292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 5835 times:



Quoting WAC (Reply 4):
here is the network map for the new AZ http://corporate.alitalia.it/en/grou...x.htm

I'm afraid this is the Alitalia transition network (not including Air One), which was planned before the privatisation process was completed. It's basically the Alitalia network for this winter.

I'm Greek so I can give you the examples of ATH and SKG. Until last year, Alitalia flew to ATH & SKG both from FCO & MXP (3x daily FCO-ATH, 3x daily FCO-MXP, 1x daily FCO-SKG, 1x daily MXP-SKG).
They dropped MXP-ATH and axed SKG altogether, which is what you see in the network WAC posted. However Air One jumped in and launched MXP-ATH (2x daily) and MXP-SKG(1x daily), which are now technically part of the new Alitalia network as well.
As if that weren't complicated enough, I checked alitalia.com and for the summer it shows:
4x daily FCO-ATH, all 4 with an AZ code but 1x daily is Air One-operated
3x daily FCO-SKG (??!!), AZ codes but Air One-operated
2x daily MXP-ATH, AP codes so I guess also Air One-operated

A bit confusing if you ask me...
Anyway, to sum up SKG is back (from FCO this time and with 3 daily flights, a little too much for a route that was axed a year ago, don't you think?) and so is MXP-ATH (though through Air One).


User currently offlineLIPZ From Austria, joined Jun 2006, 1075 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 5767 times:

Quoting OlympicATH (Reply 14):
As if that weren't complicated enough, I checked alitalia.com and for the summer it shows:
4x daily FCO-ATH, all 4 with an AZ code but 1x daily is Air One-operated
3x daily FCO-SKG (??!!), AZ codes but Air One-operated
2x daily MXP-ATH, AP codes so I guess also Air One-operated

1x daily NAP-ATH op by AP confirmed as well.

Quoting OlympicATH (Reply 17):
Anyway, to sum up SKG is back (from FCO this time and with 3 daily flights, a little too much for a route that was axed a year ago, don't you think?)

Well during the past summer FCO-SKG has been operated by AZ with 321, while MXP-SKG 1 daily with CR9. It's about the same offered capacity compared to 3 daily FCO-SKG with CR9.

[Edited 2009-01-13 02:10:44]

User currently offlineOlympicATH From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2001, 292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5637 times:



Quoting LIPZ (Reply 18):
1x daily NAP-ATH op by AP confirmed as well.

 checkmark  Absolutely, I forgot this one. Daily CR9 as well.

Quoting LIPZ (Reply 18):
Well during the past summer FCO-SKG has been operated by AZ with 321, while MXP-SKG 1 daily with CR9. It's about the same offered capacity compared to 3 daily FCO-SKG with CR9.

You're right. SKG used to see 1x daily MD8 each from FCO and MXP. Last summer AZ dropped MXP-SKG and upgraded FCO-SKG to a 321 and AP launched MXP-SKG on a CR9. Then this winter AZ axed SKG altogether.
My point was that SKG doesn't seem to be a very strong performer for AZ and that going from 0 to 3 daily FCO-SKG was a big step. Although the change in capacity is not huge, it's a lot of seats between Rome and Thessaloniki...
BTW, does anyone know if MXP-SKG is dead for good?

In general, is the new Alitalia going to keep focusing on FCO, or will MXP be developed as well now that Air One is in the picture?


User currently offlineNewAlitalia From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5620 times:



Quoting OlympicATH (Reply 19):
In general, is the new Alitalia going to keep focusing on FCO, or will MXP be developed as well now that Air One is in the picture?

Here it's very quickly translated the press conference of the AZ Chairman and AZ CEO at the press conference of yesterday:

The agreement made with Air France - Klm confirms "the strategic priorities of Malpensa". It was said by the Chairman of CAI, Roberto Colaninno, during a press conference in which he was announced the agreement with the Franco-Dutch group at the end of the bew AZ board meeting.

"It is confirmed the strategic priorities of Malpensa but it is necessary the reorganization of the airports system."

And, in this context, said Colaninno, "we plan to concentrate in Malpensa the intercontinental routes." Amsterdam, Paris and Milan Malpensa will be the "three major European hub 'of the partnership Air France-KLM-Alitalia. Between Alitalia and Air France it is the "commitment to focus in Malpensa the intercontinental routes and maximize the presence and profitability of routes to the Mediterranean, the Far East and South America from Fiumicino.

"Now - said Corrado Passera, managing director of Intesa Sanpaolo Bank - we all work together to make a big Malpensa. Passera said that Air France is the right choice for Alitalia. Air France, said Sabelli, compared with two other potential partners Lufthansa and British Airways, "has shown more determination and desire that others have not had."

Way Out.
Synergies for 720 million euros in the coming years. The agreement with Air France, said the new Chairman of AZ Colaninno, will lead to synergies of 720 million euros for the coming years. " The Board of Alitalia, said Colaninno, "today approved unanimously and with full satisfaction the agreement with Air France". There is a way-out in the contract: a clause of withdrawal under the assumption that at least 50% of the synergies were not achieved within 3 years.

It was fixed in 4 years the term of the lock up for the shareholders of the new Alitalia Mr Colaninno said. In practice, it was explained that there are shares of Category A (75% held by the group of Italian entrepreneurs) and Category B (in-hand of Air France-KLM). Until January 12 2013, the Class A shares will be sold only within the group of Italian entrepreneurs.

Colaninno has assured that Alitalia will have a "complete management autonomy" under this Agreement.

Air France will have no veto right. The chairman of CAI explained that Air France, according to the agreement, will appoint 3 members out of 19 in the Board of the New Alitalia and two out of nine in the Executive Committee. Also, the Franco-Dutch group will not have veto right, apart from exceptional cases such as the sale of the company or a capital increase without pre-emptive rights.

http://www.ilsole24ore.com/art/SoleO...d-efa358f1ae05&DocRulesView=Libero


User currently offlineNycfly75 From Italy, joined Aug 2005, 759 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5618 times:

All aircraft will be repainted in AZ's current newer livery. Right now its basically a situation like the DL/NW merger. The schedules will be better merged with the summer 09 schedule. Right now if you check on AZ timetable all Airone flights appear and an AZ flight may be on an ex-AP aircraft. FCO will be the new company's focus with Malpensa's flight numbers growing by the Summer schedule. I believe its been agreed to add 14 routes from MXP by summer, with a focus on business customers. Linate will become an airport for the FCO-MXP shuttle only. Best theing, the new AZ has zero debt from the old company.

User currently offlineGayStudPilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 453 posts, RR: 7
Reply 22, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 5365 times:



Quoting Nycfly75 (Reply 6):
Alitalia is no longer owned by the Italian Government. It has a completely new management and ownership team in place. The new Alitalia ownership group has also purchased Airone and has merged it into the new Alitalia. Air France/KLM Group has also taken a 25% interest in the new company.

While I believe there is money to be made in the Italian market, I seriously doubt the long-term success of this arrangement.


User currently offlineHumberside From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2005, 4920 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 5339 times:



Quoting Nycfly75 (Reply 21):
Linate will become an airport for the FCO-MXP shuttle only.

What will happen to all of AZ/AP's other LIN slots? Arent they just handing a huge opportunity to the likes of Meridiana, Air Italy, Easyjet, Lufthansa etc



Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7063 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 5318 times:

Get rid of the 737s and MD 80s (sadly) soon, as well as the Avros, leaving

CRJ900
E170
A32x
767
A330
B777

as the new fleet



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
25 Nycfly75 : Elaborate please...
26 *Niels* : Just presented on Dutch national news. KLM and Alitalia will form some sort of joint venture. This basically means a lot more connections from Italy t
27 Post contains links and images Oldeuropean : That sounds funny.   Because: http://www.airliners.de/news/artikelseite.php?articleid=17126 Rough translation: "The new Alitalia started on this Tue
28 SXDFC : Will any 737s appear in the AZ livery? as AZ never flew the 737! Glad to see Alitalia going in a brand new direction! As someone else stated I hope to
29 JoFMO : The new Alitalia started like the old Alitalia ended.... A bad sigh for the things to come. The new Aliatlia got rid of most burdens, but the biggest
30 GayStudPilot : I believe they will have labor problems in the future and the unions will try once again to strangle them. No different from other Italian unions. I
31 Hjulicher : Apparently they serve Seattle, Washington, but not Washington DC which is what they actually serve. Lots of airlines make geographical mistakes like t
32 MAH4546 : Alitalia does not fly to Washington, D.C.
33 Hjulicher : Wow, excuse me... I didn't know Seattle had AZ service. WOW! Disregard my post then.
34 BrightCedars : I'm glad this solution was found and now AZ has to fly on its own, without any safety net. For my part, I will stay away from it for some time before
35 Cws818 : They don't serve SEA on their own, nor do I believe they ever have.
36 MAH4546 : Seattle does not have Alitalia service either. Alitalia, in the U.S., serves just Boston, Chicago, Miami, New York and Newark. They did fly to Washin
37 777 : Yes, it does! AZ 628 FCO-ORD operated by Airone AZ 629 ORD-FCO operated by Airone
38 777 : You are right, it's a stupid error on the route map that made confusion between the State of Washington and Washington D.C.[Edited 2009-01-14 01:16:0
39 LIPZ : ORD stands for "O'hare Int'l Airport" in Chicago. AZ flew MXP-IAD between Apr 04 and Sep 06.
40 MAH4546 : No, it does not. ORD is Chicago.
41 NCB : Alitalia, congratulations for becoming... a feeder to AF/KLM. All important Italian cities will be connected with AMS and CDG. New Alitalia can forget
42 Art : The work culture may prove to be a fatal liability IMO. I agree that it is the thing that needs changing most. Unfortunately it is possibly the most
43 AlitaliaDC10 : AZ also had flights FCO-PHL on D10 and 742s in the late 70s. And yes they did serve DTW. DTW was meant to have been resumed as a daily 742 operation f
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