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Delta And ATL At Odds Over Arpt & Lease $$  
User currently offlineFFlyerWorld From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 335 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 10151 times:

Looks like potential hurdles to get new International Terminal and gates completed due to Delta and ATL not able to agree on costs and other related issues. Seems Delta has its hands full with issues now with MAC in MSP and now in its own hometown of ATL.
What next??

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met....html?cxntlid=homepage_tab_newstab

104 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFLALEFTY From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 477 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 10053 times:

Considering that DL has inherited a well-developed hub in MEM, the politicians in Atlanta should realize who has the upper hand in this argument.

User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4753 posts, RR: 45
Reply 2, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 10045 times:

This is nothing more than negotiations. ATL won't let DL leave and DL doesn't want to leave ATL.


Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineNASCARAirforce From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3184 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 10018 times:

Waiting for the rumors to start now that this merger took place so that Delta could move its HQ to DTW hehe

User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6636 posts, RR: 24
Reply 4, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 10005 times:



Quoting FLALEFTY (Reply 4):
Considering that DL has inherited a well-developed hub in MEM, the politicians in Atlanta should realize who has the upper hand in this argument.

Except that MEM has crappy O+D and can't support the international flights that ATL can. Unlike in other hubs, DL doesn't have the upper hand. DL's massive international operation can't be easily moved elsewhere and even a lot of the domestic traffic won't work in other hubs.

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 5):
ATL won't let DL leave

ATL already knows that DL won't and can't leave. I'm sure a deal will be reached, but DL can't dictate the terms.


User currently offlineJetJeanes From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1431 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 9924 times:

Heck mem is all Delta and Nwa with a gate for airtrans united and american, the rest is theirs.
Mem does have an Intl area but not the size of atl,s . with only 2 intl flights theres nomuch need for one .They have been doing a lot of work around
Mem. A tram was built years ago underground that went from terminal to terminal but was never used and has been sitting empty.I walked it years ago and it runs a pretty good way. the airports design still has expansion for the terminals on blueprints.I believe they can add up to 44 more gates before getting into any major terminal expansions.



i can see for 80 miles
User currently offlineFlypig687 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 56 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 9887 times:

ATL is a great airport in many respects and Delta know this. It seems that they do not want to move the international traffic out of ATL, but domestic is different. From the way i read the article it also seems that connecting pax will not be affected mostly ATL originating pax.

Overall this seems like just a pissing contest with both parties knowing they need each other but trying to flex their muscles to see who flinches first.


User currently offlineFFlyerWorld From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 335 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 9672 times:

Well possible more turbulence on the future horizon. I spoke with a pal of mine who works with SWA corporate planning and she claims that SWA is going to ATL to meet with city folks sometime in February. Maybe the city has other plans as backup to Delta's warnings! Time will tell! I believe there are a few (more than 8 or so) common use gates that SWA could utilize until/if /when they end up purchasing AirTran. Should be interesting negotiations with Shirley Franklin, ATL, Delta and now Southwest! Fasten Your Seatbelts!!!

User currently offlineFFlyerWorld From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 335 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 9661 times:

Mayor of Atlanta Shirley Franklin's comments today regarding Delta - ATL tiff....

http://www.ajc.com/search/content//m.../2009/01/18/franklin_delta_qa.html


User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 9601 times:

this is nothing more than negotiations between a company and its suppliers (and an airport is most definitely a suppier to an airline). There are people in Atlanta that want to build a shrine to themselves in the new int'l terminal (not terribly uncommon in gov't) and DL wants to make sure they are not uncompetitive with facilities costs.

This has nothing to do with the merger; it is a 30 year renegotiation of DL's lease - unless you believe DL had planned the NW merger 30 years ago.

DL has pumped an enormous amount of int'l growth into N. Georgia; as many people have pointed out, ATL is not geographically the most advantageous place to connect to most of the northern hemisphere but ATL works because it is a large, well run, and low cost. DL is simply making sure the city of Atlanta understands that those 3 things remain as cornerstones of how ATL is run.

See the following quote from the mayor:

Well, the question really is, can Atlanta and Georgia afford not to have a successful airport? I think the answer to that question is no. And then you back up to what is the relationship we need in order for both to flourish and prosper.


User currently offlineAirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 9454 times:



Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 13):
(and an airport is most definitely a suppier to an airline)

Personally I would primarily view an airline as a supplier to an airport, although it does work both ways.


User currently offlineRwSEA From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 3108 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 9400 times:



Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 7):
Except that MEM has crappy O+D and can't support the international flights that ATL can. Unlike in other hubs, DL doesn't have the upper hand. DL's massive international operation can't be easily moved elsewhere and even a lot of the domestic traffic won't work in other hubs.

I would agree with you that DL would never move their hub to MEM, but to be fair, ATL probably couldn't support more than 4-5 international destinations without all that feed either. LHR, CDG, FRA, AMS, and a few caribbean markets would be about it.


User currently offlineDALMD88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2572 posts, RR: 14
Reply 12, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9332 times:

Some of us here really jump to some outlandish conclusions. This isn't a threat by DL to pull up and move out of ATL. It does put into question the future growth by DL in ATL. Instead of putting more new international service into ATL it may go to JFK or DTW. The price of doing business in ATL is a major factor.

The entire new international terminal has been a mess from day one. I believe they have already spent as much as the project was expected to cost and there is very little to show for the years of work.


User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9555 posts, RR: 14
Reply 13, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9316 times:



Quoting FLALEFTY (Reply 1):
Considering that DL has inherited a well-developed hub in MEM, the politicians in Atlanta should realize who has the upper hand in this argument.

s**t DL moving Atlanta up to MEM would put them in BK so fast it wouldn't be funny. MEM has almost no O/D. Alot of markets would fail if they got moved to MEM.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 4):
ATL already knows that DL won't and can't leave. I'm sure a deal will be reached, but DL can't dictate the terms.

all this is is negotiations. Both sides are flexing. ATL will see nothing but growth.

Quoting DALMD88 (Reply 12):
The entire new international terminal has been a mess from day one. I believe they have already spent as much as the project was expected to cost and there is very little to show for the years of work.

Which is what Delta real problems are. They want and need more FIS gates but the city cant get its s**t together and get it done. The city says it can only cut 300M off the new term. and DL wants at least 400M and the city is talking about stopping the project.

fact is these are negotiations and we will have to see how it plays out. I will say this the city saying DL has to deal by the 23 is not smart. You don't piss off the hand that feeds you.

IMHO the faster the State takes over and gets all the dummys out of the airport the better.



yep.
User currently offlineAirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9218 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 13):
I will say this the city saying DL has to deal by the 23 is not smart. You don't piss off the hand that feeds you.

I must say I find the topic genuinely interesting so I was wondering if this isn't a bit of a contradiction though from you first paragraph. I mean, it's valid enough to say that DL is 'the hand that feeds ATL' but, then again, they can't exactly uproot and decide to move. Thus, surely would that not mean ATL would have somewhat of the upper hand in these negotiations......as I'm curious what exactly, at the end of the day, DL could really do about it?


User currently offlineSNCntry32 From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 1520 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 9197 times:

I can't wait to see what outlandish commitment DL makes to the state of Georgia in exchange for lower fees, tax breaks, and an updated terminal with new facilities.


Long Live Memphis!
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9555 posts, RR: 14
Reply 16, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 9066 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 14):
I must say I find the topic genuinely interesting so I was wondering if this isn't a bit of a contradiction though from you first paragraph. I mean, it's valid enough to say that DL is 'the hand that feeds ATL' but, then again, they can't exactly uproot and decide to move. Thus, surely would that not mean ATL would have somewhat of the upper hand in these negotiations......as I'm curious what exactly, at the end of the day, DL could really do about it?

Get up and move.......Just not to MEM.
Add more flights to JFK and DTW.
DL has many options but they will stay ATL
Like I said this is pretty much a pissing match over the new term. IMHO is about time DL has said something because the city is really f**king up with it. This thing should have been by 2007 and they aren't even close. DL has every right to complain about it.

Quoting SNCntry32 (Reply 15):
I can't wait to see what outlandish commitment DL makes to the state of Georgia in exchange for lower fees, tax breaks, and an updated terminal with new facilities.

DL is A) talking to the state at all. B) isn't asking for tax breaks or lower fees.
1) this is between Atlanta and Delta.
2) DL is pissed that the city can't get F done
3) not only is F 2-3 years late but its cost WAYYYYYY to much
4) DL needs gates and needed them last week.
5) DL is not happy about the SCG
6) the higher the cost for F the higher the landing fees will go, Something DL doesn't want.

DL and the City have been working together for a long time and this is not the first time it has happened. (I have seen the City and Delta get into it over a parking lot.  Yeah sure ) So don't worry just yet they will work it out. I do hope the State gets into it though. Maybe Sonny can kick the airport into gear.



yep.
User currently offline727forever From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 793 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 7442 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 14):
at the end of the day, DL could really do about it?

Spread the love all around the system. They now have hubs that would love to see the connecting service that ATL has and could provide immediate jobs from people wanting to work. I agree that the city of Atlanta needs to get its collective s*&t together and stop messing around. I mostly make fun of this "New Delta" business, but in this regard it is a different animal. This is no longer C.E. Woolmans Delta, these guys are shrude business men and if they can't get the deal they need from Atlanta, they'll take the business elsewhere. They have facilities in JFK, CVG, SLC, DTW, PDX, SEA, and LAX and MSP (when they aren't fighting with the airport boards there). This connecting traffic can connect through any of these cities, within geographic limitations. In my opinion Delta would be smarter to do this anyway. The customer service aspect of the ATL hub is seriously lacking and one bad weather day in ATL and the whole operation falls apart. Why not have your traffic connect through other places than ATL...

The saying has always been, "When a DL passenger dies, it don't matter whether they goin to heaven or hell, they's still gotsta connect thru ATLANTA!" This doesn't always have to be the case.



727forever
User currently offlineBrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4301 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 15 hours ago) and read 7186 times:

The title of this thread is somewhat misleading when you consider that they have not even begun serious negotiations. I am guessing its the press on a slow news day trying to get sensationalistic headlines.

Quoting FFlyerWorld (Reply 8):
Mayor of Atlanta Shirley Franklin's comments today regarding Delta - ATL tiff....

http://www.ajc.com/search/content//m....html

The above article seems to hold more facts then the one to kick off this thread.



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineSuseJ772 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 820 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 6760 times:

Presumably this should have been negotiated before the merger. The real question isn't ATL/MEM - but especially back then - ATL/DTW. Admittedly, ATL is a stronger hub - but taking DTW as the hub after the merge wouldn't have been that "far fetched" of an idea.

But now that the merge is essentially over, and DL has stated they intend to keep ATL as the main hub, they really lost their negotiation platform.



Currently at PIE, requesting FWA >> >>
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10511 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 6621 times:



Quoting SuseJ772 (Reply 20):
Presumably this should have been negotiated before the merger. The real question isn't ATL/MEM - but especially back then - ATL/DTW. Admittedly, ATL is a stronger hub - but taking DTW as the hub after the merge wouldn't have been that "far fetched" of an idea.

But now that the merge is essentially over, and DL has stated they intend to keep ATL as the main hub, they really lost their negotiation platform.

I don't think DL has ever intended to move the hub in ATL and I still don't think they do. The city of Atlanta has made a lot of hay from ATL being the worlds busiest airport and the largest hub in the world. They need to get their act together and work something out with the airline that made it all possible.



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12119 posts, RR: 49
Reply 21, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 6396 times:
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Also keep in mind there are other airlines that fly into and out of ATL. And ATL does not want to happen to it what has happened with say PIT, STL and CVG to name a few. It is a fine line these airports have to walk. On one hand you do want to please and wotk closely with you biggest customer, though on the other hand like Mom always said, "Don't put all your eggs into one basket" Dl ould very easily say hey DTW or MSP here we come, ATL then could also say don't let the jet bridge hit you in the ass on your way out. The bottom line, like being employeed we can all be replaced in the end, and don't you forget it.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10511 posts, RR: 14
Reply 22, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 6353 times:



Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 22):
Dl ould very easily say hey DTW or MSP here we come, ATL then could also say don't let the jet bridge hit you in the ass on your way out.

But, why would either party want to? Just doesn't make sense. Also, what other airline could or would want to fill that void left by DL?



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineNwaesc From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 6353 times:



Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 9):
(and an airport is most definitely a suppier to an airline).



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 10):
I would primarily view an airline as a supplier to an airport,

I always thought of it as being a symbiotic relationship...



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12119 posts, RR: 49
Reply 24, posted (5 years 9 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 6296 times:
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Quoting Mayor (Reply 23):
Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 22):
Dl ould very easily say hey DTW or MSP here we come, ATL then could also say don't let the jet bridge hit you in the ass on your way out.

But, why would either party want to? Just doesn't make sense. Also, what other airline could or would want to fill that void left by DL?

People use to say PA and TW would never be allowed to go under, yet they did and we survived. So what I am trying to say is neither side is Teflon coated. The bottom line is if you bluff the other side can call your bluff and then be ready to go forward or plan to have egg on your face and your credibility has gone down the crapper.

Also why does anyone need to fill the void? Higher fares will right the market.



You can cut the irony with a knife
25 Mayor : Oh, I don't know. Maybe it's because of what you said in this post......
26 Mir : Plenty of them. First, the obvious one: Airtran. Southwest would probably jump at the chance. And I'm sure JetBlue would love the opportunity to get
27 Luv2fly : My analogy was being employed we can all be replaced, doesn't mean we will be though, in the end we will survive. Sure it could and most likely will
28 Mayor : Long Beach??? Anyway, all of those three airlines together, still wouldn't fill the void. You're not thinking of the entire operation, which includes
29 TVNWZ : That is right. A lot higher fares would mean less people would travel, meaning fewer airplanes needed, meaning fewer gates, people, infrastructure, f
30 Mir : I specifically mentioned that the international traffic would have to find a new way of getting somewhere. Probably would involve a connection. But A
31 Srbmod : Actually, DL is holding all of the cards. DL hasn't shown their hand at all. They've been using the comments at the time the merger was announced tha
32 United1 : Realistically though how much of ATL can be moved to MEM? DL would have to spend quite a bit to build the facilities at MEM that they currently have
33 ASFlyer : MEM couldn't possibly absorb even 1/2 the traffic that ATL gets anytime soon. The facilities there aren't nearly big enough.
34 Post contains links Srbmod : Add AirTran into the mix now: Airlines threaten to move flights from Atlanta Of course, where the heck would FL route flights through? IND? MKE? BWI?
35 DeltaL1011man : Got to love the city. I hoped they had things turning around once they got 10/28 and new ATC tower done but..........guess not. The AJC is........wel
36 FFlyerWorld : Well as I noted earlier in the thread - SWA is VERY interested in potential flying in /out of ATL, not to mention a few others you included. The O/D
37 SNCntry32 : Right. So when fees rise, and DL dosent want to pay them, what are they going to do? Ask for a break. With some commitment. I would love to see some
38 DeltaL1011man : Whay are fees going to rise...........I'd say read the links before posting next time. DL/Atlanta haven't even really started talking about gate leas
39 FFlyerWorld : What makes you think that Delta wants the South Gate Complex to be built in the first place? My guess is that they would NEVER want that to occur as
40 SNCntry32 : Right. So when fees rise a little, and DL dosent want to pay them, what is going to happen?
41 AirNZ : Yes, I understand this of course but surely that would be one huge and dangerous step for DL to take, wouldn't it? Thus, and as I was asking, short o
42 FFlyerWorld : Very much agree and very informed remark. I, though, on the other hand, fly Delta exclusively and live in ATL so this is VERY important for me.
43 Post contains links FLALEFTY : http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123214812705491861.html It looks like the WSJ agrees with me (although DTW was mentioned as the alternative hub for As
44 Luv2fly : And CVG will soon be a think of the past as well.
45 FFlyerWorld : And you could add up all the "business travelers" flying Biz Elite from all the cities you mention combined (plus add another 10 or so) and will NEVE
46 Luv2fly : Now ATL airport knows what other airports charge so neither DL nor ATL are going into this blind.
47 Deltal1011man : I willing to bet they are........if SGC gets done its likely dL will get all of T-D. Sure FL will get some growth but so will Delta. If they get ever
48 FLALEFTY : Give me some solid DL ATL international O&D numbers to prove your point and I will gladly concede. But if you read the WSJ article, it mentions that
49 United1 : ATL "wins" because off all of the connecting traffic and because of its geographical location not because of its O&D numbers. Something like two-thir
50 FFlyerWorld : And so the answer for Delta is .... MEM , CVG or DTW?????? BIG Mistake!
51 United1 : None of those cities will work quite like ATL will simply because of the geographic location. However if DTW for instance was built up to ATLs level
52 FFlyerWorld : On average, 10% of ATL's total psgr traffic is International. In 2007, almost 9 million International travelers passed thru ATL. Just around 30% of t
53 N757kw : I don't think the City of Atlanta or the state of Georgia will let DL pick up most of its flights and HQ and move. If I remember correctly DL is the l
54 Post contains links JohnJ : The Memphis Business Journal's take on the matter: http://www.bizjournals.com/memphis/stories/2009/01/19/daily3.html
55 ItalianFlyer : EXACTLY!!! Remember allot of folks at 'new Delta' are 'old Northwest' and have played hardball with a political hornets nest before (MAC). This is re
56 WorldTraveler : an airport can produce a product that the consumer wants so it can not be a consumer company. Airlines produce products for the consumer and airports
57 FlyPNS1 : Exactly. DL would struggle (read: lose a lot of money) trying to replicate ATL at any other hub. The same is largely true for FL (though to a lesser
58 Mayor : Do you not think that ATL would struggle without DL and FL?
59 Luv2fly : Sure it would, though both airlines are full of themselves if they think that ATL airport would fail to continue with out them.
60 United1 : Isn't that the chicken and the egg argument? DL/FL need ATL and ATL needs DL/FL....While I'm sure they will come to some sort of agreement neither si
61 LAXdude1023 : The numbers ive seen put ATL's overall international O&D just shy of 20%. That is much lower than most hubs, but with good reason. The portfolio of i
62 WorldTraveler : Airlines have mobile factories - airplanes - so yes they do have the leverage to move the negotiations in their favor. The fact that FL jumped on the
63 LAXdude1023 : Absolutely. The city of Atlanta, the state of Georgia, and to some degree the deep south and parts of the South East rely on the partnership ATL and
64 Luv2fly : The airport and ATL are there for the citizens of the state not just DL. And when you place all your eggs in one basket let me just say CVG and PIT!
65 DeltaL1011man : right Delta owns all the buildings in the WHQ. (plus the Res center/TechOps/Midfield/Delta Tech) No the SGC will happen. DL needs gates FL needs gate
66 FFlyerWorld : Exactly the reason that Southwest will be arriving in ATL for initial discussions sometime in February. Timing seems kinda interesting considering th
67 United1 : While it is true that planes can be reallocated elsewhere, I don't think that gives DL much (if any of an edge) on these negotiations simply because
68 LAXdude1023 : Definately about the Facilities and DL's willingness to build a hub there. Not so much about metro population. Otherwise metros that are larger and h
69 FlyPNS1 : I'd argue that ATL has a bit more leverage because they know neither DL nor FL will leave. It's a threat with no teeth behind it. And if DL/FL were t
70 FFlyerWorld : ATL's International O&D demand is 30% of the TOTAL INTERNATIONAL TRAFFIC. Meaning of the 9 million International passengers that used ATL in 2007 - m
71 LAXdude1023 : When you include ATL's international carriers, perhaps. But I thought we were talking about Delta since the thread is about Delta and ATL.
72 FFlyerWorld : Yes - that is true. The foreign flag carriers are almost exclusively O&D.
73 AAflyguy : What I'm wondering is what time frame these cost increases @ ATL would take place over. It seems that none of the posters have mentioned the fact that
74 Mayor : But surely not at the level it does now. What other legacy carrier out there would want to try and fill the void, even partially? Would they want to
75 LAXdude1023 : True to a point. For BA and LH that would be more true than not. With AF, KL, and KE, there might be alot of connections on those flights since they
76 Luv2fly : Who says it has to, not everyone wants to connect through ATL.
77 Mayor : Well, I would think that even a bureaucrat could figure this out. If ATL wants to raise the per passenger rates up, would they not hope that the pass
78 AirNZ : Well, they essentially would be, wouldn't they considering they can't fly within the US? The same is technically true of almost every 'foreign' airli
79 JohnJ : Having transited ATL, MEM and DTW on a trip this week, I'm left with the feeling that ATL has simply reached the limit of what it can handle, new faci
80 PSU.DTW.SCE : 1500+ flights a day would be a huge fiasco. There is no need to pump that kind of volume through ATL, considering how much of that traffic could be r
81 Jetdeltamsy : Huh? What? Yea, right.
82 AAflyguy : DTW has a facility which was built to have capacity well beyond the current demand. Metro Detroit has a population only about 500K or so less than Met
83 WorldTraveler : DL does not need gates. They are moving more capacity to int'l flights; they don't need the number of gates they once had. And they are not gate cons
84 Surprise : DL needs gates, specifically international gates. In the middle of January, a traditionally slow time of the year flights are still being held out fo
85 Post contains links FlyPNS1 : DL still relies largely on ATL since most of its hubs can't profitably run the same flights that ATL runs. CVG/MEM/SLC are too small and would be dis
86 Briguyinhou : Yes, I wonder how ATL would loose? If Delta were to pull flights and "right size" ATL then all ATL has really lost is the right to connect a passenge
87 Sdexplorer00 : Does anyone know, both pre and post merger, what percentage of traffic each of delta's hubs carry?
88 United1 : I really hope for DLs sake that they don't enter into negotiations with that arrogant of an attitude. DL has little leverage in these negotiations DL
89 Mayor : You don't think ATL's largest tenant has at least a little pull? DL is what has made ATL what it is, no one else. Fact of life.
90 AirNZ : On what factual basis are you declaring that you personally know what both DL and FL will pay for gates, or anything for that matter concerning their
91 DeltaL1011man : Just said it could........when it was at 1300 it wasn't bad. (not great but not bad) plus it would give the city a reason for a 6th runway.........wh
92 WorldTraveler : while you may want to believe that the reality is that every analyst who has weighed in on the situation recognizes that DL IS in the driver's seat.
93 PlanesNTrains : For all intents and purposes, DL IS ATL. Delta could pull down 20% of their capacity (yes, I'm pulling that number ouf of my behind) and no one else
94 DeltaL1011man : Now this I agree on. IIRC the SGC doesn't have a price tag yet.............it is that far behind(Something was going to be done by 2011......) The Ci
95 Mayor : I was referring just to ATL. I know that it happens thruout the country. It was in response to this post from Luv2Fly in response to you. "Get over y
96 United1 : Care to provide a link (or several as you said EVERY) to back up that statement? Couldn't have written that statement any better if I had tried.....
97 Goaliemn : One thing noone has mentioned is MSP is planning on adding another concourse and a hotel. Plus, adding more international gates. Could this be used ag
98 Mayor : That's not MY quote. If you'll notice, I attributed it to Luv2Fly. It actually goes against what I was saying.
99 FlyASAGuy2005 : You know, I think this entire situation has been blown way out of proportion. These are two seperate entities whom rely on each other for mutual gain
100 Post contains links DL Widget Head : Here's a link... http://www.ajc.com/services/content/...tedition/2009/01/19/delta0119.html “I think Delta is in the driver’s seat,” Minneapolis
101 FlyPNS1 : These articles only go to show how clueless the media is. Let me repeat this again. DL CANNOT move most of its flights from ATL. They WILL NOT be pro
102 United787 : Sounds like problems in Delta la la land... Has Delta been ATLed?
103 LAXdude1023 : Yet some would be better at other hubs. PVG is a good example. I wouldnt be surprised to see DL move some (albeit not alot) international capacity to
104 DeltaL1011man : ummmm going 2x daily on DTW-PVG would be more than stupid........most eur. routes are better via JFK. and Latin AM better via ATL. Other than the one
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