Twinotter4ever From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 213 posts, RR: 0 Posted (4 years 4 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4179 times:
It seems that Honeywell has been able to extract information from the CVR and FDR of the NZ/XL plane. Seems there is some indication of possible control issues with the aircraft. Thing are still not clear. However it seems that they will not be able to simply leave the plane be on the seabed on this one. This investigation may take some time. It seems that the aircraft had a sudden increase in power and pitch and then the aircraft stalled and a wing dropped (stall induced?) then crashed into the sea in short order, all as they were preparing for landing with the control issues. Pilots were "screaming" according to the article on Flights web article, must have been pretty bad. Disturbing to say the least.
777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 11308 posts, RR: 17 Reply 1, posted (4 years 4 months 2 days ago) and read 4138 times:
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Cause of Airbus crash unlikely to be known for weeks
It is likely to be several more weeks before the cause of the fatal crash of an Air New Zealand Airbus A320 off the French coast seven weeks ago is known.
Five New Zealanders and two Germans died in the crash.
Air NZ chief executive Rob Fyfe said today he had spoken with chief prosecutor Jean-Pierre Dreno who made it clear the cause was not yet known.
"He made it quite clear to me that there are several more weeks of detailed analysis required before the investigating team has a clear idea of a likely cause," Mr Fyfe said.
Mr Fyfe was told investigators were clear on the flight path and knew power was applied to the engines, but did not know how or why.
TV3 last night reported Mr Dreno as saying the cockpit voice recorder revealed the pilots were having trouble controlling the plane. It then caught the scream of the pilot just before impact.
Zeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 7725 posts, RR: 73 Reply 2, posted (4 years 4 months 2 days ago) and read 4124 times:
Wonder if they had unsymmetrical flap/slat deployment ? Not uncommon to have power increase when flap is deployed due to the drag, and would explain the wing roll.
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NZ560 From New Zealand, joined May 2006, 240 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (4 years 4 months 2 days ago) and read 4101 times:
As has been posted in another thread, the flight carrying the victims is arriving in AKL tomorrow at 11:00am on NZ38. It will be unloaded of passengers then towed to the hanger for the NZ whanau to pay their respects. I will be heading to the airport tomorrow to watch the aircraft fly in and to pay my respects as it flys over head.
TwinOtter4Ever From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 213 posts, RR: 0 Reply 4, posted (4 years 4 months 2 days ago) and read 4072 times:
May be possibly some sort of elevator sticking or failure, that they were fighting causing a strong pitch up pitch up. Thought the aircraft are completely different, a recent Crj incident had the aircraft pitch up suddenly due to hyd fluid on a trim control box for the elevators. The old Alaska MD-80 incident near LAX comes to mind, as well as the Qantas A330 computer mismatch problem that cropped up recently. Maybe be an unlikely scenario, but computers may have compensated with engine power but unable to compensate....Airbus aircraft are supposed to protect from this kind of event. They had a very experienced group of people on this flight and it seems somewhat unlikely that crew error is involved, though not impossible.
As Zeke mentioned asymmetrical thrust may account for things as well. In any case it is all very strange after just finishing a maintenance check. I would hate to be the one responsible for a accidental omission on procedures. I hope they find the cause quickly, but carefully
TwinOtter4Ever From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 213 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (4 years 4 months 2 days ago) and read 4063 times:
Quoting NZ560 (Reply 3): As has been posted in another thread, the flight carrying the victims is arriving in AKL tomorrow at 11:00am on NZ38. It will be unloaded of passengers then towed to the hanger for the NZ whanau to pay their respects. I will be heading to the airport tomorrow to watch the aircraft fly in and to pay my respects as it flys over head.
Good of you to be there to pay your respects. Those of us that can't be there will have the crew and passengers in our thoughts.
NZ1 From New Zealand, joined May 2004, 2188 posts, RR: 27 Reply 6, posted (4 years 4 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 3684 times:
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Quoting NZ560 (Reply 3): As has been posted in another thread, the flight carrying the victims is arriving in AKL tomorrow at 11:00am on NZ38. It will be unloaded of passengers then towed to the hanger for the NZ whanau to pay their respects. I will be heading to the airport tomorrow to watch the aircraft fly in and to pay my respects as it flys over head.
I will also be there at the hangar for the private service. RIP
NZ560 From New Zealand, joined May 2006, 240 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (4 years 4 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3511 times:
Welcome home guys. Today there was a camera man filming the aircraft coming in and also another one up in the top viewing area filming the vehicle's and the area around the aircraft. Here's hoping that Murray White will also be home soon. RIP guys.
NZ560 From New Zealand, joined May 2006, 240 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (4 years 4 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3487 times:
As it was raining as the aircraft was on finals and it looked like they parked it on gate 7 does anyone know the rego of the aircraft? It the viewing area on the roadside there was a guy with a huge camera taking photo's so not sure if one will appear here in a few days.
Gonzalo From Chile, joined Aug 2005, 1671 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (4 years 4 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3391 times:
Quoting TwinOtter4Ever (Reply 4): As Zeke mentioned asymmetrical thrust may account for things as well
Zeke is talking about flap or slat asymmetry, not thrust asymmetry. Very different things with very different effects, a thrust asymmetry can be easily compensated with rudder ( i.e. when you lose one of the two engines ), but, when a flap or slat is stuck ( in any position ) without symmetry, your chances of a controlled flight are far, far less.... you have more "wing surface" on one side, and in jets of this size, you HAVE to roll in a spin, simple like that. Let's see what else the investigators can find in the next days / weeks. Is good to know the crew is back in home, R.I.P. now.
Twinotter4ever From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 213 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (4 years 4 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 3130 times:
Quoting Gonzalo (Reply 11): Zeke is talking about flap or slat asymmetry, not thrust asymmetry. Very different things with very different effects, a thrust asymmetry can be easily compensated with rudder ( i.e. when you lose one of the two engines ), but, when a flap or slat is stuck ( in any position ) without symmetry, your chances of a controlled flight are far, far less.... you have more "wing surface" on one side, and in jets of this size, you HAVE to roll in a spin, simple like that. Let's see what else the investigators can find in the next days / weeks. Is good to know the crew is back in home, R.I.P. now.
My apologies, that is what i meant to say, but I got typing asymmetric and I kept on typing thrust. Indeed he did say asymmetric flap deployment. We shall see what the investigation finds out.
TG992 From New Zealand, joined Jan 2001, 2910 posts, RR: 11 Reply 14, posted (4 years 3 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2563 times:
Airbus has issued an advisory to operators, including, in part:
It said during painting and maintenance it was important to protect all aerodynamic data sensors.
It has also said that tests such as low speed tests "must be performed at safe altitude and be preceded by a recall of basic rules as regards to minimum speeds and recovery actions".
(snip)
Mr Fyfe said it was important that Airbus had issued the statement.
However, it was also important the information was not taken as a prejudgment of the outcome of the official investigations, he said.
"As I have said previously, any speculation as to the outcome of that investigation into the flight operated by XL Airways of Germany would be premature and inappropriate." http://www.stuff.co.nz/4827673a11.html for the full report.
AirbusA370 From Germany, joined Dec 2008, 242 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (4 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2219 times:
Can a failure of an airspeed sensor due to paint particle ingestion cause this effect? I thought that there was some kind of redundancy in the A320 flight control systems. Or are we talking about multiple failures?
Quote: Mr Fyfe will travel to France with members of Mr White's family toward the end of next week to bring him home.
May I say a huge huge thank you to the French people who have put in many hours finding the bodies and parts of the aircraft. I will always remember the part your team played in this terrible accident.
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