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Air Jamaica Ends 40-year Miami Service  
User currently offlineNjdevilsin03 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 727 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 4631 times:

Haven't seen it posted yet...

http://www.miamiherald.com/103/story/877453.html

Air Jamaica is stopping its money-losing flights to Miami International Airport -- but will keep its Fort Lauderdale service.

The government-owned carrier will continue its service to Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport, where nearly four times as many of its South Florida passengers already fly, said Air Jamaica Chief Executive Bruce Nobles.

For the airline in South Florida, Fort Lauderdale is profitable, while Miami is ''losing money -- a lot,'' Nobles said.

''In Fort Lauderdale, we're the dominant carrier [to Jamaica] and the airports are 30 miles apart,'' he said. ''And the vast majority of our traffic are Jamaicans who live in both places and go back and forth.''

U.S. Census figures for 2000 show that 71,766 Jamaicans live in Broward, and 41,576 live in Miami-Dade.

Airport costs per passenger are also much lower in Fort Lauderdale -- $5.22 per passenger, versus $15.82 at MIA.

''[Air Jamaica have] been very successful operating here for 14 years and have been one of our oldest international carriers,'' said Steve Belleme, Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood's business development manager. ''So their chances are better of being profitable here because the costs are much lower.''


717, 727, 731, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 752, 753, 762, 763, 777, DC9, MD80, DC10, L1011, ERJ, CRJ, ATR, DH8, A300,
32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCaribbean484 From Trinidad and Tobago, joined Jan 2007, 2638 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 4678 times:

I suggest you look at the Jamaican Forum it was already reported there
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...eneral_aviation/read.main/4284532/



All ah we is one family
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32688 posts, RR: 72
Reply 2, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 4641 times:

They'll be back in better times. It's obviously a drastic measure aimed at saving an airline that might not be around by August.

They are also ending Atlanta and Los Angeles.

Air Jamaica has always offered a terrible schedule for business travellers, and Miami-Kingston has always been an important business route. Though with AA's convenient schedule that is timed to catered to business travellers, JM simply didn't get the customers they needed.

Plus, as mentioned, the Jamaican community is centered in Fort Lauderdale. Though it's likely 4x the size of what the census estimates are. FLL-KIN is a huge market. Even AA flies FLL-KIN.



a.
User currently offlineItalianFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1099 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 4637 times:

I did not know Nobles was at AJ now...interesting. I see that they are also hacking ATL & LAX too...and cutting the fleet from fifteen down to nine  Wow!

http://www.nationnews.com/story/293667121873048.php


User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8801 posts, RR: 5
Reply 4, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 4599 times:
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Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 2):
They'll be back in better times. It's obviously a drastic measure aimed at saving an airline that might not be around by August.

You're right on target as usual. They will have to return to MIA, for reasons that you are well aware of.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 2):
FLL-KIN is a huge market. Even AA flies FLL-KIN.

And AA's LF on the route is quite impressive.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32688 posts, RR: 72
Reply 5, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 4561 times:

The first backlash:

http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/edito...EDS_TO_EXPLAIN_MIAMI_ROUTE_CUT.asp

This cut is going to draw a lot of political and customer backlash from JM. It will be interesting to see if they are able to resist the pressure to reverse the decision. It will show their strength if they are able to resist.



a.
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8801 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4544 times:
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Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 5):
It will be interesting to see if they are able to resist the pressure to reverse the decision. It will show their strength if they are able to resist.

And the PNP political party will harp on it in Parliament; just like the sale of JM's Heathrow slots to VS.


User currently offlineCaribbean484 From Trinidad and Tobago, joined Jan 2007, 2638 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4514 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 5):
This cut is going to draw a lot of political and customer backlash from JM. It will be interesting to see if they are able to resist the pressure to reverse the decision. It will show their strength if they are able to resist

Well considering that they only carry about 6000 pax per month on the route compares to 24000 pax to FLL and the load factor never got above 40% to MIA I am not sure how much of a backlash they will get from this.
The amount of money JM lost on MIA is quite astounding and for such a short route,
You are right that JMs flighs are not good for business travellers, if they have to then they would have to add another flight in the evening and that would not be fair to tha airline at all as they would have futher looses on MIA.
The airline did try to make it work on all counts but looses stemed up and the divestment of the airline must take piority over all other things.



All ah we is one family
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32688 posts, RR: 72
Reply 8, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4487 times:



Quoting Caribbean484 (Reply 7):
if they have to then they would have to add another flight in the evening and that would not be fair to tha airline at all as they would have futher looses on MIA.

That is not entirely true.

While it is possible loses would grow absent a rise in traffic, offering double-daily MIA-KIN with convenient morning and evening departures runs the possibility of making it more attractive to business and last-minute travellers, increasing traffic on the route and the spreading the fixed costs of the station.



a.
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8801 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4480 times:
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Quoting Caribbean484 (Reply 7):
Well considering that they only carry about 6000 pax per month on the route compares to 24000 pax to FLL and the load factor never got above 40% to MIA I am not sure how much of a backlash they will get from this.

This will also cause a stir with some business leaders in Jamaica, and possibly some politicians as well who travel to MIA only on JM. Also, if Jamaica wants to position itself as a financial leader in the Western Caribbean in the future, service to MIA will recommence. Especially if the new investors want to develop KIN into a true hub.


User currently offlineCaribbean484 From Trinidad and Tobago, joined Jan 2007, 2638 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4453 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 8):
offering double-daily MIA-KIN with convenient morning and evening departures runs the possibility of making it more attractive to business and last-minute travellers, increasing traffic on the route and the spreading the fixed costs of the station.

While the logic is true, JM did this same thing about 2 years ago when the new Chariman took over. They had a flight at 7am to MIA and another evening flight and it never worked.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 9):
This will also cause a stir with some business leaders in Jamaica, and possibly some politicians as well who travel to MIA only on JM. Also, if Jamaica wants to position itself as a financial leader in the Western Caribbean in the future, service to MIA will recommence. Especially if the new investors want to develop KIN into a true hub.

Well these are the same people that paid AA subsidies to fly to Jamaica. But that is besides the point, yes it is sad to see MIA go and one day they would restart MIA as they have to have a clear vision for what the new owners of JM wants.



All ah we is one family
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8801 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4434 times:
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Quoting Caribbean484 (Reply 10):
Well these are the same people that paid AA subsidies to fly to Jamaica. But that is besides the point, yes it is sad to see MIA go and one day they would restart MIA as they have to have a clear vision for what the new owners of JM wants.

Yes, but only to MBJ. Hopefully JM will be able to find investors who really value the potential that KIN has in becoming a true hub geared towards the business traveler. They will be back at MIA in the future.


User currently offlineAA1818 From Trinidad and Tobago, joined Feb 2006, 3432 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 4305 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 2):
They are also ending Atlanta and Los Angeles.

...and GCM.

AA1818



“The moment you doubt whether you can fly, you cease for ever to be able to do it.” J.M. Barrie (Peter Pan)
User currently offlinePar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7115 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4188 times:



Quoting SCL767 (Reply 4):
You're right on target as usual. They will have to return to MIA, for reasons that you are well aware of.

Hearing a lot of reasons some of which they already tried - schedules - but very few on the main point, will it be profitable?
FLL is close, guess the problem the airline made was to have service to both airports, when one compares the cost and the proximity of the airports, for a small international carrier operating into the US, how sound is the rational for flying into both airports? Do they fly into EWR and JFK, closest comparison within their route structure that I can think of.


User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8801 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4154 times:
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Quoting Par13del (Reply 13):
Hearing a lot of reasons some of which they already tried - schedules - but very few on the main point, will it be profitable?

That depends if JM's potential new investors want to develop a hub at KIN in the future. While FLL gets mostly VFR, MIA can potentially pick up business passengers, and connections too; if KIN were to become a hub in the future. However, that is up to JM's potential new investors to decide on.

Quoting Par13del (Reply 13):
how sound is the rational for flying into both airports?

A bit similar as to why UP flies into both FLL and MIA.


User currently offlineGlobalflyer From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 926 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4079 times:

Yet another airline bites the dust into ATL! We are down to only 15 passenger airlines with the withdrawal of JM. I am wondering if there is more of a variety in Cargo carriers thatn pax carriers now? Sure wish ATL would get more carriers.


Landing on every Continent almost on an annual basis!
User currently offlinePar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7115 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 3999 times:



Quoting SCL767 (Reply 14):
A bit similar as to why UP flies into both FLL and MIA.

Except when one looks at the distance involved, it is somewhat different. Also UP has suspensed its FLL service on a few occasions, and only recently re-instituted jet service.

AA via Eagle also increased their service to FLL a year or so ago and they have now virtually terminated NAS-FLL, even if cheaper to operate into FLL, they like most airlines want to "force" customers into their market, hence my question of the rational of operating to both FLL and MIA, if JM wants or wanted to develop MIA-KIN. If they just want to maintain a South Florida link, then FLL is the way to go.

They have tried numerous schedule changes for the MIA-KIN flights, if business travellers did not like their schedules, my believe is that we are not talking about local as in South Florida business, but those connecting in MIA fro other states, in which case, they will use their first airline if they offer service or their code share partner, can't recall if JM ever had tie in's with AA.


Cheers


User currently offlineAA1818 From Trinidad and Tobago, joined Feb 2006, 3432 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3899 times:



Quoting Par13del (Reply 13):
Do they fly into EWR and JFK, closest comparison within their route structure that I can think of.

JM dropped EWR didn't they?

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 14):
A bit similar as to why UP flies into both FLL and MIA.

...also Caribbean Airlines serves bth successfully.

AA1818



“The moment you doubt whether you can fly, you cease for ever to be able to do it.” J.M. Barrie (Peter Pan)
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8801 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3790 times:
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Quoting Par13del (Reply 16):
the rational of operating to both FLL and MIA

So AA will soon have the monopoly on the MIA-KIN route. JM's code-share relationship with VS to LHR will terminate. This will cause political problems, and to some of JM's customers, it will appear as if JM has once again abandoned them only to AA's benefit . And it doesn't appear that VS will increase frequency to MBJ as well. So who benefits from JM's withdrawal from MIA?

Quoting AA1818 (Reply 17):
JM dropped EWR didn't they?

Yes, they dropped EWR. However CO still flies to MBJ out of EWR. Also, surprisingly DL will operate ATL-KIN daily soon. I wouldn't be surprised if DL tried to penetrate the JFK-KIN market soon.


User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17412 posts, RR: 46
Reply 19, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3789 times:

Their MIA flights have consistently run in the 40s, and being JM, they probably lost $2 for every $1 in revenue.

Quoting Caribbean484 (Reply 1):
I suggest you look at the Jamaican Forum it was already reported there

As much as I want to wade through Jamaican minutiae, I'll pass.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 9):
This will also cause a stir with some business leaders in Jamaica, and possibly some politicians as well who travel to MIA only on JM.

The damn lovebird just needs to die. If the politicians are annoyed, let the money come out of their pockets.

Quoting AA1818 (Reply 12):
...and GCM.

as well as BGI and GND



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8801 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3765 times:
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Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 19):
as well as BGI and GND

According to JM, they still plan on operating JFK-BGI-JFK and JFK-GND-JFK. However, Air Jamaica will discontinue service between Jamaica and both GND and BGI.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32688 posts, RR: 72
Reply 21, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 3616 times:



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 19):
Their MIA flights have consistently run in the 40s, and being JM, they probably lost $2 for every $1 in revenue.

Only a few years ago, however, the break-even on the MIA flights was 45%. Cargo drove these flights, and JM will continue to fly cargo flights to MIA.



a.
User currently offlinePar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7115 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3368 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21):
Cargo drove these flights, and JM will continue to fly cargo flights to MIA.

Interesting, I guess a re-work of my original question would be, what would happen if they drop FLL and only fly to MIA, if this is all about loosing money, can running pax to FLL and cargo to MIA be economical and profitable? Both flights on their own may make money, but could they not be combined, would JM pax who now use FLL be adverse to toughing it out via MIA to get home? Most in the Caribbean are not used to having many choices for international travel.


User currently offlineMCO2BRS From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2007, 539 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 3092 times:

Wouldn't JM be better off reducing capacity and/or frequency as opposed to completely axing MIA all together? Or is this something they have already done, and have decided this still isn't working?

Cheers,

MCO-2-BRS


User currently offlineTrintocan From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2000, 3237 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (5 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 3050 times:

Ouch! This is a drastic set of cuts. JM losing MIA - that's major because after all MIA has traditionally been seen as the US gateway to Latin America and the Caribbean. FLL does not even come close. At MIA connections to many other destinations in the US and elsewhere are easily available. I do not know what sort of scheduled times they flew to MIA - could anybody fill me in on this?

All the same MIA is a significant loss. Even if the Jamaican community in South Florida lives closer to FLL and the flights operate from there it is another feather out of JM's cap. One wonders why the large business sector in Jamaica with links to the US could not make MIA, the business hub of Florida, work. With this and the loss of the VS codeshare to LHR I am afraid that JM is actually playing into AA's hands - AA will have the MIA - KIN and MBJ markets to itself and will probably gain even more market share to LHR than it has already.

LAX and ATL I do not consider to be as significant losses to JM as LAX is certainly a smaller market for them (and yet again AA will snap that market up) while ATL will have DL to look after it.

GCM - why is it that JM cannot work it while KX can?

Finally. it would appear that BGI and GND would be served by planes doing W patterns - eg MBJ - JFK - BGI - JFK - BGI. The Jamaica market from the Eastern Caribbean has never been very large and BW's daily services to KIN have always cornered that market.

Sadly, it looks like very rough times for JM. All the best to them as they restructure.

TrinToCan.



Hop to it, fly for life!
25 MAH4546 : Fort Lauderdale has the world's largest Jamaican ex-pat community. Miramar, Florida is essentially "Little Kingston." If JM were to drop FLL, then th
26 MaverickM11 : I'm not so sure. There's precious little in the JM system that actually works and pays for itself. It will all depend on how much the government is w
27 Babybus : Dropping MIA (and all the other American destinations) seems a bit drastic. Surely they could have reduced services to once or twice a week and increa
28 Anetter123 : Wonder if AA will now add more capacity with JM out of MIA?
29 Captaink : Not a bad idea you have, but one small problem. JM is reducing their fleet to nine busses. So, 9 birds to stretch between, FLL, JFK, YYZ, PHL, BWI, G
30 AirJamaica : ORD will remain. My predictions where axing is concerned were LAX, GCM & ORD. Although DL is king at ATL with their multiple frequencies into MBJ I w
31 AA1818 : AA now have the ability to make good profits ex MIA with the reduced (not elimination because FLL is so close) competition. They will be able to char
32 OB1504 : Who operates JM's cargo flights?
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