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Nigeria: FG Threatens To Sanction BA & Delta  
User currently offlineB747-4U3 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2002, 988 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7406 times:

Had a good chuckle over this today!

"Both British Airways (BA) and Delta Airlines risk sanction by the Federal Government for maltreating Nigerian passengers, if the word of Aviation Minister, Babatunde Omotoba, is anything to go by.

He disclosed on Tuesday that both BA and Delta Airlines treat Nigerian passengers in violation of the rules of the International Civil Aviation Organisation (ICAO)."

"Omotoba said the Nigerian Civil Aviation Authority (NCAA) has concluded plans to summon Delta Airlines for allegedly using "scrappy" aircraft on the Nigerian route, adding that BA is also guilty of the practice."

Full story at:

http://allafrica.com/stories/200902040109.html

33 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineKhobar From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2379 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7376 times:

Scrappy? They like to fight?

Or is he trying to imply they are ready for the scrap heap?

Or is he trying to say they are not that bad, just crappy?

The guy obviously doesn't get out much - I dare say there are a lot of planes not used for Nigeria that would also qualify.


User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7210 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7366 times:

When is the next election. This sounds like blatent playing to the gallery.

Is he saying that all Nigerian airlines have newer/better aircraft.

My understanding is that many airliners in Nigeria, apart from Arik are far from new.


User currently offlineTonystan From Ireland, joined Jan 2006, 1394 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 7311 times:

Nigeria really needs to sort itself out!

Seems everytime the government backs a new local airline they throw daft accusations at the stable foreign airlines who are driving the real economy in that corrupt nation!



My views are my own and do not reflect any other person or organisation.
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26508 posts, RR: 58
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 7287 times:



Quoting B747-4U3 (Thread starter):
Had a good chuckle over this today!

LOL... Me also you have to laugh.

Quoting B747-4U3 (Thread starter):
"Both British Airways (BA) and Delta Airlines risk sanction by the Federal Government for maltreating Nigerian passengers, if the word of Aviation Minister, Babatunde Omotoba, is anything to go by.

He disclosed on Tuesday that both BA and Delta Airlines treat Nigerian passengers in violation of the rules of the International Civil Aviation Organisation (ICAO)."

Its all gone down hill since BA stopped giving out the free amenity kits with a ''do it yourself'' credit card fraud kit. And how to ''spam wth Hotmail'' free CD.



AEGEAN-OLYMPIC AIR - ΟΛΥΜΠΙΑΚΗ " μέλος στη Star Alliance
User currently offlineC767P From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 879 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6928 times:

Wow, I would think the Nigerian Aviation Minister needs to get his priorities in order. Would he rather not have air service to the destinations provided by both BA and DL? "Scrappy" aircraft? Both the Boeing 747-400 and 767-300 are fine aircraft and perfectly suitable for serving the route. The Boeing 767-300ER serves as the backbone of Delta's international fleet, the 777 is needed for routes of higher range and demand. I would want as much air service as airlines are willing to provide to my country/state/city since I think it is only logical that increased competition will always leave me with the upper hand and a more satisfied customer.

User currently offlinePGNCS From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 2757 posts, RR: 45
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6893 times:

Surely it would be an enormous help to Nigeria if BA and DL simply stopped all service there.

User currently offlineNaijaflyer From Nigeria, joined Jun 2006, 21 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 6777 times:



Quoting C767P (Reply 7):

Exactly my point. Its just unfortunate that in Nigeria, most aviation ministers are not professionals in that field. Its usually a form of political patronage and they end up being influenced by a bunch of aides/'technical assistants' who IMHO should have been flushed out long ago with their vested interests. It is agreed that the 763 is DL's dominant aircraft, but when the cargo on the LOS route is factored in, then its not remotely adequate, taking the range into account as well (There's a thread titled DL summoned for leaving LOS pax bags or something like that, which dwelt on the payload issue extensively). Methinks the minister could have appealed for a larger aircraft i.e the 772 instead of trying to talk tough. As for the 744, I believe that BA is well within its rights to make use of it considering the cargo, pax (especially premium) and range on the route. It was obvious that the minister was misinformed by accusing BA of using a 747-200 on that route.
As for suggesting that BA and DL should stop/suspend their service... that's definitely not going to happen unless there's a diplomatic row like when the then military government banned British registered aircraft from flying to Nigeria in 97, and KL/AF/LH made a killing for the 2 years the ban was in place. Those of us loyal BA customers had to fly to ACC and board the BA flight to LGW from there.


User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8092 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 6722 times:
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Boy where is Nigeria Airways when you need them. The minister may like their "scrappy" planes better.

User currently offlineBrainwashed From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2008, 7 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 6671 times:



Quoting Naijaflyer (Reply 5):

Like it or not, the comments attributed to the Nigerian minister are utterly disgraceful. Even if they just pandering to the electorate, they unfortunately speak volumes about the individual concerned and shows a very immature (democratic) political system.

You may try and dismiss peoples' concerns about corruption in Nigeria and elsewhere in Africa as a western prejudice and, hell, what would we know given that 99% of us have never been to Nigeria. But you truly are deluded if you and try and convince everyone that business in Nigeria is now whiter than white. The situation may be improving, but it has a long way to go before the culture of bribery is eliminated from society (this is speaking as someone who had to hand over $60 to a cop in Pemba, Mozambique simply for being in the wrong place, at the wrong time - asshole!). Wasn't there a contestant on Nigeria's version of 'Dragons Den' who factored in 'exceptional payments' into his business plan?!?

Either way, these comments go to show that cost and risk involved in Nigeria is high. If Arik are Nigeria's #1 in 5 years, I'll quite happily drink a barrell of oil. The chances are that another company will be lining the minister's palm with silver and all of a sudden see the domestic competition stifled and grab a few slots at LHR.


User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12090 posts, RR: 50
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 6671 times:

Maybe both BA and DL failed to upgrade said Minister, wife, flunky and or other individual of limited importance.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineSsublyme From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 515 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 6648 times:

Why do such threads always end up about how corrupt Nigeria and Africa is?

Why not just stick to the ridiculous comment made by the minister?


User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12090 posts, RR: 50
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 6642 times:



Quoting Ssublyme (Reply 13):
Why do such threads always end up about how corrupt Nigeria and Africa is?

Why not just stick to the ridiculous comment made by the minister?

Don't they end up going hand in hand?



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineCityofAthens From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 6607 times:

Things work differently in Africa - always have and always will; no one , especially no one from outside is going to change that. Things will change from within, at their own pace.

I agree to some extent that the comments made were a bit strange (quite amusing too, at least to me Big grin ).

Politics is a game, that's my own belief; in that sense, Nigeria is no different to any other nation. Corruption is alive and well everywhere; I guess in Nigeria it's more acceptable (perhaps because exchanges of gifts or what have you have been a feature of life there for 100s of years) and a little bet less sophisticated than in the West.  Wink

I'm not saying it's right, and I'm not acting as an apologist for the minister .... at the end of the day, it (corruption) exists - it's something we have to live with whilst we try to battle it. I think DL and BA probably understand this, or they wouldn't bother with the hassle.

Money talks. And there's lots of money at stake here.


User currently offlineSsublyme From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 515 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 6570 times:



Quoting CityofAthens (Reply 15):
Politics is a game, that's my own belief; in that sense, Nigeria is no different to any other nation. Corruption is alive and well everywhere; I guess in Nigeria it's more acceptable (perhaps because exchanges of gifts or what have you have been a feature of life there for 100s of years) and a little bet less sophisticated than in the West.

Exactly, maybe one day Nigeria will get to the stage where it's called fancy names like lobbying or accepting $100k to remodel a kitchen etc. Its everywhere, as you stated, it just gets tiring everytime a thread on Nigerian aviation comes up, the thread ends up about how corrupt the country/continent is. *shrug*


User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12090 posts, RR: 50
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6500 times:



Quoting Skyhigh (Reply 17):
Aren't Delta using one of their 777's?

I thought the 777 was a substitution and not a regular occurrence. I believe most of the time DL uses a 767 on the route.



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineYVRLTN From Canada, joined Oct 2006, 2347 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6473 times:

Of course, is it a surprise the homegrown competition Arik Air uses lovely brand new A345's which are not at all scrappy? Once they fly to AMS, KL will be scrappy too.


Follow me on twitter for YVR movements @vernonYVR
User currently offlineNaijaflyer From Nigeria, joined Jun 2006, 21 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 5376 times:



Quoting Ssublyme (Reply 14):

I agree with the above posts and as I pointed out earlier, the minister's comment was misinformed and he could have discussed bilaterally with BA over the emergency landing at KAN (which as I pointed out in my deleted commment, is a regular aviation occurrence i.e. aircraft having to land elsewhere because a fault was discovered) instead of playing to the gallery. The issue of DL's equipment has been overflogged so there's no point going back on that. A simple discussion with them on the way forward would have sufficed.
BTW, I never claimed that doing business in Nigeria now is 'whiter than white'. Granted, there are issues which as we all know are pertinent to any emerging country but these are not restricted to us as recent events globally have proven. Frankly speaking, these comments get pretty tiring.


User currently offlineBlueShamu330s From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 2789 posts, RR: 25
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 5056 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 8):
Boy where is Nigeria Airways when you need them.

Not looking too "shabby."  Wink


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Photo © Ken Iwelumo - Global Aviation Images




So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
User currently offlineBeeweel15 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1719 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 4668 times:



Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 8):
Boy where is Nigeria Airways when you need them. The minister may like their "scrappy" planes better.

Well lets talk about scrappy aircraft . After dealing with them for several years. I remember their DC10 5N-ANN Annie as we called her was a faithful aircraft but many times had to be flown with out auto pilot many times between LOS and JFK. Loading systems broke and had to be loaded manually. Imagine pushing a 5000lb pallet into position. Lav systems down, Emergency slides inop which resulted in a number of seats being blocked for several flights etc.


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They also sent a B707-320F once with no autopilot , Pilots seats wired to the floor etc.


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Look at these old birds flying over there and they want to complain about BA & DL


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User currently offlineGilesdavies From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2986 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4396 times:

This whole situation is laughable!

Could this be anything to do with Arik AIr now operating these routes..?

Maybe Nigeria is getting a little big headed, now they have Arik Airlines flying their posh new A340-500's with fancy seating and service to LHR and JFK, the government expects all other airlines to offer passengers a similar level of comfort and brand new aircraft!

Im sure Nigeria will be the first to moan if DL and BA get barred and if Air Arik were to vanish they have no connections at all.


User currently offlineWahdadli From Antigua and Barbuda, joined Dec 2007, 66 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4141 times:

LOL... This is funny. He should try flying LGW to the Caribbean islands on BA (777-200) or VS (747-400) he will see uncleaned and smelly aircraft. I flown BA on that route 4 times in the last 4 months in clubworld and have actually asked for an extra hot towel to clean my tray table and the area for the glasses and tv.

I think the general cleanliness of aircraft has fallen.


User currently onlineSkyTeamTriStar From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 381 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 3499 times:

The whole story is false since the Gov't clearly doesn't know that Delta spells their name as 3 words: Air Lines not Airlines.  Silly

User currently offlineI380North From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 117 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3129 times:



Quoting B747-4U3 (Thread starter):
Maybe both BA and DL failed to upgrade said Minister, wife

In the West, we call it lobbying and providing planes to your elected reps and his family for a junket. so, what is the difference

Quoting CityofAthens (Reply 13):
Why do such threads always end up about how corrupt Nigeria and Africa is?

Answer......Stereotype

Quoting Ssublyme (Reply 14):
Don't they end up going hand in hand?

Just like every Western/American/English is God-fearing and will never rip you off !!!!

Regarding flights into Nigeria, DL product is simply inferior. Other legacy airline (EK, Qatar) fly in with T7. And adding salt to injury, they (DL) separate you from your luggage. To me, that is unacceptable, Can imagine doing 10+ hr trip without AVOD? The minister, as currupt as he may be, is simply asking why the world's biggest airline (DL) has a sub standard product. We on a.net should understand that when a question is asked it is not a shake down.


User currently offlineB747-4U3 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2002, 988 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3091 times:



Quoting I380North (Reply 23):
Can imagine doing 10+ hr trip without AVOD? The minister, as currupt as he may be, is simply asking why the world's biggest airline (DL) has a sub standard product.

But he specifically states that Nigerian passengers are experiencing that inferior product. DL use their "inferior" 767s on a huge variety of routes. It is not a case of Nigerians being discriminated against. It is simply a case of DL not having upgraded their product. No other government is complaining, so why should he?

The guy further discredits himself by accusing BA of using a substandard product. BA do not use a specific aircraft on their Nigeria routes. The could fly to LOS one day and then JFK the next. Having experienced BA in F, J, W and Y, I can safely say that BA is amongst the best. To call their product "scrappy" whilst not complaining about KL or LH is simply picking on BA.

He is only saying things like this because of politics. He knows what he is saying will be popular amongst his target audience.


25 Skibum9 : Scrappy?!? Doesn't Nigeria have a problem with even keeping the birds of its airlines in the air? Maybe everyone should ban together against Nigeria f
26 Chgoflyer : Based on my experience doing business in Nigeria- DL and BA simply did not grease the right palms.
27 I380North : you are so sure. For the same reasons why you think DL is great and I think DL is so so. Stand to be corrected BA mostly flies 747 and 777 to LOS. I
28 DeltaL1011man : Which wont happen. LOS is great for Delta but it isn't that great. Best LOS will ever get is the 763. (or 787 when they come) it is not reg. DL flys
29 B747-4U3 : I never said I "love" DL. I was merely stating that the aircraft they use to Nigeria are the same ones they use elsewhere on the network...i.e. they
30 CHRISBA777ER : Its just the minister doing a little free advertising - he is almost screaming that DL and BA are using crap planes with poor in flight offerings to t
31 Post contains links VV701 : I have deja vu. This could lead to an impounding of a BA or DL aircraft in Nigeria and the overnight cancellation of BA and/or DL flights as happened
32 Leezyjet : One of these pathetic "Aviation Ministers" accused Virgin of being racist and offering an inferior product to Nigeria when they first started operatin
33 PanAm747 : Interesting that not a single other country anywhere in the world has complained about airlines offering "substandard" and "racist" (the implication)
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