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New Building/Structure At Hkia Apron  
User currently offlineCELESTAR From Singapore, joined Jul 2001, 403 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3614 times:

I will try to be specific as I do not keep track of the runway number.
At HKIA (HK international airport), standing at the main terminal, looking towards the sea/bay not towards the mountain at CLK, on the aircraft parking apron, you can see a building that is being build up. Looks like a mini-terminal? What exactly is that building? Is it a terminal for low cost airlines? Since it is sitting in the middle of the apron, how to reach there is your flight is using gates in that building? By bus? Appreciate someone who can answer this.

21 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineAznMadSci From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 3681 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3610 times:

Are you talking about this building behind this AY A340?

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u252/AznMadSci/Filipinas-2008/Filipinas-02Dec08267.jpg

I too am curious as to what this building will be!



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User currently offlineAnonms From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 620 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 3599 times:

Isn't it the satellite terminal for smaller aircraft?


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User currently offlineSydaircargo From Australia, joined Jun 2008, 242 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 3585 times:

HKG Airport website talks about a T1 extension as a Satelite concourse

User currently offlineNicholaschee From Australia, joined Oct 2005, 661 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 3541 times:

That's the HKIA North Satellite Concourse. When complete, it will serve up to 10 narrow bodies (Code C) aircraft at any one time.

User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9188 posts, RR: 15
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 3529 times:

When will they start building terminal 3 as well as a third runway?

User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4840 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 3513 times:



Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):
When will they start building terminal 3 as well as a third runway?

Not sure about the terminal, but AFAIK the 2 runways are not congested and with the current worldwide downturn CX in particular has taken quite a hit... Is there a need for a 3rd runway in the short/medium term? Obviously long term it will be needed.



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User currently offlineBA319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8561 posts, RR: 54
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 3422 times:
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Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 6):
but AFAIK the 2 runways are not congested

- I have been here spotting all day, they have some busy times but there is plenty of slack at certain times of the day.



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User currently offlineCityAirline From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 704 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 3338 times:



Quoting Nicholaschee (Reply 4):
When complete, it will serve up to 10 narrow bodies (Code C) aircraft at any one time.

10? Looks more like 6-8, unless they they will have gates on the short sides of the building too.

//Alex



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User currently offlineAnonms From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 620 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3322 times:



Quoting CityAirline (Reply 8):
10? Looks more like 6-8, unless they they will have gates on the short sides of the building too.

Gates on all 4 sides. Someone put concept pictures on here a while back.



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User currently offlineCELESTAR From Singapore, joined Jul 2001, 403 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 3231 times:

So, if it is a remote side terminal, how to get there? By bus? or some underground train?
Frankly, I don't see the need for a remote terminal. Already if you are unlucky, you don't get a air-bridge at HKIA, so why not just alight the aircraft, enjoy the breeze, and let the bus take you to the main terminal?
Well, someone will know more than I do.


User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3206 times:



Quoting Nicholaschee (Reply 4):
That's the HKIA North Satellite Concourse. When complete, it will serve up to 10 narrow bodies (Code C) aircraft at any one time.

 checkmark 

Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 6):
Is there a need for a 3rd runway in the short/medium term? Obviously long term it will be needed.

You'd appreciate the construction of a runway on a piece of dry flat land is not a short or medium term project. And this one will be on land to be reclaimed from the sea, surrounded by mountains. The challenges and difficulties are beyond anyone here would be able to appreciate.

Quoting Anonms (Reply 9):
Gates on all 4 sides.

 redflag  Stands on 3 sides only. A very clever colleague of mine designed this. It's a bit of a tight squeeze but it works and is completely Annex 14 compliant.

http://www.hkatc.gov.hk/HK_AIP/supp/A12-08.pdf
http://www.transportcareers.mottmac.com/projects/hkiasatellite/

Quoting CELESTAR (Reply 10):
By bus?

 checkmark 

Quoting CELESTAR (Reply 10):
Well, someone will know more than I do.

 checkmark 



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User currently offlineAznMadSci From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 3681 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3187 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 11):
Stands on 3 sides only. A very clever colleague of mine designed this. It's a bit of a tight squeeze but it works and is completely Annex 14 compliant.

Are there any renderings of the inside of the satellite? I would assume KA's A321s would be the largest that could be used at the satellite. Other than KA and HK Express, what other airlines maybe expected to use the facility?



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User currently offlineCX flyboy From Hong Kong, joined Dec 1999, 6616 posts, RR: 55
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3180 times:

A decent way would be to have underground walkways to the new satellite terminal but that would be too costly and too logical for the airport authority. I guess it is an excuse to shove the LCCs there to free up other terminal space.

As for the 3rd runway, Cloudyapple is right. It would take years to get government approval, environmental and social impact studies done and then sort out the funding and that is even before construction begins. Financial crises like the current one are short term blips in the big picture of an airport and before the life of CLK is out, there will be demand for a 3rd runway and there will probably be several more financial downturns too.


User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 3122 times:



Quoting AznMadSci (Reply 12):
Other than KA and HK Express, what other airlines maybe expected to use the facility?

The official line is any Code C aircraft from any airline could be parked there. Operationally tho there are always preferences in stand allocations. The airlines have preferences, the handling agents have preferences, ground has operational preferences.

Quoting CX flyboy (Reply 13):
A decent way would be to have underground walkways to the new satellite terminal but that would be too costly and too logical for the airport authority.

Yes an underground link would be better for the passengers as well as ground but that needs to be balanced against the disruptions that would be caused by having to close the taxilane and a few stands for 6 months or more to build this cut and cover tunnel.



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User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4840 posts, RR: 9
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 3106 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 11):

Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 6):
Is there a need for a 3rd runway in the short/medium term? Obviously long term it will be needed.

You'd appreciate the construction of a runway on a piece of dry flat land is not a short or medium term project. And this one will be on land to be reclaimed from the sea, surrounded by mountains. The challenges and difficulties are beyond anyone here would be able to appreciate.

Considering the entire airport (2 runways, taxiways, terminals, road and rail connections) were built in what would be called a medium term timeframe, and that numerous other airports around the world have built runways reclaimed from the sea, I don't see how the challenges would be THAT great. Sure it would be in deeper water than the original, but HK and China have both shown the ability and desire to get projects done with little in the way of red-tape.

Sure it would be an extraordinary project and will be needed, but it is definantly a longterm prospect even though as mentioned it could be done very quickly (within 5-10 years I'd say if there was a desire to have it done).



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineCARST From Germany, joined Jul 2006, 822 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 3070 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 14):
Yes an underground link would be better for the passengers as well as ground but that needs to be balanced against the disruptions that would be caused by having to close the taxilane and a few stands for 6 months or more to build this cut and cover tunnel.

In my opinion such a tunnel could be build in 3 days ...

All concrete parts should just be build before the works begin... ground, wall and ceiling parts, everything in 3x3m concrete forms.

Day one morning: Diggers come, crack up the taxiway and make a 3m deep and wide path between the satellite and the main terminal.

Day one afternoon: Cranes install the pre-build parts into the tunnel.

Day one evening/night: Recreation taxiway

Day 2 & 3: Let the taxiway harden...


User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 3070 times:



Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 15):
Considering the entire airport (2 runways, taxiways, terminals, road and rail connections) were built in what would be called a medium term timeframe, and that numerous other airports around the world have built runways reclaimed from the sea, I don't see how the challenges would be THAT great. Sure it would be in deeper water than the original, but HK and China have both shown the ability and desire to get projects done with little in the way of red-tape.

I was not suggesting the project is too difficult to accomplish but it will take time. The runway will certainly not be operational in the timeframe you suggested. It's just technically not possible.

I'm not going into any detail because I am working on this. I suggest anyone interested in this to watch out for the 2030 Masterplan which will be published some time in the near future.



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User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 3067 times:



Quoting CARST (Reply 16):
In my opinion such a tunnel could be build in 3 days ...

All concrete parts should just be build before the works begin... ground, wall and ceiling parts, everything in 3x3m concrete forms.

Day one morning: Diggers come, crack up the taxiway and make a 3m deep and wide path between the satellite and the main terminal.

Day one afternoon: Cranes install the pre-build parts into the tunnel.

Day one evening/night: Recreation taxiway

Day 2 & 3: Let the taxiway harden...

Huf Haus doesn't do taxiways unfortunately.



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User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 3060 times:

Deleted - Double post.

[Edited 2009-02-12 02:46:41]


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User currently offlineCARST From Germany, joined Jul 2006, 822 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 3034 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 18):
Huf Haus doesn't do taxiways unfortunately.

Kind of funny, but i wasn't talking about some prefabricated house.

Look at the TBMs (tunnel boring machines) which are used over the whole world for creating large railway and road tunnels. They use rounded, prefabricated concrete parts of 2x2m size too and place them around the whole tunnel-wall automatically after they finished drilling some 2m.

Prefabricated concrete parts are used everywhere on the world, so it should be possible to prebuild these parts for 3m wide pax tunnel to the satelite terminal.

All detail work can be done later, but this project could take 3 days, not more.


User currently offlineAnonms From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 620 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2913 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 11):
   Stands on 3 sides only. A very clever colleague of mine designed this. It's a bit of a tight squeeze but it works and is completely Annex 14 compliant.

Ah, sorry. My memory failed me this time around.  Sad



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