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US Airways Base At LGA-Sustainable?  
User currently offlineCXA330300 From South Africa, joined May 2004, 1561 posts, RR: 2
Posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 7459 times:

I was at LaGuardia dropping off my father last week to drop him off for his flight to CLT. The terminal was dead! Of course a lot of it has to do with economy, but compared to the other terminals (particularly the Delta Terminal) it was very quiet. Considering that the terminal was also quiet when I flew out of it during boom times a while back, I'm compelled to ask: how sustainable (and profitable/unprofitable) is US Airways' LaGuardia focus city, especially considering their huge regional base in PHL?


The sky is the limit as long as you can stay there
40 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTheGMan From United States of America, joined Nov 2008, 657 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 7335 times:

What day and time of day was it?

Weekends are often dead at LGA, but Monday morning the USAir terminal is pretty busy, even at 5 am.


User currently offlineAirlinespotter From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 162 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 7272 times:

Hummm, I also was there last week and it was very crowed. Like TheGMan said, what day & time were you there?

User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 7144 times:

It is sad how few mainline jets US has at LGA...Aside from the Shuttle ops, it is mostly RJs and Dash-8s...

User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 7094 times:

I've found LGA to be quite quiet even during the week but during a certain time of the day. That's why whenever i'm flying in and out of there (always leisue so timing doesn't matter) I fly right in during the "sweep spot" when there's like no traffic.

Believe it or not, you can find this time at ATL also. Working on the ramp in Atlanta, it's quite a site to look up and down C (DCI side) and see a little more than half of the gatesempty and we're all in the breakroom catching a nap.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineTheGMan From United States of America, joined Nov 2008, 657 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 6931 times:



Quoting RJpieces (Reply 3):
It is sad how few mainline jets US has at LGA...Aside from the Shuttle ops, it is mostly RJs and Dash-8s...

Right now it is like 3x daily 321 service to CLT.


User currently offlineStarAlliance38 From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 1445 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 6928 times:

I'm flying LGA-CLT tomorrow, but I opted for the regional jet. I kinda wish I got the mainline flight now, but O well!


Roar, lion, roar
User currently offlineTheGMan From United States of America, joined Nov 2008, 657 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 6775 times:



Quoting StarAlliance38 (Reply 6):
I'm flying LGA-CLT tomorrow, but I opted for the regional jet. I kinda wish I got the mainline flight now, but O well!

You will regret it. I flew a CRJ-200 LGA-CLT last month, only because it was the last flight back and it was miserable.
Load factor was 100%


User currently offlineCXA330300 From South Africa, joined May 2004, 1561 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 6748 times:



Quoting TheGMan (Reply 1):
What day and time of day was it?

Wednesday evening roundabouts 5:45pm, my dad was on US3077.

How big is the US Airways operation out of LGA? My dad was surprised by the number of Dash-8s he saw...



The sky is the limit as long as you can stay there
User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19215 posts, RR: 52
Reply 9, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 6637 times:

I'll be flying thro' LGA on Thursday, routing DCA-LGA-PHL on US and AWI. I will have 2h 10m there if it's all on time. What is the viewing like airside within the US terminal?


"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8491 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6573 times:



Quoting RJpieces (Reply 3):
It is sad how few mainline jets US has at LGA...Aside from the Shuttle ops, it is mostly RJs and Dash-8s...

It's sad how so much of LGA's potential is made illegal by the perimeter rule. I am sure US would like to fly LGA-LAX, and so would WN, but unfortunately Americans don't have the freedom to travel that route, at least not commercially. Probably the fat cats with their own jets can fly the route no problem, though! Just not regular people, becuase that would be too much freedom for them, maybe.

 Big grin


User currently offlineVictorKilo From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 311 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6489 times:



Quoting RJpieces (Reply 3):
It is sad how few mainline jets US has at LGA...Aside from the Shuttle ops, it is mostly RJs and Dash-8s...

Looking at US's LGA schedule for a random weekday next week, only 5% (10 out of 197) of US's flights out of LGA are non-shuttle mainline flights. Even including the Shuttle ops, only 21% of US's flights at LGA are mainline.

I thought that the Regional Jets would be to blame for this, but what shocked me the most looking at their schedules was that US has more turboprop flights out of LGA than Regional Jets - 80 to 75. And those 80 flights are to only thirteen destinations (only daily turboprop flights counted here - there may be additional RJ departures):

ALB 5
BTV 8
BUF 7
BWI 8
CHO 3
ITH 4
MHT 5
ORF 4
PHL 9
PVD 7
ROA 3
ROC 7
SYR 10

In total, US serves 28 nonstop destinations on the average weekday with 197 flights, an average of 7 flights per destination. Many - possibly even a majority - of these flights do not operate on the weekends.

80% of US's flights are either to hubs or are within 300 miles of LGA, and only one - a daily flight to SAV - is longer than 700 miles.

US at LGA focuses on a few markets with short flights with a high frequency of flights served by small aircraft. This appears to be aimed at the business traveller who prefers LGA over JFK or EWR. Is this sustainable in this economic downturn? I think so, but if the focus city should need to shrink, I would expect that the higher cost RJ's would go, rather than the lower cost turboprops.


User currently offlineMoose135 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2314 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6465 times:



Quoting Flighty (Reply 10):
It's sad how so much of LGA's potential is made illegal by the perimeter rule. I am sure US would like to fly LGA-LAX, and so would WN, but unfortunately Americans don't have the freedom to travel that route, at least not commercially. Probably the fat cats with their own jets can fly the route no problem, though! Just not regular people, becuase that would be too much freedom for them, maybe.

Right, because it's such a hardship to have to go all the way to JFK, out there in the boondocks, for a flight to LAX.  Wink

For me, ISP is more convenient. Where are my ISP-LAX non-stops? I think my civil rights are being violated!



KC-135 - Passing gas and taking names!
User currently offlineTommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6400 times:

US has always been top dog at LGA. If their concourse are dead, I'd hate to see what DL's or AA's is looking like these days.


"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6372 times:



Quoting Moose135 (Reply 12):
Right, because it's such a hardship to have to go all the way to JFK, out there in the boondocks, for a flight to LAX.

If you believe in the free market, then there should be no restrictions on flights at LGA,DCA, etc in terms of where an airline can fly to.


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22924 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6350 times:



Quoting RJpieces (Reply 14):
If you believe in the free market, then there should be no restrictions on flights at LGA,DCA, etc in terms of where an airline can fly to.

If we accept the fact that LGA (and DCA) need some sort of restriction, is a perimeter rule preferable to slots?



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineUSAirALB From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 3058 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6287 times:



Quoting Tommy767 (Reply 13):
US has always been top dog at LGA. If their concourse are dead, I'd hate to see what DL's or AA's is looking like these days.

Well, they had surrendered their Florida flights after 9/11, if only they hadn't canceled it.

Today, they fly to: IND,SDF,DAY, CMH, PIT,ROA,CHO,RIC,ORF,DCA,BWI,PHL, ACK,MVY,HYA,BOS,PWM,BTV,ALB,BUF,SYR,ROC,ITH,PVD,STT,FPO,NAS,DAB,SAV,AGS,CHS,MYR,ILM,RDU,CLT,GSO.



E135/E140/E145/E70/E75/E90/CR2/CR7/CR9/717/732/733/734/735/73G/738/739/752/753/762/772/319/320/321/333
User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8491 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6153 times:



Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 15):
If we accept the fact that LGA (and DCA) need some sort of restriction, is a perimeter rule preferable to slots?

The two are not related. Slots exist because the runways would otherwise get clogged by unmanaged traffic (like a NYC intersection without traffic signals). It would be a mess.

Once the traffic jams are smoothed out by slots, then we can discuss where the flights can go. That won't really make a difference in terms of congestion.


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22924 posts, RR: 20
Reply 18, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6138 times:



Quoting Flighty (Reply 17):
Once the traffic jams are smoothed out by slots, then we can discuss where the flights can go. That won't really make a difference in terms of congestion.

Sure it would. How many cities inside the perimeter can you think of that are underserved?



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineJetstar From United States of America, joined May 2003, 1645 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6098 times:
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Quoting Tommy767 (Reply 13):
US has always been top dog at LGA. If their concourse are dead, I'd hate to see what DL's or AA's is looking like these days.

I have been flying DL out of LGA for almost a year now and I can say I never have seen DL’s terminal so called dead. Usually all 3 of the security lanes are open and at least a few people are waiting to go through each lane.

There might be times during the day when there is a traffic lull, but with hourly flights to ATL, mostly on 757’s and now NW’s flights to their hubs and DL’s Florida runs to all the major cities in Florida with at least 3 or 4 flights a day, with mostly mainline aircraft during the winter season tends to keep the terminal fairly busy.


User currently offlineCactusBDL From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 18 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5876 times:



Quoting StarAlliance38 (Reply 6):
I'm flying LGA-CLT tomorrow, but I opted for the regional jet. I kinda wish I got the mainline flight now, but O well!

I flew BDL - CLT in the CRJ900....not a bad flight at all.

Quoting Tommy767 (Reply 13):
US has always been top dog at LGA. If their concourse are dead, I'd hate to see what DL's or AA's is looking like these days.

I totally agree with you. the shuttle service is most productive with their mainline fleet. The express service is pretty busy as well. If they wernt productive, why the use of their own tower in LGA?


User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5848 times:



Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 15):

If we accept the fact that LGA (and DCA) need some sort of restriction, is a perimeter rule preferable to slots?



Quoting Flighty (Reply 17):
The two are not related.

I'm all for slots. However, the permiter rule seems pointless to me. Whenever entities like the PA or DOT try to interfere with the free market, they wind up making things worse. Slots are necessary to make sure that the aiport is not insanely overcrowded; however, if an airline has a slot (and a limited number of slots at that), they are free to choose whether they want to run hourly flights to Chicago or throw in some transcons to LA, etc etc. Removing the perimter rule at LGA would hardly affect JFK ops.


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22924 posts, RR: 20
Reply 22, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5808 times:



Quoting RJpieces (Reply 21):
I'm all for slots. However, the permiter rule seems pointless to me. Whenever entities like the PA or DOT try to interfere with the free market, they wind up making things worse.

I hate to press the point, but why are slots better "government interference" than the perimeter rule? We seem to agree that some sort of "government interference" is necessary.

If the slot restrictions went away, you would no longer see 8 daily flights to BWI or BTV-- instead, you'd probably see 5 on larger aircraft. That would free up some space for new entrants, and I bet that, given the relative lack of gate space at LGA, a slot-free but perimeter restricted airport would be less crowded and delayed than it is today.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineVctony From United States of America, joined Aug 1999, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5766 times:



Quoting Moose135 (Reply 12):
Right, because it's such a hardship to have to go all the way to JFK, out there in the boondocks, for a flight to LAX.

I'd argue that the ability to use the A, E, or J subway or the LIRR to the AirTrain actually makes JFK easier to get to than LGA.

JFK, not LGA, has the rapid transit access.


User currently offlineMicstatic From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 778 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (5 years 6 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5736 times:



Quoting Vctony (Reply 23):

JFK, not LGA, has the rapid transit access.

Don't forget EWR.



S340,DH8,AT7,CR2/7,E135/45/170/190,319,320,717,732,733,734,735,737,738,744,752,762,763,764,772,M80,M90
25 Tinpusher007 : US isn't top dog anymore. AA is currently number 1 at LGA followed by DL and then US. Once DL and NW are combined onto SOC DL will then become the nu
26 Etops1 : I remember back in the day when we operated 757's out of lga .
27 Tiger119 : - Is there much GA in and out of LGA? I thought most the GA in and out of The NYC Area went through HPN, TEB, ISP or even possibly SWF? With that bei
28 AirNovaBAe146 : Its an Operations tower, not an ATC tower. Used mostly to coordinate activities and provide a view of the ramp to their ground supervisors. Some Ops
29 Flighty : Yes, and if you have some good connections I think DCA is also available for GA operations. A friend of mine was saying they operated there anyway. C
30 Csm737 : I flew ROA-ATL-LGA-DTW-ROA last month and both Delta and NW areas were very sparse...it just depends on the time of day....another thing that was odd
31 Tommy767 : AA did a HUGE cutback at LGA last year which led to a major loss in Eagle flights as well as mainline to Florida including MCO, TPA, and FLL. I remem
32 Milesrich : The is very little GA traffic out of LGA, except for Trump's 727-25, and there is little GA traffic at LAX. Most GA traffic to LA goes to other airpor
33 Cubsrule : Would a rule that you have to have a gate to operate a flight solve that problem? With the amount of RJ and prop flying, I feel like it might-- but I
34 LGA777 : As others have already said it's all about timing. Even with the economy the US Terminal at LGA can be packed regulary. Busy times include Thur-Fri-S
35 CXA330300 : Speaking of WN, any news on when their planned service to LGA shall start, if at all?
36 Jetstar : In 1957 or 1958, my father flew out of LGA to LAX on a TWA Connie to visit his parents, as far as I remember it was a non-stop, my father did not lik
37 CXA330300 : That was well before the perimeter rule came into effect in the 1980s after deregulation and before the massive development of JFK, which was then kn
38 TheGMan : Idlewild changed to JFK shortly after JFK was assassinated.
39 RJpieces : I'm not sure when they ended their "airline within an airline"--I forget the name; those red planes. Metro somethign???? But US did operate LGA-FLL a
40 Post contains links LGA777 : The last Metrojet ended in Dec 2001. Around the same time US ended all 737-200. MD-80, and F-100 ops using the events of 9-11 to shrink operations sig
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