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Delta Sells More Planes As Operations Decline  
User currently offlineKarlB737 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3090 posts, RR: 10
Posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 21004 times:

A clearer picture of what decisions Delta is making regarding the overall fleet as the merger unfolds is here for you to read. Couple with that the fact that fewer passengers are flying because of personal/business economic conditions. Take a peek and maybe some of you can add to this your own additional insights as employees.

Delta Sells More Planes As Operations Decline

Courtesy: The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

http://www.ajc.com/business/content/.../2009/03/04/Delta_planes_sold.html

77 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 1, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 20918 times:

From the link in OP:

Quote:
Delta said it has agreements to sell 31 of the 33 Boeing 737-800 jets it has on order, which reduces its commitments by about $1.3 billion through 2011

That's about 10 738 per year. I suppose the drop in traffic, along with route rationalization post merger justifies the move.


User currently offlineMax550 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1147 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 20910 times:

My question is who's buying aircraft right now?

Also, it says they sold 5 757-200's and bought 4 757-200ER's (which I know don't exist), where did they buy the 757's from?

[Edited 2009-03-04 12:13:58]

User currently offlineCompensateMe From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 1030 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 20879 times:



Quoting Max550 (Reply 2):
My question is who's buying aircraft right now?

Look at the types: old DC-9, 757 and 742.

They were sold for scrap.



Hypocrisy: "US airlines should only buy Boeing... BTW, check out my new Hyundai!"
User currently offlinePilotboi From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 2366 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 20873 times:

I wouldn't call it a clearer picture. It's basically just a recap. And almost all the aircraft they've removed in the past year had plenty of cycles on them, so it's not like they went to waste. To no surprise, they are removing the oldest ones first. And there's no indication that they plan to retire a single type yet (expect maybe the DC-9-30 subtype). IMHO, this article is a fus over nothing, and if anything simply an unnecessary status report.

User currently onlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3006 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 20868 times:

So, they're selling "future" a/c, not actually a/c they're currently using? That's (slightly) comforting.


Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offline0NEWAIR0 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 939 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 20782 times:

The 737-800s are old news, the 787 was predicted awhile ago because the new Delta really doesn't need them (yet), the 757s were almost replaced one for one, selling "airframes" really doesn't matter because they were already sitting in the desert, selling a few CRJ 200s is also old news too, I believe.

As for the DC-9s and A320s, well, northwest was already planning on sellling a lot of the 9s before the merger and I imagine that the new combined delta would allow for the selling of A320s (too many 140-150 seat planes to service the routes).



"The future belongs to those who believe in the beauty of their dreams."
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15694 posts, RR: 26
Reply 7, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 20770 times:

I don't think that this is as big of a story as the papers would lead you to believe. Many of the planes mentioned would probably be going soon anyway. The 747-200Fs, DC-9s and CRJ-100s were on borrowed time anyway. It is a bit confusing about the 757s. It says that some are being taken out of service but they are adding "757-200ERs", which I assume are the misguided reporters designation for 757s with APB winglets. So are there five 757s being sold and four converted or one sold and four converted? Also, do we know when these 738 delivery slots are and who the buyers are? I would guess that DL can get decent delivery slots from Boeing if they decide to reorder any of the 737s. Furthermore, is this 737 cancellation due to the rumored acquisition of another 20 or so MD-90s that was mentioned here on A*Net?


Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineDbo861 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 880 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 20444 times:

Are the 4 "757-200ERs" in addition to the ex-TWA 757s Delta recently took delivery of? I'm assuming these will be outfitted with Business Elite and used on international routes.

User currently offlineRwy04LGA From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 3176 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 20376 times:



Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 1):
Delta said it has agreements to sell 31 of the 33 Boeing 737-800 jets it has on order, which reduces its commitments by about $1.3 billion through 2011



Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 5):
So, they're selling "future" a/c, not actually a/c they're currently using? That's (slightly) comforting.

Didn't they buy them at very good prices and are now making a profit from these sales?



Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
User currently offlineDalmd88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2532 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 20322 times:

I don't think the sale of the 738 orders is old news. Just a few months ago those were still on the books. This means almost no new narrowbodies this or next year. All that is left are a few more 737-700's. It also means we keep the MD88 fleet longer.

User currently offlineCALPSAFltSkeds From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 2577 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 20210 times:

Is DL in bad shape financially to decide on increasing the age of their equipment by not accepting new aircraft and retaining older MD88 aircraft? Or are they betting on continued lower fuel prices?

User currently offlineTu154m From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 677 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 19940 times:

Parking of planes =letting go of people. Anyone care to guess when the next hammer will fall on the employees either in paycuts or layoffs????


CEOs should swim with cement flippers!
User currently offline0NEWAIR0 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 939 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 19845 times:

Quoting Dalmd88 (Reply 10):
I don't think the sale of the 738 orders is old news.

Delta has been deferring, selling, and canceling 737-800s since 2005 (if not earlier). I thought is was already "public knowledge" that Delta would not ever take delivery of most of the 737-800s on order.

[Edited 2009-03-04 14:13:37]


"The future belongs to those who believe in the beauty of their dreams."
User currently offlinePilotboi From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 2366 posts, RR: 9
Reply 14, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 19541 times:



Quoting Max550 (Reply 2):
Also, it says they sold 5 757-200's and bought 4 757-200ER's (which I know don't exist), where did they buy the 757's from?

AA

Quoting Dbo861 (Reply 8):
Are the 4 "757-200ERs" in addition to the ex-TWA 757s Delta recently took delivery of? I'm assuming these will be outfitted with Business Elite and used on international routes.

All this article is doing is recapping the 2008 overall fleet changes. The article says "While it removed planes from its fleet, Delta also added five Boeing 737-700s, four Boeing 757-200ERs and two Boeing 777-200LRs to its fleet." All that means is that in 2008, 5 73Ws were delivered, 4 75Es were delivered (from AA), and 2 77Ls were delivered. Nothing new here.

Quoting Dalmd88 (Reply 10):
This means almost no new narrowbodies this or next year. All that is left are a few more 737-700's

One more 73W in July 2009. Then the last 2 738s, which were the only ones that were NOT sold off, in May and June 2010. Also, 2 more 73Ws that do not have firm dates yet, but my guess would be then 2010 as well. But again, this article isn't telling us anything we don't already know.

Quoting CALPSAFltSkeds (Reply 11):
not accepting new aircraft

What do you mean? Other then the 738s being sold off, which was done years ago to help get out of chapter 11. Over the past few years they've been accepting deliveries of 73Ws, 75Es, and 77Ls.

Quoting CALPSAFltSkeds (Reply 11):
retaining older MD88 aircraft

4 are stored. Plus the 3 oldest have been WFU. Of those 3, ship 901 was scrapped last month. They obviously want to get rid of them - the older ones at least.

Quoting 0NEWAIR0 (Reply 13):
I thought is was already "public knowledge" that Delta would not ever take delivery of most of the 737-800s on order.

It is. And has been for years.


User currently offlineGARUDAROD From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 1511 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 18897 times:

One interesting bit of information listed not commented on, Delta will be starting
B74F service from ATL to NRT, KIX and PVG. One wonders if indeed the Freighter
division will be kept around longer than thought. You do not start a new Freighter service
only to shut it down 6 months later, do you?



Cargo doesn't whine, moan, or complain
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24738 posts, RR: 46
Reply 16, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 18730 times:



Quoting GARUDAROD (Reply 15):
You do not start a new Freighter service
only to shut it down 6 months later, do you?

In Delta's case they will. Just keeping the planes busy for now.

MEC was notified the ANC 742 base (which supports at the cargo flying) will be closing in the second half of the year, but no later then 12/31, with the 742F not transfering onto the future single operating certificate.

Was discussed a week or so ago:
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...eneral_aviation/read.main/4326128/



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9266 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 18600 times:



Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 4):

pretty much

Quoting Rwy04LGA (Reply 9):
Didn't they buy them at very good prices and are now making a profit from these sales?

yes, this is why Gerry went with it.

Quoting Dalmd88 (Reply 10):

These 737s were sold in BK. They are still on the books and will be till all of them are gone. DL still has a s**ton of 737s options



yep.
User currently offlinePilotboi From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 2366 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 18369 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 17):
DL still has a s**ton of 737s options

60 to be exact, plus 120 rolling options.


User currently offlineCap2008 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 255 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 18368 times:



Quoting Tu154m (Reply 12):
Parking of planes =letting go of people. Anyone care to guess when the next hammer will fall on the employees either in paycuts or layoffs????

I don't really see layoffs coming as a result of this "news", if anything they'll just suspend hiring, and let decrease in capacity be compensated by the void created from retirees. I don't foresee any paycuts in the near future either, just let the economy sort itself out and business will pick back up in time.



The mother of the last KC-135 pilot has yet to be born.
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9266 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 18209 times:



Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 14):
All this article is doing is recapping the 2008 overall fleet changes. The article says "While it removed planes from its fleet, Delta also added five Boeing 737-700s, four Boeing 757-200ERs and two Boeing 777-200LRs to its fleet." All that means is that in 2008, 5 73Ws were delivered, 4 75Es were delivered (from AA), and 2 77Ls were delivered. Nothing new here.

seems like people are reading DL's SEC file and do not know what it means, then putting a PR out about it.  Smile



yep.
User currently offlineN867bx From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 339 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 17642 times:

So when is Delta gonna get rid of the DC9. Has this been discussed?

User currently offlinePanAm788 From United States of America, joined Sep 2008, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 16570 times:



Quoting N867bx (Reply 22):
So when is Delta gonna get rid of the DC9. Has this been discussed?

Haha are you kidding? Yeah its been discussed, look around a bit, you'll find it for sure.



heroes get remembered but legends never die
User currently offlinePilotboi From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 2366 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 16400 times:



Quoting N867bx (Reply 22):
So when is Delta gonna get rid of the DC9. Has this been discussed?

As soon as that announcement is made, you'll know. Anet will have day of silence. Big grin

In all seriousness, it's been discussed since April last year, at least on here. There has been no formal announcements, so we'll just have to wait and see.


User currently offlineDalmd88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2532 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (5 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 16311 times:

Ok so I thought this was more 738 being sold off before we got them. So nothing is really new then.

25 LACA773 : Wouldn't it be more financially feasible in the long run for DL to go ahead and retain their 73H orders and delay them instead while removing the olde
26 MCOflyer : All of the newly added 752ER's were ex TW that AA had flying from DFW to LAS, MCO, SAN and FLL. These birds are all relatively new builds, so they'll
27 Brilondon : Are they planning to utilize more RJ's on some of the thinner routes and with the combined fleets find they have excess capacity in their system. You
28 Columba : maybe they mean 757s with winglets which would not be new aircraft but still....
29 Scouseflyer : They've still got 5 A319s and 2 A320s outstanding from NWA is it likely that these will be delivered or will they get cancelled / sold on?
30 Pilotboi : Already being done. DAB is a great example. Just over 2 years ago there were 6 daily 88s. Now...what is it? 4 CRJs and 1 88. Yes, they are talking ab
31 FlyASAGuy2005 : The 737 deal has nothing to do with the MD-90s. This is a deal DL started several years ago to raise cash in a time that they didn't need to extra ca
32 Columba : When I recall all the "DL will get rid of all A32xs in favor of 737s" comments over the last few months I would not say it was "public knowledge" For
33 0NEWAIR0 : From my point of view, getting rid of A32Xs in favor of 737s has nothing to do with getting more 737s. All that that means, from my point of view, is
34 WA707atMSP : Cancelling the -800s is a smart move on DL's part. Despite Boeing's denials, I still think they will move on a 737 replacement sooner rather than late
35 Burnsie28 : Well in reality the 737's are more expensive to operate, they are a heavier airplane and crew costs are higher on it, also there are a lot more A319/
36 0NEWAIR0 : > The projected fuel burn on a A320/19 per hour is 675 gallons (from jetBlue and SkyBus) an 773 (from Virgin America) > The projected fuel burn on a
37 Globeex : There are about 45 (ER)s (please correct me if I'm wrong). First was delivered to Air Europa as far as I know. They do have a MTOW of almost 115.000
38 SuseJ772 : That was my question. I also wondered this as well. I think this makes sense. Delta has realized their money is in international routes and they are
39 KC135TopBoom : I agree. DL is positioning itself very well with a big Boeing order, perhaps for the Y-1. No, that is not correct. See 0NEWAIR0 reply # 38. His numbe
40 0NEWAIR0 : I'm thinking that there won't be another "hammer" so to speak but more of attrition through regular retirements. -7 CRJ - ASA/COMAIR Already furlough
41 Post contains links CompensateMe : http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/print.asp?entryID=147190 From the article: "[Alaska Airline's] 737-800 burns about 850 gallons per hour." So no, h
42 KC135TopBoom : I suspect that DL will get rid of the NW A-319s and A-320s as soon as they can. DL is not a big Airbus coustomer, they prefer Boeing aircraft. I belie
43 CompensateMe : The cost to dump 125 A319/A320, then acquire replacements, then spend tens of millions to retrain pilots, mechanics, etc. would make this prohibitive
44 LAXintl : One thing I know that has surprised Delta in recent weeks with the A319/A320 fleet was the news they are incapable of running transcons due to their l
45 Planefxr : This is ridiculously old news, try December of 2006 old. DL entered into agreements with a couple of different leasing companies to sell 38 737-800's
46 CompensateMe : Shouldn't be a surprise . NW operated BOS-SEA with the 320 in the early 1990s & sometimes made fuel stops. It surprises me that the 319 couldn't oper
47 Tommy767 : Really? only 71? I thought they had more than AA, like somewhere in the 90-100 range?
48 0NEWAIR0 : If you take the numbers from the SEC filings and the DOT filings. You will come up with a slightly different number for Alaska's fuel burn per hour.
49 LAXintl : NWA 319s are low weight versions also with MTOW of 154300lbs, while in comparison UA, US are 166,400lbs capable.
50 Ikramerica : Not to mention that AS has a different use pattern for their planes, being a primarily west coast airline and moving entirely to 737s, than would NW
51 FlyASAGuy2005 : Goes to show that you shouldn't listen to rumor, but what's actually on paper. The deal with the 737s is about 4 years old. so yes, it was public kno
52 LACA773 : I thought the 319s were the more practical a/c to use on transcons over the 320/321s? They used the 320s out of LAX to BOS as well when they were run
53 DeltaL1011man : no they are not. Hold on, DL would save OLDER and MORE EXPENSIVE A32S and drop the newer 737NGs. Would this not HURT the bottom line? Not help? all 9
54 BMI727 : From a purely operational standpoint the 737NG has a cost advantage over the A320. Except that I suspect that many of NW's A320s are paid for which m
55 Planefxr : I would not look for either fleet type to disappear anytime soon, however I would speculate that the A320's would be the first to go as they are olde
56 AirNz : This 'expertise' has been constantly repeated on here for many months by DL 'experts'.......funny though, how not one single piece of evidence to dat
57 Planefxr : And highly unlikely it will at a future date either.
58 Post contains images FlyASAGuy2005 : I don't think anyone is claiming to be an expert on anything unless someone actually comes out and says, hey i'm executive so and so and work for Delt
59 Avconsultant : All companies are in bad shape not just DL. IMO, DL is one of the best airlines knowing their position in this economic downturn. They're doing the s
60 Bmacleod : Selling doesn't necessarily mean the airline is dropping them from the fleet entirely right? Many airlines often sell very expensive aircraft to leasi
61 FlyASAGuy2005 : None of the 738 that have been sold are being flown under the Delta banner. That isn't to say that in the future, they end up leasing the same a/c th
62 AirNz : Yes, I see exactly where you're coming from and, for the most part, I entirely agree with you. However, whilst no, they don't come out and say it (th
63 DeltaL1011man : I still think that that person is Jim W. or Ed B. right. The deal with the 737s was a deal made buring BK. They also (at the same time) ordered 30 CR
64 FlyASAGuy2005 : agree with you 100% there sir. Ahhh, that's where I think most will bicker. Someone (and I see it all the time) will cleverly reply, "it's only my op
65 DeltaL1011man : I want to say EV has at least a few if not all. get 3 or 4 at the end of the month
66 777STL : Years ago they were supposed to take on more, but AA ended up selling a bunch of them to QF before they took delivery. I'm talking 2001 timeframe her
67 Pilotboi : Actually, only 2 so far. N131EV and N132EV. 6 orders remain, plus 2 to still transfer from 9E. 7103 was just delivered on the 6th. Then the last 7 ha
68 DeltaL1011man : and I missed it!?!?!?! crap. I wont miss the others.
69 Post contains links Pilotboi : http://flightaware.com/live/flight/D...5/history/20090306/1715Z/KPAE/KATL Someone's not keeping up with my site. You see, if you were checking my sit
70 DeltaL1011man : yea yea yea. I just dont check the front page. yea my bad...........sure hope someone got some pic.......hint hint. (starts with a C)
71 Pilotboi : I believe he was working at the time it arrived. Or sleeping. One of the two. Anyways, no photos up on his Flickr yet. I'll ask him next time I see h
72 Brons2 : So is the lower MTOW on the NW A319/320 a paper reduced MTOW? What would it take to get them up to the current limits?
73 FlyASAGuy2005 : Are you a member of the VA?
74 Pilotboi : Once was. But haven't flown for DVA, or on VATSIM, or even just FS in a long time. I've heard a bunch of the guys over there are avid readers of my s
75 FlyASAGuy2005 : Yes, they are! Filler
76 Timf : Based on information posted on Delta's blog today, it appears the remaining 5500 series 757s from Northwest are also on the way out. The post indicate
77 LAXintl : Yes for the A320s, no on the A319s. The 319s require a new strengthened nosegear.
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