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LAX's Once Strong South American Network  
User currently offlineJuventus From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2835 posts, RR: 2
Posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 6683 times:

Looks like at one point Los Angeles had a strong South American presence. Even Viasa used to fly there. Those were the days, now the sole South American carriers are LAN and Avianca.


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70 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25150 posts, RR: 46
Reply 1, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 6660 times:

Also had Ecuatoriana (707,DC-10,A310) for a very long time and Saeta(A310/B733) briefly.

While Central America we had Air Panana 727-100s also.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineFlyboy80 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 1878 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 6644 times:

Does AA do any Latin America destinations out of LAX? I would presume SJU in the Carribean, maybe CUN?

User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 6653 times:

BN and PA use to fly LAX-South America

User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5901 posts, RR: 6
Reply 4, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 6612 times:
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Korean Air has re-entered the South American market from LAX.

In addition to the strong presence of South American carriers back in the day, some used to make LAX their intermediate stop to Asia...Varig to NRT and VASP to SEL. I believe JAL and KAL flew through LAX to South America.


User currently offlineMayaviaERJ190 From Mexico, joined Jan 2008, 304 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 6508 times:

Considering LAX-MEX almost an airbridge, that LAX is a Mexicana focus city and that AM and MX have published fares for the following (ex HAV), I should conclude that a big chunk of the LAX-South/Central America traffic is nowadays under Mexican hands:

From LAX AeroMexico offers excellent connections @ MEX to:
GRU, EZE, SCL, SAP and MGA in addition to their daily AM18 LAX-LIM w/1 stop. MDE will be joining soon.

From LAX Mexicana offers excellent connections @ MEX to:
GRU, EZE, BOG, CCS, PTY, SJO, GUA and HAV. Off-topic: They have just added their fare for LAX-MAD!



My other plane is an A380.
User currently offlineBigGSFO From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2920 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 6507 times:



Quoting Flyboy80 (Reply 2):
Does AA do any Latin America destinations out of LAX? I would presume SJU in the Carribean, maybe CUN?

SJU, SJD and SJO (seasonal).


DL has plans for LAX-GRU in Mary.


User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5901 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 6463 times:
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I believe you can make connections on TACA, LACSA and Copa to South America fairly easily from LAX.

User currently offlineVincewy From Taiwan, joined Oct 2005, 767 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 6430 times:

One of the main reasons is concentration of traffic toward MIA, instead of just one flight to one airport, now we have 2-3 flights a day to MIA. We can say the same thing about Asian airlines toward LAX.

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25150 posts, RR: 46
Reply 9, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 6429 times:



Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 6):
SJU, SJD and SJO (seasonal).

Also daily SAL on 757s.

Quoting Wedgetail737 (Reply 7):
I believe you can make connections on TACA, LACSA and Copa to South America fairly easily from LAX.

 checkmark , along with the dozen ways to connect via other hubs or gateways such as the US carriers or people like LAN that offer good connectivity via its two flights two LIM and SCL.


At the end of the day, while not quite nonstop, LAX is very well connect still to South America with 1-stop service virtually to all meaningful destinations.

In the mean time the direct services tend to focus on Mexico and Central America reflecting the ethnic make up of the Los Angeles Hispanic community.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineEghansen From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 6348 times:



Quoting Juventus (Thread starter):
Looks like at one point Los Angeles had a strong South American presence. Even Viasa used to fly there. Those were the days, now the sole South American carriers are LAN and Avianca.

Los Angeles is not a natural gateway from South America. It's only feeder traffic would be from SFO, PDX and SEA.

Many people who are geographically challenged are not aware that South America is not due south of North America. DFW is GMT-6 and NYC is GMT-5. Santiago is GMT-4 and Brazil/Argentina is GMT-3.

If you look on a map, you will see that Buenos Aires is actually about even with Newfoundland and Sao Paulo is even with Greenland. It makes much more sense to have west coast passengers connect in Dallas, Houston, Atlanta or Miami than to offer nonstop flights.


User currently offlineJuventus From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2835 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6307 times:



Quoting LAXintl (Reply 1):
Also had Ecuatoriana (707,DC-10,A310) for a very long time and Saeta(A310/B733) briefly.

Ha yeah Ecuatorania.


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Quoting Wedgetail737 (Reply 7):
believe you can make connections on TACA, LACSA and Copa to South America fairly easily from LAX

correct plenty of connecting opportunities, IAH, DFW, MEX, PTY. Still would be nice to see a couple more South American carriers at the largest O&D airport in the world..... If I had my choice, AR A340 and Varig 767, altough I'm sure that won't happen again


User currently offlineAirJamaica From Jamaica, joined Aug 2006, 2516 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6308 times:

( off-topic but ) Does AA still serve LAX-MEX ? If not when was it axed ?

[Edited 2009-03-15 13:14:38]


greenheart
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25150 posts, RR: 46
Reply 13, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6272 times:



Quoting AirJamaica (Reply 12):
Does AA still serve LAX-MEX ? If not when was it axed ?

I dont recall AA ever serving LAX-MEX.

They applied for it a few years back when Delta dropped the route, but the designation was awarded to AS instead.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineBigGSFO From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2920 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6269 times:



Quoting AirJamaica (Reply 12):
( off-topic but ) Does AA still serve LAX-MEX ? If not when was it axed ?

AA doesn't serve LAX-MEX and as far as I know, never served this market. They applied but lost to AS when DL left the market. They did operate LAX-GDL for awhile.


User currently offlineAirJamaica From Jamaica, joined Aug 2006, 2516 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6213 times:



Quoting LAXintl (Reply 13):
I dont recall AA ever serving LAX-MEX.

They applied for it a few years back when Delta dropped the route, but the designation was awarded to AS instead.



Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 14):
AA doesn't serve LAX-MEX and as far as I know, never served this market. They applied but lost to AS when DL left the market. They did operate LAX-GDL for awhile.

OK. Thanks for correction. I was probably mixing it up with LAX-GDL.



greenheart
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9343 posts, RR: 14
Reply 16, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6099 times:



Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 6):
DL has plans for LAX-GRU in Mary.

also DL has LAX-CUN and a few other citys mostly sat. only.



yep.
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25170 posts, RR: 22
Reply 17, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 5912 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 3):
BN and PA use to fly LAX-South America

Braniff had LAX-BOG and LAX-LIM nonstops in the 1970s, continuing to points beyond. Whey they acquired 747SPs in the late 1970s they operated LAX-SCL nonstop for a while.

I may be wrong but I believe Pan Am's only nonstop from LAX to South America was to CCS.

Quoting Eghansen (Reply 10):
Many people who are geographically challenged are not aware that South America is not due south of North America. DFW is GMT-6 and NYC is GMT-5. Santiago is GMT-4 and Brazil/Argentina is GMT-3.

If you look on a map, you will see that Buenos Aires is actually about even with Newfoundland and Sao Paulo is even with Greenland. It makes much more sense to have west coast passengers connect in Dallas, Houston, Atlanta or Miami than to offer nonstop flights.

Yes, common misconception. For example, if you fly due south from Detroit you don't even cross South America. You're over the Pacific Ocean.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25150 posts, RR: 46
Reply 18, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 5863 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 17):
I may be wrong but I believe Pan Am's only nonstop from LAX to South America was to CCS.

Also had GYE and SCL nonstops in South America, plus off course lots of Cen Am destinations.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineMalaysia From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 3343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 5837 times:

Did EVA AIR ever serve Central America via LAX?


There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5925 posts, RR: 40
Reply 20, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5825 times:



Quoting Malaysia (Reply 19):
Did EVA AIR ever serve Central America via LAX?

I think PTY in the past, with 74M



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25150 posts, RR: 46
Reply 21, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5773 times:



Quoting Avianca (Reply 20):
I think PTY in the past, with 74M

 checkmark  and with terrible results. -- I cant recall any flights with >100 pax per except for a few days during the Xmas holidays.

When Copa commenced LA directly, EVA had no chance and discontinued the route.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6187 posts, RR: 30
Reply 22, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 5712 times:
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I took AR 385 LAX-MEX-LIM-EZE and AR 384 in the opposite direction many times throughout the 70's and 80's. A few times I boarded at LAX and many more at MEX. I recall that the plane, a 707 in the 70's and later a 747, was usually full in F and Y. I always did wonder about that, as at the time, AR was flying also to JFK and MIA. Why can't they make the route work again?


MGGS
User currently offlineSpeedbird0125 From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 184 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 5562 times:

What about KE's LAX-GRU?
Are they doing good job on this route?


User currently offline4EVERVARIG From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 66 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 5530 times:

The reasons that LAX was so popular back in the days in traffic to and from South America was that it was the "midpoint" in traffic wise between Southwest Asia and Latin America. Also, Sao Paulo(GRU) has the 2nd largest Korean community outside of Korea, and Los Angeles being the 1st largest Korean community outside of Korea, there was a sizeable traffic between GRU/LAX/SEL. Also, Sao Paulo once had a large Japanese community outside of Japan, thus the demand for flights through LAX to Asia, as LAX also offered several options to travel to Asia.

Don't forget that back in the days, Korean Air did not offer direct flights to and from GRU or any other Latin American destination. The only asian carrier to serve LAX and GRU was JAL.

Also, back then, US government did not require visas for transit passengers. It appears that since 9/11, many from Latin America, are flying to Asia through Europe, mainly connecting in Paris(Skyteam), London(One World) or Frankfurt(Star Alliance) hubs as they are not required to go through a costly and rigorous VISA application requirements as it is being done to US travelers.


25 Juventus : A Brazilian aneter said Korean was doing very well on LAX-GRU. Not sure if they pick up any passengers in Los Angeles or most come from Asia.
26 Post contains links and images Superfly : Excellent thread Juventus! Not to be knit-picky but you should have chosen this photo for Varig representation. View Large View MediumPhoto © Se
27 WorldTraveler : California still has one of the largest Latin populations in the US. US carriers favor their east coast hubs while Latin carriers have generally not b
28 LAXintl : Certainly, but not primarily ones from South America, but instead heavily skewed towards Mexico and Central America. For example foreign born populat
29 Hardiwv : The only flights from LAX to South America: LAX-GRU Korean LAX-GRU Delta (due to start) LAX-LIM LAN LAX-BOG Avianca LAX-SCL (to be dropped on 28 March
30 4EVERVARIG : KE's load on LAX/GRU/LAX is not strong given the fact that the US VISA requirements prevent many to travel to GRU through this route. According to KE
31 Hardiwv : I dont think this is true. Where do you have this info? My information is that KE flight is usually showing loads of about 70% with C and F class hav
32 Legacyins : Korea is part of the Visa waiver program and Korean citizens do not need a visa to enter/transit the U.S.. Capturing traffic on the GRU-LAX-SEL is a
33 2travel2know : I'm going to dare to add LAX-PTY CM, since a big number of passengers on that flight actually end up in CM Southamerican destinations.
34 Juventus : SCL will be dropped??? how I wish you were kidding. Terrible news... Santiago has been served from LAX for years
35 LAXintl : SCL will still be served 1-stop. Basically LAN is routing everything via LIM again. (11x per week)
36 MayaviaERJ190 : and LAX-MEX-LIM AeroMexico (AM018 daily)
37 Superfly : Any chance of a LAX-GIG non-stop? Would TAM ever consider this?
38 Hardiwv : TAM is considering LAX-GRU and JNB-GRU with the later in its top-list of future destinations. Rgs,
39 MAH4546 : No chance. TAM didn't even start GIG-U.S. until this past fall.
40 Superfly : Well that's close. That is so hard to image. LA and Rio are such major cities with a lot of business ties as well as tourist. I am not doubting you o
41 4EVERVARIG : I got the info through the KE's LAX Base mgmt. In fact, I was told that the past few weeks have been extremely weak. Also, are you aware that KE does
42 Post contains links Viscount724 : Not yet. List of countries participating in the VWP in the table near the top of the following page. I believe Brazil has to meet certain other requi
43 DesertAir : While I was living in Guatemala in the 1990s AA began service from LAX to Guatemala and El Salvador. The service only lasted for a short time. I was l
44 MAH4546 : American Airlines has since resumed LAX-SAL, which they have operated daily for the past 4-5 years or so. There really aren't any significant busines
45 Superfly : Was the Varig MD-11 photo (post #26) a flight through LAX?
46 Juventus : [ Still the same almost 20 years later, with the execption of DFW instead of MIA... connecting in MIA would really suck, that's a 5 hour detour.... no
47 MAH4546 : Yes. Varig flights were through-flights to Nagoya and Tokyo, depending on the day. VASP flights were through flights to Seoul. When Varig discontinue
48 Hardiwv : Interesting because KE manager for Brazil mentiones load of 70%, with C class peforming particularly well. Actually KE strong performance was one of
49 Superfly : Wow. Didn't know yields were that light.
50 Jfk777 : The Varig MD-11 was landing at Hong Kong's famous Kai Tek which is now closed, it has been since 1998.
51 Superfly : I know that. I was asking if that Hong Kong flight went through LAX.
52 Viscount724 : No, the RG route to HKG operated GRU-JNB-BKK-HKG.
53 Jfk777 : no, IT went via JNB to BKK and HKG. Varig didn't operate the route very long.
54 Superfly : Thanks. That is a lot of stops for a single flight. Was range an issue for the MD-11?
55 Jfk777 : GRU to JNB is about 10 hours, BKK and HKG are 12 and 13 hours from JNB. It was really an extension of existing service from South Afriva RG operated
56 Superfly : Thanks for the info. I wish I had the chance to fly on Varig before they fell to the state they're in now. A cousin of mine just flew on TAM (MIA-GIG
57 Legacyins : As stated, Brazil is not part of the US visa waiver program. Visa waiver applicants are not vetted by their local AMCONs and as long as their passpor
58 4EVERVARIG : Understood that once you have the clearance you can pass through US ports. My issue is that it is very hard to get the initial clearance. It is not a
59 LAXintl : As a nugget of info, KE62 GRU-LAX arrived tonight with mere 91 passengers, and a flight I found records for last week had 105 onboard. Not very inspir
60 2travel2know : 91passengers enroute to ICN or 91 passengers disembarking in LAX? KE GRU-LAX-ICN requires U.S. (transit) visa so even if KE could get some traffic be
61 LAXintl : 91 total onboard GRU-LAX sector. How many of those 91 are for LAX or continuing to ICN, I don't have access to.
62 Juventus : Thanx for the info LAXInt'l, you usually have good data, I enjoy reading your posts. For those of us who want to see more South American carriers at
63 WorldTraveler : This is a pretty light time of year for travel but it is possible that KE wants to drop GRULAX and allow DL to operate the right. If KE was able to p
64 Rafabozzolla : It's NOT. I travel to the USA on my Italian passport. All I ever needed was to have an updated passport. Nowadays, on top of that, I go to ESTA websi
65 The777Man : My guess is that KE does very well with cargo to/from GRU so they can still make money with a low load like 91 passengers. The777Man
66 4EVERVARIG : I can't speak for or about the requirements for people from Italy or other European nations. However for Koreans, it is not as easy, as I have helped
67 LAXintl : Another data point: KE62 GRU-LAX tonight had 92 total passengers arriving LAX.
68 Legacyins : I think you are getting confused what the Visa Waiver program is. You do not apply for the Visa waiver program. Citizens of certain Countries can ent
69 FrmrCAPCADET : I don't think it has been mentioned, but all of South America is east of Florida. When you look at a globe an LAX flight to most of SA would pass not
70 4EVERVARIG : Many here are under the impression that under the VWP, any "Joe-6-packs" can get in a flight from Korea to anywhere in the US without any problems. B
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