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Delta PIT-CDG...what?  
User currently offlineEWRkid1990 From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 182 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 9523 times:

Delta started flying PIT-CDG. What gave them the idea that this route would be profitable? And why PIT? I was there a few weeks ago and the place was dead. Biggest plane I saw in my two and a half hours of waiting was a Southwest 737-700.

23 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineAf773atmsp From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 2706 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 9478 times:

Since DL and AF have a strong partnership there will be many connection opportunities at CDG. And service to CDG is the only TATL flight PIT has so no competition.


It ain't no normal MD80 its a Super 80!
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8910 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 9216 times:

This route is part of the AF/DL Joint Venture. Air France has a large stake in this route in terms of profitability, and with the JV, it made sense to use Delta equipment, since DL has the 757 which can cross the pond, while AF's smallest transcontinental plane is the A330-200. An A332 would be way too much metal, but a 757 probably fits the market.

Also, there is a revenue guarantee from Pittsburgh to mitigate any losses.


User currently offlineCush From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 249 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 9216 times:

This question has been discussed in all shapes and forms in the "Whats going on in PIT" threads. The reason this route is necessary is due to the large number of Fortune 500 and international firms that have their headquarters or offices in Pittsburgh. Based on sales volume thus far it has proven to be pretty successful!


Fly me to the moon let me play among the stars.
User currently offlineEWRkid1990 From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 182 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 9151 times:

Its also the only international flight PIT has. But will they be able to fill the seats?

User currently offlineNWADC9 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4898 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 9007 times:



Quoting EWRkid1990 (Thread starter):
Delta started flying PIT-CDG.

No they haven't. They will in June.

Quoting EWRkid1990 (Reply 4):
Its also the only international flight PIT has.

Air Canada Jazz and USA 3000 would like to beg to differ.

Quoting EWRkid1990 (Thread starter):
I was there a few weeks ago and the place was dead. Biggest plane I saw in my two and a half hours of waiting was a Southwest 737-700.

Because you arrived at a dead time. We actually get 757s already from United to ORD, and during the summer we get them from Delta to ATL.



Flying an aeroplane with only a single propeller to keep you in the air. Can you imagine that? -Capt. Picard
User currently offlineNwaesc From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3391 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 8951 times:



Quoting EWRkid1990 (Thread starter):
What gave them the idea that this route would be profitable? And why PIT?

I don't know about profitable per se, but I can think of a few million "reasons" why they started it up....



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15809 posts, RR: 27
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 8811 times:



Quoting EWRkid1990 (Thread starter):
What gave them the idea that this route would be profitable?

I think there was talk of revenue guarantees, or maybe that was RDU. Anyway, this is essentially an Air France flight. NW/DL/AF/KL don't care in the least which of them you fly across the Atlantic since it's all the same to them. DL had to be the ones to operate the flight since AF doesn't have 757s.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineThegreatRDU From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2311 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 7672 times:

The RDU flight was postponed until 2010..... it will be on a 757-200WL........ are there any incentives for this flight like PIT has and RDU-LHR or do they want to give it a shot?


Our Returning Champion
User currently offlinePITops From United States of America, joined May 2007, 1442 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 7607 times:

I personally think a Frankfurt flight would've been better.


Ground Ops, Southwest Airlines, CMH
User currently offlineUSPIT10L From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 3295 posts, RR: 7
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 7376 times:



Quoting ThegreatRDU (Reply 8):
The RDU flight was postponed until 2010..... it will be on a 757-200WL........ are there any incentives for this flight like PIT has and RDU-LHR or do they want to give it a shot?

The ACAA reported that they have a deal with DL to guarantee revenues, but the flight has been booking so well that DL doesn't think they'll need them to generate a profit on the route.



It's a Great Day for Hockey!
User currently offlineToltommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3304 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 7268 times:



Quoting PITops (Reply 9):
I personally think a Frankfurt flight would've been better.

Not on DL. No online connectivity to speak of on either end. With CDG, the connection possibilities on AF are huge.

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 10):
The ACAA reported that they have a deal with DL to guarantee revenues, but the flight has been booking so well that DL doesn't think they'll need them to generate a profit on the route.

Not exactly.....

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09078/956750-147.stm

Delta Air Lines has cut the price of its new Pittsburgh-to-Paris nonstop flight in an effort to boost demand. Roundtrip fares were available yesterday for less than $700 on Delta's Web site. That's almost half the introductory rate of $599 one-way based on a roundtrip purchase offered by Delta when the flight was first announced in November.

Delta spokeswoman Susan Elliott said the airline cut the fare in an effort to drum up additional demand for the flight. The move comes less than two weeks after Delta's district sales manager had said the airline was "very pleased" with early bookings.

"Basically we've adjusted prices to stimulate activity," Ms. Elliott said. "It was something we felt was needed on that route."


User currently offlineN670UW From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1606 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 7091 times:



Quoting Toltommy (Reply 11):
Not on DL. No online connectivity to speak of on either end. With CDG, the connection possibilities on AF are huge.

I'm sure he means on US. If anything, Pittsburgh probably has stronger business ties to Germany than to France, and with a LH code on the PIT-FRA flight, there would still be significant connecting opportunities beyond Frankfurt. Problem here is, US has no interest in such a flight.

I'm glad PIT will have something across the Atlantic, I hope it works out for DL and AF.


User currently offlineThegreatRDU From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2311 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days ago) and read 6929 times:



Quoting N670UW (Reply 12):
I'm glad PIT will have something across the Atlantic, I hope it works out for DL and AF.

And I hope the RDU flight works out too.... even though it probably won't



Our Returning Champion
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33173 posts, RR: 71
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days ago) and read 6845 times:

Quoting ThegreatRDU (Reply 8):
The RDU flight was postponed until 2010..... it will be on a 757-200WL........ are there any incentives for this flight like PIT has and RDU-LHR or do they want to give it a shot?

Honestly, I would not hold my breathe on that happening. In airline speak, a one-year delay is just as good as "canceled."

It's common practice among the airline industry to do this.

What is likely the situation is that, as of now, Delta does not plan to start the route. However, they will monitor market conditions and keep the route in mind.

That way, when if the route doesn't start, they soften the negative press.

[Edited 2009-03-22 20:35:26]


a.
User currently offlineFlaps From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 1292 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 6292 times:



Quoting N670UW (Reply 12):
I'm sure he means on US. If anything, Pittsburgh probably has stronger business ties to Germany than to France, and with a LH code on the PIT-FRA flight, there would still be significant connecting opportunities beyond Frankfurt.

While the local community does have stronger ties to Germany than France, connecting opportunities on DL/AF/KL/NW through CDG are greater. I have no interest in anything operated by US domestically or internationally. LH has studied the PIT-Germany market for years. If the market was ready they would have started it. They had access to the same support that DL/AF received. Maybe someday but not now.


User currently offlineYVR1968 From Australia, joined Feb 2004, 704 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 6089 times:



Quoting Toltommy (Reply 11):

Obviously this flight is not meeting Delta's expectations. The Delta spokesperson was rather vague about that.

Funny how they are focussing on that one inaugural flight!

Quote from the article:

"As part of efforts to pave the way for a successful takeoff, the Allegheny Conference is urging businesses, universities and others planning spring trips to Europe to book the June 3 nonstop flight to Paris."

What about the flights on the 4th, 5th, 6th,, etc etc... I think they should be focussing on more than just the inaugural!

And some idiot is actually counting the seatmap (probably on a daily basis - oh look, there is one more gone!) Do people not realise that a lot of seats are not even available to be booked online as they are either held for premium customers, exit rows or airport check-in. I wonder how many of these seats have actually been sold?

And about these subsidies being offered. Shouldn't we be stopping this kind of nonsense as it really is like another potential bailout. We have to get back into the mindset of letting businesses fail if necessary and stop with the handouts!


User currently offlineUSPIT10L From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 3295 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 4655 times:



Quoting YVR1968 (Reply 16):
"As part of efforts to pave the way for a successful takeoff, the Allegheny Conference is urging businesses, universities and others planning spring trips to Europe to book the June 3 nonstop flight to Paris."

What about the flights on the 4th, 5th, 6th,, etc etc... I think they should be focussing on more than just the inaugural!

And some idiot is actually counting the seatmap (probably on a daily basis - oh look, there is one more gone!) Do people not realise that a lot of seats are not even available to be booked online as they are either held for premium customers, exit rows or airport check-in. I wonder how many of these seats have actually been sold?

And about these subsidies being offered. Shouldn't we be stopping this kind of nonsense as it really is like another potential bailout. We have to get back into the mindset of letting businesses fail if necessary and stop with the handouts!

Welcome to Allegheny County, where money is thrown at everything and accomplishes little or nothing. As for complaining about "subsidies," if they didn't have them, none of these routes would be possible. PIT deserves international services, just like any other major airport. If the demand is there, the flight will work, period.



It's a Great Day for Hockey!
User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3304 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4180 times:



Quoting Flaps (Reply 15):
LH has studied the PIT-Germany market for years. If the market was ready they would have started it.

The problem for LH is equipment. DL is running a 757 on the CDG route. LH doesn't have anything nearly that small for international service. CDG gives good connectivity to all of Germany without any backtracking, so total travel time will probably be less to most cities.


User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15809 posts, RR: 27
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 4086 times:



Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 18):
The problem for LH is equipment. DL is running a 757 on the CDG route.

Exactly right. PIT-CDG is really an Air France flight, just with DL metal. AF, KL, and DL don't care which of them you fly across the Atlantic, it's all the same to them. Likewise, it doesn't matter whether you take LH or UA either. AA, IB, and BA are trying to get approval for the same thing but Sir Richard is having a fit.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9256 posts, RR: 21
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3991 times:



Quoting YVR1968 (Reply 16):

I respect your opinion, but I think you are wrong. DL even said that they are pleased with the rate of bookings for the CDG flights. They said they usually tweak fares on every route they start, and besides, I saw on CNN the other day that airlines all across the board (domestic and internationally) are drastically slashing fares. Welcome to the worst recession since the Great Depression...

Regarding the hapless ACAA, I have said enough about that 3 ring circus...



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15809 posts, RR: 27
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3965 times:



Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 20):
Welcome to the worst recession since the Great Depression...

Airlines were few and far between back then and the ones that did exist were heavily regulated. We are truly in uncharted waters now and anyone's guess is as good as mine as far as what will happen next.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9256 posts, RR: 21
Reply 22, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3948 times:



Quoting BMI727 (Reply 21):
Airlines were few and far between back then and the ones that did exist were heavily regulated. We are truly in uncharted waters now and anyone's guess is as good as mine as far as what will happen next.

There was few of pretty much everything back then. I was about to make a statement regarding that, but I refrained from doing so. I do not wish to think/ponder how bad things may get before they get better...

I do pray that this CDG flight is a success...  pray 



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15809 posts, RR: 27
Reply 23, posted (5 years 8 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3924 times:



Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 22):
There was few of pretty much everything back then. I was about to make a statement regarding that, but I refrained from doing so. I do not wish to think/ponder how bad things may get before they get better...

Don't worry too much. Attrition? Probably. An apocalyptic collapse of the industry? Probably not. The world would have a hard time operating without airlines.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
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