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Gordon 747 By British Airways  
User currently offlineSumma767 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 2559 posts, RR: 6
Posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 16525 times:

Whether it's because a large journalist core is accompanying him, because he wants to fly a larger flag, or for some other reason, Gordon Brown is taking to the Americas (with a stop in Strasbourg) onboard a BA 747. From the Downing Street Flickr photos, it seems that its G-CIVG

The British Prime Minister's trip will take him to New York, Brasil and Argentina.

It can be followed on google maps: http://www.number10.gov.uk/Page18702
Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/downingstreet/sets/72157615759473273/
and even Twitter.

80 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15730 posts, RR: 26
Reply 1, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 16487 times:

I think I found this flight on FlightAware as BA1. I've checked BA 1 several times since the Concorde left and it has been a 777 from ADW to LHR, which I assume is some sort of diplomatic flight.


Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineBlueFlyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3967 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 16378 times:
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Quoting BMI727 (Reply 1):

Correct. BA1 is scheduled to fly SXB-JFK this evening.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BAW1



I've got $h*t to do
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15730 posts, RR: 26
Reply 3, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 16315 times:

Is flight 1 used for government VIP charters then? For that matter, how often do such flights happen? And why does the British government charter airliners versus having a larger VIP wing of the RAF like the USAF?

[Edited 2009-03-24 10:37:45]


Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineLufthansa From Christmas Island, joined May 1999, 3207 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 16268 times:

Well, I for one
think its outrageous that GB (even though I dont like him, but he's still the bloody PM) has to take a chartered aircraft for this sort of trip. Bloody hell england, get over the tall poppy syndrome! Tunisia has just decided to get an A345 for its head of state. The least the UK could do is buy a BBJ... or maybe even something cheap like a 20 year old 767-300 or 757. Something that can fly at least 8 or 9 hrs non stop. It should be able to do Trans atlantic nonstop and Australia in 2 stops max.

This chartering BA aircraft all the time is mad. Why don't you all just ask him to catch the buss to work. Better still... why not ask him to walk, and pack his own lunch. And while your at it, why not call domino's for pizza when visiting heads of state come, that should save a bucket load! Come on folks this is got to the absurd level. The least that can be done is the RAF pick up a few clapped out 767s, refurbish them, add some anti missile technology and maybe some off the shelf fully flat bed business class seats, say something like what United use.. and some sort of premium economy seat for the press up the back and you'd have some kind of workable outcome.

Dear old Baroness Thatcher used to roar into town with power in the VC-10. Unfortunately its not exactly welcome everywhere anymore. So maybe its time for the Prime Minister to move into the 1980s. Surely that's not too excessive. When you consider Australia and Malaysia have BBJ's, Italia the Airbus 319, France the 340, Japan 747-400s, Canada A310s, Germany A310s, Iran has A321s, Russia has Il- 96's, (yes i think this would be better then the current arrangements) Bulgeria has Tu-154 M, New Zealand has 757s, Kuwait has A300s, Kazakhstan has 767, turkey has A319 CJ, Baharain Boeing 727-2M7/Adv(RE) Super 27 , Azerbaijan Airbus A319-115X CJ, Armenia Airbus A319-132 CJ , Brunei - Government - one of everything (maybe not the best example) Holland some fokkers, hell even argentina and brasil have 707s.... why does the worlds 4th largest economy and founder of the english speaking world have nothing? Sorry but the UK SHOULD be more influential in the world. What the bloody hell is going on in london? This has gone too far already! Nobody needs arab style imperial barge but they do need the tools to do the job effectively... and with secure communications and Air Force level protection that BA can't offer.


edit...for wine induced typos. but still point remains. the UK deserves better!

[Edited 2009-03-24 10:48:18]

User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15730 posts, RR: 26
Reply 5, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 16245 times:



Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 4):
Why don't you all just ask him to catch the buss to work. Better still... why not ask him to walk, and pack his own lunch.

I wouldn't put that past the environmentalists. There is certainly a very good case to be made for dedicated aircraft, especially this day in age.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineDavehammer From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2007, 472 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 16175 times:

I'd get the PM an A330 and be done with it. Seems daft to keep hiring when world leaders are busier than ever charging all over the place. Or they should have just taken one of the BA 747's that were just retired/cannibalised.

User currently offlineSumma767 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 2559 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 16145 times:

Just a correction on my original post: The PM will visit New York, Brasil and Santiago, Chile (but Argentina is not on the schedule as I originally wrote).

On why the British government does not get a long haul plane, well, only a couple of year's ago that was the intention. An airplane for long haul trips would be shared between the PM and the Monarch. There would also be a small jet for short hops. However, Gordon Brown himself chose to scrap the idea of the long haul plane, because the costs would not be any cheaper than the current arrangement of chartering commercial craft.

However, I am sure that it was mostly a political decision. Poor Gordon would have been mocked for getting a multi-milion pound aircraft for his travels.

Whilst the cost and comfort of travelling on BA compared to a government aircraft is probably similar, the current arrangenment does not address security issues. Even more importantly when the head of state is travelling.

I am sure BA is not complaining though! When they have plenty of 747s parked, this trip will be a nice little earner!

[Edited 2009-03-24 11:00:56]

User currently offlineDirectorguy From Egypt, joined Jul 2008, 1668 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 16098 times:



Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 4):
Dear old Baroness Thatcher used to roar into town with power in the VC-10

LOL, What a smashing way of putting it! My hat goes off to you

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 4):
Nobody needs arab style imperial barge but they do need the tools to do the job effectively...

Are you referring to the 8,000 camel power jewel-encrusted oil-guzzling/flying harem jumbo beauties used by the KSA, Kuwait, UAE and the like?  Smile
Somehow it's okay for the Air Force One to be a 747, but if it's for an Arab government it becomes an imperial barge of sorts...

Even the Royal Family doesn't have a proper aircraft. I say the British government buy 2 A340s to be shared between the PM and the Royals-it's shocking that HM has to resort to using a Hawker or a Piper, or some pathetic 9-seater. We clearly are not amused.


User currently offlineTheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 16097 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
Is flight 1 used for government VIP charters then? For that matter, how often do such flights happen? And why does the British government charter airliners versus having a larger VIP wing of the RAF like the USAF?


I think it is a lot cheaper to hire a large plane from an airline than to have one that you only use 6 times a year.

Quoting Summa767 (Reply 7):
Whilst the cost and comfort of travelling on BA compared to a government aircraft is probably similar, the current arrangenment does not address security issues. Even more importantly when the head of state is travelling.

I really don't think security is an issue in this sort of thing, if it was he wouldn't be on it.

[Edited 2009-03-24 11:17:03]

User currently offlinePHKLM From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Dec 2005, 1198 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 16071 times:



Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 4):
Holland some fokkers, hell even argentina and brasil have 707s...

The Netherlands has one Fokker 70 for government flights, however a section of KLM's World Business Class is sometimes reserved on request for longer flights AFAIK.

Argentina has Tango-01 and that's a Boeing 757.


User currently offlineSumma767 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 2559 posts, RR: 6
Reply 11, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 15998 times:

Quoting Theginge (Reply 9):
I really don't think security is an issue in this sort of thing, if it was he wouldn't be on it.

It is not much of an issue, and hence the PM and the Monarch go on a commercial airliner.
However, given the optional extras of anti-missile flares and other goodies on a dedicated aircraft, they would probably choose to have them, as indeed have some other government's aircraft.

Another issue is communications. I am sure ad-hoc arrangements can be made on these trips (satelite phone, of course, but access to internet?), but having a dedicated aircraft would allow more sophisticated and presumily more secure communications.

[Edited 2009-03-24 11:57:49]

User currently offlineDanfearn77 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2008, 1812 posts, RR: 9
Reply 12, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 15918 times:

I have always wondered why we dont have an aircraft for the head of state. Then i remember we are a country which complains at everything and all these bloody environmentalists get their own way!

I dislike his Lordship Brown but i agree we need an aircraft for the Head of State.



Eagles may soar high, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines!
User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13184 posts, RR: 77
Reply 13, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15754 times:

[quote=Summa767,reply=0]Whether it's because a large journalist core is accompanying him, because he wants to fly a larger flag, or for some other reason, Gordon Brown is taking to the Americas (with a stop in Strasbourg) on board a BA 747.

The reason will be, that BA provided the aircraft for this charter that not only fitted in with the PM's needs but also the allocation of aircraft within the BA operation.

Lufthansa, you may not know that in the past, when even the idea of a dedicated VIP type has been mooted, even using 2nd hand aircraft, the press over here have gone into overdrive.
It's become virtually politically impossible to consider it even.
Whether for the PM or Queen, or in reality, both.

It may not be logical to some, but the answer back will be that the current arrangement works just fine and reduces the costs of such trips.

It is also nothing new, Thatcher might have insisted on a VC-10 (despite RAF operational needs), but she went bonkers in Downing Street which is why her own party ditched her.
Today, the remaining VC-10 (and L1011) fleet of the RAF is way too heavily tasked in doing what they were really brought for, supporting the armed forces.
Nothing new since BA and it's predecessors such as BOAC have been providing such VIP charters for over 50 years.
So British PM's and the current head of state have been regularly flying on mere commercial airliners for a very long time.

More recently, the question of secure military communications if something major should happen while the PM was airborne has been mooted.
But don't expect a rational discussion in the press.
There wasn't one before the current economic crisis on this subject, no chance now.

The only way I can see the RAF getting an at least semi dedicated VIP type for longer haul charters, is via the A330 tankers being procured for the RAF.
Not those 14 airframes directly (they'll be way too busy), but perhaps if the current overstretch of RAF transport assets led to some A330-200's with R/R engines being acquired on the back of the problems in the airline industry, these could in time serve as VIP aircraft, when they were not training A330 tanker crews.

As for 'Tall Poppy', is that worse than the farce over the new US Presidential helicopter (which may well be repeated a decade hence when the current AF1's are replaced).
What used to be a fairly straightforward bunch of VIP aircraft and choppers supporting the US head of state seems to have morphed into an increasingly overblown air armada.


User currently offlinePar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7119 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15696 times:

It has been noted that BA is not a national airline and is in fact private, so my question would be, has Virgin ever been charted to carry the PM, why only BA, is this some back handed way to continue to subsidize BA?

User currently offlineLHRjc From Netherlands, joined Apr 2006, 1964 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15638 times:



Quoting Par13del (Reply 14):
It has been noted that BA is not a national airline and is in fact private, so my question would be, has Virgin ever been charted to carry the PM, why only BA, is this some back handed way to continue to subsidize BA?

I believe the PM has also flown on a Flightline MD90 and a Privatair BBJ in the not too distant past?



"Our 319's are very reliable. They get fixed very quickly."
User currently offlineTimboflier215 From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 1334 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15609 times:

I know that before Blair left office, he started a study into getting two VIP a/c - a 737/A320 sized plane and a smaller biz jet. Is this idea now dead or has the study simply yet to report its findings?

User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15730 posts, RR: 26
Reply 17, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15569 times:



Quoting Summa767 (Reply 7):
There would also be a small jet for short hops.

Aren't there some RAF BAe 146s for VIP use?

Quoting Directorguy (Reply 8):
Somehow it's okay for the Air Force One to be a 747, but if it's for an Arab government it becomes an imperial barge of sorts...

I wouldn't say that it is improper for an Arab government or any other government to have a nice plane. Also, the VC-25s (Air Force One) carry a large press contingent on many trips. Furthermore, they are fitted out comfortably but not luxuriously. Air Force One is more like a corner office than a mansion.

Quoting Theginge (Reply 9):
I really don't think security is an issue in this sort of thing, if it was he wouldn't be on it.

It isn't an issue until Joe Terrorist decides to dust off his Stingers. This is by far the best reason for any head of state to travel in a dedicated aircraft.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12464 posts, RR: 46
Reply 18, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15551 times:
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Quoting Davehammer (Reply 6):
Or they should have just taken one of the BA 747's that were just retired/cannibalised.

Which BA 747s were just retired/cannibalised?  confused 



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
User currently offlinePnwtraveler From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 2235 posts, RR: 12
Reply 19, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15488 times:

For how many days a year would Brown require this aircraft? How much more often does he fly within the EU and shorter haul aircraft are sufficient?

The aircraft mentioned for Canada is one of the A310's that Canada flies. They are easily reconfiguered and used for multiple tasks. The one with a VIP interior is hardly AF1 standards. Think old first class seats in the front and economy charter in the rear for press. It can be easily changed over to all economy. It can be used to ferry back fallen Canadian soldiers and even regularly scheduled Air Force flights. So while it has a VIP (yeah right) interior it is by no means a true head of state aircraft.

For the record the head of state aircraft deployed by some countries is hardly a positive to be cited.


User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13184 posts, RR: 77
Reply 20, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15489 times:

I think that Blair idea was dropped, by Brown when he became PM (to widespread approval too, at least in the media).

32 Sqn RAF has two remaining BAe-146, acquired in 1986.
They are almost now often tasked-along with some of their BAe-125's, in providing military liaison support.
This squadron is still referred to as the 'Queen's Flight' though in truth Royal tasking is I think less than 20%

BA do most of the VIP charters - when they haven't, BA's own operational needs have been a factor in at least two cases I'm aware of.
As I said, BA, before then, BOAC, have been doing them for decades, when one is required, BA have an inventory of cabin VIP kits for various types.
(And we once knocked one together in 1991 in Concorde G-BOAB's forward cabin, when it flew the Queen around the Southern US on a tour).
But another consideration might be that BA do not overtly make PR from doing these, who wants to bet the Branson would do similar, c'mon-he couldn't help himself!


User currently offlineDavehammer From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2007, 472 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 15464 times:

I thought that three of the older ones were sent down to Cardiff to be stored and had their Club seats taken out for installation into 777s. I may well have the wrong end of the stick though!

User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5188 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 15327 times:



Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 4):
This chartering BA aircraft all the time is mad

Perhaps it is cheaper than getting his own aircraft?

Who knows... but here in Aus they have a BBJ for the PM and small CRJ for other flights.


User currently offlineLHR27C From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 1279 posts, RR: 16
Reply 23, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 15288 times:



Quoting Par13del (Reply 14):
It has been noted that BA is not a national airline and is in fact private, so my question would be, has Virgin ever been charted to carry the PM, why only BA, is this some back handed way to continue to subsidize BA?

Absolutely not, it's purely a commercial charter. BA with a much larger fleet than VS naturally has more spares available. The VS operation uses all their fleet intensively and most of the time they do not have spare capacity for charters.

Quoting Davehammer (Reply 21):
I thought that three of the older ones were sent down to Cardiff to be stored and had their Club seats taken out for installation into 777s. I may well have the wrong end of the stick though!



Quoting Scbriml (Reply 18):
Which BA 747s were just retired/cannibalised? confused

G-BNLA,B and C, the 3 oldest BA 744s, are parked up at CWL due to lack of demand in the Winter 08/09 timetable. I would hardly call them retired/cannibalised though!



Once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned forever skyward
User currently offlineAerdingus From Ireland, joined Dec 2006, 2826 posts, RR: 15
Reply 24, posted (5 years 5 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 15075 times:

Somehow i dont think the PM flying around in his own plane would go down well with the general public of the UK. And at least this way money is being generated into a company.


Cabin crew blog http://dolefuldolegirl.blogspot.ie/
25 Par13del : One would think that the prestige of flying one's head of state at least once in a while would make them juggle their schedule. The onus of that woul
26 AirbusA6 : Perhaps BA could see us one of their 744s at a knock down price, as they get parked (especially when the 77Ws and A380s come into service). It could b
27 LHR27C : To correct one of my earlier posts, I just got an email which pointed out G-BNLA is still in service with BA. It's only G-BNLB and BNLC that are parke
28 Viscount724 : Why? If chartered aircraft are good enough for the Pope, does the British Prime Minister deserve anything better? In my opinion, the deciding factor
29 GlobeEx : Make it even a B744 Well, a 340 would be even better. An old A345 would have been perfect. With light loads you might have come close to LHR-SYD
30 Post contains links and images TomTurner : Tony Blair in a ......DC-8. Nice... Why not break out those VC-10s again... View Large View MediumPhoto © David Marshall Tom
31 JFKMan : Brown is here in New York? yuck...*faints* Why is he using a 747? Blair did not... Major got the Concorde...which was a nice way to show off :P
32 Post contains links VV701 : As others have pointed out Tony Blair when Prime Minister flew on an official visit to South Africa in February 2007 in a Swiss registered DC-8 (HB-I
33 TJCAB : correct. I believe they actually fly both of VC-25's they always have a backup, and then there is the support aircraft for the Limo's, helicopter, an
34 MAN2SIN2BKK : Yes, there are a number of A345s available; TG have got 4 they want rid of, one is only 3 years old
35 Irobertson : Tom, this DC-8 is still in pristine condition and for sale I believe. It would make a perfect low-usage private VIP for Britain. Failing that, you co
36 YULWinterSkies : Why would the British govt need an aircraft if they can work out deals with BA all the time? There is some money that can be saved by now owning an ai
37 Babybus : No head of state needs a private aircraft. It's 2009 for gawd sake! It's about time they entered into the modern world and used video conference calli
38 Aerdingus : Exactly, we've moved on from countries having to impress each other with State equipment. The Irish government has two Gulfstreams I think & it pisse
39 AirbusA6 : Gordon Brown needs a 747 to carry all the press people in the back, the whole trip is a PR stunt really, to show Gordon flying around, saving the wor
40 Lufthansa : Then you've never actually had to win somebody over in one of these group type situations. Face to face contact is absolutely vital if you actually w
41 AirlineCritic : Eh? Buy more aircraft and/or reduce current flights, just so that one aircraft can sit idle and be commissioned for PM charter duty if and when it ha
42 BRUspotter : Mr Brown gets to fly on a very sparkly clean 744, the last BA plane I flew on was filthy!
43 BMI727 : I hope you're joking.
44 LHRlocal : I can just imagine if the government ordered/bought any kind of plane for VIP use, the newspapers/media would have an absolute field day considering t
45 Babybus : You forget one thing in your analogy...all these guys know each other very well already. It's not like a job interview at all where you don't know th
46 Aerdingus : Exactly what I mean.
47 Babybus : There is one fault in your analogy here. All these guys know each other and speak to each other on the phone all the time. In a job interview two peo
48 Flypig687 : I am suprised to hear the the UK doesn't have VIP dedicated aircraft. I did not know VIP air wings are such a rarity. Here in the states the VIP Air W
49 GDB : Reply 37 might have been made in jest, but it quite accurately sums up the response if a dedicated VIP aircraft was procured. It's not about what PM i
50 Par13del : In the UK I think one would have to ask why the Royalty has VIP a/c and the Prime Minister does not, that probably goes a long way to explaining why
51 GDB : Or just don't mention the VIP part, since these A330's would honestly be initially as a general force supplement. Carrying troops around and similar.
52 Leezyjet : Utter tosh, the VS suite is longer than the BA First bed and it also has a dedicated sleeping surface, so is hardly uncomfortable. VS simply do not h
53 BMI727 : I don't think that the Cowboys have their own plane. The Dallas Mavericks have a 757-200 that is operated by Pace Airlines though.
54 VV701 : This is an unnecessary question as it is based on an incorrect assumption. In the UK neither the British Royal Family or the Prime Minister has a VIP
55 GDB : VV701 nailed it, on the subject, there was one of those inevitable carping campaigns in the press when it was 'revealed' that government ministers, we
56 Pnwtraveler : The A330 will be perfect for conversion to a VIP role the same as Canada does with A310. Once there are enough in the fleet that is. Not having a jet
57 BCAL : First and foremost the Prime Minister is not the Head of State of the UK. That role goes to the Queen or ruling Monarch. However Margaret Thatcher sta
58 GDB : BCAL, but how much were RAF aircraft used in the preceding decades? We know that Thatcher actually specified a VC-10, we've not seen that since. Did B
59 Post contains links and images DEVILFISH : Way to go! I say chuck the press, and get these two..... http://www.airbus.com/store/photolib...ct_image_lowres_709X473_A318_D.jpg http://www.airbus.
60 BCAL : The details were posted on the Ministry of Defence website and some figures were released in the accounts of the royal household. The Daily Mail, and
61 Danfearn77 : Wow what an amazing looking aircraft. Looks brand new. I'd be more than happy with that!
62 MD11junkie : Need to correct you a bit there. Brazil retired its 707 almost 4 years ago (if not more), for an Airbus A319CJ. Argentina has retired its T-01 707 pr
63 AirbusA6 : Being Prime Minister would be perfect for an A Netter, as think of all the aircraft you could hire "No we had the DC 8 last time, I want an IL 96 thi
64 Acontador : 'Speedbird 1' landed a couple of hours ago in Santiago, Chile. While I will not comment on the economics or rationale behind choosing a BA 747, I have
65 CityofAthens : Acontador, as BA cabin crew I must agree with you - I miss SCL terribly ... the views on the flight from EZE were simply stunning and I loved Santiag
66 GDB : I framed my reply poorly, what I should have said was 'is the the actual figure for the whole of the Blair government over that period?' That would m
67 AirbusA6 : Yes, though Gordon Brown's current global tour is very much of his own making, trying to badger the world into following his policies at home, when t
68 Babybus : I agree. A subscription to an internet provider and a MSN log-in name should do the trick. These politicians are supposed to be busy men. However, th
69 Lufthansa : I'm sorry but this is just utter nonsense. You don't have a clue if you think you can honestly achieve anything serious via MSN. This is nothing more
70 FlyingAY : My company is encouraging us to use remote connections, video conferencing, email, phone and other means in order to avoid unnecessary travelling. Th
71 GDB : While no one doubts the 'overstretch' (in truth not so unusual just more apparent), the shortage of support choppers (as lamented by Flight Internati
72 Theginge : This thread seems to be getting slightly political!
73 Lufthansa : Of course there is unnecessary travel in the world. But the job of head of state is a lot different to say the job of sales rep for a computer compan
74 Post contains images DEVILFISH : Spoilsport. Airbus might even give it as a bonus out of gratitude for the prestige of a "Royal XWB" order, though used by 32 Sqn. But I agree. The Gl
75 Lufthansa : lol, you got me! I couldn't sleep and got up.... with food on the brain... yes folks that would be there is far more at stake with the PM or Presiden
76 Speedbird128 : Sure. How many bizjets are there for the UAE 'so-called' VIPs? Abu Dhabi emirate *ALONE* (when i was last working there anyway) 2 B744 (A6-YAS, A6-UA
77 I380North : Now that Tony is gone and W is out, and the Obamas are still looking for a dog. You think your PM can apply for the lap dog position. Hmmmm...I wonde
78 AirNZ : Well now....................Gordon Brown isn't a Lord and most certainly he (nor any other Prime Minister) is not Head of State!
79 VC10er : I think Brazil has an A320. Lula bought it. Cardozo, the previous president gave an interview once on this topic. It was in Icaro magazine on VARIG w
80 Post contains links and images Acontador : As promised, here's one: View Large View MediumPhoto © Andrés Contador - AirTeamImages
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