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DL Axes BDL-AMS  
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7558 posts, RR: 8
Posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 9888 times:



Quote:
WINDSOR LOCKS, Conn. (March 27, 2009) – Connecticut Department of Transportation and Bradley Airport officials announced today that the flight by Northwest Airlines to Amsterdam, set to resume June 3, has been suspended. Given the challenging economic climate and poor advance reservations, airline officials from Delta Air Lines decided that the flight is not financially viable at this time, but will be reconsidered as economic conditions improve

Sad its unfortunate. So much for the economy supposidly bouncing back, but I have to wonder if the poor bookings was because people were fearful the airline would just drop the flight again?

http://www.bradleyairport.com/News/press.aspx?id=95


"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
46 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCAL764 From United States of America, joined May 2008, 377 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 9883 times:

I did have a feeling this would come. Sad but true. Here's another link: http://tinyurl.com/d8beam

[Edited 2009-03-27 11:32:54]


1. Fly to Win 2. Fund Future 3. Reliability 4. Work Together CO: Work Hard, Fly Right...
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6784 posts, RR: 17
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 9857 times:

Okay.. so that's RDU and BDL.. and the clock ticks for PIT...


Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineItalianFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1099 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 9616 times:



Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 2):
Okay.. so that's RDU and BDL.. and the clock ticks for PIT...

Unless the Commonwealth of PA and City want to throw more money at it, I am afraid you are right.


User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6784 posts, RR: 17
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 9561 times:



Quoting ItalianFlyer (Reply 3):
Unless the Commonwealth of PA and City want to throw more money at it, I am afraid you are right.

Perhaps they can buck the trend, but the news article about lowering rates to increase ridership did not sound too well. But, one can never know.. I wish them well whichever way it goes..



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineSurfandSnow From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 2897 posts, RR: 31
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 9485 times:

I am actually somewhat surprised...DL has a sizeable presence at BDL. Perhaps in the future we may see a BDL-CDG service, which would make more sense to me than AMS. I wonder if PDX-AMS will be next.


Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
User currently offlineToltommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3304 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 9385 times:

Wasn't BDL service about giving the banks and insurance companies an easier way to get to Europe? Given the current turmoil in the industry, I can see what this might not be as necessary as it once was....

User currently offlineUSPIT10L From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 3295 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 9095 times:



Quoting ItalianFlyer (Reply 3):
Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 2):
Okay.. so that's RDU and BDL.. and the clock ticks for PIT...

Unless the Commonwealth of PA and City want to throw more money at it, I am afraid you are right.

It's still loaded and while the prices have been cut, bookings are supposedly "good" according to DL spokespeople.



It's a Great Day for Hockey!
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6784 posts, RR: 17
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 8947 times:



Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 7):
bookings are supposedly "good" according to DL spokespeople.

yes.. and RDU-CDG will be back in 2010... RDU/CMH/BDL-LAX will return when the market turns.. BDL-AMS will return when the market turns..

I wish PIT luck.. they may be the ones that make it.. but I see a riptide occuring..



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23212 posts, RR: 20
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 8829 times:



Quoting ItalianFlyer (Reply 3):
Unless the Commonwealth of PA and City want to throw more money at it, I am afraid you are right.

Haven't they already agreed to throw money at it? With the economy how it is, DL would be foolish to walk away from the guaranteed revenue.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33194 posts, RR: 71
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 8820 times:



Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 8):
yes.. and RDU-CDG will be back in 2010... RDU/CMH/BDL-LAX will return when the market turns.. BDL-AMS will return when the market turns..

I wish PIT luck.. they may be the ones that make it.. but I see a riptide occuring..

The PIT-CDG flight runs on huge subsides, just like RDU-LHR. It will live and die on the subsidy bank.



a.
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9670 posts, RR: 14
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 8791 times:



Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 2):

read below.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 10):
The PIT-CDG flight runs on huge subsides, just like RDU-LHR. It will live and die on the subsidy bank.

In two years PIT-CDG will likely be gone unless they extend the contract. But it should start in time.



yep.
User currently offlineAzjubilee From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 3984 posts, RR: 28
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 8759 times:

The success of any of these p2p routes is the customer. If they don't book, the flights don't make it. No amount of subsidy can help the fact that people just either aren't traveling or are indeed willing to drive for a better price. PIT-CDG is no different.

User currently offlineAzjubilee From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 3984 posts, RR: 28
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 8740 times:

Since there is no way to edit... I should clarify that instead of P2P, I should haven't written small/medium size markets. After all... AMS is virtually a hub, as is CDG and NRT.

User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23212 posts, RR: 20
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 8684 times:



Quoting Azjubilee (Reply 12):
No amount of subsidy can help the fact that people just either aren't traveling or are indeed willing to drive for a better price. PIT-CDG is no different.

The PIT subsidy is, IIRC, structured as a revenue guarantee. That makes it irrelevant to DL whether people fly or not (to the extent that it matters, DL likely actually prefers that people NOT fly, as it's somewhat cheaper to fly an empty airplane than a full one).



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlinePITrules From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 3236 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8130 times:

Looks like PIT is now 4x weekly except for the middle of summer.

PIT's flight has subsidies start if revenue does not meet a certain level. We still don't know what that level is, and may never know.

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 11):

In two years PIT-CDG will likely be gone unless they extend the contract. But it should start in time.

Lets hope in two years the global economy will allow all these flights (PIT, RDU, BDL, etc) to operate and sustain themselves.

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 14):
That makes it irrelevant to DL whether people fly or not (to the extent that it matters, DL likely actually prefers that people NOT fly, as it's somewhat cheaper to fly an empty airplane than a full one).

If that's the case I doubt Delta would have put the flight on sale.



FLYi
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16892 posts, RR: 51
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8112 times:

If AA and BA ever get their anti trust immunity granted then I could see AA flying 757s from BDL to LHR, until then I don't see any other viable Trans-Atlantic routes from BDL.


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5348 posts, RR: 25
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7909 times:



Quoting STT757 (Reply 16):
If AA and BA ever get their anti trust immunity granted then I could see AA flying 757s from BDL to LHR, until then I don't see any other viable Trans-Atlantic routes from BDL.

I actually think that CDG would have had a chance too. Obviously LHR will be better but I think that CDG could also work.



Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7838 times:



Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 10):
The PIT-CDG flight runs on huge subsides, just like RDU-LHR. It will live and die on the subsidy bank.

I dont think RDU-LHR has subsidies I think it has a contract


User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9262 posts, RR: 21
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7698 times:



Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 4):
Perhaps they can buck the trend, but the news article about lowering rates to increase ridership did not sound too well. But, one can never know.. I wish them well whichever way it goes..

At first, no it did not, but all across the board airlines are slashing fares for the upcoming Summer. It's not just PIT-CDG on DL that is seeing fares slashed in half...

Quoting PITrules (Reply 15):
PIT's flight has subsidies start if revenue does not meet a certain level. We still don't know what that level is, and may never know.

I am still optimistic that PIT-CDG will be a success. It's a shame that BDL-AMS and RDU-CDG were suspended...



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5348 posts, RR: 25
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7689 times:



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 18):
I dont think RDU-LHR has subsidies I think it has a contract

Glaxo essentially pays for the flight by purchasing a block of seats on each flight. That is a subsidy.



Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6784 posts, RR: 17
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7596 times:



Quoting OA412 (Reply 20):
Glaxo essentially pays for the flight by purchasing a block of seats on each flight. That is a subsidy.

Incorrect. Glaxo AND A BUNCH OF OTHER COMPANIES have an agreement with AA to offer the flight through the RTRP (Research Triangle Regional Partnership). They may purchase the seats, I'm not sure.. I don't think anyone knows except AA and RTRP. But Glaxo is just one of the players.. not the only player.. And the cargo on the flight also provides good revenue..



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9670 posts, RR: 14
Reply 22, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7307 times:



Quoting PITrules (Reply 15):
If that's the case I doubt Delta would have put the flight on sale.

One wold hope that no city/airport would be so stupid to let them do so.



yep.
User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7271 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 22):
One wold hope that no city/airport would be so stupid to let them do so.

 checkmark 

Let's be a little realistic here.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineFuturePilot16 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2035 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 8 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 7002 times:

I actually was planning to fly BDL to AMS in the near future (didn't book yet). I live in Ct and that flight was the closest I would have to drive to an airport (rather than driving 2 hrs to JFK). Really sad to see it go.


"The brave don't live forever, but the cautious don't live at all."
25 Cubsrule : I'm sure that selling the flight was a condition of the subsidy...
26 BMI727 : Exactly. Subsidies are just the bait cities use to attract airlines. Whether a flight remains or not is based on how many people actually fly it. I d
27 PITrules : How is that a subsidy? The service is so valuable to Glaxo and whomever that they pay for a block of seats - even if they don't use them all. If taxp
28 Cubsrule : ehh... They have other things they could do with the aircraft.
29 PITrules : Delta doesn't think so. If this flight is hypothetically able to support itself after two years, Delta would drop it anyway to do "other things"? Oth
30 BMI727 : Right now DL won't do other things with this aircraft because it's at least some guaranteed revenue (pretty nice these days) and they must think that
31 PITrules : I agree 100%. I was just replying to the notion that Delta would want this route to intentionally tank to save operating costs flying fewer passenger
32 BMI727 : Of course not. If they did this, it would essentially be a 2 year charter contract. The subsidies act to lower the barriers to entry. Airlines like t
33 Sectflyer : As a supporter of the BDL-AMS flight I am disappointed, but not to surprised. I kind of saw this coming. First the reduction from 5 to 4 days a week.
34 Burnsie28 : So does anyone think that if the flight does come back that people won't book it because they don't have faith in the airline to keep it around?
35 USAirALB : I doubt DL will even reconsider it....I hope they do, I can get to BDL in about 1hr and 20 mins, so that was great, its kinda my secondary airport. Le
36 Sectflyer : I don't think it was a lack of faith in the flight. It is the economy. European vacations are a low priority when your worried about getting laid off
37 Seemyseems : Wiki is saying that DL is ending ATL - AMS, this can't be right.
38 Burnsie28 : Thats why I said if it does come back... seems like based off all the press releases that people are getting frusturated.
39 Sectflyer : The flight should have been booked full on its first day as a show of support. It was not even close. They say RDU-CDG is on for next year. Perhaps BD
40 Sectflyer : I absolutly believe people will book it if they bring it back. If this had been 1999 or even 2004 the flight would have been a money maker. Fuel kicke
41 Burnsie28 : You'll notice that it says its being replaced by Northwest Airlines... which is indeed true.
42 EXAAUADL : That isnt really the economic definition of a subsidy. That is more like a revenue guarantee or a ticket bank. The reson there is a difference as far
43 Cubsrule : The local market to CDG is probably a bit larger; perhaps CDG would work better. It's a bit farther, but either route is well within the range of the
44 Seemyseems : So it will be NW until they dissapear then will be back to DL? Is DL keeping MAN? Thanks
45 Burnsie28 : Correct, these flights are DL XXX but operated by Northwest, they are being managed by the Delta (Deltamatic) system. Just like the Delta flights lik
46 Cadet57 : Which is what was said about BDL. Take your statement with a shaker of salt.
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