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Hainan Airlines To Buy Boeing & Airbus Planes  
User currently offlineCartenz From Indonesia, joined May 2007, 32 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 8006 times:

Just read on Bloomberg.com that Hainan Airlines plans to purchase 14 Boeings and nine Airbuses, plus to lease 15 planes. No details on the type of the planes, yet. Anybody know?

Please see the news at
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601089&sid=aajd8OntGaDI

14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineJoecanuck From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 5318 posts, RR: 30
Reply 1, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7826 times:

That seems odd to me. As much as China really wants Hainan to be an international tourist hotspot, I doubt it will ever happen. Haikou has a huge airport, that's almost completely deserted. I have no idea what they are going to do with the planes.

There are probably hundreds of half completed apartment blocks in Haikou, and hundreds more finished, yet vacant, blocks. The resorts which are completed, are empty.

Sanya is touted as a resort area but it's mostly run down and has a lingering odeur of low tide...but it is incredibly overpriced.

The rest of the island is almost completely rural and doesn't support anything remotely touristy.

It is a beautiful island but I'm not sure they have a need for a bunch more planes parked at the terminal.



What the...?
User currently offlineBrenintw From Taiwan, joined Jul 2006, 1569 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7804 times:

Didn't Hainan take one of the A346 from CX -- and it's still sitting at HKG ... what's the story with that anyway?


I'm tired of the A vs. B sniping. Neither make planes that shed wings randomly!
User currently offlineHNL-Jack From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 817 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7657 times:



Quoting Joecanuck (Reply 1):
That seems odd to me. As much as China really wants Hainan to be an international tourist hotspot, I doubt it will ever happen. Haikou has a huge airport, that's almost completely deserted. I have no idea what they are going to do with the planes.

I've spent considerable time in Hainan primarily to consult, unsuccessfully with the government on strategies to build Hainan to what they refer to as the "China's Hawaii." While I agree with most of what you say, the airport facilities in Haikou are old, dilapidated and far from huge. And as you said, mostly deserted. Sanya on the other hand has a fairly new terminal that looks like a smaller version or the original Dulles terminal, but like Haikou is mostly vacant. They only turn on the air conditioning and lights when there is a flight on the ground.

It's an island that is hot and humid, has a beautiful landscape, but will never be a resort area that appeals to western tourists for several reasons of which you've touched on a few. While many of the beaches are beautiful, most have polluted water due to the lack of adequate sewage systems. The hotels lobbies are loaded with teen age prostitutes, particularly in Haikau, one of the primary reasons they get six million tourists a year. And, most of them are businessmen from China. And to top it off, the government is extremely corrupt, looking for payoffs every time you turn around. Poverty is evident throughout the island, with some of the worst slums in Haikou that I've seen in my travels around the world.

The island could have appeal, it's close to Japan and could offer a convenient tropical experience. Unfortunately, that's unlikely to change as those in power seem to like the "class" system they have in place and don't really appear to want to do what's necessary to change things.



Grew up in the business and continued the family tradition.
User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2453 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7570 times:



Quoting Joecanuck (Reply 1):
That seems odd to me. As much as China really wants Hainan to be an international tourist hotspot, I doubt it will ever happen. Haikou has a huge airport, that's almost completely deserted. I have no idea what they are going to do with the planes.

Despite the name, you will find that most of their international flights do not operate from Haikou or Sanya. And they are not restricted to hub at Haikou, they have hubs in Beijing, Xian, Taiyuan, Ningbo, Tianjin & Urumqi.

Does this give you an idea why they might need so many aircraft?

Quoting Brenintw (Reply 2):
Didn't Hainan take one of the A346 from CX -- and it's still sitting at HKG ... what's the story with that anyway?

Rumour has it that it may be wetleased to CRK/HKE. Who knows where it would end up? The saga continues.

Slightly off topic. We keep thinking most of the A320s/A330s ordered by CRK/HKE would eventually be taken up by Hainan given the dire state CRK/HKE is in. Anyone knows when these aircraft are due to be delivered?



A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
User currently offlineBrenintw From Taiwan, joined Jul 2006, 1569 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7490 times:

CRK/HKE has 14 Boeing and 50 Airbus aircraft on order according to Wiki (how accurate that is, I have no idea ...)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CR_Airways

Could these be the aircraft referred to by Bloomberg -- with Hainan simply taking over (some of) the existing orders of its subsidiary?

Wiki claims: 4 B738, 10 788, 30 A320 and 20 A332.

[Edited 2009-04-30 01:46:49]


I'm tired of the A vs. B sniping. Neither make planes that shed wings randomly!
User currently offlineJoeCanuck From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 5318 posts, RR: 30
Reply 6, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 7451 times:



Quoting HNL-Jack (Reply 3):
While I agree with most of what you say, the airport facilities in Haikou are old, dilapidated and far from huge.

I guess the airport looks huge because there's never much of a crowd. As for everything else;  checkmark 



What the...?
User currently offlineZKEOJ From New Zealand, joined Feb 2005, 972 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 6074 times:



Quoting HNL-Jack (Reply 3):
one of the primary reasons they get six million tourists a year

Can you elaborate on this one? I assume they are domestic tourists, but they have to get there as well, thus isn't there a lot of traffic for Hainan Air then? Just out of interest, not questioning you or the other posters at all... I am a tourism expert and it is interesting to me to find out  Smile

Cheers
micha


User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8625 posts, RR: 15
Reply 8, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 5955 times:

Per the latest issue of airways, Hainan or Grand China airline have the following on order:

14 A319-132 due 2009- 2010
13 A320-232 due 2010-2012
22 B738 due 2010-2012
2 A332-243 due Jul09, 2010
3 A330-242F due May10, 2011, 2012
10 788 due 2010-2013

For their subsidiaries:

Deer Air
3 Gulfstream G350's due 2010
1 Gulfstream G550 due 2011
1 Boeing BBJ due 2011

Grand China Express Air:
39 Harbin built Embraer E145
41 Embraer E190

Enjoy the info and I hope its correct and per Airways, they have 3 A346's, 3 763ER's, 6 A342's, 2 733's, 6 734's, and 38 738's.

KH

[Edited 2009-04-30 14:38:29]

[Edited 2009-04-30 14:40:37]


Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineEghansen From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 5841 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 4):
they have hubs in Beijing, Xian, Taiyuan, Ningbo, Tianjin & Urumqi.

Hainan Airlines is actually the HNA group which owns four airlines and have taken over terminal one in Beijing for their exclusive use. This terminal (the old domestic terminal) has 13 jetways including 2 for widebodies. In addition to domestic flights from Beijing, they fly to Berlin, Budapest, Brussels, Moscow, St. Petersburg and Seattle.

They are also to planning to use 50 aircraft to build up a hub at Xian.


User currently offlineHNL-Jack From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 817 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (4 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4605 times:



Quoting ZKEOJ (Reply 7):
Can you elaborate on this one? I assume they are domestic tourists, but they have to get there as well, thus isn't there a lot of traffic for Hainan Air then? Just out of interest, not questioning you or the other posters at all... I am a tourism expert and it is interesting to me to find out Smile



Almost all are male, from the mainland and Hong Kong.



Grew up in the business and continued the family tradition.
User currently offlineSneiled From France, joined Feb 2009, 10 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (4 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 4215 times:

The position and development of Hainan Airlines on domestic and worldwide market is quite difficult to understand for westeners.
It is same the complexitiy than Hainan province's tourism development project. Hainan island want to be the main tourism destination in Asia.
Hainan Airlines want to be world class airline ...on their own way
It takes time as they need to fine tuned their expansion strategy. They have strong assets and are well financially loaded
It is one of the major airline in China for domestic market. (4th)
Now they operates international flights from Beijing to Europe and the USA and fly only to cities that are not really main international airport (e.g.: Seattle, Brussels and Berlin)
They target those cities to develop a niche market which is a risky strategy but it will probably payoff on the long term.
I bet that in less than a decade Haikou will become a mojor hub both domestic and international. First Asia then Russia, Europe and the US. But who knows if Haikou is their priority as a main hub?
Sanya (300KM south of Haikou) is their major city for Hainan tourism and they plan to extend the airport (new Internatinoal Terminal just completed in 2007 but extension is already on the way).

I bet Hainan Airlines will be one of the major airline in Asia by 2020. They have very high expectations as they learn (copy?!) from EK, QR and SQ.
They can be the leading airlines they want to be but they need to have an "outside eye"...


User currently offlineSneiled From France, joined Feb 2009, 10 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (4 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 4192 times:



Quoting HNL-Jack (Reply 3):

If you have world class hotel such as Ritz Carlton, Marriott, Starwood (Meridien and Sheraton already opened), IHG, Hilton and Banyan Tree opening hotels out there, there must have a huge market and not domestic wise only...
They do need a lot of improvement but they are slowly on the way.
The corruption of the Hainan party leaders is a real handicap to the tourism development. It could be faster and well done. They need better support from the Central Government and have a genuine strategy based on their main competitors. They want to beat Phuket and Bali but they do not want to develop the same way... This is all about how China handles their growth.


User currently offlineAstral From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 214 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (4 years 11 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3919 times:

I wish to input a few up dated information on Hainan Airlines. The airline itself is owned by the HNA Group, which also owns hotels, coaches, part of the two airports in Hainan Island, shopping malls etc etc.
The items that would be of concern to us would be (1) Hainan Airlines has changed its business name (i.e. DBA) to Grand China Airways (2) It is the fourth airline in China granted 'international' licience and operational status (3) HNA Group owns major shares in Hong Kong Airlines/Hong Kong Express Airways, and send in executives from Hainan Airlines to sit on the Board. (4) HNA Group also owns a number of smaller airlines in China, inclding Deer Jet, China first executive charter jet company, and grouped them under Hainan Airlines.
A little history may help too. Hainan Island was upgarded to a Province about ten years ago (exactly how long I have to search for the info), and enjoyed considerable concessions from the Central Government to help to establish itself. Major concessions included lower taxes, lower import/export regulations, plus a range of others.
Hainan Island was also the first territory in China that received 'Open Sky' authority from CAAC. That will allow any international carriers to fly directly into/out of Hainan Island with no restrictions and with 5th Freedom. All in the name of promoting tourism to this tropical weather island.
Even as a long time supporter of China, and with ongoing consultantcy contracts with aviation ettities in China, I am supposed to say good things about China, but I must concure with HNL Jack about the problems in Hainan. It is very funny to hear some of my Chinese friends in CAAC commented that Hainan Airlines is operated by Priates from South China Sea !!!
I have 'interesting contacts' with HNA Group executives a few times last year, and I concluded that they have no idea how to run an international airline. They basicly has a kind of a grand dream coupled with some semi-realistic forcast and unwillingly given concessions from CAAC. They only exist for political reasons, and for the Island's economical future., However, if they can bring their houses (HNA Group and Hainan Airlines) in order, they could become a real force to deal with as they have a lot of political backup power and financial sources.
Anyway, those Airbus and Boeings are existing orders and are to be replacment for B767 on Hainan's own routes, and A330 for Hong Kong Airlines/Hong Kong Express. One point to note is that those B737-8s now operated by Hong Kong Airlines/Hong Kong Express are to be replaced by the new A320/321 and A330 from HNA Group.


User currently offlineJoeCanuck From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 5318 posts, RR: 30
Reply 14, posted (4 years 11 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 3845 times:



Quoting Astral (Reply 13):
It is very funny to hear some of my Chinese friends in CAAC commented that Hainan Airlines is operated by Priates from South China Sea !!!

This cracked me up. I visit a buddy of mine who is a professor at Hainan U, in Haikou. He has lived in China for 6 or 7 years. His experiences mirror yours to a large degree.

To give the Chinese credit, they are spending a lot of cash improving their agricultural infrastructure. We did a couple of cross island tours in a mighty QQ and there is a lot of road building. Of course, this is after what looks like decades of neglect.

One more note on Hainan; The island is reputed to have the most bland food in China. Nothing I ate there came close to refuting that.

They are also in the middle of cranking out an elevated train which will connect the train station to the airport and city. With luck, it will be finished before the airport collapses under the weight of it's neglect. On the up side, you never have to worry about crowds at the airport.



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