MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31730 posts, RR: 72 Reply 1, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 6875 times:
More unneeded hysteria. I don't think AA crew did a single thing wrong. It's the flu, people need to get over it. And the swine flu isn't particularly more dangerous than the regular flu, which kills over 100,000 Americans annually.
CityofAthens From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 2, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 6861 times:
Not sure we have all the facts to hand here .... while a Doctor may have the benefit of experience and specialised knowledge , flu symptoms aren't always obvious ... either the AA crew didn't spend enough time with these two passengers to realise they were showing the relevant symptoms, or the two passengers in question weren't showing obvious signs of specifically having "flu" as opposed to a common cold or just a sore throat, or the symptoms were obvious and the AA crew didn't follow required procedure (which is what the article implies).
Not trying to excuse the crew but I can see how they may not have reported something they weren't sure of, or didn't believe was the case.
Nomadd22 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 1695 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 6772 times:
What do you think the odds are of having a group of 150 people without some of them having "flu like" symptoms? There's enough of this fear mongering garbage in the media without another knee jerk hysteria ninny trying to make something out of nothing.
Sancho99504 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 559 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 6584 times:
I agree with most of the replies on here. I don't think this swine flu "PANDEMIC" is serious. They were raving about SARS in 2003 or 04 which wasn't as serious as the media made it out to be. I also don't think AA did anything wrong. It's the passengers own stupidity for traveling with flu like symptoms in the first place. It's selfish people like this that make things worse than they are.
Flybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1796 posts, RR: 1 Reply 11, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3938 times:
When the H1N1 hits India it's just going to mushroom because of the squalid and dense conditions of the very poor in and around the major cities. However, I have to agree with other people... this is much ado about nothing. Regular flu kills tens of thousands a year yet no one talks of a regular flu pandemic. Now this swine flu "pandemic" got people frightened around the world. I went to the grocery store yesterday to buy a bottle of hand sanitizer... sold out because some lady hours ahead of me bought every last bottle on the shelf (or so the cashier says).
I'm not sure thermal imaging at airports are reliable either. What if someone was running to make a connection? Their image is going to light up like a roman candle. Are authorities going to bar people from travel because they're a little sweaty? Nowadays airports and relaxation are mutually exclusive.
"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
Ckfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 4906 posts, RR: 1 Reply 12, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 3082 times:
One point to remember is that the flu can come on very quickly. I once got up and 6:00 and felt fine. By 10:00, I wasn't feeling very well. By 1:00, I realized I had the flu. That's a span of 7 hours. It's certainly possible that the passengers in question boarded at ORD with no symptoms, but were showing symptoms, by the time the plane landed in DEL.
FLFlyGuy From United States of America, joined May 2004, 242 posts, RR: 3 Reply 14, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2976 times:
Well, whoever is at fault, it certainly isn't the flight attendant crew. This is the message we got from the company on 28APR:
" in-flight, when the Purser/F/As may notice pax that may indicate physician on call notification via the captain, please note this does not require any updates or changes to the gen dec form for the flight. The question on the form related to illness is when a known ill customer has been approved for travel at flight departure. Please continue to follow the normal operating procedures for completing the general declaration form for all flights.
Thank you for your cooperation."
So, even if the passengers did appear sick, according to AA we weren't supposed to list that on the General Declaration. Now, personally, I am not sure that makes sense, but that's what we have been told.
The views expressed are my own, and not necessarily those of my employer.
WorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2971 times:
Quoting FLFlyGuy (Reply 18): So, even if the passengers did appear sick, according to AA we weren't supposed to list that on the General Declaration. Now, personally, I am not sure that makes sense, but that's what we have been told.
very interesting. I would like to know where AA says that notification should be made to authorities n the event of illness on board the flight.
Other FAs that can speak to the procedures on their int'l flights are welcome to contribute.
FrmrCAPCADET From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1615 posts, RR: 1 Reply 17, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 2877 times:
Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 19): carriers don't offer you a free deferral and refbook if you are sick, so if the question is "fly with the flu or waste $1000 or more" most people would fly with the flu...
Just another example of "if the government does not regulate" private industry often tends not to do the right thing.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
While I too feel the media is creating hysteria, we should not oversimplify the problem. The core issue is not the # of deaths, but the mortality (ie death) rate. If regular flu kills 36,000 out of 36M a year who get it, the death rate is 0.1%.
But if swine fly kills 70 people out of 700 who get it, then the death rate is 10%, or swine flu is 100 times more dangerous. So while the chances of getting it may not be high, the risk of death one you get it could be very high.
That is why the WHO etc are not taking any chances.
Airline crews are trained in airline safety, not to make medical diagnoses. They do not have the education necessary to distinguish between swine flu symptoms and an allergy. I would be extremely upset if an airline crew member stopped me from boarding because that crew member "suspected" me of having some particular ailment.
If the Indian (or any other government) is worried about incoming international passengers having any particular ailment, then it is up to that government to supply whatever procedures and personnel to screen for that particular ailment. Airlines personnel should not co-opted into performing tasks on behalf of governments that they are not educationally equiped to handle.
Should an airline employee stop an international passenger from boarding if the crew member suspects the passenger has AIDS? Many governments prohibit AIDS sufferers from entering their countries.
Airliner crews are flight and safety personnel, not health and police officials.
DLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3566 posts, RR: 10 Reply 21, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 14 hours ago) and read 2702 times:
Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 20): which is why all they are required to do is inform governmental officials if they are aware of any health problems on their flight. That's all they can be expected to do.
But then you start down a slippery slope of what constitutes a "health problem"?
If I cough or sneeze during a flight, should I be reported upon arrival. If I am suffering from a hangover and arriving into a country that prohibits alcohol, should that also be reported? What if I have a skin rash? It could look like a symptom of many communicable diseases to a FA, but in fact would only be psoriasis. If I were reported to the authorities on this basis and refused entry, you can be sure that I would sure both the airline and the medically untrained FA upon my return to the USA.
Airline crews do not have the necessary medical background to be able to determine what a legitimate "health problem" is.
That is why every government has their own immigration and custome procedures, in order to look at each individual and package entering the country, to determine if they pose any sort of threat to thier community.
The airlines should not be undertaking any responsibility for determining the healthiness of their passengers, including the "reporting of suspects".
WorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 22, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 14 hours ago) and read 2692 times:
Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 21): But then you start down a slippery slope of what constitutes a "health problem"?
I agree. Airline personnel should be limited to what they are TOLD by passengers about their health - not their assessment. Asking an FA to determine if the grimace on someone's face is because they having pre-term labor or a heart attack vs. just the emotions of travel is not something airlines should be expected to do.
But airlines do in fact have an obligation to report known health problems on their flights.
Burkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4303 posts, RR: 2 Reply 23, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 14 hours ago) and read 2678 times:
The Hysteria about the mexican flu is mucgh more dangerous than the disease itself. But it is the ground for a multi billion dollar business. Drug industry is far more powerful and makes more $ than aviation industry.
No FA is a doctor and can diagnose a flu, resp the danger of a mexican flu. Countries that make such rediculous requirements just should be banned from flying there.
Cubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 21766 posts, RR: 19 Reply 24, posted (4 years 7 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 2628 times:
Quick question for those in the know in India about this paragraph from the article:
Quote: It was a grave mistake on the part of the carrier to overlook such sick passengers even though it's now mandatory for airline staff to ask passengers about their health condition during the flight, identify those with influenza symptoms and report them to airport health officers before landing,'' one official said.
So are AI and IC going from row to row and individually quizzing passengers about whether they have flu-like symptoms?
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
25 Aajfksjubklyn: The only thing spreading this flu was CNN, mass hysteria is right.
26 Boeing747_600: It doesn't require a medical degree to establish that someone has flu-like symptoms.