Falcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 12899 times:
Per our Daily News Update:
Service to cease on three routes from EWR
Beginning June 11, CO will discontinue service from EWR to three cities: Birmingham (BHM), Ala., Columbia, (CAE), S.C., Lexington (LEX), Ky. The routes are operated by CO’s regional airline partners. BHM, CAE and LEX will continue to have service from IAH.
CO will also reduce service from EWR to Ashville (AVL), N.C., Hartford (BDL), Boston (BOS), Jacksonville (JAX), Fla., Kansas City (MCI), Norfolk (ORF), Va., and Toronto (YYZ).
The schedule changes are part of an effort to ease congestion and delays at EWR, taking into account the current capacity needs and relative financial performance of the routes.
COflyerBOS From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 331 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 12832 times:
The BOS flights are NEVER on-time so they might as well just reduce them. I avoid connecting in EWR now if I can. However, if flying to Europe, I make sure to give myself at least 4 to 5 hours for connection time, especially in the winter. Better safe than sorry.
A318 From Bahamas, joined Jan 2008, 410 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 12283 times:
ORF and YYZ reductions come as a surprise to me. I'm a flight attendant with 9L on the Q400 and those flights are constantly full. Continental has been replacing mainline flights to BOS with the Q400 so I'm assuming that's part of the reduction. Since I started flying back in May of 2008, the two destinations I hear that we are going to start flying to on the Q are MCI and JAX.... who knows.
IAHFLYR From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 4790 posts, RR: 21
Reply 7, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 12001 times:
Quoting COflyerBOS (Reply 2): The BOS flights are NEVER on-time so they might as well just reduce them
Never, never, as meaning not even 1 flight has been on time in the entire history?
Sorry, had to comment on that statement as a very good friend of mine is a CO Captain and has recently flown the EWR-BOS and then BOS-IAH legs once a week for the month of March. They made it back to IAH all four weeks in time to play golf in the early afternoon, which couldn't happen if the BOS flights were NEVER on time.
Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
STT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 17243 posts, RR: 50
Reply 10, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 11329 times:
Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter): CO will also reduce service from EWR to Ashville (AVL), N.C., Hartford (BDL), Boston (BOS), Jacksonville (JAX), Fla., Kansas City (MCI), Norfolk (ORF), Va., and Toronto (YYZ).
I checked CO's website and I don't see any changes for the Summer from the current frequencies.
CLE757 From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 1171 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 11254 times:
Quoting A318 (Reply 5): ORF and YYZ reductions come as a surprise to me. I'm a flight attendant with 9L on the Q400 and those flights are constantly full. Continental has been replacing mainline flights to BOS with the Q400 so I'm assuming that's part of the reduction. Since I started flying back in May of 2008, the two destinations I hear that we are going to start flying to on the Q are MCI and JAX.... who knows.
TOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3343 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10945 times:
Quoting A318 (Reply 5): ORF and YYZ reductions come as a surprise to me. I'm a flight attendant with 9L on the Q400 and those flights are constantly full.
Full doesn't equal profitable. There's a lot of seats in the EWR-Toronto market between AC, CO and Porter. That keeps yields down. ORF has a lot of military, flying on GOV or MIL fares, which are also low yield. Personally, I suspect that the "congestion" excuse is just that. CO didn't have any congestion problems at EWR when they were able to attract a higher fare.
Yes, in fact all three markets dropped are big Delta cities. I suspect that these markets were already marginal for CO, and with the prospect of losing the DL code and SkyTeam affiliation, there wasn't much hope for improvement. These is perhaps a small shakeout of the merger and alliance switch.
Klwright69 From Saudi Arabia, joined Jan 2000, 2258 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10619 times:
I have taken CO on EWR-CAE several times, but it was like 16 years ago. At one time I think they had it combined with a GSO stop. Actually I was trying to get to Augusta GA (which CO has also served briefly, but never lasted)
As I recall, EWR-CAE has been dropped and added back several times over the course many, many years.
It has never really done much financially I suspect, it is just there to bolster the EWR hub. Not a real surprise as access to EWR should be rationale.
Cubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23956 posts, RR: 21
Reply 19, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 9739 times:
Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 14): Yes, in fact all three markets dropped are big Delta cities. I suspect that these markets were already marginal for CO, and with the prospect of losing the DL code and SkyTeam affiliation, there wasn't much hope for improvement. These is perhaps a small shakeout of the merger and alliance switch.
That makes sense to me. I see three categories of cities here:
1) Strong DL cities where your analysis is spot-on (BHM, CAE, AVL, JAX, LEX)
2) Short flights whose cuts probably legitimately are congestion-related (BOS, BDL)
3) Routes that are probably just weak (MCI, ORF, YYZ)
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
KITH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 379 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 9726 times:
ITH is also losing all service to EWR starting on June 11.
It is a real shame and when the route was announced last summer the community reacted positively.
ITH did well for CO giving them significant international feed through their EWR hub to destinations in Europe as well as Asia.
One only hopes NW will up their second DTW flight with a CRJ, or that NextGen and the airspace redesign in NYC will soon allow a vast improvement and CO to reenter the ITH market.
ScottishLaddie From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2004, 2386 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 9596 times:
Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 12): I've heard routes like EWR to BHX/BRS/BFS and SNN have all been struggling recently...
The routes still seem busy enough (BRS sometimes looks a bit on the low side) but judging by lower BizFirst loads and reduced prices I'd say yields are struggling, but that's nothing unique to CO and their UK routes, this is obviously a universal problem just now with the recession etc.
Flyinryan99 From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 2068 posts, RR: 14
Reply 22, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 9523 times:
Quoting KITH (Reply 20): ITH is also losing all service to EWR starting on June 11.
Even though they are flying full means that either the yields aren't good or the congestion is the culprit. Is CO pulling the other Dash 8 Q200 flights out of EWR too? MDT is the only other one I can think of off of the top of my head (I know there are more). Are they going to replace other RJ routes with the Dashers or are they going to move the Q200s around again?
Soxfan From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 879 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (6 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 9069 times:
Quoting A318 (Reply 5): Continental has been replacing mainline flights to BOS with the Q400 so I'm assuming that's part of the reduction
If available, why not reduce the frequencies to Boston, as they are, but replace the 733s and 735s with bigger aircraft such as the 738, 739, or even the 757 at peak times? Capacity wise, it could potentially be combining two shuttles into one, which would also allow for a lessening of the congestion.
Now, if only they could do something about the weather...
Pilot: "Request push, which way should we face?" JFK Ground: "You better face the front, sir, or you'll scare the pax!"
: SYR gets the Q200 from EWR. They already put the 737 on EWR-JAX. I don't know if that ended for the summer or not, but I'd imagine that this would be
: I don't think there is any such thing as a "good" B1900 route! Mike
: No surprise here. I'm actually still surprised they have service to EWR from BDL. The flights are almost always late and at least when I travel (whic
: Probably true. If you built enough ground time into the turn, it wasn't an issue. But if you start parking plase, productivity moves up on the priori
: Curious as to how they will reduce it... it would be down to 4x which for such a short hop is horribly inconvenient.
: I always thought the DH2 flights in EWR were just placeholders while the FAA considered slot control. Now that the FAA has said no auctions or slots,
: all CLE-EWR and other inter-hub service must be all mainline only, based on a union agreement.
: I honestly think it would kill them. They, like UA, don't have the metal to spare. I have said it on here before and i'll say it again, there is no r
: Birmingham is a fairly large city to be losing service to EWR, or so I would think. LEX and CAE are much smaller markets, not too surprising consideri
: Interesting, all midwest and northeast passengers essentially cannot fly CO to BHM as CLE and EWR are cut as they will not go to IAH to connect (logi
: True, but we do have flights like CO Connection flight 8700 that go CLE-SYR-EWR, and flight 8752 that go EWR-SYR-CLE. It cannot be sold CLE-EWR and b
: One of the times I went from EWR-CAE the flight was cancelled-this was on mainline aircraft at that time-no one paid much attention as there was proba
: OKC has been spared....I was fearing the worst when I saw the thread title...
: CO planes do spend their fair share of time in the various 'penalty areas' around BOS...notably on 15R when that runway isnt being used
: I agree. AA has plenty of mainline to BNA, perhaps the most besides WN and both seem to do well. CO should really be looking into this because it doe
: That's not what I said.... That's what I said, thanks for the help.....
: Ah, Thanks, Falcon for the clarification on bridging.
: I just did a random check for SYR-EWR for July 20th and it shows 2 E145's, 1 Q400, and a Q200 compared to this friday which shows 2 Q200, 1 E145, and
: CO carries something like 6 PDEW on BDL-EWR, so the question is really whether they can offer acceptable connecting opportunities with only 4 flights
: We used to get daily (I think), CO flight from IAH to YEG and they dropped sometime in late '06 or early '07, does anybody know why?? All other Americ
: They did serve the route, however they had better use for the 737-500 during the day so they tried the red eye flight that didn't serve the business c
: what about CLE-YEG?--it would feed into the red-eye schedule better with CLE being in ET zone and may have more O&D than IAH.
: CLE-YEG would have far less O&D traffic than IAH-YEG, which would be largely powered by oil traffic.
: With 9 daily UA flights into YEG (4 DEN, 3 ORD, 2 SFO), I'm not sure that CO really needs to serve YEG.
: Am I the only one surprised that CO is still operating MSN-EWR? It always seems to make the cut.
: With respect, you’re missing the boat. It wasn’t until last year that the draconian slot controls took effect in that CO had to “use or lose”
: I agree with you about that. In addition to UA, AC obviously has a nice network out of YEG and good connections via YYC, including EWR and IAH (as we
: By that logic, they should stop flying to ORD, DEN, YYZ, FRA, etc.
: The adequacy of CO/UA's service at YEG has nothing to do with the adequacy of their service at any other station.
: You said that CO is outgunned at YEG and therefore questioned the need for CO in the YEG market. The same circumstances are present in other markets;
: No you're not... I've wondered this myself. It gets in to EWR at ~ 2100, so I can't imagine there's much of anything left to connect to (if there's a
: Perhaps you could point me to the place where I said that CO was outgunned... I simply observed that the level of service to YEG is adequate (adding
: That's not the sense I took from "With 9 daily UA flights into YEG (4 DEN, 3 ORD, 2 SFO), I'm not sure that CO really needs to serve YEG."
: My feeling is that CO is primarily concerned with being able to offer YEG as a destination to its customers, not necessarily serving it themselves. C
: Exactly YEG probably won't see service right away on CO, but I wouldn't be surprised to is a CRA fly that route in 2010 or a E70 with United.
: could 757's be dropped from EWR to LHR and replaced with real Atlantic jets, 767's would do nicely.
: I questioned the need for YEG-IAH. I never said that CO was outgunned. FWIW, with the oil traffic, a UA ExPlus aircraft might be a more appropriate a
: CO has a 777 already on EWR-LHR with the two other frequencies being 752s. I wish CO had ordered more 767/777 or more 757 back in the day because tho
: OK, this marks a couple of times I misunderstood your meaning. Since nobody else has any trouble, it must be my fault.
: CO is bringing in 67 737-900ERs which have the same capacity as the 757-200s, actually the 737-900ERs have more First Class seats. They're also addin
: They ARE real Atlantic Jets. They're certified for the routes; they can do them efficiently and safely for the airlines. Gosh, but I get tired of hea
: i love flying up front on the 757..........much more than a 777 or 764!!!