Luvflng From Costa Rica, joined Nov 2000, 178 posts, RR: 0 Reply 1, posted (4 years 7 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 6767 times:
In all honesty, would you think that UA mainline pilots would let management weasle them out of international flying? Since the negotiations with UA APLA started last month, EI IAD-MAD flying will be used as a concession from the management to give something back to the pilots. IMHO, you will never see EI flying for United.
Mercure1 From French Polynesia, joined Jul 2008, 887 posts, RR: 2 Reply 3, posted (4 years 7 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 6514 times:
'We are very excited by the potential of the partnership and believe that the unique combination of two leading transatlantic airlines can drive significant value for the shareholders of both companies,' commented Aer Lingus CEO Dermot Mannion.
Dermot Mannion left the CEO spot only 3 months after saying this...hmmmm
United From Germany, joined Jan 2004, 311 posts, RR: 0 Reply 4, posted (4 years 7 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 6446 times:
Quoting Luvflng (Reply 1): In all honesty, would you think that UA mainline pilots would let management weasle them out of international flying? Since the negotiations with UA APLA started last month, EI IAD-MAD flying will be used as a concession from the management to give something back to the pilots. IMHO, you will never see EI flying for United.
Right on. The number one issue in the contract negotiations this time around is scope. Scope is the defining factor in how many flights may be outsourced and how many may be kept. This is nothing new; it exists with the ALPA agreement to allow UA a certain percentage of UX flying, which has in recent years vastly increased (with the advent of CR7s, E70s,..) and, arguably, taken away 737 flying from United pilots. Now, with the pending EI agreement, crews hired entirely separately from the UA and EI pool of pilots (and perhaps cabin crew too) will be used, paid far less than pilots at either existing entity, and will presumably used to an ever increasing number of transatlantic routes to cut staffing costs... just as the UX agreements have done to the smaller mainline UA jets flying.
In my opinion, the pilots at UA will never let this happen. I have heard, though, that the EI pilots unfortunately do not really have much say in the issue of scope within their contract.
Pinhammond From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2006, 36 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (4 years 7 months 3 days ago) and read 6078 times:
Writing as one who had negotiated 2 agreements to fly for a US carrier on sectors which had been flown on their own aircraft within Europe I can tell you that there is no way that ALPA will consider such an idea even for one micro-second.
COEI2007 From Vanuatu, joined Jan 2007, 1912 posts, RR: 6 Reply 11, posted (4 years 7 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 5306 times:
P**s off UA and EI unions at the same time? Not the smartest thing from UA and EI!
EI's former CEO had come up with this idea. He is now gone, so lets hope the idea is gone. Most airlines are cutting back transatlantic capacity, and a route like IAD-MAD on a 330 is madness at this time. It was supposed to be on sale last month, and still isnt, so that isnt a good sign. I doubt UA's partners would be to happy about having EI flying for them!!!
Alphaomega From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 542 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (4 years 7 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 4169 times:
IAD-MAD was originally set out to be sold by UA and EI, with UA booking most of the seats and EI operating the route with their aircraft and personnel.
Why? Not sure, but I'm guessing we can get a good thread going about the why...
In any event, the daily IAD-MAD is scheduled to start next March, along with IAD-DUB going daily...so we shall see how it unfolds. UA and EI are already cooperating on the IAD-DUB route with mixed results.
Both the UAL and the EI pilot contracts have specific language that prohibits this type of operation. I can assure you, both pilot groups would let their airline go under rather than allow this operation to take place.
Despite leaving One World, Aer Lingus kept most of their links with airlines in the alliance such as the British Airways code share which has been expanded to more Irish-London routes recently. They dropped the American Airlines code share in favour for a more extensive partnership with United which see's the UA code on all Aer Lingus transatlantic flights and the EI code on a number of domestic United flights. After leaving One World Aer Lingus also began their partnership with JetBlue which has proven very successful in the first year. I think Aer Lingus will feel the need to join an alliance again but I don't think it will be One Word, more likely is Star Alliance as they fly to more of their hubs and have this close relationship with United.
Shamrock604 From Ireland, joined Sep 2007, 4060 posts, RR: 13 Reply 20, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3628 times:
Quoting Pinhammond (Reply 7): Writing as one who had negotiated 2 agreements to fly for a US carrier on sectors which had been flown on their own aircraft within Europe I can tell you that there is no way that ALPA will consider such an idea even for one micro-second.
It's funny Pinhammond, when ever it's something to do with Aer Lingus, you are "speaking as someone who has done..... such and such".
Can you give some back up perhaps?
It's just you said something similar when EI started its Gatwick ops...
Flown EI,FR,RE,EIR,VE,SI,TLA,BA,BE,BD,VX,MON,AF,YS,WX,KL,SK,LH,OK,OS,LX,IB,LTU,HLX,4U,SU,CO,DL,UA,AC,PR,MH,SQ,QF, EY, EK
Joeljack From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 891 posts, RR: 0 Reply 23, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 1887 times:
Still would like to know if it counts toward Lifetime United Flight Miles (million miler status) If it doesn't, then I will continue to connect in FRA or MUC, just like several other people that I know. I wish United would publish this.