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A350 XWB - Test Flight Programme  
User currently offlineAviationbuff From India, joined Mar 2008, 1425 posts, RR: 3
Posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 8031 times:

Five A350 XWBs to feature in test-flight programme

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...ture-in-test-flight-programme.html

Quote:
Airbus' test-flight programme for the A350 XWB will comprise five aircraft, two of which will be fitted with interior cabins.

The airframer expects to complete the five aircraft relatively quickly, in the space of about six months.

As per A350 XWB programme head Didier Evrard
    Second and fifth aircraft will be fitted with cabins.
    Fifth aircraft will be used largely for longer flights to test the capability for operations
    while the early fitting of the second is designed to address customisation and definition "challenges" with the cabin.
    Sixth aircraft off the line will be the first specifically for customers.


Other highlights includes:
    The test regime to last about 15 months but says the flight programme could be completed in 12, with around 3,000hr total flight time.
    Airbus has already passed the crucial 'MG5' review stage for the A350-900 variant, which has frozen the design of the fuselage, wings, empennage and systems architecture.
    The airframer will reach both technological and manufacturing readiness for the twin-jet by the end of this year and be "in place to manufacture the first parts


18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineAirCanadaA330 From Canada, joined Aug 2008, 292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 7629 times:
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I wonder if Airbus has learned from the A380 and B787 delays, but since Im new at all of this...what are the chances the A350 will have delays? I cannot wait to see the finished product roll off the line!

Cheers;



Cheers;
User currently offlineMCIGuy From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1936 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 7572 times:

Quoting AirCanadaA330 (Reply 1):
I wonder if Airbus has learned from the A380 and B787 delays, but since Im new at all of this...what are the chances the A350 will have delays? I cannot wait to see the finished product roll off the line!

Hard to say at this stage but Airbus has left themselves lots of breathing room.

[Edited 2009-05-12 16:16:21]


Airliners.net Moderator Team
User currently offlineEbbUK From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 7454 times:

Really great to see Airbus incorporating lessons learnt from the 380 to the XWB. The importance of delivering planes that are ready to go, outside and in.

My bet is they will do the tests in 12months but there will be a delay somewhere out of the woodwork. Not so sure about the fitting of interiors so early on in the manufacturing process. Those buggers will slip up.


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30528 posts, RR: 84
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 7429 times:
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It sounds like they're following the A380 gameplan, which in and of itself was a valid one so they look to be taking a reasonably conservative approach.

User currently offlineTdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7205 times:



Quoting Aviationbuff (Thread starter):
The test regime to last about 15 months but says the flight programme could be completed in 12, with around 3,000hr total flight time.

This is bad news for somebody but, at this point, I can't tell who.

Boeing is using 6 airplanes to test two engines types in ~9 months. Airbus is using 5 airplanes to test one engine type in 15 months. Either Boeing doesn't have a snowballs chance in heck of making their schedule, or Airbus is massively sandbagging their schedule.

Tom.


User currently offlineRedFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4312 posts, RR: 28
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7145 times:



Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 5):
or Airbus is massively sandbagging their schedule.

From a PR and customer satisfaction perspective, they're aiming for the bullseye. (Not surprising considering their experience with the A380 and watching the 787 program unfold.) However, being overly cautious in business only adds to their costs. In the final analysis, I don't think they will endure the skepticism Boeing has on the 787. Unless, of course, they manage to allow the program to crater with incessant delays.



I'm not a racist...I hate Biden, too.
User currently offlineCHCalfonzo From New Zealand, joined Mar 2007, 182 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7119 times:



Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 5):
This is bad news for somebody but, at this point, I can't tell who.

Boeing is using 6 airplanes to test two engines types in ~9 months. Airbus is using 5 airplanes to test one engine type in 15 months. Either Boeing doesn't have a snowballs chance in heck of making their schedule, or Airbus is massively sandbagging their schedule.

Delaying deliveries is much more expensive than padding out the flight test schedule. Im sure that if Boeing could turn back the clock they would allow themselves more time for the 787 flight test program too.



Piper power!
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7056 times:

12 months with some margin sounds realistic. However plans always look good in advance..

I would like to see a timeline. I think it would also be crusial how the supply chain has progressed in preparing for production of the major CRFP parts (fuselages) .


User currently offlineAviationbuff From India, joined Mar 2008, 1425 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 6138 times:

Some more update on Flight:

Airbus to test A350 fuselage/cabin behaviour early in flight-testing

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...elagecabin-behaviour-early-in.html

Quote:
Airbus has revealed the first details of the A350 XWB's flight test programme, which will involve five aircraft flying about 3,000h. The airframer intends to begin flight-testing a cabin-equipped aircraft early in the programme to understand the interior's behaviour in the carbonfibre fuselage.

The -900 is the lead A350 variant and final assembly of the first aircraft is due to start in Toulouse by mid-2011, with first flight scheduled to follow "eight to nine months" later in the first quarter of 2012, says A350 programme chief Didier Evrard. Certification and service entry is due to follow a 15-month flight-test programme of about 3,000h, in mid-2013.

Airbus revises A350 Trent XWB thrust values following weight increases

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...hrust-values-following-weight.html

I was expecting all these press releases during the Paris Air Show; and to steal some limelight from 787 which will be buzzing with activities such as first flight and other relates tests during the same time.


User currently offlineScouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 3373 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5888 times:



Quoting Aviationbuff (Reply 9):
The -900 is the lead A350 variant and final assembly of the first aircraft is due to start in Toulouse by mid-2011, with first flight scheduled to follow "eight to nine months" later in the first quarter of 2012, says A350 programme chief Didier Evrard. Certification and service entry is due to follow a 15-month flight-test programme of about 3,000h, in mid-2013.

So final assembly will begin in 2 years time, so we're looking at recongnisable components appearing about 9 months before that - late next year - it's closer than you think Big grin


User currently offlineFrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1560 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5745 times:



Quoting Keesje (Reply 8):
12 months with some margin sounds realistic. However plans always look good in advance..

Exactly.

Quoting AirCanadaA330 (Reply 1):
I wonder if Airbus has learned from the A380 and B787 delays, but since Im new at all of this...what are the chances the A350 will have delays?



Quoting Keesje (Reply 8):
I would like to see a timeline. I think it would also be crusial how the supply chain has progressed in preparing for production of the major CRFP parts (fuselages) .

Somehow, I doubt if any of the major parts like fuselage, wings, engines will cause any bottlenecks. The devil is in the details - who on Earth would have guessed that fasteners would be such a huge part of the 787 delays?



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT4/7,ATP,CRK,E90,F50/7
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5603 times:



Quoting Frigatebird (Reply 11):
The devil is in the details - who on Earth would have guessed that fasteners would be such a huge part of the 787 delays?

Well right after roll out, we "saw" something was fishy
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...general_aviation/read.main/3604483
..got royally beat up of course  fight  See reply 13  bitelip , in hind sight nobody wanted to see..


User currently offlineAircellist From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1709 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 5204 times:

Interesting re-read... Thanks, Keesje.

And another dose of respect to Astuteman and WingedMigrator...


User currently offlineBaroque From Australia, joined Apr 2006, 15380 posts, RR: 59
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 4764 times:



Quoting Aviationbuff (Reply 9):
Airbus revises A350 Trent XWB thrust values following weight increases

You would think they might have left a bit of a margin when they shrank the things!! IIRC, the smallest is now back where it was. Just hope this is not the saga of the RR Spey over again.


User currently offlineTrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4679 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3818 times:
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Quoting Aviationbuff (Reply 9):
Airbus revises A350 Trent XWB thrust values following weight increases

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...hrust-values-following-weight.html

so are they still below the thrust they first thought they needed before the cuts in 07?anyone remember what the original specs were?


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30528 posts, RR: 84
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3801 times:
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Quoting Trex8 (Reply 15):
so are they still below the thrust they first thought they needed before the cuts in 07?anyone remember what the original specs were?

Initial thrust for the A350-800XWB was 75,000lbs, so they are now back to where they were.

Initial thrust for the A350-900XWB was 87,000lbs, dropping to 83,000lbs and now at 84,000lbs. So they are still 3,000lbs below the original spec.

Initial thrust for the A350-1000XWB was 95,000lbs, dropping to 93,000lbs and now at 94,000lbs. So they are still 1,000lbs below the original spec.



What I am somewhat intrigued by is that the A350-800XWB is supposed to be the lightest plane and "over-winged" and yet it requires all of the original thrust while the larger and heavier models do not...


User currently offlineTrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4679 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3785 times:
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Quoting Stitch (Reply 16):
What I am somewhat intrigued by is that the A350-800XWB is supposed to be the lightest plane and "over-winged" and yet it requires all of the original thrust while the larger and heavier models do not...

"stubby" short fuselage causes more drag?? Big grin - I'm not an engineer!!!
or they overestimated how overwinged etc it was


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30528 posts, RR: 84
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3712 times:
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Well many Airbus Aficionados firmly believe the A350-800XWB having a common wing with heavier models would endow that plane with a not-insignificant aerodynamic performance advantage compared to the 787-9's wing and would therefore play a not-insignificant role in providing the A350-800XWB with overall performance equal to, if not greater than, the 787-9 even though it's the "shrink" to the 787-9's "stretch".

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