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Delta Adding New Routes?  
User currently offlineDeltaHolland From Netherlands, joined Dec 2008, 94 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 9566 times:

Do you think Delta would ever add routes such as-
Oslo, Warsaw, Helsinki, Or Lisbon?
I have to say i'm very suprised Delta gets most of there routes to work for them.

36 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 9967 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 9513 times:

Well, they've had all those routes, at one time or another, in the past. Not sure what the plans are for those particular cities in the future.

Quoting DeltaHolland (Thread starter):
I have to say i'm very suprised Delta gets most of there routes to work for them.

Why does this surprise you? Contrary to many opinions on here, DL hasn't been successful with their international routes just because of dumb luck.



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineDirectorguy From Egypt, joined Jul 2008, 1639 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 9460 times:



Quoting DeltaHolland (Thread starter):
Do you think Delta would ever add routes such as-
Oslo, Warsaw, Helsinki, Or Lisbon?

These routes tend to be very seasonal in terms of demand. OSL, WAW and LIS are all *A hubs, with HEL a ow hub, so there isn't any Skyteam feed at these ends. IMHO, the whole point of being in an alliance is delegating traffic to secondary European points to the regional carriers (AF and KL in this case). It's very tricky otherwise.


User currently offlineNWAESC From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 3372 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 9384 times:



Quoting Directorguy (Reply 2):
IMHO, the whole point of being in an alliance is delegating traffic to secondary European points to the regional carriers (AF and KL in this case).

 checkmark 

Only things I would add are that A) NW ran MSP-OSL for awhile, and it was a miserable failure, and B) Of the 4 you mentioned, I would say LIS has the best shot of coming into being. That's just my opinion...



"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
User currently offlineDeltaHolland From Netherlands, joined Dec 2008, 94 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 9181 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 1):



Quoting Directorguy (Reply 2):



Quoting NWAESC (Reply 3):

I see, I actually never thought of that, your completely right. I would think that LIS would have the most potential. NW served OSL? Suprise Suprise. Also, I read on wikipedia last year that Continental and Delta wanted to add WAW. But as you know, wikipedia isnt the best for those type things.


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6346 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 9151 times:



Quoting DeltaHolland (Reply 4):
NW served OSL? Suprise Suprise.



When NW served OSL it was also serving CPH, ARN, PIK, SNN and HAM.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16694 posts, RR: 51
Reply 6, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 9141 times:



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 5):
When NW served OSL it was also serving CPH, ARN, PIK, SNN and HAM.

That was the first time 25 years ago, the second time was via MSP and it was a flop.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineVadheim From Norway, joined Jul 2000, 623 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8997 times:

Oslo (OSL) - Minneapolis (MSP) was served the summer of 1999 with a daily Northwest DC10, and Oslo was the only Scandinavian city served then. The first time served was back in the 1980's when Northwest Orient had a quite extensive Scandinavian network serving Oslo (GEN), Stockholm (ARN) and Copenhagen (CPH).

At the moment I do'nt think we will see Delta in Oslo. We already have Continental serving New York (EWR) daily and US Airways serving Philadelphia (PHL) daily. If we get any Delta route in the future it will be Atlanta, but that will depend on the success of their Stockholm and Copenhagen routes.

At the moment we are only waiting for Thai Airways to arrive here in Oslo June 15th.  Smile


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User currently offlinePGNCS From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 2757 posts, RR: 45
Reply 8, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8933 times:



Quoting Mayor (Reply 1):
Quoting DeltaHolland (Thread starter):
I have to say i'm very suprised Delta gets most of there routes to work for them.

Why does this surprise you? Contrary to many opinions on here, DL hasn't been successful with their international routes just because of dumb luck.

Mayor is exactly right: DL has been largely successful internationally not because of luck, but because of planning and analysis. Some routes haven't worked, and DL has pulled the plug on them, but most have, and many have succeeded wildly beyond anyone's imagination (especially the African routes.)

I have no idea if you will see these cities added (or re-added) to the DL schedule in the future; WAW may be dependent on LOT's future, while I would personally love to see LIS although I doubt the need for the capacity on it out of JFK (given the service from EWR).

Clearly DL spend a lot of time thinking about things like this, and when (and if) it makes sense it will show up in the schedule.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16694 posts, RR: 51
Reply 9, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8911 times:



Quoting PGNCS (Reply 8):
while I would personally love to see LIS although I doubt the need for the capacity on it out of JFK (given the service from EWR).

If DL were to launch flights to LIS they would be much better served from BOS.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 9967 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7695 times:

IIRC, WAW was only served from FRA after the PA acquisition. I don't believe it was ever served non-stop from the states.


"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineCokePopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1167 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7656 times:

Quoting Mayor (Reply 10):
IIRC, WAW was only served from FRA after the PA acquisition. I don't believe it was ever served non-stop from the states.

For some reason I think it was. We had WAW based f/a's and there was an uproar
that they were going to operate WAW-JFK-WAW flights. And I believed they did for a short
period. around 1994 or 95

[Edited 2009-05-24 16:50:27]

User currently offlineMayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 9967 posts, RR: 14
Reply 12, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7579 times:

You could be correct. I just can't remember. I thought it went away when the FRA hub went away. Same with LED.


"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7321 posts, RR: 24
Reply 13, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7567 times:



Quoting Vadheim (Reply 7):
At the moment I do'nt think we will see Delta in Oslo. We already have Continental serving New York (EWR) daily and US Airways serving Philadelphia (PHL) daily. If we get any Delta route in the future it will be Atlanta, but that will depend on the success of their Stockholm and Copenhagen routes.

Ive heard ATL-CPH does very well. Ive heard the opposite of ATL-ARN, but its still new. I dont have my ear as much to DL's network as I do with AA's so things could be different now.

Either way, I dont see ATL-OSL or ATL-HEL as routes that would work. Maybe JFK-OSL with a 757 would work.

Also KL covers Norway like a glove. They fly to BGO, SVG, and TRD as well as OSL. I agree that DL is probably best letting KL handle Norway.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9081 posts, RR: 12
Reply 14, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7546 times:



Quoting STT757 (Reply 9):
If DL were to launch flights to LIS they would be much better served from BOS.

No JFK would be right. The have more feed in NYC vis BOS.



yep.
User currently offlineCokePopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1167 posts, RR: 10
Reply 15, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7527 times:

Remember Delta was suppose to start Gothenburg GOT this summer.
So they are looking in that direction.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16694 posts, RR: 51
Reply 16, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7460 times:



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 14):
No JFK would be right. The have more feed in NYC vis BOS.

Feed for Portugal, does DL have flights from JFK to EWR?.. Portugal is a huge VFR market, not much for tourism or business (from the US). The market for flights to Portugal are New Jersey, Rhode Island and Massachusetts, JFK is not going to draw people from Newark (where the Portuguese are). DL could have BOS to themselves.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineRobertS975 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 931 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7348 times:
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Quoting STT757 (Reply 16):
Feed for Portugal, does DL have flights from JFK to EWR?.. Portugal is a huge VFR market, not much for tourism or business (from the US). The market for flights to Portugal are New Jersey, Rhode Island and Massachusetts, JFK is not going to draw people from Newark (where the Portuguese are). DL could have BOS to themselves.

Actually, the current flights from PVD and BOS to Portugal are to the Azores, not Lisbon.


User currently offlineSeemyseems From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2009, 967 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7332 times:

I too think LIS will be the next route, perhaps from JFK? Does DL intend on serving more UK routes, they could benefit from GLA, LBA or maybe ABZ?


seemyseems
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7321 posts, RR: 24
Reply 19, posted (4 years 11 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6516 times:



Quoting STT757 (Reply 16):
Portugal is a huge VFR market, not much for tourism or business (from the US). The market for flights to Portugal are New Jersey, Rhode Island and Massachusetts



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 14):

No JFK would be right. The have more feed in NYC vis BOS.

Here's the thing about VFR traffic to Portugal:

The metropolitan area with the largest population of foreign born Portugese in the USA isnt, NYC/NJ or Boston, its Providence, RI.

So the question becomes, is it better to have a flight from Boston nonstop and try to attract the market that way, or is it better to try and attract customers by adding a flight from PVD to JFK to connect there?

CO flies from EWR to PVD, so they can capture the market that way.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineCityAirline From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 682 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (4 years 11 months 23 hours ago) and read 5884 times:



Quoting CokePopper (Reply 15):
Remember Delta was suppose to start Gothenburg GOT this summer.
So they are looking in that direction.

Yes, but it was postponed and is now aimed for a 2010 start. Four flights a week from JFK on the 757.

//Alex



I don't fly to live, I live to fly...
User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5225 posts, RR: 25
Reply 21, posted (4 years 11 months 22 hours ago) and read 5731 times:



Quoting CokePopper (Reply 11):
Quoting Mayor (Reply 10):IIRC, WAW was only served from FRA after the PA acquisition. I don't believe it was ever served non-stop from the states.
For some reason I think it was. We had WAW based f/a's and there was an uproar
that they were going to operate WAW-JFK-WAW flights. And I believed they did for a short
period. around 1994 or 95

WAW was indeed served nonstop from JFK after the FRA hub was dismantled. The flight operated in the mid 90's but I cannot remember off hand when it was discontinued.



Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineHumberside From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2005, 4914 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (4 years 11 months 17 hours ago) and read 4792 times:



Quoting RobertS975 (Reply 17):
Actually, the current flights from PVD and BOS to Portugal are to the Azores, not Lisbon.

The entry for BOS on wikipedia (so yes it could be wrong) says SATA fly to LIS and Porto (seasonally) as well as the Azores



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User currently offlineAacun From Mexico, joined Jan 2004, 507 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (4 years 11 months 16 hours ago) and read 4444 times:
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I remember seeing NW DC-10-30's in MIA at somepoint during the late 80's or early 90's and them flying to Europe. If memory serves me right, It was Oslo and some other city...Can anyone confirm this?

User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12163 posts, RR: 36
Reply 24, posted (4 years 11 months 15 hours ago) and read 4320 times:
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I'm still wondering what will happen once DL no longer has a partner on NYC-OSL, but a competitor instead.. I'd like to see both JFK-GOT and JFK-OSL on alternating days with the 757.

One can dream  Smile



911, where is your emergency?
25 Mayor : CO was always more of a competitor than a partner as a member of Skyteam.
26 Jetlanta : I wouldn't plan on DL adding any of the mentioned markets in the near term...or any others in Europe. The market is terrible. There will be subtractio
27 TOLtommy : You are correct. DL did operate JFK-WAW with JFK based FA's. DL management flipped it to WAW based FA's and the US based FA's were able to go to Infl
28 LAXdude1023 : Maybe a little off topic, but DL/NW are cutting frequency from DTW and ATL to NRT starting in October it looks like. Both will be daily with a 744.
29 Mayor : Well, there were WAW based FA's right after the PA acquisition just as there were TLV based ones. The TLV ones only had to fly to Paris in the mornin
30 Toltommy : Yes and the WAW based FA's did the 727 flying via FRA. When DL pulled down the FRA hub, they tried placing the WAW FA's on WAW-JFK, but it caused an
31 DeltaL1011man : What aircraft was it on if you remember? Agree. IMO JFK-ZRH may get pushed back along with GOT if it hasn't already. Very bad time to start new fligh
32 Ocracoke : As well as DEL and BOM based ones. I think the ones from DEL went first, then TLV, then WAW, and just recently, with the B77LR JFK (ATL)-BOM, finally
33 OA412 : 763
34 Panamair : No, ZRH is going ahead starting June 8. They have reduced one weekly frequency on it for the first few weeks in June and have managed to fill up some
35 DeltaL1011man : I cant remember but was it going to be daily or 5x weekly? Isn't Delta going to start 3x weekly JFK-PRG on a 763?
36 Panamair : ZRH was going to be daily; they've cut one mid-week frequency for June (so 6x weekly); July and August should probably stay daily, but I would expect
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