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Why Only UA Offering "premium" Domestic Product?  
User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1543 posts, RR: 1
Posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2976 times:

Does the UA PS product really just cover the entirety of the premium domestic market? I've always thought that PS is a great idea, especially since no one else was, or is, offering anything truly comparable AFAIK, but been stumped as to why no one else has done it. I realize that perhaps the LAX/SFO-JFK routings may well be saturated with the current UA PS service (unless another carrier wanted to break in on that market, which wouldn't make business sense anyway). However, I just can't believe that there are not other markets which could support like offerings, even if on smaller metal such as A320-series or 73's. I've ridden the domestic F product on DL Mad Dogs and 75's (one with the new interior, but not AVOD or etc.) in the last few years and found it nice but I could definitely see where I would like to have the option for something better on more routes if I were one of those who UA is targeting with PS service.

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 5930 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2941 times:



Quoting LHCVG (Thread starter):
Does the UA PS product really just cover the entirety of the premium domestic market? I've always thought that PS is a great idea, especially since no one else was, or is, offering anything truly comparable AFAIK, but been stumped as to why no one else has done it.

UA and AA both offer premium products in the JFK-LAX/SFO markets. UA with P.S. and AA with their American Flagship Service. DL used to (prior to song) with BusinessElite US between NY and California. CO still uses their BusinessFirst configured aircraft on a few EWR-LAX flights but I'm not sure if the service is different on board then a normal transcon flight.



Semper Fi - PowerPoint makes us stupid.
User currently offlineEghansen From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2924 times:

Premium service has been tried many times worldwide with limited success. MGM Grand, Maxjet, Eos, Silverjet are all out of business and the only other all premium service that I know of in the world is Singapore JFK/LAX-SIN nonstops. Airlines make a lot of money from the cattle-car back-of-the-plane passengers.

User currently offlineRayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 7991 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2800 times:



Quoting Eghansen (Reply 2):
Airlines make a lot of money from the cattle-car back-of-the-plane passengers.

But because the LAX-JFK route is full of passengers from the entertainment industry willing to pay premium prices for flying this route, I expect UA to keep their p.s. operations on this route. I wouldn't be surprised to see many well-known entertainment celebrities flying the p.s. LAX-JFK flights.


User currently offlineEghansen From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2713 times:



Quoting RayChuang (Reply 3):
But because the LAX-JFK route is full of passengers from the entertainment industry willing to pay premium prices for flying this route, I expect UA to keep their p.s. operations on this route. I wouldn't be surprised to see many well-known entertainment celebrities flying the p.s. LAX-JFK flights.

Oh, I didn't say that premium flights would not work anywhere, but it has to be a special market and I don't think there are many of those.


User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1543 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2693 times:

Thanks for all the replies. I guess that makes sense that there just isn't much more of a market for it (at least to justify the expense and dedicated a/c).

User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6712 posts, RR: 32
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2609 times:

The big issues:

* Most companies outside the entertainment industry won't allow employees traveling on company business (aside from, perhaps, officer-level executives) to book domestic tickets in First or Business Class unless there is absolutely no other option and the travel is time-critical.
* Few individuals are willing to pay the going fares for domestic First or Business Class and many that could afford to do it simply use private or fractional jets.
* The number of U.S. routes with consistently sufficient paid traffic to justify premium F/J service probably amounts to under ten.


User currently offlineRayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 7991 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2465 times:



Quoting ScottB (Reply 6):
* Few individuals are willing to pay the going fares for domestic First or Business Class and many that could afford to do it simply use private or fractional jets.

That would be true for most flights across the USA but on the LAX-JFK route, even a First Class ticket on a p.s. flight is still cheaper than chartering a private jet to fly this long a distance. Unless you're a "top of the A list" celebrity who can command six-figure salaries per episode on a top-rated TV series or a movie star who can command eight-figure salaries per movie, they'll be interested in the LAX-JFK UA p.s. flight or AA Flagship Service flight.


User currently offlineAviators99 From United States of America, joined May 2008, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2375 times:

I would use it on every route I travel. I've switched my flying to VX on legs where they fly, because it is closer to this.

User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1543 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2339 times:



Quoting RayChuang (Reply 7):
That would be true for most flights across the USA but on the LAX-JFK route, even a First Class ticket on a p.s. flight is still cheaper than chartering a private jet to fly this long a distance. Unless you're a "top of the A list" celebrity who can command six-figure salaries per episode on a top-rated TV series or a movie star who can command eight-figure salaries per movie, they'll be interested in the LAX-JFK UA p.s. flight or AA Flagship Service flight.

I guess that was actually what I had in mind originally --- that offering this service gets some who would otherwise charter to book a 1st class ticket on p.s. and get a pretty nice flight experience for a lot less than chartering costs (as in domestic first isn't going to draw those extremely wealthy high rollers).


User currently offlineFrmrCAPCADET From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1710 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2227 times:

Doesn't Jet Blue offer the equivalent of economy plus on all of its flights?


Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
User currently offlinePSA727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 974 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2215 times:

AA basically offers the same product JFK-SFO/LAX, except that the coach section is not Economy Plus like United's. However, I've flown both AA's and UA's J product on these routes and IMO, AA delivers a much better in-flight service. You leave those flights feeling like you just had a Thanksgiving meal (without the family arguments). As for expanding this type of product, I don't think that demand for the F product warrants this. This is a LA-NY media run, and that's what you'll usually see seated in the front cabin on these flights.


fly high, pay low...Germanwings!
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9508 posts, RR: 52
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2191 times:

3 class service has happened in the past on BOS-SFO/LAX. It's a smaller market, but that is a long flight with a lot of high end customers.

Quoting LHCVG (Thread starter):
I've always thought that PS is a great idea, especially since no one else was, or is, offering anything truly comparable AFAIK, but been stumped as to why no one else has done it.

As far as seats go, Virgin America is definitely at a higher standard than anyone else in the US. They offer international business class style of service and seating.

Quoting FrmrCAPCADET (Reply 10):
Doesn't Jet Blue offer the equivalent of economy plus on all of its flights?

In economy, jetBlue seat pitch is about equivalent to Economy Plus. I think the OP was talking more about the premium classes though instead of the domestic first class product which is about the same on all airlines in the US.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1543 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2074 times:

Does the AA service use 75's as well or do they still run 762s on the premium transcon legs?

User currently offlineFURUREFA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 801 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2047 times:



Quoting LHCVG (Reply 13):
Does the AA service use 75's as well or do they still run 762s on the premium transcon legs?

-EWR-LAX is a 752
-IAD-LAX is 738s and a 752
-BOS-SFO is 752s
-BOS-LAX is 763s and 752s
-JFK-LAX is 762s
-JFK-SFO is 762s and a 763
-MIA-SFO is 752s
-MIA-LAX is a 738, a 772, 763s and 752s

All flights other than the 762 on JFK-LAX/JFK-SFO and the 772 on MIA-LAX are sold as and are two-cabin aircraft (F/Y). The exceptions (JFK-LAX/SFO and MIA-LAX) are sold as F/J/Y.

Matt


User currently onlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32616 posts, RR: 72
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2041 times:

AA's MIA-LAX 772 flight, the only 3-class domestic 772 run by AA, is by far the best domestic service currently available, in my experience. The on-board service by the FA's on that flight in the premium cabins is seemingly flawless everytime I'm on it.

Also, while AA does not offer 3-class service on the 763s, trans-cons operated by the 763s connecting MIA/JFK/BOS with LAX/SFO still offer a "more" premium business class product, with Bose canceling headsets and a better food product.



a.
User currently offlineAirmaleJUM From United States of America, joined May 2009, 44 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 1995 times:

The UA P.S. service offers Bose noise cancelling headsets in first and business and also personal media players which have 30 movies on demand, games, tv shows and short subject programs. The meal service starts with a cocktail service with warmed nuts. Next a hot or cold appatizer, salad. In first you have 3 choices for your main course. Desert is an ice cream sunday with and fruit. Prior to landing the flight attendants offer fesh oven baked chocolate chip cookies. Abour a year ago the service was 10 times better, but UA did some budget cuts and down graded the service. Business class used to have the appertizers also, now it starts with a salad and both cabins have chocolates during the flights prior to the cuts. The breakfast service is elaborate also and before the budget cuts there was a snack offered before landing on the breakfast flights. P.S. is still a good product. On the LAX-JFK there are many celebs. I have flown with the Olsen Twins, Vanessa Williams, Rick Fox, Lindsey Lohan, Drew Berrymore, Snoop Dogg, Giana Delerentes, Ashanti, L.A. Reed and Faye Dunaway just to name a few on the UAL flights to LAX.

User currently offlineDLHFLYER From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 184 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 1925 times:

Because for the most part, the airline industry is a price driven commodity. People buy based on who's cheaper. Therefore, premium products are usually a fail, except of course in markets like JFK-LAX, where there is demand for a premium product.


Duluth is a nice city, we even get 3 months without snow per year
User currently offlineUA772IAD From Australia, joined Jul 2004, 1730 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 1915 times:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 6):
* Most companies outside the entertainment industry won't allow employees traveling on company business (aside from, perhaps, officer-level executives) to book domestic tickets in First or Business Class unless there is absolutely no other option and the travel is time-critical.
* Few individuals are willing to pay the going f

True, unless they travel a lot and obtained high mileage status allowing them to upgrade to F or J on a Y ticket.

[Edited 2009-05-26 18:29:59]

[Edited 2009-05-26 18:37:38]

User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6712 posts, RR: 32
Reply 19, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 1835 times:



Quoting UA772IAD (Reply 18):
unless they travel a lot and obtained high mileage status allowing them to upgrade to F or J on a Y ticket.

That's not directly paying for the ticket, though. If you're a good bargain hunter, you can probably get ExPlat on AA or 1K on UA for $5000 in paid tickets.


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