Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
KLM's 3rd 77W On Its Way To Eham  
User currently offline747ata32 From Netherlands, joined Oct 2006, 44 posts, RR: 1
Posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 9433 times:

Just wanted to let you know that KLM's 3rd 77W PH-BVC has been delivered today and left PAE at 11:40am PDT and is enroute to AMS, expected there tomorrow early morning.
Check here: http://flightaware.com/live/flight/KLM7461

Regards,

Frank

[Edited 2009-05-28 13:23:37]


Flown: 733, 734, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 743, 744, M11, 752, 763, F100, F70, SF340, A319, A320, A321, A332, 772, 77W, D10, D
34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 9437 times:

Thanks for the news. With the current configuration, small C cabin and mega Y cabin, the B77W is configured for times of recession. I imagine it will be used to make MNL daily B77W. I can hardly think of a better fit for the B77W, MNL is just perfect for this configuration.

Rgs,


User currently offlineDALCA From Netherlands, joined Aug 2006, 518 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9265 times:

We need more of these long beasts at AMS, they really fit in nicely


Zanair flight, please hold on finals as we have to clear rhino's off the runway. Next flight: AMS-FRA-AMS
User currently offline747ata32 From Netherlands, joined Oct 2006, 44 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9133 times:



Quoting DALCA (Reply 2):
We need more of these long beasts at AMS, they really fit in nicely

PH-BVD will join the fleet coming August. 2 more will arrive in 2010 and I am quite sure we will see some more in 2011/2012, depending on how the world economy is going to develop itself and when KL starts phasing out the 744 full pax a/c.



Flown: 733, 734, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 743, 744, M11, 752, 763, F100, F70, SF340, A319, A320, A321, A332, 772, 77W, D10, D
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17056 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9025 times:

The 777 always looks good in KLM's color scheme.

Is KLM using the 77Ws for replacement of older a/c (MD11, 747s) or for expansion?



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineCityAirline From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 687 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 9002 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 4):
Is KLM using the 77Ws for replacement of older a/c (MD11, 747s) or for expansion?

As of now, it's mainly for expansion.
Maybe in the future, KL will replace their full pax 744s with 77Ws, but never MD11s as the difference in capacity is huge (150 seats)!

//Alex



I don't fly to live, I live to fly...
User currently offlineSeemyseems From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2009, 967 posts, RR: 7
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8952 times:

I think KL's B77W look really cool, I know they have 6 on order will they order more?

So when are the other 3 machines due to be delivered?



seemyseems
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17056 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8937 times:



Quoting Seemyseems (Reply 6):
So when are the other 3 machines due to be delivered?

Here you go

Quoting 747ata32 (Reply 3):
PH-BVD will join the fleet coming August. 2 more will arrive in 2010




Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineSeemyseems From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2009, 967 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8925 times:



Quoting B747forever (Reply 7):
Here you go

Oh! Thanks, should have scrolled up first!  Big grin

PH-BVD will be the SkyTeam logo jet which should look good.



seemyseems
User currently offlineKL911 From Ireland, joined Jul 2003, 5120 posts, RR: 12
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8891 times:



Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 1):
. I imagine it will be used to make MNL daily B77W

Why isn't MNL daily yet? They had two 777W's for a while now, two could already have made it daily. Weird.



Next trip : DUB-AUH-CGK-DPS-KUL-AUH-CDG-ORK :-)
User currently offlineKrisYYZ From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 8792 times:

I'm still very disappointed that KL decided to put 3-4-3 economy seating on their new B77Ws. Will KL's new economy extra class have 3-4-3 seating as well?

KrisYYZ


User currently offlineYULWinterSkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2176 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 8386 times:



Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 10):
I'm still very disappointed that KL decided to put 3-4-3 economy seating on their new B77Ws.

Yes, well, initially, they were supposed to replace the 744 one by one, so they have the same capacity, and such asks for 3-4-3 in Y. This is what AF has done with the 77W CIO, and there really is not much that separates AF from KL. As long as (unlike the AF ones) the 772s remain in 3-3-3...
I can bet you that 3-4-3 in Y 777 cabins will be the norm in 5-10 years from now, when the 744s become obsolete and need a replacement. Such will beat a 748I any day in terms of economics.



When I doubt... go running!
User currently offline747ata32 From Netherlands, joined Oct 2006, 44 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 8335 times:

BVC has arrived!
05:43 AM Amsterdam Local Time.



Flown: 733, 734, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 743, 744, M11, 752, 763, F100, F70, SF340, A319, A320, A321, A332, 772, 77W, D10, D
User currently offlineMindscape From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 315 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 8273 times:



Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 1):
With the current configuration, small C cabin and mega Y cabin, the B77W is configured for times of recession

I thought KLM decided to put more C class seats on their B77W starting with the 3rd frame, and the two first would be retrofitted afterward ?


User currently offlineAirbuseric From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 4253 posts, RR: 51
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 7432 times:



Quoting Mindscape (Reply 13):
I thought KLM decided to put more C class seats on their B77W starting with the 3rd frame,

I think that this aircraft might be the first one with the new Premium Economy class installed? Since it's confirmed that KL will introduce this new class during this year to the customer...

KL's C-class 2-3-2 layout is also really bad, to be honest.



"The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going"
User currently offlineHardiwv From Brazil, joined Oct 2004, 8780 posts, RR: 50
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 7388 times:



Quoting Airbuseric (Reply 14):
KL's C-class 2-3-2 layout is also really bad, to be honest.

It is bad but again this is the norm in the market, AF does the same.

Rgs,


User currently offlineBushman From Russia, joined Jan 2007, 62 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 7325 times:

Anyone knows when will be its first flight on AMS-MNL route?

Thanks


User currently offlineLACA773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 6820 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting Airbuseric (Reply 14):
KL's C-class 2-3-2 layout is also really bad, to be honest.

Unfortunately, this is the norm with the 77Xs. They configure J like they do on the 744s. The only exceptions are NZ, CX, AC (and some of DL's 777 fleet, mainly 77Ls right now.) that have that have the Herringbone configuration.


User currently offlineAABB777 From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 528 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 6682 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!



Quoting LACA773 (Reply 17):
Unfortunately, this is the norm with the 77Xs. They configure J like they do on the 744s. The only exceptions are NZ, CX, AC (and some of DL's 777 fleet, mainly 77Ls right now.) that have that have the Herringbone configuration.

And QR: They offer 2-2-2 in J on both the 77W and 77L.


User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9731 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 6626 times:

I will be waiting on the day KL will start using their 777's to CUR. Probably it will be the 772 but who knows. We get the 744 now and if cargo and passenger loads keep justifying a 747 sized aircraft we might see the KL 77W as well  Smile

A388


User currently offlineSeemyseems From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2009, 967 posts, RR: 7
Reply 20, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 6539 times:

Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 10):
I'm still very disappointed that KL decided to put 3-4-3 economy seating on their new B77Ws. Will KL's new economy extra class have 3-4-3 seating as well?

I reckon that maybe KL will have 3x3x3 on these aircraft soon, I remember hearing that they have a lot of left over seats due to its high capacity. 3x3x3 would be better and 2x2x2 in Bus would be better too, plus I hear the middle seat can be annoying to other pax.

Quoting Airbuseric (Reply 14):
think that this aircraft might be the first one with the new Premium Economy class installed? Since it's confirmed that KL will introduce this new class during this year to the customer...

I'm looking forward to seeing it, I think that the next B77W coming in August will have this, and as the B744's are getting retrofitted in June or July (I think), they should be getting the new eco+ soon. Will the A330's and MD-11's get the new class?

[Edited 2009-05-29 05:47:37]


seemyseems
User currently offlineTGV From France, joined Dec 2004, 874 posts, RR: 20
Reply 21, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 6213 times:



Quoting LACA773 (Reply 17):
Unfortunately, this is the norm with the 77Xs. They configure J like they do on the 744s. The only exceptions are NZ, CX, AC (and some of DL's 777 fleet, mainly 77Ls right now.) that have that have the Herringbone configuration.



Quoting AABB777 (Reply 18):
And QR: They offer 2-2-2 in J on both the 77W and 77L.

And SQ, BR, 9W, TK.

Not a norm yet.



Avoid 777 with 3-4-3 config in Y ! They are real sardine cans. (AF/KL for example)
User currently offlineKrisYYZ From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 5352 times:



Quoting YULWinterSkies (Reply 11):
I can bet you that 3-4-3 in Y 777 cabins will be the norm in 5-10 years from now, when the 744s become obsolete and need a replacement. Such will beat a 748I any day in terms of economics.

What I also find somewhat interesting is that KL uses one of the narrowest seats on their wide-bodies at only 17.5in wide. Compare that with AC's B777s at 18.5in, DL's B777s at 18.0in and the narrowest is AF's B77Ws at only 17.0in while their B772s are 18.0in. One must also take into consideration that most North American passengers are slightly wider than their European counterparts.


So I guess KL B77Ws must lose a lot of aisle space which would be more annoying for the FA's than the pax.

Quoting Seemyseems (Reply 20):
I reckon that maybe KL will have 3x3x3 on these aircraft soon, I remember hearing that they have a lot of left over seats due to its high capacity. 3x3x3 would be better and 2x2x2 in Bus would be better too, plus I hear the middle seat can be annoying to other pax.

Given the current recession that may turn out to be the case. Also the drop in premium class traffic may contribute in changing economy class layout. BA also uses 17.5in seating on their B772s yet their new B77Ws will be in 3-3-3 config, I wonder if they will use 18in seating on those birds.

KrisYYZ


User currently offlineKL911 From Ireland, joined Jul 2003, 5120 posts, RR: 12
Reply 23, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 5155 times:



Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 22):
One must also take into consideration that most North American passengers are slightly wider than their European counterparts.

And why should a European carrier care about the unhealthy lifestyle of a few persons in the US?..... Live healthy, live happy and fly happy.... I'm one of those passengers that can become extremely pissed off when i pay for a seat and sit next to a 120 kg guy that takes all the space.....



Next trip : DUB-AUH-CGK-DPS-KUL-AUH-CDG-ORK :-)
User currently offlinePHKLM From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Dec 2005, 1198 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (5 years 2 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 5151 times:



Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 10):
I'm still very disappointed that KL decided to put 3-4-3 economy seating on their new B77Ws. Will KL's new economy extra class have 3-4-3 seating as well?

Yes. KLM envisions no dedicated cabin/seats for Y+ (unlike AF), so it will be like United Airlines' Y=, just extra pitch. At least this is what I read recently on luchtvaartnieuws.nl

Quoting Mindscape (Reply 13):
I thought KLM decided to put more C class seats on their B77W starting with the 3rd frame, and the two first would be retrofitted afterward ?

I reckon that would be the most stupid thing to do these days, add more C seats... KL will likely want to stick to 35C, just like on the 772.

Quoting Airbuseric (Reply 14):
I think that this aircraft might be the first one with the new Premium Economy class installed? Since it's confirmed that KL will introduce this new class during this year to the customer...

As far as I know BVA/BVB were already adjusted for Y+, with more pitch in the first rows of economy, but please correct me if I'm wrong.


25 Cba : IIRC KLM ordered the 772 to replace the MD-11. The 77W is for expansion (short term), and eventually to replace the 744. Not sure what the plans for
26 PHKLM : The 772 has replaced the B743 and allowed the airline to grow. Airbus is said to have offered KL a sweet deal if the company would have ordered the A
27 KrisYYZ : I agree. I have been stuck between two large passengers in the past and it was terribly comfortable. However a large portion of TATL pax are from N.
28 A388 : Wouldn't the A350-1000XWB be a better option as it is offered as a 777 replacement aircraft (including the 77W) or will the -1000XWB be the same size
29 Hotje : I'll avoid 3-4-3 in a 777 on any route, especially KL's (seat pitch still at 31", which is not enough in any configuration). Just disgusting how they
30 Viscount724 : I don't think so. I believe the 772s (and 3 744ERF freighters) were ordered to replace the 743s and 742SUDs.
31 TGV : Because for now AF77W are already with 3-4-3 while AF772 are still with 3-3-3. But the 772 will also be reconfigured with 3-4-3 when Y+ cabin is inst
32 Kappel : The a350-1000 is slightly smaller than the 77W, but does not allow 10 abreast like the 77W. That's why the 77W is more likely as 744 replacement (the
33 Seemyseems : Does KL plan to install the WBC seats from the B77W on to its other aircraft?
34 KrisYYZ : That's unfortunate, AF offered a very nice product in Y. Good tips, thanks for posting. KrisYYZ
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
DL 757 On Its Way To BGR? posted Thu Dec 13 2007 12:27:32 by TWA757
Canjet On Its Way To Cyqb posted Sun Mar 4 2007 04:41:29 by H. Simpson
Herb Says WN Was On Its Way To A Record Till 9/11 posted Mon Sep 11 2006 00:04:29 by KarlB737
TAM On Its Way To SXF (Berlin Schoenefeld) posted Sat Jun 10 2006 14:04:54 by Delta777Jet
2nd B777 Of Aeromexico On Its Way To MEX posted Sat Apr 29 2006 02:22:10 by JAVOMD88
Another 777 On Its Way To Air India? posted Wed Jan 4 2006 06:40:12 by TheBigOne
AirFrance 777-300 On Its Way To MEX Right Now? posted Sun Nov 6 2005 15:54:27 by Mx330
772LR On Its Way To COS posted Thu Jul 7 2005 18:21:13 by Clickhappy
772LR On Its Way To Fargo ND (FAR) posted Thu Jun 30 2005 18:00:52 by Clickhappy
UA 744 On Its Way To ANC posted Fri Apr 29 2005 08:34:32 by Chugach