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Why Not More A.M. Flights To Europe From U.S.  
User currently offlineRichiemo From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 220 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 24426 times:

I know that there are currently several morning flights to London from Newark and JFK. I would think there would be similar demand for morning flights to Paris, Dublin, Frankfurt? Granted, those cities are further east than London, so you'd have to leave the U.S. east coast earlier and/or arrive there later in the day than the London flights, but does anyone think we'll ever see a morning departure, say JFK to CDG?

54 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJetblueguy22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 2798 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 24412 times:
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Possible but probably not. Remember the time difference would mean that the flight would arrive late at night and then would either have to sit or leave right away which would mean it would get in late in JFK. Versus if you leave at say 8 at night from JFK you arrive just in time for the work day in CDG.
Blue



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User currently offlineWeirdLinguist From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 44 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 24415 times:

people would rather fly in during the daytime IMO, I flew JKF-AMS coupla months ago the flight left at 11 pm and got there 11am, 12 hours +/-. If a flight leaves at 10 in the morning it arrives 10 pm. See no point to getting there that late.

User currently offlineManuCH From Switzerland, joined Jun 2005, 3011 posts, RR: 46
Reply 3, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 24378 times:
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I would actually pay premium to have daytime US-to-Europe flights. I'm one of those people who can't sleep on airplanes (because of the noise or whatever), and west-to-east jetlag combined with sleep deprivation (even if only a night) kills me and makes me totally un-productive for 2-3 days at least.


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User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11438 posts, RR: 58
Reply 4, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 24352 times:
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Quoting Richiemo (Thread starter):
but does anyone think we'll ever see a morning departure, say JFK to CDG?

AF already tried JFK-CDG daylight but the results were not good.

Quoting Jetblueguy22 (Reply 1):
Remember the time difference would mean that the flight would arrive late at night and then would either have to sit or leave right away which would mean it would get in late in JFK. Versus if you leave at say 8 at night from JFK you arrive just in time for the work day in CDG.
Blue

That's the main problem, agree 100%. If you leave NYC during the day, except for LIS and LHR where the time zone is different from the rest of Europe (and LIS is not so strong in terms of traffic), the plane can't reach NYC in a good time.
Also, you will rely on O&D only as connections will be limited in NYC.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineERJ From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 245 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 24302 times:

Don't forget about onward connections. Arriving Europe AM allows a day's worth of connecting opportunities. Plus the return times are more convenient as the planes arriving early AM can turn quickly and get back Stateside at midday. If the flight left 9 AM and arrived 9 PM, 2 hour turn departing 11 PM it would arrive in the US in the middle of the night. So the PM Eastbound departures work better for a/c utilization as well as passenger connections.

User currently onlineCALPSAFltSkeds From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 2637 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 24202 times:

1.) As mentioned connections work best on both side of the pond with evening eastbound and midmorning westbound. Morning eastbound could only connect from close in cities or from redeyes from the Wet Coast, meaning a redeye is not avoided on the trip. Westbound there would be few connections at US airports if the aircraft left Europe late in the day.

2.) Aircraft utilization is best with evening east and midmoring west. For US carriers they would have to turn back the same day or use most of two aircraft for one round trip. Being at a European hub, the home country airline may have aircraft available to operate the westbound return earlier.

3.) Demand for westbound flight from Europe after 6pm would be poor and more than compensate for any gain in a daytime eastbound.

4.) With some markets being large, demand for limited service US-Europe in the morning is being served. That being said, most likely load factors are lower than the evening departures.


User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4015 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 24110 times:

Quoting Richiemo (Thread starter):
Granted, those cities are further east than London

Almost all markets in Continental Europe are one time zone further ahead than London and that adds up to the slightly longer travel time.

Another factor is that probably London could support more daylights if it had a 24-hour airport. It does not and the departure stream that would allow lots of night connections from the US dies down too early. Arrivals at around 9pm could connect to departures bewteen 10:30 and 11:30pm.

My preferred travel pattern into London is to leave NY early morning, get to London and enjoy the nightlife until very late.

[Edited 2009-06-05 10:12:21]


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User currently offlineRichierich From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 4263 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 24047 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 4):
Also, you will rely on O&D only as connections will be limited in NYC.

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Don't underestimate this. A daytime flight from the US to Europe basically discounts connecting pax on either end. London can just about get away with it because of its prime importance to the US and NYC market.

I've always wanted to try one of those flights but never have. I prefer the the late evening flights (11PM from JFK) as I seem to sleep better and not have the jetlag hit me like an anvil in the morning hours.



None shall pass!!!!
User currently offlineAirBuffalo From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 138 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 23880 times:



Quoting WeirdLinguist (Reply 2):
people would rather fly in during the daytime IMO,

That may seem logical -- flying overnight and sleeping in a seat is out-of-the-ordinary for joe tourist. However, I think the business traveler who makes up the bulk of high-yeild fares prefers the overnight.

Perfect example is routings from europe to s. america where airlines like LX have a plane sitting on the ground all day (or flying add-ons like GRU-SCL, LX92/93) so both transoceanic segments are overnight. The difference between these and Europe-NA is that the route is too long to have both segments in a 24 hour period. So, contolling for the side benefit of higher aircraft utilization, the market probably prefers overnights.

Also, I've been on trans-pacific day flights where the cabin crew requests that the window shade be drawn during the whole flight.... they'd like it to be nighttime as much as possible!


User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6764 posts, RR: 32
Reply 10, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 23777 times:



Quoting AirBuffalo (Reply 9):
That may seem logical -- flying overnight and sleeping in a seat is out-of-the-ordinary for joe tourist.

The red-eye eastbound is also more desirable for U.S.-based tourists since it eliminates the cost of a night in a hotel and the early morning rush to the airport. But aside from that, connections and aircraft utilization are the key reasons why we don't see many daylight flights from the U.S. to Europe.


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25346 posts, RR: 22
Reply 11, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 23664 times:

Quoting ManuCH (Reply 3):
would actually pay premium to have daytime US-to-Europe flights.



Quoting Incitatus (Reply 7):
My preferred travel pattern into London is to leave NY early morning, get to London and enjoy the nightlife until very late.

Most business travellers don't want to waste a full day which they do when taking a daytime flight, and most leisure travellers don't want to waste a day of their vacation time, plus pay for one more night in a hotel. It''s for much the same reasons that daytime flights between North America and deep South America (EZE/GRU/SCL etc.) aren't popular, even with only minor time zone differences. People just don't want to waste a full day flying and pay for another expensive night in a hotel.

Very few transatlantic routes have enough O&D demand to warrant daytime flights. They normally require very high yields (meaning full premium cabins) to offset the usual very poor aircraft utilization. In many cases, a daytime flight to Europe means the aircraft can only operate one one-way sector in a 24-hr period.

With the major drop in business traffic due to the financial crisis, I would expect daytime flights will become fewer. And they often have poor Y class load factors.

[Edited 2009-06-05 12:18:10]

User currently offlineThestooges From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 23627 times:



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 3):
I would actually pay premium to have daytime US-to-Europe flights. I'm one of those people who can't sleep on airplanes (because of the noise or whatever), and west-to-east jetlag combined with sleep deprivation (even if only a night) kills me and makes me totally un-productive for 2-3 days at least.

Although I wouldnt necessarily pay extra for a daytime US-Europe flight, I completely agree with you that the jet lag received after flying an overnight US-Europe flight is by the far the worse I have ever encountered, much worse than the jet lag from flying East Cost US to East Coast Australia or vice versa for example. Something about it being suddenly 6AM when you think its only midnight, and therefor completely missing a whole nights sleep. Like you, I am totally out of it for at least a few days !!!


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11438 posts, RR: 58
Reply 13, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 23502 times:
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Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 11):
Most business travellers don't want to waste a full day which they do when taking a daytime flight, and most leisure travellers don't want to waste a day of their vacation time, plus pay for one more night in a hotel. It''s for much the same reasons that daytime flights between North America and deep South America (EZE/GRU/SCL etc.) aren't popular, even with only minor time zone differences. People just don't want to waste a full day flying and pay for another expensive night in a hotel.

I don't see such a problem. 99% of travellers fly on daylight Europe-US because of time zone and duration of flights, but the flights depart during the afternoon giving time to connections to reach their flights.
If you need to do the same to South America, you need 10-11 AM departures, and will rely on late night connections out of GIG / GRU / EZE / SCL.
Would be great to airlines, but if all move on this direction.
Also, mostly routes will demands more than 24h for 2 trips and turn around. In general 26h of aircraft usage (of course they can run like LHR-JFK-LHR-GIG-LHR or CDG-JFK-CDG-GRU-CDG)
Furthermore, concerning to "waste a full day" be in mind, the return flight, if you need to get to your city in Europe early morning, you will need to depart by 4 PM from Brazil for example, which means be at the airport for check-in at 2PM, left the hotel by 12PM... or in other words, you will waste a full day of work or vacation time any way !



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25346 posts, RR: 22
Reply 14, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 23405 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 13):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 11):
Most business travellers don't want to waste a full day which they do when taking a daytime flight, and most leisure travellers don't want to waste a day of their vacation time, plus pay for one more night in a hotel. It''s for much the same reasons that daytime flights between North America and deep South America (EZE/GRU/SCL etc.) aren't popular, even with only minor time zone differences. People just don't want to waste a full day flying and pay for another expensive night in a hotel.

I don't see such a problem. 99% of travellers fly on daylight Europe-US because of time zone and duration of flights, but the flights depart during the afternoon giving time to connections to reach their flights.

From Europe to the US, there are no options to daytime flights. It's different in the other direction where you have a choice. If not mistaken the only overnight flight from Europe to Norht America is one of IB's MAD-MEX flights where it works due to the flight duration and time difference, although it leaves MAD very late.

Given the choice of a daytime or overnight flight eastbound from the US to Europe (or Canada....AC has a daytime flight YYZ-LHR), most passengers prefer the overnight flights.


User currently offlineHotelmode From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2007, 460 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 23307 times:



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 13):
Furthermore, concerning to "waste a full day" be in mind, the return flight, if you need to get to your city in Europe early morning, you will need to depart by 4 PM from Brazil for example, which means be at the airport for check-in at 2PM, left the hotel by 12PM... or in other words, you will waste a full day of work or vacation time any way !

Yes, but to get to London at a say 10pm you'd need to leave Brazil at 0700, so leaving your hotel at 0300, wasting a nights hotel bill! Not to mention that there would be nil connectivity at either end. For continental Europe its an hour worse.

Of course its 2 hours better in the northern winter!


User currently offlineIncitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 4015 posts, RR: 13
Reply 16, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 23291 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 11):
Most business travellers don't want to waste a full day which they do when taking a daytime flight, and most leisure travellers don't want to waste a day of their vacation time, plus pay for one more night in a hotel.

Have you ever tried to work a full day in NY, then get on a plane and work the following full day in London? I have. While I can do it, it is not easy. Most people who do work that requires quick brain reaction will not be at their peak performance after an overnight transtlantic flight. NY-London is a fairly short route and the only way to get some sleep is to be in business or first and dismiss the entire meal service. It is not the same as NY-SaoPaulo or London-HongKong.

Also, several companies have travel policies that prevent employees from traveling business class on shorter longhaul flights like NY-London. Among those people, the daylight flights are very popular. They don't really lose an entire day of work because they can work on their laptops. The company saves $2000 or $3000.

The reality is much more varied than people not wanting to waste one day traveling. Though I agree that's an important factor.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 11):
With the major drop in business traffic due to the financial crisis, I would expect daytime flights will become fewer. And they often have poor Y class load factors.

That's possible but the fall in traffic may be mitigated for daylights by people trading overnight business class for daylight cattle class.



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User currently offlineCairo From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 23239 times:



Quoting WeirdLinguist (Reply 2):
people would rather fly in during the daytime IMO, I flew JKF-AMS coupla months ago the flight left at 11 pm and got there 11am, 12 hours +/-. If a flight leaves at 10 in the morning it arrives 10 pm. See no point to getting there that late.



Quoting WeirdLinguist (Reply 2):
I would actually pay premium to have daytime US-to-Europe flights

All other factors (connections, fares, time allocated for travel) being equal, the research we did at a major US airline indicated more people preferred to travel on a theoretical daylight crossing - in both directions, not just westerly. The night crossing is dreaded by many who find sleeping on the plane odd and almost everyone hates arriving in London at 0600 and hates the expectation of a full day at that point - whether on business or pleasure.

The predominate evening departures for Europe from the USA are more a function of airline needs than customer preference. Surveyed flyers revealed that with enough time available and if expenses were no issue - they'd prefer to arrive in Europe late on the day of travel, go to sleep right away, and start their business trip or vacation after a good night's rest in a hotel.

Cairo


User currently offlineAmricanShamrok From Ireland, joined May 2008, 2903 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 23221 times:



Quoting ManuCH (Reply 3):
I would actually pay premium to have daytime US-to-Europe flights. I'm one of those people who can't sleep on airplanes (because of the noise or whatever), and west-to-east jetlag combined with sleep deprivation (even if only a night) kills me and makes me totally un-productive for 2-3 days at least.

My words exactly I always hate arriving back in Ireland at all hours of the morning and then coming home and falling into bed and not being able to sleep that night. I can't believe there are not more flights that arrive in Europe at night that way you can just go to bed at the same time as everyone else and get back on track quicker.



Shannon-Chicago
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11639 posts, RR: 61
Reply 19, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 23186 times:

There are two primary reasons why, currently, all of the daylight eastbound flights from the U.S. to Europe go to London:

1) London is - by far - the single largest market in Europe for the U.S. and generates substantially more demand, at all times of the day, than any other single market in Europe

2) Because of its location (closer to the U.S. than anywhere else in Europe except Ireland and Iceland) and time difference (one hour earlier than the continent) flight times are a bit more bearable from the U.S. to London in the daytime, allowing an arrival in London that isn't too late (before 22:00-23:00 in most cases)

That second reason - the practical realities of flight time and time zone difference - is also the reason why, with only a single exception, all of the existing daily flights from the U.S. to Europe (London) are from the Northeast: JFK, Newark, Boston and Dulles. This is because schedule dictates that flight can still leave these cities late enough to get reasonable connections and O&D on the U.S. end, but still get into London early enough to allow some limited connections on that end, and not be too late at night that people don't want to arrive then.

That all being said, I personally think that the one gaping hole in the present U.S.-Europe schedule in terms of daylight eastbound flying is JFK-Paris. I know, I know, others have tried it (Air France most recently, at TWA years ago I believe) but I think that nowadays, it could definitely be done. In my opinion, Air France failed to make it work because the plane they were using on it - the A330 - was too big. But I think that flight would be perfect for a ~180-seat 757, and I think that if an airline were to try it from JFK (probably AA or DL), they could make it work with a 757.

Just my thoughts, though.


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 20, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 23131 times:



Quoting Commavia (Reply 19):
with only a single exception

And even that one exception isn't too bad. It leaves Chicago at 900a and arrives into LHR at 1040p - at that hour when Customs/Immigration is a breeze at LHR, it's not unrealistic to be at your hotel in Central London by midnight if you take Heathrow Express. That still allows for a (very) late dinner and drinks, in bed by 1 a.m. and up at around 7.

Plus, that ORD flight allows for a good number of connections from the midwest - it's a 910a departure, so it allows for a good chunk of the country (most of the Central time zone, plus some Eastern time zone) to make it on that flight.

I might be a Delta guy, but given the choice of flights, I'd much rather take the 610a flight out of MSP to ORD and then hop on the 777 over to LHR and get in that night. AA's flight times to LHR just work better for me that way from a comfort perspective.


User currently offlineShamrock321 From Ireland, joined May 2008, 1598 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 23072 times:

When did they move us? We are now further east than London? Perhaps your geography skills need a touch up? How much more would an need to spend on catering on a daylight US-Europe flight since Im sure people would eat more during the day? I doubt its a significant factor tough!

User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11438 posts, RR: 58
Reply 22, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 22863 times:
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Quoting Hotelmode (Reply 15):
Yes, but to get to London at a say 10pm you'd need to leave Brazil at 0700, so leaving your hotel at 0300, wasting a nights hotel bill! Not to mention that there would be nil connectivity at either end. For continental Europe its an hour worse.

Agree with you, daylight sectors from Brazil would be crazy.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 14):
From Europe to the US, there are no options to daytime flights. It's different in the other direction where you have a choice. If not mistaken the only overnight flight from Europe to Norht America is one of IB's MAD-MEX flights where it works due to the flight duration and time difference, although it leaves MAD very late.

Also agreed. A 1:30 departure from Europe (except UK and LIS) wouldn't be so bad, and would arive MIA for example closer to 5:30/6:00. But which airports could do that ?



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4471 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 22735 times:



Quoting Richierich (Reply 8):
I've always wanted to try one of those flights but never have.

I've done the daytime BOS-LHR on AA twice. It's really quite nice flying over during the day. If possible, you should definitely try it.

Quoting Thestooges (Reply 12):
Something about it being suddenly 6AM when you think its only midnight, and therefor completely missing a whole nights sleep. Like you, I am totally out of it for at least a few days !!!

Me too! Last time I flew the night flight MIA-LHR we got into LHR around 9:30am (I of course did not sleep at all on the plane - I just can't do it no matter how hard I try). I then proceeded to stay up until about 8pm London time - was quite a zombie that day, but I managed to adjust after just that one day. But, still, I would prefer arriving at 10pm or 11pm at LHR, going to the hotel and going to sleep.

Quoting Cairo (Reply 17):
The predominate evening departures for Europe from the USA are more a function of airline needs than customer preference. Surveyed flyers revealed that with enough time available and if expenses were no issue - they'd prefer to arrive in Europe late on the day of travel, go to sleep right away, and start their business trip or vacation after a good night's rest in a hotel.

Yes, I belive that to be correct. The overnight flights to Europe is completely for the convenience of the airlines.


User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4471 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (5 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 22711 times:

By the way, has anyone factored in the issue of not being able to check in to your hotel until 3 in the afternoon?

I really don't think the majority of pax flying to Europe on these overnight flights appreciate having to cool their heels for 8 or 9 hours until they can check in to their hotel room.

These overnight flights are almost completely for the convenience of the airlines!


25 Qantas777 : they don't make money on direct operating costs and do not provide any value to any potential connecting flights.
26 DiscoverCSG : I assume you're referring to SEA and PDX. Beyond that, I've taken full advantage of the morning USA-LHR flights on both of my recent UK trips from NY
27 DeltAirlines : If you can do it with O&D (or a few connections on the originating end), it makes it doable. The four cities with daytime flights to LHR - Boston, Ne
28 FlyMD : Additionally, red eye transcons can make the connection.
29 BA747400 : Me too, though on BA. It was really strange though, because as you fly north over the Atlantic (especially during the winter months) the sun goes dow
30 Babybus : True. We always assume the arrival city is the actual final destination. Most people have further connections to get up north or to another city on t
31 Gigneil : IDK, as a businessperson I would never take one. But if I'm going to London for a quick few days on holiday, that 9am flight from Dulles always hit th
32 Jhooper : Not sure if anyone hit on this or not, but when you're going "against the flow" of the majority of the North Atlantic traffic, you're taking a huge hi
33 ORD2PHL : I definitely see both sides of this argument and it's all really just a matter of preference. I have flown IAD-LHR on UA's daytime services (Departs
34 Thestooges : Wow I can't beleive I forgot about this point. This can be a VERY painful expereince, when I flew into London from New York a few years ago I was sta
35 Legacytravel : I took the morning flight from EWR-LHR and when we arrived in LHR it was like a ghost town. I did notice that much of London appears to shut down at n
36 AirNZ : I'm not quite sure what you mean by ".....what happens then"? Surely the proper thing to be doing is being fully aware of the hotel Check-In time bef
37 MasseyBrown : Many business people book an extra night just to ensure the availability of a room when they arrive. As someone who can't sleep much on planes, I try
38 Thestooges : Well seeing as I havn't worked in hotels and rarely stay in them either, I have no idea what happens there, but I can tell you, that everyone who arr
39 N62NA : Vacationers, especially those that are on their first trip to Europe from North America, are usually not aware of this "slight detail" and are the on
40 Thestooges : Skimmed over your post and didn't even see this, this helps to explain some of my question.
41 DeltAirlines : As I mentioned above, most major hotels have a bell desk where you can drop your luggage off with them after doing all the check-in formalities (just
42 Knope2001 : A benefit for some on the daytime eastbound is that a cheaper class is much more tolerable. Of course for some people it's coach no matter what. But f
43 MasseyBrown : What is all you want to do is sleep? In that case freshening up will require amphetamines.
44 Directorguy : Not in the context of Europe-North America flights, but I hate overnight flights. I hate having to show up at the airport at 10 pm and then arrive at
45 Gigneil : And if you are in the general area of Heathrow, or even a lot of the properties in London City proper, those hotels have your room ready in almost ev
46 CityofAthens : Just flew BOS-LHR morning departure today; we landed at 1930 into T5; flight time 5hrs45 ... painless. Brunch service after take-off from BOS, full ba
47 Thestooges : Thanks for that info, as this is what I had suspected. So lets say your room is ready for you when you arrive 5 am Monday for example. Do you just pa
48 2travel2know : I think the only U.S. airline that could make A.M. flights from NYC to London work may be AA. Why? Because IMHO, AA could fly a plane to London around
49 Pellegrine : I really like morning flights into LHR, because I don't sleep well on planes. But, the overnights aren't bad either because I don't require much sleep
50 Viscount724 : UA seems to have exactly what you want. UA923 departs LHR at 07.55 and arrives IAD at 11.10. In fact, I think that may be the earliest departure from
51 Incitatus : Good luck on getting that 0130 departure slot out of Heathrow. The price right now is infinity.
52 2travel2know : LHR isn't Londons only airport. B.T.W., wasn't LHR open 24/7 and its night-time slots "affordable" even if not that many available since there's some
53 Pellegrine : Knew about the UA one, I had no idea BA had a LHR-JFK so early. That's a +++++++. I'm doing more TATL with BA nowadays, wish they'd bring back the mo
54 Gigneil : I have never paid for Sunday night when arriving Monday AM at a Heathrow area hotel. NS
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