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Geneva International Airport(GVA) Recieves Award  
User currently offlineRootsAir From Costa Rica, joined Feb 2005, 4186 posts, RR: 40
Posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 3110 times:

Geneva’s international airport has been given the Eagle Award 2009, by the international air transport authority, IATA. The award was given in recognition of the airport’s gains in efficiency, its efforts to maintain low cost air travel, its environmental achievements and its transparency.

in french: http://www.romandie.com/infos/ats/di...08111102588172019048040_brf024.xml


Regards BM  airplane  wave 


A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
15 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 1, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2947 times:



Quoting RootsAir (Thread starter):
Geneva’s international airport has been given the Eagle Award 2009, by the international air transport authority, IATA. The award was given in recognition of the airport’s gains

-
I fear you feel frustrated about the lack of responses ! What I can tell you is that I since 1973, in fact quite a while, worked at or around repeatedly awards-winning ZRH-airport. ZRH indeed DOES have its merits, but over the decades in fact rather has been a well-selled mess of a place ! The "air-conditioning" of this airport caused me many "health-hazards", the working conditions were lousy, the "environment" contributed to me having had cancer in '88, but well, overall according to the media it is one of the most SUPERB AIRPORTS anywhere.
-
So that I do not really feel like giving much value to "awards" ..........  wave   wave 


User currently offlinePITrules From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 3236 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2929 times:

Interesting that a new runway has been mentioned. I imagine this would be to the immediate northwest of the current one?

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/news_dig...d=9154974&cKey=1212466846000&ty=st



FLYi
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25843 posts, RR: 22
Reply 3, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2914 times:



Quoting PITrules (Reply 2):
Interesting that a new runway has been mentioned. I imagine this would be to the immediate northwest of the current one?

It's highly unlikely that a 2nd runway will ever be built at GVA. The environmental issues would never be overcome, and there is no available land without destroying many buildings, most of which are in France. The Swiss/French border lies very close to the edge of the current runway.


User currently offlinePITrules From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 3236 posts, RR: 6
Reply 4, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2904 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 3):
It's highly unlikely that a 2nd runway will ever be built at GVA. The environmental issues would never be overcome, and there is no available land without destroying many buildings, most of which are in France.

I just had another look at GVA on Google Earth.

To build an 8,000' runway 1,000' north of the current runway (with a parallel taxiway in between) would only require taking a hanful of buildings. They are located to the west of the general aviation area, and are all in Switzerland. Part of the general aviation area would have to be slightly relocated as well.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 3):
The Swiss/French border lies very close to the edge of the current runway.

When the original runway was built, wasn't there a land swap with France? If so, I don't see why it couldn't be done again. After all, this portion of France benefits from GVA as well.


Having said all that, yes I agree there are issues to be overcome. It would depend how much they want it.



FLYi
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25843 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2894 times:



Quoting PITrules (Reply 4):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 3):
The Swiss/French border lies very close to the edge of the current runway.

When the original runway was built, wasn't there a land swap with France? If so, I don't see why it couldn't be done again. After all, this portion of France benefits from GVA as well.

Yes there was a land swap when they extended the runway around 1960..

Even if they could squeeze in a shorter runway far enough from the current one to permit simultaneous operations, noise would be the big issue as the departure/arrival path for the new runway would be much closer to the French town of Ferney-Voltaire at one end and the Geneva community of Meyrin, a densely-populated area of apartment buildings, at the other end. I just can't see those issues ever being resolved. They couldn't even reach an agreement to cut down some trees on the French side of the border a few years ago which were considered to be a safety issue.

LGW handles almost 3 times GVA's passenger traffic and roughly 40% more aircraft movements with just one runway.


User currently offlineRunway23 From US Minor Outlying Islands, joined Jan 2005, 2214 posts, RR: 35
Reply 6, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2877 times:



Quoting PITrules (Reply 2):
Interesting that a new runway has been mentioned. I imagine this would be to the immediate northwest of the current one?

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/news_dig...ty=st

That article is a year old. IIRC in the mean time respective airport/government officials have come out saying there will not be any second runway. Although some of the excuses put out are simply untrue (stating that the mountains are in the way is ultimately false).

It's also important to take into account that any additional runway would need to go through local votes (historically Geneva citizens have been against airport expansion). Then you have to renegotiate the agreement with France and of course cut down the forest that lies ahead of the grass runway 23 (source of much NIMBY protest a few years ago).

Generally though the larger problem is with those who use the airport. Geneva is Europe's second most used business jet airport and therein lies the problem. Expand the airport and add another runway/terminal and you have to displace these users. Most are highly influential and will not go away from the airport (why would they - it's almost downtown these days). You have no alternatives anyways where they can go. Annemasse airfield can't take large bizjets and is a pain to get to from Geneva. Annecy airport is 25 minutes away and certainly not useful for that type of user. Further afield Lausanne is still very much underused and really too far to be an alternative (let's not even mention Payerne).

Generally though all of these factors have meant that the airport has been slow to expand. The latest airport overhaul is a testament of this. The widebody gates (C-gates) look awful and have been a temporary solution for the past years and no effort has yet to be put into announcing its replacement (even though new services have come and the gates are now at pretty much 100% utilization). There are also other visible errors in planning that prevent airport terminal expansion (palexpo hall 7 impeding what could have been useful terminal space) or the firefighters hall or cargo facilities located way to near to the terminal.

Overall though I'm surprised to see the airport receive an award now. Yes it is profitable and has done well to attract new service (although probably more a testament of the local economy's strengths) - in terms of planning it's fallen behind. The terminal has come to be overused. Those who remember GVA even just 3-4 years ago will remember never seeing queues at the security checkpoint except on winter weekends. Now it seems almost every morning is a winter weekend with queues often around 15 minutes.

There's still a lot of work left to bring GVA back to how it felt a few years ago (convenient, friendly) and really take care of planning something that's useful for the next two decades rather than just catching up to things that should have been done two decades ago.


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25843 posts, RR: 22
Reply 7, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 2784 times:



Quoting Runway23 (Reply 6):
Those who remember GVA even just 3-4 years ago will remember never seeing queues at the security checkpoint except on winter weekends. Now it seems almost every morning is a winter weekend with queues often around 15 minutes.

15 minutes is nothing compared to many airports in other parts of the world. I've never had to wait that long to clear security, rarely over 5 minutes. Last Saturday morning I made it from the train to the gate in less than 10 minutes. You can't do that at many airports.

Overall, GVA does an excellent job considering the severe geographical constraints it can't do anything about.

With Switzerland now part of Schengen since the end of March, you also have one less roadblock during busy periods as a high percentage of traffic is to/from Schengen countries and no longer has passport controls on both departure and arrival. I used to find long lines at passport control during peak periods much more of a problem than the security checkpoints.


User currently offlineHBJZA From Switzerland, joined Jan 2006, 377 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 2734 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 3):
It's highly unlikely that a 2nd runway will ever be built at GVA. The environmental issues would never be overcome, and there is no available land without destroying many buildings, most of which are in France. The Swiss/French border lies very close to the edge of the current runway.

As it seems impossible to build a new runway in GVA, I remember having read a few years back that there is a plan to link GVA and LYS with a high speed underground train that would do the trip as fast as in 16 minutes.
Have anyone else heard about it and have more details about it ?


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15810 posts, RR: 27
Reply 9, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 2719 times:

I was there just a few weeks ago and can say that it is a pleasant, efficient and user friendly airport. A bit too much perhaps. I would have liked to stick around and enjoy it a bit, but I was from the plane to the train station in under 15 minutes.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 7):
With Switzerland now part of Schengen since the end of March, you also have one less roadblock during busy periods as a high percentage of traffic is to/from Schengen countries and no longer has passport controls on both departure and arrival.

That explains why my passport wasn't checked when I arrived. But they did check it on the way out at ZRH. In fact, as the officer at ZRH was looking at my uncle's passport he asked why he had no entry stamp. My uncle replied that he entered Switzerland at the Geneva Airport and the officer said "oh, well they do it different there." I still don't know quite what he meant.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25843 posts, RR: 22
Reply 10, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 2709 times:



Quoting BMI727 (Reply 9):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 7):
With Switzerland now part of Schengen since the end of March, you also have one less roadblock during busy periods as a high percentage of traffic is to/from Schengen countries and no longer has passport controls on both departure and arrival.

That explains why my passport wasn't checked when I arrived. But they did check it on the way out at ZRH. In fact, as the officer at ZRH was looking at my uncle's passport he asked why he had no entry stamp. My uncle replied that he entered Switzerland at the Geneva Airport and the officer said "oh, well they do it different there." I still don't know quite what he meant.

If you arrived in GVA on a direct flight from the US, you should have cleared passport control and they should have stamped your passport. If they didn't, they weren't applying the Schengen rules correctly. You should have passport stamps at the first point of arrival and last point of departure in the 25-country Schengen area.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15810 posts, RR: 27
Reply 11, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 2707 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 10):
You should have passport stamps at the first point of arrival and last point of departure in the 25-country Schengen area.

I did have that. I should have mentioned that I arrived from Italy, not from the US. I guess the guy in ZRH assumed that we had come straight from the US.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineRunway23 From US Minor Outlying Islands, joined Jan 2005, 2214 posts, RR: 35
Reply 12, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 2688 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 7):
15 minutes is nothing compared to many airports in other parts of the world. I've never had to wait that long to clear security, rarely over 5 minutes.

It really depends what time you fly. Around 5-730am you will wait about 5 minutes. Any time after that and it can easily reach up to 20 minutes until about 1pm. Something still unheard of like I said less than half a decade ago. Although there is (eternal?) hope that with one-stop security coming in November that things will be better.

Quoting HBJZA (Reply 8):
As it seems impossible to build a new runway in GVA, I remember having read a few years back that there is a plan to link GVA and LYS with a high speed underground train that would do the trip as fast as in 16 minutes.
Have anyone else heard about it and have more details about it ?

The project was called 'Swiss Metro' and was IMHO the biggest fantasy Switzerland ever had. In fact, IIRC the project was done by EPFL more as a showcase and then trying to find financing. Obviously that never came through and I'd give it as much of a probability of happening as Geneva airport getting two new runways overnight (ie. never going to happen).

That said with better infrastructure and planning I'm sure an SNCF trainline could be set up linking Geneva and LYS in about an hour or so. Although that will always beg the question whether Geneva/Swiss government will want to lead customers to a French airport. I'm more convinced that overtime we will see Geneva try to convince nearby cities like Annecy to use LYS freeing up space/usage for people from Geneva core/surrounding Vaud to make use of the existing airport.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 10):
If you arrived in GVA on a direct flight from the US, you should have cleared passport control and they should have stamped your passport. If they didn't, they weren't applying the Schengen rules correctly. You should have passport stamps at the first point of arrival and last point of departure in the 25-country Schengen area.

GVA don't follow Schengen rules properly. They don't scan/pull up EU/Swiss passports on the registry like they are supposed to. They have started to stamp foreign passports though - although that is something that happened in the past week or so. Weird thing is since Schengen GVA immigration has gone from being Geneva airport police to Swiss border patrol whilst in ZRH it has stayed the same being run by ZRH airport. I'm not sure why it's not the same for both airports but its a somewhat interesting difference.


User currently offlineQFMel From Australia, joined Jun 2009, 79 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2624 times:



Quoting Runway23 (Reply 12):

GVA don't follow Schengen rules properly. They don't scan/pull up EU/Swiss passports on the registry like they are supposed to. They have started to stamp foreign passports though - although that is something that happened in the past week or so. Weird thing is since Schengen GVA immigration has gone from being Geneva airport police to Swiss border patrol whilst in ZRH it has stayed the same being run by ZRH airport. I'm not sure why it's not the same for both airports but its a somewhat interesting difference.

Much to my chagrin, have never had my passport stamped in either ZRH or GVA, regardless of whether I was flying directly (eg from HKG) or transiting through a Schengen port (eg FRA).
Insert sad face here! Doesn't diminish my love of Geneva in particular, however- fantastic place.


User currently offlineBabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2596 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 10):
You should have passport stamps at the first point of arrival and last point of departure in the 25-country Schengen area.

Well I'd like to go back to the days when all passports were stamped on arrival and departure from any airport. Fantastic! What a lovely souvenir of a trip.

I fly over GVA at least once a month and it always looks so empty. I know it's not, but from 38,000ft it does. A pretty location for an airport.


User currently offlineLH526 From Germany, joined Aug 2000, 2379 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (5 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2587 times:
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Quoting RootsAir (Thread starter):
The award was given in recognition of the airport’s gains in efficiency

PAH, ever flew through GVA during Motor Show?



Trittst im Morgenrot daher, seh ich dich im Strahlenmeer ...
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