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Woman Dies Onboard AirTran Flight  
User currently offlineEwRkId From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 594 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 8714 times:

PHILADELPHIA (BNO NEWS) — An AirTran Airways passenger plane made an emergency landing at Philadelphia International Airport on Thursday after an elderly woman died on board, officials say.

The flight, AirTran Airways flight 664, departed Westchester County Airport in New York at 1.18 p.m. local time and was bound for West Palm Beach International Airport in Florida when one of the passenger reported heart problems to the flight attendant.

The captain of the plane, which is a Boeing 717-200, then declared an emergency and was diverted to Philadelphia International Airport. “There was a doctor on board who began tending to the patient, but unfortunately the passenger did pass away,”

Heres the link:
http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/...an-flight-officials_100209615.html


Certainly a sad day around the world RIP,
EwRkId

18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTharanga From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 1861 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 8592 times:

Sad. RIP.

This is actually my biggest fear of flying - I have no concern about a plane crash at all, but I do worry about people having medical problems, with no timely way of treating them.


User currently offlineWjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5118 posts, RR: 22
Reply 2, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 8306 times:

Actually, you can be on the ground in a matter of minutes, where emergency crews will be waiting, and, you stand a pretty decent chance of someone on board either being a doctor or other health professional. That's a lot closer access to care than a lot of people have. If I call 911 in a Midtown Manhattan restaurant or skyscraper, I'm gonna wait 10-15 minutes for someone to get there, if I'm lucky and massive traffic doesn't box in the ambulance. Then, I'm going to take a while to get through traffic to the hospital. Yes, it's nice that I have a trauma center/emergency room at one of the best hospitals in the world within a five-minute walk from the front door of my apartment building, but if I'm real distress, I'm not going to be ambulatory.

Bottom line is that for a lot of folks, being in an airplane that can/will land at a major city in a matter of minutes, with Paramedics and EMTs right there, and presumably a hospital pretty close by, is as good or better a situation than they'd find at home.

Of course, in the middle of the ocean it's a different story.


User currently offlineZrs70 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 3129 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 8228 times:

FWIW, I was flamed on this forum for reporting an in flight death two years ago! Is anet growing up?

Inflight Death On LH 450 FRA-LAX, 7/28/07 (by Zrs70 Jul 29 2007 in Civil Aviation)



14 year airliners.net vet! 2000-2013
User currently offlineM11Stephen From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1247 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 8184 times:

Airplanes carry AEDS, First Aid Kits, and F/As get advanced first aid training. Its sad that these things seem to happen a lot but there is only so much airlines can do... If you even think you'll have medical emergency during flight during flight, don't fly, go to a doctor. An airplane isn't the worst place to have an unexpected medical emergency however. You have at least one person on board who has extensive first aid training who's going to do whatever they can to help you and a lot of times theres an EMT, Nurse, or Doctor onboard.


My opinions, statements, etc. are my own and do not have any association with those of any employer.
User currently offlineAirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 7937 times:



Quoting Wjcandee (Reply 2):
being in an airplane that can/will land at a major city in a matter of minutes,

Up to a certain point only though, and I certainly wouldn't be as fast to say that an a/c can can at such a destination "in a matter of minutes"

Quoting M11Stephen (Reply 4):
extensive first aid training who's going to do whatever they can to help you and a lot of times theres an EMT, Nurse, or Doctor onboard.

Again, First Aid training is certainly not "extensive" with regard to any medical 'emergency'.
Might indeed be an EMT, nurse or doctor aboard sometimes.....but pretty limited without the capability of equipment requirements except in very minor 'emergencies'.


User currently offlineKingFriday013 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 1296 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 6028 times:



Quoting M11Stephen (Reply 4):
F/As get advanced first aid training

Just curious, but what kind of training/certification do they have? For example, I'm an American Red Cross-certified Professional Rescuer (CPR, AED, first aid, etc., for workplace; second to lifeguards and EMTs). What kind of certification (or rating, if that helps make it clearer) do flight crew members get?

-J.



Tho' I've belted you an' flayed you, By the livin' Gawd that made you, You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din!
User currently offlineBP1 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 593 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 5668 times:

Does AirTran use MedAire or MedLink?

Thanks,
BP1



"First To Fly The A-380" / 26 October 2007 SYD-SIN Inaugural
User currently offlineM11Stephen From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1247 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 5058 times:



Quoting KingFriday013 (Reply 6):

Just curious, but what kind of training/certification do they have? For example, I'm an American Red Cross-certified Professional Rescuer (CPR, AED, first aid, etc., for workplace; second to lifeguards and EMTs). What kind of certification (or rating, if that helps make it clearer) do flight crew members get?

Yes, there not EMT's but IIRC there is basic first aid then there is advanced first aid. They get advanced first aid training.



My opinions, statements, etc. are my own and do not have any association with those of any employer.
User currently offlineM11Stephen From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 1247 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4944 times:



Quoting BP1 (Reply 7):
Does AirTran use MedAire or MedLink?

Thanks,
BP1

I think every airline subscribes to one of those kinds of services. There is only so much that can be done though since your miles up in the sky...



My opinions, statements, etc. are my own and do not have any association with those of any employer.
User currently offlineSFONative From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4927 times:

Quoting Zrs70 (Reply 3):
FWIW, I was flamed on this forum for reporting an in flight death two years ago! Is anet growing up?

While I see no reason for you to get flamed for posting this, I also do not disagree with those who may not like the idea of posting such a story, unless you are asking some kind of question or are trying to make a point with regards to the story. Of which I see you had neither and this appears to just be a FYI post.

This is someone's loved one, appears for the moment to be a pretty cut and dry story with no foul play suggested, and really is not all that uncommon.

Possibly no need to post this on here so a bunch or knuckleheads can start bantering back and forth about it......  

I like to think some things should stay sacred, but I am proven wrong on a daily basis.

But thats just my $0.02.



[Edited 2009-06-26 13:54:14]

User currently offlineKingFriday013 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 1296 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4645 times:



Quoting M11Stephen (Reply 8):
Yes, there not EMT's but IIRC there is basic first aid then there is advanced first aid. They get advanced first aid training.

Thanks... but does anyone know if flight attendants have an actual specific certification? I'd guess Professional Rescuer because it's meant for people who may have to perform first aid (incl. CPR) in the workplace. Anybody know for sure?

-J.



Tho' I've belted you an' flayed you, By the livin' Gawd that made you, You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din!
User currently offlineBingo From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 359 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4615 times:

Quoting SFONative (Reply 10):
While I see no reason for you to get flamed for posting this, I also do not disagree with those who may not like the idea of posting such a story, unless you are asking some kind of question or are trying to make a point with regards to the story. Of which I see you had neither and this appears to just be a FYI post.

I think that this is a fair posting in all accounts. If you think this type of thread isn't worthy of being posted then ignore it and "Thread Darwin" will do his thing and move it to page 2, then page 3, until its gone.

The thing to remember is that members of the general public (including victim's families) and media with questions surrounding this and other such events will hit google and do searches for information regarding such incidents. Your threads can (and do) show up in their search results. We all complain about CNN, FOX and all the other channels messing things up when reporting aviation news. Well use an event like this to help them get the facts straight.

FA's are trained in X,Y,Z. There are X services that airlines subscribe to that provide inflight access to medical professionals. Pilots do Y when being informed of an incident on board. If a doctor is onboard he/she may assist the flight crew within X boundaries.

I'd be embarrassed if a family member does a search and finds a thread here where someone is getting flamed for a "lame" post such as a death in flight.

In terms of the situation regarding this unfortunate event onboard AirTran, as the facts above have stated, the passenger was treated with excellent medical care onboard. Unfortunately all efforts were unsuccessful in reviving the passenger. Our sincerest sympathies to the family of the deceased.

-Bingo

[Edited 2009-06-26 14:29:23]

User currently offlineGoomba From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 309 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4231 times:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but...

The FAA mandates defibulators on aircraft and flight attendants are trained in CPR.

That's not to say that this is a sure fire cure for a person going into cardiac arrest or having a heart attack, but this does certainly help. With each minute that goes by, a person loses about 10% of their chance of survival during a cardiac emergency.

On an aircraft, you are captive in a small area, you have a lot of people around you (including usually a doctor or health care professional), flight attendants trained in CPR (among other passengers too), and a defibulator.

Just my opinion, but I'd rather be on an aircraft during a cardiac emergency vs. let's say my car driving in traffic on the highway. I feel pretty confident that my chances of survival would be greater.

That said...RIP to the woman onboard this flight and thoughts and prayers are with her family.


User currently offlineMarkhkg From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 960 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days ago) and read 4030 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 5):
but pretty limited without the capability of equipment requirements except in very minor 'emergencies'.

The US required Emergency Medical Kit (EMK) has more medications than some ambulances in some countries. You have epinephrine for intravenous (1:10,000 concentration) and injectable (1:1000) use, nitroglycerin, atropine, lidocaine, aspirin , injectable diphenhydramine and albuterol, to name just a small part of the bag. In addition, the fact that every 121 operation flight in the US has an AED is why I'm more likely to survive a cardiac arrest in the air than on the streets in New York.
(AEDs are still not required on European aircraft per the JAA)

FAA required EMK contents are here: http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulatory...Document&Highlight=defibrillators,

Quoting KingFriday013 (Reply 6):
but what kind of training/certification do they have?



Quoting M11Stephen (Reply 8):
They get advanced first aid training.

I'm not sure if you can call what's required "advanced". The curriculum that I have seen was essentially the Red Cross "Standard First Aid/CPR/AED" course with Infant, Child and Adult CPR with a couple of additional topics such as hypoxia and aviation physiology. The FAA does not have a required curriculum nor sets a number of hours required for training. I'm not trying to minimize the fact that the F/A training is intensive - the fact that they re-certify every 12-24 months depending on their carrier, when a CPR certificate lasts 1-2 years and a First Aid certificate lasts 3 years, along with performance drills is pretty good for me. What I am trying to say is that they are not necessarily trained the "First Responder" or "EMT-B" standard as established for US Emergency Medical Services providers which is slightly more advanced than a regular First Aid course. Of course, some air carriers may enhance their training to go over more advanced stuff (like how to use a bag mask resuscitator, oxygen theraphy, Medlink etc.) but the minimum requirement is more similar to the regular flavor first aid class that any layperson can take.

Requirements are noted here:
http://rgl.faa.gov/REGULATORY_AND_GU...25710700523ad6/$FILE/AC121-34B.pdf

Quoting Goomba (Reply 13):
The FAA mandates defibulators on aircraft and flight attendants are trained in CPR.

If there is one flight attendant on board a 121 operation, an AED and EMK must be equipped. These are in addition to the standard First Aid Kit and oxygen.

I'd be interested in finding out if Air Train uses Medaire, StatMD or UPMC...



Release your seat-belts and get out! Leave everything!
User currently offlineSFOnative From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (5 years 1 month 4 days ago) and read 4030 times:



Quoting Bingo (Reply 12):
I think that this is a fair posting in all accounts. If you think this type of thread isn't worthy of being posted then ignore it and "Thread Darwin" will do his thing and move it to page 2, then page 3, until its gone.

Be careful when you say "you". I personally am not making any specific judgements here. Your point would be better stated by saying... "If someone thinks this type of thread isn't worthy" etc.  Smile

Quoting Bingo (Reply 12):
The thing to remember is that members of the general public (including victim's families) and media with questions surrounding this and other such events will hit google and do searches for information regarding such incidents. Your threads can (and do) show up in their search results. We all complain about CNN, FOX and all the other channels messing things up when reporting aviation news. Well use an event like this to help them get the facts straight.

I agree, and again why I wouldn't fault someone who opposes this thread for this very reason. It is easily accessable to all. But just like the media or any other information outlet, chances of getting information wrong is just as likely. You probably didn't mean this exactly , but if someone suggests that a bunch of enthusiasts on an Airline forum are going to know more about the actual situation at hand is a bit of a stretch.

Quoting Bingo (Reply 12):
FA's are trained in X,Y,Z. There are X services that airlines subscribe to that provide inflight access to medical professionals. Pilots do Y when being informed of an incident on board. If a doctor is onboard he/she may assist the flight crew within X boundaries.

Not sure how or why this fits into the discussion.

Quoting Bingo (Reply 12):
I'd be embarrassed if a family member does a search and finds a thread here where someone is getting flamed for a "lame" post such as a death in flight.

Agreed, but this or something else uneccessary is bound to happen that takes away from the respect or "sacredness" of the event.

Quoting Bingo (Reply 12):
In terms of the situation regarding this unfortunate event onboard AirTran, as the facts above have stated, the passenger was treated with excellent medical care onboard. Unfortunately all efforts were unsuccessful in reviving the passenger. Our sincerest sympathies to the family of the deceased.

Again, I agree, but don't see the relevance to our discussion.

Cheers.


User currently offlineBlackbird1331 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1893 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 1 month 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3672 times:

People die every day. Why is it such a big deal when it occurs on an airplane? If you were to die as you read this, would it make the news?


Cameras shoot pictures. Guns shoot people. They have the guns.
User currently offlineBingo From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 359 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (5 years 1 month 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3177 times:

Quoting SFOnative (Reply 15):
Be careful when you say "you". I personally am not making any specific judgements here. Your point would be better stated by saying... "If someone thinks this type of thread isn't worthy" etc.

Not singling out anyone. Strictly a hypothetical. Your rewording is accurate with the intended sentiment.

Quoting SFOnative (Reply 15):
You probably didn't mean this exactly , but if someone suggests that a bunch of enthusiasts on an Airline forum are going to know more about the actual situation at hand is a bit of a stretch.

Its actually scary but people who aren't members of airliners.net actually think that people on here are certified experts. They don't realize that (for the most part) people on here are really just every day people who just happen to drool over Boeings and Airbuses rather than Fords and Chevies. Don't believe me, read the Moderator Warnings at the start of every AF 447 Thread.

Quoting SFOnative (Reply 15):
Not sure how or why this fits into the discussion.

Examples of information that could be used in a posting such as a death in the air.

Quoting SFOnative (Reply 15):
Again, I agree, but don't see the relevance to our discussion.

The original thread topic was on the death of a passenger. Trying to not forget what the thread was about.

Quoting Blackbird1331 (Reply 16):
People die every day. Why is it such a big deal when it occurs on an airplane? If you were to die as you read this, would it make the news?

Dying on the ground is far more common in the air. This I think its a fear most everyone can relate to feeling at some point in their flying career (passenger or crew). The idea of being trapped in an aluminum tube to with immediate access to 911 can really ruin an 8 hour flight across the pond. I think as an educational benefit to the flying public, threads like this can be used as a tool educate people about "everyday occurrences" like this. I like to think that my $5 a month goes to help further aviation by spreading (correct) knowledge about flying....not hate and discontent.

(For example) Blowing a tire on a heavy landing or a compressor stall may be a fairly common event in aviation. But to the untrained person, it's a near death experience that may cause them to never fly again. Help educate people about events like this instead of making them sorry they posted something that wasn't to someone's "coolness" standards. People shouldn't be afraid to post a question. Just my   

[Edited 2009-06-26 18:17:11]

User currently offlineIAirAllie From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (5 years 1 month 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3095 times:



Quoting Wjcandee (Reply 2):
Actually, you can be on the ground in a matter of minutes,

at least 20 minutes in most cases more on transoceanic flights.

Quoting KingFriday013 (Reply 6):
What kind of certification (or rating, if that helps make it clearer) do flight crew members get?



Quoting KingFriday013 (Reply 11):
Thanks... but does anyone know if flight attendants have an actual specific certification?

None. We don't get any certifications through our companies in the US (correct me if there are any carriers that do). We do have training on emergency first aid, use of onboard emergency equipment, CPR, training on use of the AED on an annual basis we just do not get certificated for it. Most airlines also subscribe to medlink or similar services for professional guidance in an emergency.


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