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Boeing Prepares For 747-8 Final Body Join  
User currently offlineAviationbuff From India, joined Mar 2008, 1425 posts, RR: 3
Posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 16878 times:

Boeing prepares for 747-8 final body join

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...res-for-747-8-final-body-join.html

Quote:
Boeing announced today it is preparing for the last step in the structural assembly of the first 747-8 after joining its wing and centre fuselage.

The pending final body join will next attach the centre fuselage with the forward and aft fuselage sections, Boeing says.

The preparations have begun after workers joined the 12m (40ft) fuselage section to the centre wing box, Boeing says. In May, Boeing also completed assembly of the 27.2m forward fuselage section.

No schedule has been released for the next step in the assembly process.

First flight for the 747-8F is scheduled later this year in order to meet a projected first delivery date to Cargolux in the third quarter of 2010.

The great legacy of 747 continues.... cannot wait to see the newest version of the JumboJet.



58 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTrigged From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 539 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 16852 times:

Ahhh. Finally some good news from Boeing. That is good to hear!

User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2682 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 16841 times:

Looks great! Can't wait to see it flying!


אמא, אני מתגעגע לך
User currently offlineOyKIE From Norway, joined Jan 2006, 2752 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 16827 times:

Congrats to Boeing. Does it seems more and more likely that the 747-8 might fly before the 787?


Dream no small dream; it lacks magic. Dream large, then go make that dream real - Donald Douglas
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7063 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 16767 times:



Quoting OyKIE (Reply 3):
Does it seems more and more likely that the 747-8 might fly before the 787?

I don´t know but Boeing needs good news rather sooner than later, either a first flight of the 787 or 747-8I.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineCessna172RG From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 749 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 16456 times:

I'm sure the 747-8 will be up and in the air long before the 787...


Save the whales...for dinner!!!
User currently offlineZeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 9105 posts, RR: 75
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 16329 times:



Quoting OyKIE (Reply 3):
Does it seems more and more likely that the 747-8 might fly before the 787?

Hmmm, all I can say is watch this space. I suspect some not so good announcement to come in relation to the join problems identified. Remember all the good PR which just came out before the latest 787 delay announcement.



We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
User currently offlineTISTPAA727 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 328 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 16275 times:
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Great to see some progress somewhere! I'm sure Boeing's PR department was grasping for something positive to share.

Quoting Zeke (Reply 6):
Hmmm, all I can say is watch this space. I suspect some not so good announcement to come in relation to the join problems identified. Remember all the good PR which just came out before the latest 787 delay announcement.

Care to elaborate? Are you saying there will be issues with the 748's body join? I am just trying to clarify if you are trying to make a parallel comparison between the 7l8tr7 and 748. A good news begets bad news type of thing?



Don't sweat the little things.
User currently offlineVMCA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 16226 times:



Quoting Zeke (Reply 6):
Hmmm, all I can say is watch this space. I suspect some not so good announcement to come in relation to the join problems identified. Remember all the good PR which just came out before the latest 787 delay announcement.

Remember, the 748 is just a stretch on a known commodity. From what I have heard, there are no problems at all with the 748 production and watch for an update on the range figures. I think people will be pleasantly surprised.


User currently offlineTugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 5608 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 16163 times:



Quoting TISTPAA727 (Reply 7):
Care to elaborate? Are you saying there will be issues with the 748's body join? I am just trying to clarify if you are trying to make a parallel comparison between the 7l8tr7 and 748. A good news begets bad news type of thing?

Well in another thread Clickhappy was heard to say: Boeing Thinks Big With 748 Overhead Space (by Cosmofly Jun 28 2009 in Civil Aviation)

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 18):
rather than worrying about floor space they should be asking why the titanium keel beam didn't fit in the factory last week Sad

and:

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 21):
If I had to guess on a first flight I would say no earlier than late Q1 2010

And the man has been (sadly) very accurate with the news he relates.

Tugg



I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
User currently offlineZeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 9105 posts, RR: 75
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 16150 times:



Quoting TISTPAA727 (Reply 7):
Care to elaborate?

No, last time I tried to do that the thread got shut down by the Boeing cheerleaders, took about two months until Boeing fessed up to the problems.

Quoting VMCA (Reply 8):
Remember, the 748 is just a stretch on a known commodity

Incorrect, the wing is very much an unknown.



We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
User currently offline2707200X From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 8525 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 15942 times:

Finally a little good news for Boeing after constant delay of the 787 and all the deferrals and cancellations.


"And all I ask is a tall ship and a star to steer her by." John Masefield Sea-Fever
User currently offlineVMCA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 15899 times:

Quoting Zeke (Reply 10):
Incorrect, the wing is very much an unknown.

While the wing is a new wing, the technology used in the wing/body assembly is the same as what was used in the first 747. It is proven technology and there is very little risk. You make is sound as if the wing join area is cutting edge.

[Edited 2009-06-29 10:25:05]

User currently offlineNA From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10736 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 15766 times:

Good news, cant wait to see it in one piece!

Quoting Cessna172RG (Reply 5):
I'm sure the 747-8 will be up and in the air long before the 787...

Wouldnt surprise me too, 50/50 Boeings new flagship is airborne before the "Dream"liner.
Get the feeling the 787 wont exit the road of misery for quite some time.
And I get the feeling Boeing has some positive surprises coming with the 748I. Hope its performance exceeds the expectations.


User currently offlineZeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 9105 posts, RR: 75
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 15159 times:



Quoting VMCA (Reply 12):
You make is sound as if the wing join area is cutting edge.

Not at all, just pointing out that this is not "just another" 747 wing body join, this is a new aircraft, new problems, and new solutions.



We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2289 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 14897 times:



Quoting Aviationbuff (Thread starter):
Boeing Prepares For 747-8 Final Body Join

Can somebody advice the Home Depot store in Everett to stock up on fasteners?  duck 


No, I'm sorry, I take that back! I repent in sackcloth and ashes! I wish Boeing all the best with their next number 8!

(If the 748 also gets into trouble, we can say for certain that 8 is not a lucky number for an airplane.)



Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlineVMCA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13920 times:



Quoting Zeke (Reply 6):
Hmmm, all I can say is watch this space. I suspect some not so good announcement to come in relation to the join problems identified.



Quoting Zeke (Reply 14):
Not at all, just pointing out that this is not "just another" 747 wing body join, this is a new aircraft, new problems, and new solutions.

Seems to me that it's a little more than just point out. While the wing is a new design, the mechanics of the 747 family join is not new or cutting edge. I think Boeing should be able to sort out whatever problems they may encounter if any at all.


User currently offlineAirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13724 times:



Quoting VMCA (Reply 16):
Seems to me that it's a little more than just point out. While the wing is a new design, the mechanics of the 747 family join is not new or cutting edge. I think Boeing should be able to sort out whatever problems they may encounter if any at all.

With all due respect, it seems that you are deliberately 'looking' for something to imply from Zeke when he clearly implied nothing whatever.
Just as long as they're better at sorting them out though than they have with the 787!


User currently offlineNA From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10736 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13724 times:



Quoting RedChili (Reply 15):
(If the 748 also gets into trouble, we can say for certain that 8 is not a lucky number for an airplane.)

Good one, very good one, but if that´ll make the Chinese less superstitious? I guess even their airlines execs still would think 8 is a lucky number. However stupid that may be.


User currently offlineAirproxx From France, joined Jun 2008, 636 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13579 times:

best news of the year!


If you can meet with triumph and disaster, and treat those two impostors just the same
User currently offlineFlyLKU From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 808 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13418 times:



Quoting NA (Reply 13):
Get the feeling the 787 wont exit the road of misery for quite some time.



Quoting Cessna172RG (Reply 5):
I'm sure the 747-8 will be up and in the air long before the 787...

I must have missed something. It was my understanding that the 787 is flyable as-is but that Boeing elected to strengthen the aircraft now rather than during flight testing. Furthermore, I was under the impression that this was not expected to be a major delay (months) but rather in a few weeks. Someone please enlighten me.



...are we there yet?
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12148 posts, RR: 51
Reply 21, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13392 times:



Quoting Zeke (Reply 14):
Quoting VMCA (Reply 12):
You make is sound as if the wing join area is cutting edge.

Not at all, just pointing out that this is not "just another" 747 wing body join, this is a new aircraft, new problems, and new solutions.

But, the wing of the B-747-8 is not a totally new wing, is it? I thought it was a modified B-747-400ER wing, in shape. I also thought the B-748 uses the same B-744ERF wingbox design. Additionally the new fuselarge plugs are not directly attached to the mid-body section, there is a smaller section fore and aft of the mid-body before the new plugs.

While you are right, this is not just another B-747 wing/body join, it is also not much different than the other models of the B-747.

I also thought the only Boeing WB that had a real unique wing/body join was the B-787. Meaning, the techniques used to mate the body/wing is simalar (but not identical) to those methods used for the B-767 and B-777.


User currently offlineNA From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10736 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 12901 times:



Quoting FlyLKU (Reply 20):
I must have missed something. It was my understanding that the 787 is flyable as-is but that Boeing elected to strengthen the aircraft now rather than during flight testing. Furthermore, I was under the impression that this was not expected to be a major delay (months) but rather in a few weeks. Someone please enlighten me.

You still believe such words from Boeing? Why do they decide on such further image-damaging decision days before the 787 should have flown, finally. If its not a very serious issue, such delay is not justified in the long-lasting mess the "Dream"liner is in. And if its a very serious issue, why is it detected so extremely late?

As for the 748, no 747 version ever differed from its former versions so much, not even the 744.
The 744 had a new cockpit, new wing-to-body fairings, new wing-tips and new engines. The rest were minor affairs. The 744 program was delayed for about 6 months.
The 748 has a largely new wing, new engines, a longer fuselage, a redesigned tailfin and stabilisers, and the pax-version a massively redesigned interior and windows.


User currently offlinePlaneInsomniac From Canada, joined Nov 2007, 678 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 12202 times:



Quoting FlyLKU (Reply 20):
It was my understanding that the 787 is flyable as-is but that Boeing elected to strengthen the aircraft now rather than during flight testing.

Well, the 787 seems to be barely flyable. The flight test program would have been so limited as to be practically useless. In any case, the impact on the certification process is significant.

Quoting FlyLKU (Reply 20):
Furthermore, I was under the impression that this was not expected to be a major delay (months) but rather in a few weeks.

Boeing says they will give an update on first flight schedule in a few weeks. As far as the change to the actual schedule goes, this is anybody's guess.

Quoting FlyLKU (Reply 20):
Someone please enlighten me.

One analyst is quoted as saying that FF will take place in Q4 2009, with deliveries pushed out by another year compared to the last schedule. The main worry is that for the second time in the 787's design process, Boeing's own design tools have failed to predict what turned out to be a major structural flaw. (Remember the wing box, which needed to be redesigned?) Since a significant part of the certification process is based on simulation results, pundits fear that the FAA will demand much more additional data and additional tests from Boeing.



Am I cured? Slept 5 hours on last long-haul flight...
User currently offlineSuprazachair From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Feb 2004, 634 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 12142 times:



Quoting OyKIE (Reply 3):
Congrats to Boeing. Does it seems more and more likely that the 747-8 might fly before the 787?

Wouldn't surprise me one bit.

Quoting FlyLKU (Reply 20):
I was under the impression that this was not expected to be a major delay (months) but rather in a few weeks. Someone please enlighten me

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...hnology/2009381335_787flaw250.html


25 Mptpa : Are you inferring then another '8' aircraft might fall into this category, namely A350-'8'00?? I hope not!! On the 787 note, perhaps more of the grou
26 Stitch : To my knowledge, the delay was due to wiring issues, not design issues.
27 Nomadd22 : That's a crock. The only limitation it has is that they can't take it to 100% of it's design load because it has to be certified to take 150% of what
28 Ikramerica : Long before? Really? So you are predicting a 9 month delay or more for the 787 now, based on one structural part needing to be beefed up? I can't see
29 PlaneInsomniac : Excuse my strong wording. However, it seems our assessments correlate pretty well at the heart of the matter:
30 Tdscanuck : What's unknown? It's a different shaped wing, yes, but I'm not sure there's anything about it that's not known at this point. They haven't actually s
31 Flylot : so, the 747-8 is not made from composites? that's kinda lame.
32 Ikramerica : They do use the same engine family, but that seems to be progressing fine.
33 Flyboy2001 : Kinda like the "revolution vs. evolution" point I was making in another thread... well, not quite as detailed a point but we're on the same page. And
34 Trent1000 : Interesting perspective. I was just about to post saying that even in these days of commercial aviation, it seems to be more a case of 'innovation' r
35 NA : Got to admire Sutter and his team! The 747 in 1968/69 was at least a comparable major step as the 787 now. And a larger test for the company´s finan
36 Aviationbuff : Your comment made me think that how the engineers have managed to successfully got all the yesteryear's aircraft flying with pencils, slide rules and
37 NQYGuy : Great news! I can't wait for this- I hadn't realised it were so soon.
38 Bmacleod : I though the 747-8 fuselage would be all composite like the 787. The engines, wings and cockpit designs are derived from the 787 but the main fuselage
39 TISTPAA727 : I remember that thread well. There are some composites throughout the structure. Someone with more knowledge can share which what is. But no, the onl
40 Burkhard : Even they have 50% composites and 50% metal.
41 Post contains images Keesje : Stole a picture from a Boeing Paris video
42 VirginFlyer : How's that? V/F
43 AirNZ : So, if Boeing haven't yet figured out what exactly went wrong, don't yet know the fix for it and have no schedule in place for it yet.....how can you
44 KC135TopBoom : You know this with certainity how? Boeing is having engineering problems with the B-787 program, but to what extent, none of us really knows. Remembe
45 Post contains links Jdevora : I don't think that the 787 is "arely flyable" but from that Carson's quote that I saw at Flight Blogger: Understanding the 787 structural reinforceme
46 Rheinwaldner : Lame! One payed no attention a long time if only the pictures in this thread revealed that the 748 was not going to be made from CFRP. The glory of C
47 Stitch : I think the new wing profile will be a hint, especially when she is in flight.
48 FlyLKU : ... thank goodness! Actually, I think it may look the same size or bigger than the 380 because it is longer but we'll just have to wait and see if th
49 EcuadorianMD11 : Bingo! Tdscanuck hits the core of the whole purpose of testing things, and that doesn´t go just for aviation only. Why bother testing something if y
50 Zeke : If you look at the plan view of it, yes same wing leading edge and trailing edge lines, but the wing cross-section is different, and they had to rede
51 StressedOut : What are you talking about? The keel beam? There is no such thing as a "fuselage beam". The keel beam gathers all of the compression (mainly) and ten
52 Zeke : Yes, if you are happier with me saying fuselage keel beam, so be it, it does not change the point I was making.
53 MadameConcorde : Can't wait to be on the very first passenger flight! Go Boeing! Go B-747-800! Go B-787!
54 Tdscanuck : I suspect a mix of being better heuristic engineers, and higher safety factors. These project aren't exactly hampered by computers, they're impossibl
55 Post contains links ArabAirX : Apparently, it seems to be a notion gathering some momentum. "In a twist of engineering fate, it seems the strength in the 747’s longevity will usu
56 Post contains links Revelation : They had a monumental task, but one factor that worked in their favor was les subcontracting meant more things were under their own control. Another
57 Travelhound : I think the time consuming component of the problem is trying to understand what the actual problem is. Once they've done that they can come up with
58 ArabAirX : This could be key in seeing the 747-8F being airborne before the 787.
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