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QX And The Dornier 328  
User currently offlineRidgid727 From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1088 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 3916 times:

Anyone have any knowledge of how many of these QX ordered, and how many did they actually take delivery of.
Also, When did they pull the first from service and when did they pull the last one from service, and if anyone is familiar with what routes they used these on.

25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineChrisair From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 2001 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 3839 times:

I found a NYTimes brief from 1991 that says they had 35 firm orders and options that would take them to 60 total aircraft. http://www.nytimes.com/1991/05/17/bu...ss/horizon-air-s-dornier-deal.html

I don't know if they got all 35, but they weren't around very long. I rode one on the PDX-SEA shuttle and it was a fantastic ride. Very, very quiet. Unlike the Q400 that I rode this morning. It's too bad those planes didn't work out for them. Other people here can probably explain why they didn't work--I heard it was a performance issue.


User currently offlineHatbutton From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1477 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 3835 times:
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QX placed an order for 35 with 25 options and was the US launch customer. Deliveries starting in 1993, through 1997. First one flew January 1994. Last one flew in October 1997.

I think in the end because of production issues and performance, they only took delivery of 12. Because it was a new type, they had all kinds of parts issues and lost a lot of revenue opportunities while planes were on the ground. They had terrible hot weather performance too.

I also read once that there wasn't a certified 328 simulator anywhere for a long time, forcing operators to do training in the aircraft which added unecessary costs and took time away from using the airplane in service. When the Dash 8 came along it was pretty much a no brainer to switch out.

They were meant to replace the fleet of 33 Metros and they were used on a ton of routes. Everything from SEA-PDX, GEG-PDX, SEA-YKM, SEA-EUG and even JAC at one point. I mean, pretty much any route you can think of back then was at one point operated by a 328 unless it was a really thin market like PDX-PDT.


User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2390 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 3748 times:
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They didn't do much out of BOI. Maybe due to heat performance. I remember the SEA-BZN-JAC route. Seemed long for the type. Were a nice looking plane.


"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 25
Reply 4, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 3732 times:

They sure did look good in the QX livery....


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Peter Schulte




A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineERAUgrad02 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 1227 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 3631 times:

Corning bases one at ILM to fly execs up to Corning, NY through the week and I'm always amazed at its initial climb-out performance. I watched it depart runway 17 and by the time it's turned back heading north, they get handed off to Washington Center and the plane isn't 15 miles from the field yet.

Desmond in ILM,



Desmond MacRae in ILM
User currently offline737-990 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 364 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 3586 times:

I remember (vaguely) that part of the problem was that Dornier promised QX to make a stretched 328 (the 428?) which would have been a 45 seater and that part of it's initial order and options would have been converted to this model. This model would have been a replacement for the Dash-8-100s in it's fleet. Since this model never materialized and because of the performance problems already mentioned QX went back to Bombardier and ordered the Dash-8-200 to replace all of it's Metro's and 328's.


Happiest is a man who has his vocation as a hobby
User currently offlineF9Animal From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4947 posts, RR: 28
Reply 7, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 3572 times:



Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 4):
They sure did look good in the QX livery....

Yes they did. I always wished that QX would have stuck with them. I also wish that Dornier would have survived. I have had the pleasure of flying on several 328's, and enjoyed the rides. I have even experienced an emergency in one, with an engine shutdown. In fact, the airplane that I had the emergency on was a fresh delivered aircraft to AWAC from QX. It still had the maroon leather seats in them, and a corporate looking paint job. It was not even in United Express colors yet.

Speaking of United Express operations. How are the 328's doing for them now? The last time I was in DEN, I saw quite a few of them. Is AWAC still flying them for UA?



I Am A Different Animal!!
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 25
Reply 8, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 3551 times:



Quoting F9Animal (Reply 7):
It still had the maroon leather seats in them...

Oooo I loved the maroon colored seats!

Quoting F9Animal (Reply 7):
Speaking of United Express operations. How are the 328's doing for them now?

I saw some pics of them in the database, a lot of them are in storage!



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently onlineFedExFlyerPHL From United States of America, joined May 2008, 172 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 3521 times:



Quoting F9Animal (Reply 7):
Speaking of United Express operations. How are the 328's doing for them now? The last time I was in DEN, I saw quite a few of them. Is AWAC still flying them for UA?

They are all in storage or with other operators since AWAC no longer flies for UA. They only fly CRJs for US.

Jeff



ABE ATL AUA AUS BHM BOS BUR BWI CLT DFW EWR HOU IAD JAN JAX LAX LGB MEM MCI MCO MDW MGW MSP MSY ORD PHL PIT SJU SNA STL
User currently offlineHatbutton From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1477 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3438 times:
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Quoting 737-990 (Reply 6):
I remember (vaguely) that part of the problem was that Dornier promised QX to make a stretched 328 (the 428?) which would have been a 45 seater and that part of it's initial order and options would have been converted to this model.

Yes you are correct. And part of the contract for the 328s stated that if a 428 wasn't made, QX had the option to basically cancel the order and return the 328s if they wanted. I want to say that also led to them quickly pulling them out of service after only 12 deliveries to go for the Dash 8.

Though QX did operate both the Dash and 328 at the same time. Bombardier was working on a stretch, and Dornier wouldn't commit to one. Made the decision easy for QX in the end.


User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 25
Reply 11, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3433 times:

When did and how did the F28 come into play??


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User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2390 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3403 times:
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The F28s first appeared in the December 16th,1984 timetable. They flew: BOI-SEA,BOI-SUN,PSC-SEA,SEA-PDX,SUN-SFO,SEA-PDX. They were also utilizing Metro IIIs,F-27s, and Sierra Pacific Convair 580s at this time.
Of course first F-28s were the -1000 series, followed later by the -4000s. I guess and assume they were all brought in from PI and USAir.



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineRacko From Germany, joined Nov 2001, 4856 posts, RR: 20
Reply 13, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 3322 times:

Pretty little bird. Unfortunately the development was very expensive as Daimler didn't want to develop an aircraft that didn't fit into the Mercedes luxury image (god knows what an aircraft has to do with cars).

So it ended up being very high-tech (full glass cockpit, even with optional Heads-Up-Displays for Cpt and FO, extensive noise cancelling - on a 30-seater in the early 90s!), but was therefore more expensive than the competition.

A small company still builds them with pre-manufactured parts that were left over after Dornier went bankrupt.


User currently offlineRidgid727 From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1088 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3191 times:



Quoting MtnWest1979 (Reply 12):
The F28s first appeared in the December 16th,1984 timetable. They flew: BOI-SEA,BOI-SUN,PSC-SEA,SEA-PDX,SUN-SFO,SEA-PDX. They were also utilizing Metro IIIs,F-27s, and Sierra Pacific Convair 580s at this time.
Of course first F-28s were the -1000 series, followed later by the -4000s. I guess and assume they were all brought in from PI and USAir.

I also think about 1983 or 84 they had a DC9 flying around that was leased from someone


User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2390 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 3121 times:
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Quoting Ridgid727 (Reply 14):
I also think about 1983 or 84 they had a DC9 flying around that was leased from someone

Correct. Was flown by AllStar Airlines. It began in Summer 1984 and flew until the F-28s came online.
Its day consisted of:
Flt 11 Lv BOI 7:25am Ar PDX 7:35am
Flt 12 Lv PDX 8:05am Ar BOI 10:05am
Flt 9 Lv BOI 12:00n Ar SEA 12:20pm
Flt 14 Lv SEA 12:55pm Ar PSC 1:35pm
Flt 15 Lv PSC 2:20pm Ar SEA 3:00pm
Flt 16 Lv SEA 3:25pm Ar BOI 5:30pm
Flt 17 Lv BOI 5:55pm Ar PDX 6:00pm
Lv PDX 6:45pm Ar SEA 7:25pm
Flt 18 Lv SEA 8:30pm Ar PSC 9:10pm
Lv PSC 9:30pm Ar BOI 11:20pm

All these flights were Mo thru Fri only.

Effective with Sept 9,1984 timetable, they operated some weekend DC-9 trips too.

[Edited 2009-07-08 09:27:13]


"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineRyDawg82 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 851 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 3087 times:

Any pictures exist of this DC-9 flying for Horizon? Not to prove it, just to see it. Did it wear QX colors, or just AllStar colors operating as QX?

Ryan



You can take the pup out of Alaska, but you can't take the Alaska out of the pup.
User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2390 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 3072 times:
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No pics I know of in QX ops. But it was in AllStar livery. I saw it at BOI one day and, like an airline geek, called airport ops and inquired about it. They said that it is flying for QX. And saw it quite a bit in and out of here (BOI).

It was in original AllStar livery, not a hybrid or in the ex-Air Florida scheme.



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 25
Reply 18, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3011 times:



Quoting Ridgid727 (Reply 14):
I also think about 1983 or 84 they had a DC9 flying around that was leased from someone

Does anyone have a reg for this aircraft??



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineRidgid727 From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1088 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3002 times:

You can see it here. (this is it at SUN)

http://www.photovault.com/show.php?c...ercial?tg=TAFVolume02/TAFV02P13_18


User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2390 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2926 times:
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Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 18):
Does anyone have a reg for this aircraft??

Believe N85AS was it.



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineRyDawg82 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 851 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 2768 times:

Hey Ridgid727 thank you for posting that photo!
Ryan



You can take the pup out of Alaska, but you can't take the Alaska out of the pup.
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 25
Reply 22, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2666 times:



Quoting MtnWest1979 (Reply 20):
Believe N85AS was it.

How can that be under an Alaska registration??



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2390 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2642 times:
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Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 22):
How can that be under an Alaska registration??

Well the AS in this case stood for All Star. Just cuz its AS doesnt mean Alaska Airlines.
Funny thing was I thought the same thing at first sight, thinking 'I didn't know Alaska had DC9s at one time'. Then realizing AS was All Star. LOL.



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
User currently offlineRyDawg82 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 851 posts, RR: 8
Reply 24, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2624 times:

Just like how ASA has most of their A/C registered N***AS.
Tail numbers are first come first serve (or reserved).

This just happened to be a very coincidental considering AAG purchased QX 2 years after that photo.

R



You can take the pup out of Alaska, but you can't take the Alaska out of the pup.
User currently offlineRidgid727 From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1088 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (4 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2587 times:

During this period, most Horizon Tail numbers ended in PH.

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