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Sabena BRU-HNL Flight  
User currently offlineAlexEU From Serbia, joined Oct 2007, 1817 posts, RR: 2
Posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 7518 times:

I have a Guinness World Record Book from the 70's and it says that the longest non-stop flight (at that time obviously) is Brussels - Honolulu. I've never heard about such a flight, so I am interested if anyone can confirm that this is truth/false? Books not related to aviation are known for making aviation mistakes.

Alex

27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25346 posts, RR: 22
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7119 times:

Sabena certainly never served HNL. It may have been some kind of special charter flight.

User currently offlineKl911 From Czech Republic, joined Jul 2003, 5141 posts, RR: 15
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6987 times:



Quoting AlexEU (Thread starter):
I have a Guinness World Record Book from the 70's



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 1):
Sabena certainly never served HNL. It may have been some kind of special charter flight.

What aircraft could have flown BRU-HNL nonstop in the 70's? None I think.....


User currently offlineDirectorguy From Egypt, joined Jul 2008, 1687 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6903 times:



Quoting Kl911 (Reply 2):
What aircraft could have flown BRU-HNL nonstop in the 70's? None I think.....

The Boeing 747SP may have been able to. It had the legs to do THR-JFK, JFK-NRT nonstop, and these routes were certain were in existence during that time, although they were slightly shorter than BRU-HNL which is over 11k km according to GCM.

Interesting that its BRU-HNL not the other way around. BRU-HNL would be a bit longer than reverse due to the winds.


User currently offlineAlexEU From Serbia, joined Oct 2007, 1817 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 6415 times:

Which means that this is probably a mistake. I am not aware if Sabena (or perhaps some other airlines?) had B747SP.

Were there any other carriers that flew Europe-Hawaii?


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25346 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks ago) and read 5991 times:



Quoting AlexEU (Reply 4):
Which means that this is probably a mistake. I am not aware if Sabena (or perhaps some other airlines?) had B747SP.

Were there any other carriers that flew Europe-Hawaii?

Sabena never operated the 747SP and there has never been nonstop scheduled service between Europe and Hawaii.


User currently offlineVC10DC10 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1036 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 5797 times:

Sorry if this is dense, but is the Guinness book quite clear that this was a flight operated by commercial, or civilian aircraft? (I ask this, realizing that certainly there were several military flights longer than this by the 1970s.)

User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9393 posts, RR: 29
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5762 times:

[quote=Viscount724,reply=5]Sabena never operated the 747SP and there has never been nonstop scheduled service between Europe and Hawaii.


in fct, there has been few scheduled same aircraft service from Europe to Hawaii at all. I am not talking about same flight numbers changing equipment at LAX or somewhere-

PA RTW might qualify as well as BA in the 60 and/or 70s. The shortest route was operated for a short period of time by LTU DUS/ANC/HNL.



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User currently offlineVC10DC10 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1036 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5755 times:



Quoting PanHAM (Reply 7):

in fct, there has been few scheduled same aircraft service from Europe to Hawaii at all. I am not talking about same flight numbers changing equipment at LAX or somewhere-

PA RTW might qualify as well as BA in the 60 and/or 70s. The shortest route was operated for a short period of time by LTU DUS/ANC/HNL.

Wasn't there also BOAC from LHR via JFK, SFO or LAX, and on to Fiji and the South Pacific?


User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9393 posts, RR: 29
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 5641 times:



Quoting VC10DC10 (Reply 8):
Wasn't there also BOAC from LHR via JFK, SFO or LAX, and on to Fiji and the South Pacific?

I think so, but I believe there was a plane change somewhere from 707 to VC10 and vv. Or was it via Japan and on to HKG? BA had full traffic rights from HKG in thse days.



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlineBrianDromey From Ireland, joined Dec 2006, 3920 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 5573 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 5):
Sabena never operated the 747SP and there has never been nonstop scheduled service between Europe and Hawaii.

Did LH not operate to HNL with a 342 at one point?



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User currently offlineBirdwatching From Germany, joined Sep 2003, 3822 posts, RR: 51
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 5511 times:



Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 10):
Did LH not operate to HNL with a 342 at one point?

I remember watching (and videotaping) a TV documentary when LH got their first A340s, in the early 90s. It was titled "Mit zweimal tanken um die Welt" (around the world on two tanks of fuel) and it was about the proving flights before scheduled service. The flight included a stop at HNL, so there must have been a FRA-HNL (or maybe MUC) involved, but this was not a scheduled flight, and it was not at maximum payload. They had a bunch of VIP and reporters on board though.
Does anybody have any more info on these events?

Soren  santahat 



All the things you probably hate about travelling are warm reminders that I'm home
User currently offlineHa763 From United States of America, joined Jan 2003, 3660 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 5417 times:
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Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 10):
Did LH not operate to HNL with a 342 at one point?



Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 11):
Does anybody have any more info on these events?

Yes, LH did fly to HNL with the A342. It was a scheduled charter flight and operated for about 1-1/2 years. I don't recall if it from FRA or MUC. I think it was originally 2x a week then went to 1x a week before it stopped.


User currently offlineAlexEU From Serbia, joined Oct 2007, 1817 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 5354 times:

How come there are so many flights from Japan to Hawaii? I presume it's because Japanese don't have as much as holiday destinations as Europeans, plus a large immigration of Asians in Hawaii.

Quoting VC10DC10 (Reply 6):
Sorry if this is dense, but is the Guinness book quite clear that this was a flight operated by commercial, or civilian aircraft? (I ask this, realizing that certainly there were several military flights longer than this by the 1970s.)

They said it was pax, although no info whether it was commercial or charter.


User currently offlineTimz From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 6836 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5207 times:



Quoting Ha763 (Reply 12):
Yes, LH did fly to HNL with the A342. It was a scheduled charter flight

Nonstop? 1990s?


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25346 posts, RR: 22
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5199 times:



Quoting Timz (Reply 14):
Quoting Ha763 (Reply 12):
Yes, LH did fly to HNL with the A342. It was a scheduled charter flight

Nonstop? 1990s?

I believe there were a very few demonstration flights but it didn't last long. Do you have any details on those flights as I have never had much success in obtaining any information?


User currently offlineVlada From Serbia, joined Aug 2005, 161 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 5134 times:



Quoting AlexEU (Thread starter):

Hello,

I have the Guinness Book of Records from 1976, and there it says that the longest non-stop scheduled flight is Sabena's BRU-HNL, operated with Boeing 747 aircraft

I don't know whether this was truth or not, I'm just saying what is written there.

What would actually be the longest non-stop scheduled passenger flight now?

Thanks,
Vlada


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25346 posts, RR: 22
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 5115 times:



Quoting Vlada (Reply 16):
What would actually be the longest non-stop scheduled passenger flight now?

I believe it's SQ's all-business class A340-500 service SIN-EWR, 8285 nm.


User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5664 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4986 times:



Quoting PanHAM (Reply 9):
Quoting VC10DC10 (Reply 8):
Wasn't there also BOAC from LHR via JFK, SFO or LAX, and on to Fiji and the South Pacific?

I think so, but I believe there was a plane change somewhere from 707 to VC10 and vv. Or was it via Japan and on to HKG? BA had full traffic rights from HKG in thse days.

BOAC flew a SVC10 service MEL-SYD-NAN-HNL-LAX-JFK-LHR in the late 60s/early 70s. For at least part of the time it was an around the world service with the aircraft coming from the UK via Europe/Asia to SIN, then PER-MEL. Not sure of the Europe/Asia stops.

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25346 posts, RR: 22
Reply 19, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 4935 times:



Quoting Gemuser (Reply 18):
Quoting PanHAM (Reply 9):
Quoting VC10DC10 (Reply 8):
Wasn't there also BOAC from LHR via JFK, SFO or LAX, and on to Fiji and the South Pacific?

I think so, but I believe there was a plane change somewhere from 707 to VC10 and vv. Or was it via Japan and on to HKG? BA had full traffic rights from HKG in thse days.

BOAC flew a SVC10 service MEL-SYD-NAN-HNL-LAX-JFK-LHR in the late 60s/early 70s. For at least part of the time it was an around the world service with the aircraft coming from the UK via Europe/Asia to SIN, then PER-MEL. Not sure of the Europe/Asia stops.

For most of the period when BA served HNL the U.S. west coast stop was SFO. They initially used the Bristol Britannia. Initially, service beyond HNL was to Tokyo. 707s replaced Britannias on that service. The Super VC-10 service to Australia via HNL started a few years later. During that period you could fly around the world on BA via either Asia using the HNL-HND service, or via the South Pacific using the HNL-NAN-SYD service.

QF also operated HNL-LHR for many years, both with stops in SFO and JFK, first with L1049G Super Constellations and then with 707s. The transatlantic sector JFK-LHR ended about the time the 707s were replaced with 747s. They could carry 5th freedom traffic between U.S. points and LHR, but obviously no domestic traffic between U.S. points.

Western Airlines (which merged with DL in 1987) also operated HNL-ANC-LGW for about 18 months in 1980-81. They also operated DEN-LGW during the same period. Both routes proved unprofitable and were dropped. Western purchased a DC-10-30 from NZ for the DEN-LGW service, but their own DC-10-10s were adequate for HNL-ANC-LGW. Western DC-10-10 and the ex-NZ DC-10-30 at LGW below.


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User currently offlineDennys From France, joined May 2001, 889 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4779 times:

Sorry Alex with all resprct and love I have for SABENA , One could say that a 707-300B/C might have done it with pay load restrictions .

I never heard about such a flight .

for sure the only arcraft capable to cover such a distance would have been their A340-200 , but certainly not in the 70s

Regards

dennys


User currently offlineAlexEU From Serbia, joined Oct 2007, 1817 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4767 times:



Quoting Vlada (Reply 16):
I have the Guinness Book of Records from 1976, and there it says that the longest non-stop scheduled flight is Sabena's BRU-HNL, operated with Boeing 747 aircraft

I don't know whether this was truth or not, I'm just saying what is written there.

Hello,
That's the Guinness Book that I have (1976), and it is Yugoslav edition. I don't have it right here with me, but I am glad that someone got the same info as I. Maybe it is Guinness mistake?

Quoting Dennys (Reply 20):

Perhaps they included a stop at e.g. Anchorage. But anyway Brussels-Honolulu flight would have 0 demand. HNL-LHR is a different story, but even that seems unrealistic.


User currently offlineVhqpa From Australia, joined Jul 2005, 1471 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4633 times:



Quoting Vlada (Reply 16):

What would actually be the longest non-stop scheduled passenger flight now?

by distance it would be he SQ SIN-EWR flight by 345 that Viscount mentioned

by elapsed time QF holds the record with its "Rare and secret order of the double sunrise" route between Perth and Ceylon with Catalina flying boats during WW2 flights were around the 28-30 hour mark and were flown in radio silence to avoid detection from the Japanese. link




Vhq.



"There you go ladies and gentleman we're through Mach 1 the speed of sound no bumps no bangs... CONCORDE"
User currently offline744rules From Belgium, joined Mar 2002, 407 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 4480 times:



Quoting AlexEU (Reply 21):
Perhaps they included a stop at e.g. Anchorage. But anyway Brussels-Honolulu flight would have 0 demand. HNL-LHR is a different story, but even that seems unrealistic.

Just a wild guess, but he only reason I can think of the interest of this one flight could have to do with Father Damian, who was burried over there, but according to Wikipedia his remains were returned to Belgium with the Mercator (used to be schoolship of the Belgian Merchant Navy)


User currently offlineB595 From UK - Scotland, joined Mar 2009, 306 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 4436 times:



Quoting Vhqpa (Reply 22):
by elapsed time QF holds the record with its "Rare and secret order of the double sunrise" route between Perth and Ceylon with Catalina flying boats during WW2 flights were around the 28-30 hour mark and were flown in radio silence to avoid detection from the Japanese. link

Great bit of history there in that link, thanks for posting it.


25 Ha763 : There are newspaper articles about the service, but I would have to go to the library and search for the microfilm with the stories.
26 Timz : Somebody corrected them-- the 1978 says SYD-SFO.
27 YULWinterSkies : Yes, the A342 at that time was the longest-range airliner in its size category, outperforming all variants of the 767, MD11, A310, A330-300. Problem
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