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Would Allegiant Consider Niagara Falls As A Target  
User currently offlineKarlB737 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3105 posts, RR: 10
Posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 3049 times:

Since Allegiant works under the umbrella of a travel company it suddenly occurred to me to ask if Niagara Falls would fall under the type of destination they prefer to fly to. As we all know it is usually a major tourist attraction that they prefer to target as a route destination.

Courtesy: Airport Business

Hoping Niagara Falls Airport Will Fly - 7 Pages

http://www.airportbusiness.com/onlin...p?siteSection=1&id=29440&pageNum=1

From the article:

"What has changed in Niagara Falls since the failure of Kiwi International Airlines is the addition of the Seneca Niagara Casino & Hotel.

The casino has brought in new opportunities for charter flights at the airport and -- more importantly -- has provided a new revenue stream to help pay for its expansion."

24 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3016 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 3042 times:

Mmm-hmmm.... Would be an interesting destination for G4's eastern stations.


Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5411 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2997 times:

Would be very seasonal (I assume.) I'm not sure if that really fits into the G4 model.

Is the casino supposed to make a big difference as to the attractiveness of Niagara as a destination? Certainly not to anyone besides the locals; sure, if someone was planning a trip to see the Falls anyway, I would expect some would visit or stay at the resort, but to make the decision to go there because now there's a casino? I don't think so.

bb


User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5803 posts, RR: 15
Reply 3, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2982 times:

I don't see it as a large enough draw to be a destination.

Now would they open a station to take tourists south from Buffalo and Canada? I could see that might be possible.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineHatbutton From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1500 posts, RR: 14
Reply 4, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2961 times:



Quoting FATFlyer (Reply 3):
I don't see it as a large enough draw to be a destination.

Now would they open a station to take tourists south from Buffalo and Canada? I could see that might be possible.

Couldn't that work in their favor though? If half the plane is always full of people going to Niagara Falls and the other half going on a sunny vacation...seems like it might work out.

The odds of it working seem to be better than me than most of the small towns they fly to where traffic is only wanting to go in one direction.


User currently offlineDoug_or From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3404 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2950 times:



Quoting Hatbutton (Reply 4):
Couldn't that work in their favor though? If half the plane is always full of people going to Niagara Falls and the other half going on a sunny vacation...seems like it might work out.

The odds of it working seem to be better than me than most of the small towns they fly to where traffic is only wanting to go in one direction.

The point is the plane wouldn't always be half full of people going to Niagra, as it is a seasonal destination, and the equation still only works if there is somewhere sunny on the other side.

Niagra is really probably more of a road trip destination, I don't think people are going to pay to fly and stay multiple days to see the falls and gamble.

Now as a source of origination traffic, I think Southwest (and to a lesser extent Airtran) have proved that if fares are low enough people will drive a long way (from both sides of the border).



When in doubt, one B pump off
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5803 posts, RR: 15
Reply 6, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2916 times:



Quoting Hatbutton (Reply 4):
Couldn't that work in their favor though? If half the plane is always full of people going to Niagara Falls and the other half going on a sunny vacation...seems like it might work out.

The odds of it working seem to be better than me than most of the small towns they fly to where traffic is only wanting to go in one direction.

Let me put it this way, around Fresno we have both Yosemite and Sequoia (compare that to the Falls). Then there are multiple casinos within a 1 hour drive with a total of over 7,600 slots and 250 tables.

But FAT is not a destination for Allegiant. So why would Niagara be any different.

I'm thinking flights out of Niagara to places like PIE and SFB, maybe 1 or 2 others would work.

But I don't see much draw for someone in say SFB to go gamble at Seneca when they have spots closer to home like the Seminole Hard Rock.

Other than snowbirds flying home to visit in winter I still don't see much demand for flights into Niagara. And of course the snowbirds would be seasonal.

It still looks to me like nothing more than another small city that Allegiant might fly out of but not bring vacationers into.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15735 posts, RR: 27
Reply 7, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2906 times:

I'm going to have to agree with the other posters that IAG probably can't draw enough tourists to be attractive to Allegiant. But there's always JetAmerica...  duck 


Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineAerokiwi From New Zealand, joined Jul 2000, 2707 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2897 times:



Quoting FATFlyer (Reply 3):
Now would they open a station to take tourists south from Buffalo and Canada? I could see that might be possible.

Given how high fares are from Canada in comparison to the States, I think this is the most likely scenario. I have many friends in Toronto who are more than willing to drive down to Buffalo to trip away to Florida/Caribbean. Allegiant picks up Canada traffic from operations in Montana don't they?


User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3016 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2891 times:



Quoting Aerokiwi (Reply 8):
Allegiant picks up Canada traffic from operations in Montana don't they?

I know they pick up Vancouver-area pax from their Bellingham, WA station.



Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offlineCIDflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2286 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2888 times:



Quoting Aerokiwi (Reply 8):
Allegiant picks up Canada traffic from operations in Montana don't they?

I've heard they pick up lots of Canadians from BLI, GFK and PBG (Plattsburgh, NY)


User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5803 posts, RR: 15
Reply 11, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2867 times:



Quoting CIDflyer (Reply 10):
I've heard they pick up lots of Canadians from BLI, GFK and PBG (Plattsburgh, NY)

They are also pulling a large number of Canadians at Great Falls and Kalispell in Montanta.

There are a few other airports near the border that have heard from Allegiant about possibly being a future destination.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5411 posts, RR: 12
Reply 12, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2851 times:



Quoting BMI727 (Reply 7):
I'm going to have to agree with the other posters that IAG probably can't draw enough tourists to be attractive to Allegiant. But there's always JetAmerica...



Quoting Aerokiwi (Reply 8):
Given how high fares are from Canada in comparison to the States, I think this is the most likely scenario. I have many friends in Toronto who are more than willing to drive down to Buffalo to trip away to Florida/Caribbean.

And to both of these posts,  Wink I remember skyBus announcing IAG... but my recollection is it never actually started -- and that was prior to the final disappearance of the airline as a whole...  tombstone 

bb


User currently offlineHatbutton From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1500 posts, RR: 14
Reply 13, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2846 times:



Quoting Doug_or (Reply 5):

The point is the plane wouldn't always be half full of people going to Niagra, as it is a seasonal destination, and the equation still only works if there is somewhere sunny on the other side.



Quoting FATFlyer (Reply 6):
But FAT is not a destination for Allegiant. So why would Niagara be any different.

I guess my point is that people in Buffalo would want to get out in the winter, and in the summer people would want to go see Niagara Falls. There is more in Niagara Falls than just a casino compared to Fresno.

The comparisons to other G4 cities near the border could make it work in my mind and the Buffalo area seems to have a decent sized population.


User currently offlineMke717spotter From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2822 times:



Quoting FATFlyer (Reply 3):
Now would they open a station to take tourists south from Buffalo and Canada? I could see that might be possible.

That's probably the best choice here. That you'd get people from the BUF area heading to Florida/the West while also getting some people coming up to check out the Falls.



Will you watch the Cleveland Browns and the Detroit Lions on Sunday? Only if coach Eric Mangini resigned after a loss.
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15735 posts, RR: 27
Reply 15, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2805 times:



Quoting Mke717spotter (Reply 14):
That's probably the best choice here.

I should clarify or add to my first post that I think that IAG could be a spoke for G4, but not a hub. Even that may be a bit more difficult than other places due to the WN presence at BUF.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5803 posts, RR: 15
Reply 16, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2804 times:



Quoting Hatbutton (Reply 13):
I guess my point is that people in Buffalo would want to get out in the winter, and in the summer people would want to go see Niagara Falls. There is more in Niagara Falls than just a casino compared to Fresno.

My point is that adding a casino in Niagara is not going to make it any more attractive to an airline than it already is or isn't.

If they don't think there is enough traffic to see the falls now then why would they think differently because a casino just opened?

As I said I think a case could be made for Niagara similiar to that for any small city that already sees Allegiant flights to Florida.

But not as one of Allegiant's vacation destinations.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineEnilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7144 posts, RR: 13
Reply 17, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2781 times:



Quoting SANFan (Reply 2):
Would be very seasonal (I assume.) I'm not sure if that really fits into the G4 model.

I agree you and with most other people.

It works much better as a spoke (serving Canadians) going to Florida/Arizona than a hub because of the seasonality and the size of the market. It's a huge regional drive market, but making it a fly market would be a tough sell without a lot of money behind it. I'm also not sure the product is that different than Gatlinburg or the Poconos or Branson. You might say that Branson has service, but only because they are writing big checks to the airlines.


User currently offlineOflanigan From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 123 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2722 times:

Could IAG be a good fit for Florida destinations and Casino Charters if they teamed up with the Seneca Nation?

User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7893 posts, RR: 52
Reply 19, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2711 times:

I would totally fly to IAG if DL offered it... then again I non rev so it wouldn't help the airlines out at all...


Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineSurfandSnow From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 2864 posts, RR: 30
Reply 20, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2612 times:

I went to Niagara Falls in October, and while it was certainly remarkable, all of the usual summertime attractions (such as the boat ride) were not operating. The market is far too seasonal to sustain Allegiant service, seeing as how Orlando, Las Vegas, Los Angeles, and Phoenix are truly year-round markets. It really is too bad Skybus failed. That airline put quite a few small airports on the map (who had ever heard of Chicopee and St. Augustine before them?) and could have really transformed the U.S. airline industry the way WN did when it began flying to HOU, MDW, ISP, and other secondary airports.


Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
User currently offlineGSPSPOT From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3016 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2586 times:

BUF/the Niagara Falls area can also be used as a base or jumping-off point for those wishing to travel further into Canada.


Finally made it to an airline mecca!
User currently offlineOswegobag From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 169 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 2445 times:



Quoting SANFan (Reply 12):
And to both of these posts, I remember skyBus announcing IAG... but my recollection is it never actually started -- and that was prior to the final disappearance of the airline as a whole...

This is correct, Skybus had plans but never materialized.

I don't want people to forget that the population in Canada that is within a 2 hour drive of IAG is over 6 million people! I think this creates enough demand in itself if the price is right.


User currently offlineToltommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3289 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2342 times:

IAG as a destination? Maybe but the biggest problem is that the NY side is much less desirable than the Canadian side. And now you need a passport to cross over.

User currently offlineYNGguins From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 511 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (5 years 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2248 times:

I've been there about 5 times.. It's only a 3 hour drive from YNG. So scratch YNG off the potential cities to Niagara, but I don't see it happening!


I am PROUD to live in the greatest country on earth: The United States of America!
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