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BA Captain Burkill (Of LHR Crash Fame) Quits  
User currently offlineVfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 4013 posts, RR: 5
Posted (5 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 18154 times:

A follow up to this archived thread:

Captain Peter Burkill - Where Is He Now? (by Bochora Feb 14 2009 in Civil Aviation)

In today's news: Burkill has applied for voluntary redundancy under a company-wide cost-cutting scheme.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-smear-campaign.html#ixzz0NREOFrtY

33 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSashA From Russia, joined May 1999, 861 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 17107 times:

Sad, sorry to hear that. Quite a man.


An2/24/28,Yak42,Tu154/134,IL18/62/96,B737/757/767,A310/320/319,F100,BAe146,EMB-145,CRJ,A340-600,B747-400,A-330-300,A-340
User currently offlineBabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 16073 times:

Maybe he is leaving under a cloud.

I don't know the full details of that incident but maybe it wasn't handled as expertly as we would like to believe.


User currently offlineHotelima From France, joined May 2009, 23 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 15143 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

As we say in France, "They don't tell us everything ! ..."

User currently offlineBochora From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2008, 491 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 14981 times:



Quoting Hotelima (Reply 3):
They don't tell us everything ! ..."

Yes but maybe in this instance we don't need to know everything. At the controls or not he was the captain, it was his aircraft and it got down (relatively) safely.


User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 14594 times:



Quoting Babybus (Reply 2):
I don't know the full details of that incident but maybe it wasn't handled as expertly as we would like to believe.

I suggest you research about this incident before you make such a comment.



A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
User currently offlineAPYu From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2007, 839 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 14060 times:

Or perhaps quite simply he was tempted by the big pay off and has a better offer!


We'd like to welcome in particular our Executive Club members and those joining us from our Oneworld alliance partners.
User currently offlineDIJKKIJK From France, joined Jul 2003, 1811 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 13358 times:



Quoting APYu (Reply 6):
Or perhaps quite simply he was tempted by the big pay off and has a better offer!

Exactly, he is probably packing up to go to DXB, AUH or DOH to take up his new assignment  Wink



Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
User currently offline757MDE From Colombia, joined Sep 2004, 1753 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 12967 times:

Wasn't he having trouble with BA for the way everything was handled with him after the incident?
I rememeber readying something on the BBC about that, and I don't know if I am dreaming or something but also remember readying he wrote to Richard Branson?



I gladly accept donations to pay for flight hours! This thing draws man...
User currently offlineVfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 4013 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 12968 times:

Not sure if you guys have actually read the linked article (just picked one - it was in all British tabloids yesterday) - the title says "...quits over "chicken" smears"

Apparently training pilots made comments about his handling of the situation and on pilots forums he was accused of "chickening out" - to an extent that he even contacted BALPA. The story conveyed in the UK press is that he has become a victiom of a smear campaign. Who knows.

Quoting DIJKKIJK (Reply 7):

Exactly, he is probably packing up to go to DXB, AUH or DOH to take up his new assignment

According to his wife, he is now a "full-time house-husband".


User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13141 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 12492 times:

It is unfortanate that such an experienced pilot who may not have been of real blame in this crash landing has been hounded out of the airline by his peers and the media. The investigation is still ongoing and it may very well be that the pilot could have been absolved of blame, but it is easier to blame one person than technical problems no one fully understands. This is not good for all other pilots who will further fear retailation and harassment for any incident. No wonder he is taking the bailout deal and somewhat fortunate that he can take it.

User currently offlineImperialEagle From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2630 posts, RR: 23
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 12017 times:



Quoting Vfw614 (Reply 9):
a victiom of a smear campaign

Thats pretty lame. If this is true, and the source can be found, I hope the guy sues "'till the cows come home" as we say in the south.



"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 5057 posts, RR: 43
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 11914 times:

Or maybe ... he just feels the "system" let him down.

What I mean is, he was trained to a high standard, by a well respected airline with a high standard of maintenance, flying an airframe also respected to a high standard with well respected (see a trend here?) engines hung on the wing .... yet ... he landed a few hundred metres short of the runway.

And by the grace of some higher being, (or luck), no one was seriously injured and he did not plant the aircraft onto what could be considered the densest populated area on the earth.

Maybe he just can't get his head around ... why?



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineBabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 11768 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 5):
I suggest you research about this incident before you make such a comment.



Quoting 757MDE (Reply 8):
Wasn't he having trouble with BA for the way everything was handled with him after the incident?



Quoting Vfw614 (Reply 9):
Apparently training pilots made comments about his handling of the situation

Maybe you need to do the reading.

BA would have to keep the blame sheet free by whatever means. Too many aircraft and jobs rely on it. I don't know the full story and neither do you.

Think before making such comments.


User currently offlinePellegrine From France, joined Mar 2007, 2468 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 11455 times:

Maybe he just got sick of SAMO, same old sh*t. I mean, a lot of people leave jobs after a major incident happens, even if it was nothing of their doing and they weren't even involved. All it takes is a catalyst. Maybe he just needed change, who knows.


oh boy!!!
User currently offlineVfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 4013 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 10947 times:



Quoting Babybus (Reply 13):
Maybe you need to do the reading.

BA would have to keep the blame sheet free by whatever means.

I was quoting. Don't shoot the messenger:

Quoting Vfw614 (Reply 9):
The story conveyed in the UK press



User currently offline757MDE From Colombia, joined Sep 2004, 1753 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 10749 times:



Quoting Babybus (Reply 13):
Think before making such comments.

I said I read it in the BBC and was asking, not confirming.

Quoting Vfw614 (Reply 15):
Don't shoot the messenger

Ditto.



I gladly accept donations to pay for flight hours! This thing draws man...
User currently offlineSEPilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 6963 posts, RR: 46
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 10688 times:

I read a while ago that after numerous trials in simulators that no pilot was able to reach the runway with the situation that Captain Burkhill faced. The criticism seems based on the fact that the first officer did the flying; but so what? Perhaps Burkhill had full confidence in his first officer and saw no reason to take over; he certainly knew that he would be blamed for anything that went wrong, and was right there to take over or give advice if needed. Also, perhaps he felt that he could better assess the situation without actually taking control himself; he might well have been searching for a cause (and possible remedy) for the problem and having to actually fly would have been a distraction from that. In any case, between them they reached the best outcome that was possible under the situation they faced, and any criticism from anyone not in authority in the situation seems to me to be extraordinarily mean spirited and out of place.


The problem with making things foolproof is that fools are so doggone ingenious...Dan Keebler
User currently offlineLHRSpotter From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2006, 182 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 10550 times:



Quoting Babybus (Reply 2):
I don't know the full details of that incident but maybe it wasn't handled as expertly as we would like to believe.

There wasn't a lot of room for expertise in this incident. Happened very low and very late in the approach. They must've been expert enough to stretch the glide the way they did and at that point that was all they could do. Now there is a new procedure which calls for full thrust to be applied on the RR powered 777s before the descent so any fuel blockage can be cleared (I am sure someone can give a lot more specific info on this than me).


User currently offlineQualitydr From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 117 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 10002 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 5):
Quoting Babybus (Reply 2):
I don't know the full details of that incident but maybe it wasn't handled as expertly as we would like to believe.

I suggest you research about this incident before you make such a comment.

Human psychology is interesting. I didn't see the first line quoted as disparaging the pilot. I read it, and thought about the (political) aftermath. I somehow didn't consider questioning the pilot's skill or decisions; he got the plane down and everybody out alive in a crisis.

I guess it's differences like this that make the world go 'round...

QD



All you need in this life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure. -- Mark Twain
User currently offlineMd88Captain From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1333 posts, RR: 21
Reply 20, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 9906 times:

There are many 777 pilots waiting on RR to fix the problem with their engine. Maybe Burkill got tired of waiting?

User currently offlineSEPilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 6963 posts, RR: 46
Reply 21, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 9068 times:



Quoting Md88Captain (Reply 20):
There are many 777 pilots waiting on RR to fix the problem with their engine. Maybe Burkill got tired of waiting?

Seeing as the problem is fairly well understood, and has existed for the lifetime of the 777 with only one accident after nearly 15 years in service, and the problem can be avoided by not initiating a landing immediately after flying at high altitudes at extremely cold temperatures, I don't see why this should be a factor. Yes, it does need to be fixed, but I would rank it far below the A330 pitot tubes in urgency.



The problem with making things foolproof is that fools are so doggone ingenious...Dan Keebler
User currently offlinePellegrine From France, joined Mar 2007, 2468 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 7863 times:



Quoting SEPilot (Reply 21):
Seeing as the problem is fairly well understood, and has existed for the lifetime of the 777 with only one accident after nearly 15 years in service, and the problem can be avoided by not initiating a landing immediately after flying at high altitudes at extremely cold temperatures, I don't see why this should be a factor. Yes, it does need to be fixed, but I would rank it far below the A330 pitot tubes in urgency.

In my opinion, since there have been many RR 777 "rollbacks", it has resulted in one crash which EASILY could have resulted in all killed, and all long haul 777 flights will be landing shortly after cruising at high altitudes, it is of the utmost importance. Safety should come first.



oh boy!!!
User currently offlineFrancoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 3790 posts, RR: 11
Reply 23, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 7608 times:

Why all the speculation? The paper article seems to be speculating as well. They have no idea why he is really quitting. Plenty of experienced captains take the opportunity to leave early in their career. Sometimes the money has been good enough to afford a long retirement, or start a completely different venture, and seeing how he has been at BA for 20 years, I'd say he's not desperate for a new cockpit job right now.

It's hard to say whether the accident has anything to do with this decision.



Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
User currently offlineTheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 7264 times:



Quoting Vfw614 (Reply 9):
Apparently training pilots made comments about his handling of the situation and on pilots forums he was accused of "chickening out" - to an extent that he even contacted BALPA. The story conveyed in the UK press is that he has become a victiom of a smear campaign. Who knows.

Where does it say anywhere it was training pilots, it says training managers, that could also mean cabin crew trainers as well. Bit of a catch all so who knows.


25 AirNz : Where are you getting the media as having anything to do with it, or are you just being 'fashionable' by involving them?
26 SEPilot : Yes, safety must come first. But all of the rollbacks except this one happened at altitude and lasted only briefly, and all except this one happened
27 MCOflyer : What the majority of many people are missing is that he has full support of British Airways in his decision. Also he was controlling the flaps which t
28 Musang : Nothing wrong with letting the co-pilot continue to fly it. Taking over the controls late in the approach (standard BA procedure in a monitored approa
29 Post contains links Vfw614 : He also got a medal from BA. You are correct. I meant to write "managers". However, other newspapers mention "refresher courses" in which those alleg
30 GDB : A link from the Daily Mail indeed? Them talking about smearing people, well they'd know all about that, including in this case. Burkhill was treated b
31 Post contains links Vfw614 : If The Times is to be believed, he had considered quitting for some time: "The pilot's row with his employers first came to light last year when Mr Bu
32 SunriseValley : Perhaps he is going while BA still has a pension plan !
33 Mutu : [quote=Babybus,reply=2]I don't know the full details of that incident but maybe it wasn't handled as expertly as we would like to believe.[/quote} Isn
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