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BA Problem - SYD-LHR  
User currently offlineCaptainsimon From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2006, 127 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 13679 times:

Just heard on the news that a BA aircraft made an emergency landing this morning at LHR.
Caused by a hydraulic problem, the aircraft apparently shutdown system on the taxiway and was towed to gate where passengers were kept onboard for 1 hr.

Any anyone give anymore info? What was the a/c involved?

Thanks

25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineKiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8580 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 13539 times:
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the BBC mentions much the same that you have

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8191962.stm

I do not understand why they kept pax on board for an hour , after travelling 20+ hours from SYD people would be desperate to get off and it would be extremely frustrating to have to just sit there .



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlineTheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 13282 times:



Quoting Kiwiandrew (Reply 1):
do not understand why they kept pax on board for an hour , after travelling 20+ hours from SYD people would be desperate to get off and it would be extremely frustrating to have to just sit there .

They say they were kept on board an hour after landing. This seems about right if they were towed to Terminal 3 as the article says. THis flight should go to Terminal 4 so I imagine the delay was to get buses around to take the passengers off. By the time a tow is sorted out and then it arrives and all the buses appear an hour doesn't sound too wide of the mark.


User currently offlineAirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 13094 times:



Quoting Theginge (Reply 2):
By the time a tow is sorted out and then it arrives and all the buses appear an hour doesn't sound too wide of the mark.

I would have to completely disagree on that.......it's way too long. Surely if stuck on the taxiway a tow should be organised very quickly. However, it doesn't stipulate whether the pax were kept on board for an hour after arrival at Terminal 3, or if that timeframe includes every aspect.


User currently offlineMusang From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2001, 865 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 13056 times:

In my experience of BA's operation at Heathrow an hour is pretty good going.

Regards - musang


User currently offlineTheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 12741 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 3):
I would have to completely disagree on that.......it's way too long. Surely if stuck on the taxiway a tow should be organised very quickly.

Yep probably will be, but I imagine it will take at least 10 mins to find a tug, remember it is a very busy time for tows at that time of day as a lot of the early arrivals are towed off and aircraft moved around. Then when the tug gets to the aircraft the tow won't commence straight away as presumably an engineer will check that the aircraft is safe to be towed.

I have seen many years ago another operators aircraft have to be towed from a taxiway in as it had an engine failure on takeoff and stopped, it took at least 40 mins due to some of the reasons I have mentioned above.


User currently offlineKaiarahi From Canada, joined Jul 2009, 3033 posts, RR: 28
Reply 6, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 12048 times:

One hour total doesn't surprise me at all. It often takes 20-25 minutes before a tug shows up for a scheduled tow to the gate at LAX.


Empty vessels make the most noise.
User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 11586 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 3):
I would have to completely disagree on that.......it's way too long. Surely if stuck on the taxiway a tow should be organised very quickly.

I would have to completely disagree on that........ I was on a BA heavy waiting for pushback from T1. The wrong tow truck was sent (one for mediums) and the replacement took 40 minutes to organize.



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User currently offlineAirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 11266 times:



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 7):
I would have to completely disagree on that........ I was on a BA heavy waiting for pushback from T1. The wrong tow truck was sent (one for mediums) and the replacement took 40 minutes to organize.

That's fair enough indeed. However, I was using the premise that major airports should know what they're doing......and that doesn't include sending a wrong tow truck.
If you wish to claim waiting on a taxiway for an hour on a tow truck and buses is 'normal' then so be it.


User currently offlineTheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 10995 times:

At Heathrow the Airport, in this case, Heathrow Airport limited (HAL) has nothing to do with pushbacks and tows. It is the Airline or handling agents who do that job.

User currently offlineSB From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2006, 216 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 10755 times:

Normal, but not really acceptable. I think most people will agree with that?

S.



"Confirm leave the hold and maintain 320kts?!"
User currently offlineBongodog1964 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 3638 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 9997 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 8):
Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 7):
I would have to completely disagree on that........ I was on a BA heavy waiting for pushback from T1. The wrong tow truck was sent (one for mediums) and the replacement took 40 minutes to organize.

That's fair enough indeed. However, I was using the premise that major airports should know what they're doing......and that doesn't include sending a wrong tow truck.
If you wish to claim waiting on a taxiway for an hour on a tow truck and buses is 'normal' then so be it.

Surely BA would need to seek permission from ATC before sending a tow truck out onto the taxiways, and a route would need to be agreed that didn't unduly disrupt operation
Especially if the truck had to come from T4, it can take a fair time to cross the active runway.


User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13229 posts, RR: 77
Reply 12, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 9798 times:

I think it better to reserve judgment on towing until we actually know what the nature of the technical problem was, don't you think?

Anyway, this incident apart, it's getting a bit old banging on about BA's performance at LHR, seeing how on time performance is and has been for some considerable time now.
(Though you'd struggle, if succeed at all, to get that info from the media, whether BA send to them or not).


User currently offlineFCA767 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2006, 1779 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 9315 times:

Only flight I see is this
ACARS mode: X Aircraft reg: G-BNLM [Boeing B744]
Message label: H1 Block id: 1 Msg no: D66A
Flight id: BAW010 [YSSY-VTBS-EGLL] [British Airways]
Message content:-
#DFBACM231BQG-BNLMBABAW10 VTBSEGLL090809 112ER032514 842 613B 016117 -243 379990850 548337401330322 3581 900 900 846 5112 7724 323017171 01275423750953949 75041571::: 27 4824-256131315691766 2 20270


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25648 posts, RR: 22
Reply 14, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 9191 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 8):
Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 7):
I would have to completely disagree on that........ I was on a BA heavy waiting for pushback from T1. The wrong tow truck was sent (one for mediums) and the replacement took 40 minutes to organize.

That's fair enough indeed. However, I was using the premise that major airports should know what they're doing......and that doesn't include sending a wrong tow truck.
If you wish to claim waiting on a taxiway for an hour on a tow truck and buses is 'normal' then so be it.

I don't know how many times I landed at LHR on a BA flight when most longhaul flights used T4, and had to sit for more than 30 minutes waiting for another aircraft to leave their assigned gate, and then often wait for someone to guide the aircraft into the gate, and then wait for buses for the passengers since many flights at T4 used remote stands. BA seemed to handle such things badly, one of the reasons I largely gave up flying BA.


User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13229 posts, RR: 77
Reply 15, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 8841 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 14):
BA seemed to handle such things badly, one of the reasons I largely gave up flying BA.

BA don't use T4 though now do they?
Indeed, after the initial fiasco T5 has transformed BA's LHR performance, which sort of indicates the LHR infrastructure was the main problem all along.

BMI had to drop their advertising claim to be LHR's most on time carrier, guess why?


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25648 posts, RR: 22
Reply 16, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 8466 times:



Quoting GDB (Reply 15):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 14):
BA seemed to handle such things badly, one of the reasons I largely gave up flying BA.


BA don't use T4 though now do they?

BA flights to BKK, SIN and SYD still use T4. They move to T3 on October 29, along with all QF flights which also now use T4.


User currently offlineFlyer732 From Namibia, joined Nov 1999, 1367 posts, RR: 21
Reply 17, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 8240 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 8):
That's fair enough indeed. However, I was using the premise that major airports should know what they're doing......and that doesn't include sending a wrong tow truck.
If you wish to claim waiting on a taxiway for an hour on a tow truck and buses is 'normal' then so be it.

I can see it easily happening, you can't drive a vehicle on a taxiway or runway without an escort from airport operations. I've seen it at ATL before, a plane lands with a hydraulic problem, after its deemed safe to move by the airport, the tow crew is escorted from the ramp they're waiting on to the aircraft. And if its a normal tow and not a supertug, its going to hit about 10 mph max, once its hooked up, towing it to a terminal could take quite awhile.


User currently offlineJetMech From Australia, joined Mar 2006, 2699 posts, RR: 53
Reply 18, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 4983 times:



Quoting Captainsimon (Thread starter):
towed to gate



Quoting Captainsimon (Thread starter):
anyone give anymore info

By the sounds of it, it may have been #1 hydraulic system that had the problem, as this is the only one that supplies the nose gear steering.

Regards, JetMech



JetMech split the back of his pants. He can feel the wind in his hair.
User currently offlineCloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 3841 times:



Quoting AirNZ (Reply 8):
That's fair enough indeed. However, I was using the premise that major airports should know what they're doing......and that doesn't include sending a wrong tow truck.
If you wish to claim waiting on a taxiway for an hour on a tow truck and buses is 'normal' then so be it.

Not claiming it's a daily occurrence but it can happen.

Quoting Theginge (Reply 9):
At Heathrow the Airport, in this case, Heathrow Airport limited (HAL) has nothing to do with pushbacks and tows. It is the Airline or handling agents who do that job.

 checkmark 

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 11):
Surely BA would need to seek permission from ATC before sending a tow truck out onto the taxiways, and a route would need to be agreed that didn't unduly disrupt operation
Especially if the truck had to come from T4, it can take a fair time to cross the active runway.

If an aircraft is blocking one of the taxiways, depending on which taxiway it is, it would be a priority to sort out. Once a tow truck is found it wouldn't take much to give it clearance to go onto the taxiways. There are tow trucks either side of the South Runway but a vehicle crossing the runway is handled no differently from an aircraft crossing. We deal with these situations on a regular basis and there are procedures in place to do that.



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User currently offlineFlyCaledonian From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2094 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 3368 times:

Don't forget this is a busy time of day for BA arrivals at LHR. Plus if it was towed to T3 they'd have to find a suitable gate/remote stand amongst all those booked to be used by the existing carriers there. And as well as a tug and the buses for the passengers that have been mentioned, BA would need to get ground crew there as well to unload the bags, etc. Given BA's operations are virtually all in T5, they'd either have to send people up from there, or get people across the active runway from T4.


Let's Go British Caledonian!
User currently offlineCarduelis From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2001, 1586 posts, RR: 10
Reply 21, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 3319 times:

This may be irrelevant, but if the aircraft was due to be parked in the Victors (cul de sac) of T4, the procedure the last time I was on one, is to stop prior to entrance, and wait for tug (both inbound and outbound) - which may have then been directed to T3 for convenience!

We all know how stories can be twisted through newspaper reporting, etc. Glad the emergency was OK!

My taxi home was still waiting after an hour!



Per Ardua ad Astra! ........ Honi Soit Qui Mal y Pense!
User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13229 posts, RR: 77
Reply 22, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2874 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 16):
BA flights to BKK, SIN and SYD still use T4. They move to T3 on October 29, along with all QF flights which also now use T4.

OK, so we don't operate out of a T4 that is packed to the rafters then!
That was the issue when all our long haul were out of there.


User currently onlineAABB777 From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 574 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2804 times:
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Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 16):
BA flights to BKK, SIN and SYD still use T4.

Why don't they use T5? Or why not use remote stands for these flights and bus in pax to/from T5?


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25648 posts, RR: 22
Reply 24, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2792 times:

Quoting AABB777 (Reply 23):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 16):
BA flights to BKK, SIN and SYD still use T4.

Why don't they use T5? Or why not use remote stands for these flights and bus in pax to/from T5?

If they used T5 it would have to handle all QF flights as well as BA flights to BKK/SIN/SYD due to the the BA/QF joint venture/codeshare. I don't think T5 has enough capacity currently to handle 1 A380, 5 744s, and 1 772, 5 of which depart within less than one hour beween 2135 and 2215, and the other two also almost at the same time (1215 and 1220). Maybe it will when the other T5 satellite terminal is finished.

[Edited 2009-08-10 12:00:20]

[Edited 2009-08-10 12:01:57]

User currently offlineTonystan From Ireland, joined Jan 2006, 1443 posts, RR: 2
Reply 25, posted (5 years 2 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2572 times:



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 24):
Maybe it will when the other T5 satellite terminal is finished.

T5 is already operating a near to full capacity even without T5C complete. At many times during the day the stands around the T5C building site are fully occupied with aircraft which are having to have their passengers bussed to and from T5A!

To be honest T5C is really not going to make the greatest difference to congestion around the T5 campus, it will simply make it easier for the passengers and save a few miles on the old buses!



My views are my own and do not reflect any other person or organisation.
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